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Senator seeks to allow goose kills near NY airport after multiple collisions with planes
Fox News ^ | April 26, 2012

Posted on 04/26/2012 4:57:20 PM PDT by SJackson

NEW YORK – The problem of birds living near some of the nation's busiest airports is coming under renewed scrutiny after two emergency landings in a week and more than three years after the famous ditching of a jetliner in the Hudson River.

U.S. Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand on Wednesday proposed making it easier to round up geese from a federal refuge near Kennedy Airport and kill them, an idea that's meeting opposition from wildlife advocates.

A JetBlue plane bound for West Palm Beach, Fla., made an emergency landing at Westchester County Airport north of New York City on Tuesday. A Los Angeles-bound jet made an emergency landing at Kennedy Airport after a bird strike on the right engine a week ago.

No one was hurt, but Grant Cardone, a sales training consultant who was on the flight out of Kennedy and was filming video from his window in seat 1D as the birds hit the plane, said it was scary.

"I felt like the plane was going to roll over on its right side," Cardone said. "Those five or six seconds were terrifying."

Cardone, 54, said he texted his wife that the flight was in trouble and added, "I love you and I love the kids." Afterward, the pilot managed to stabilize the plane and land.

Gillibrand's bill would empower the U.S. Department of Agriculture to remove Canada geese from the Jamaica Bay Wildlife Refuge during June and July when they are molting and can't fly.

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS:

1 posted on 04/26/2012 4:57:25 PM PDT by SJackson
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To: Iowa Granny; Ladysmith; Diana in Wisconsin; JLO; sergeantdave; damncat; phantomworker; joesnuffy; ..
If you’d like to be on or off this Outdoors/Rural/wildlife/hunting/hiking/backpacking/National Parks/animals list please FR mail me. And ping me is you see articles of interest.

Needless to say allowing citizens to hunt the geese and maybe donate some to food kitchens would be a non starter.

2 posted on 04/26/2012 4:59:04 PM PDT by SJackson (As a black man, you know, Barack could get shot going to the gas station, M Obama)
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To: SJackson
Any tree worshiper that opposes this should be required to fly in and out of JFK 5 times a day,every day.JFK is,perhaps,the most important airport in the world and every day it handles everything from the biggest commercial aircraft in the world (the A380),dozens of 747s (probably more) and other jumbos from all over the world.
3 posted on 04/26/2012 5:05:06 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Unlike Mrs Obama,I've Been Proud Of This Country My *Entire* Life!)
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To: SJackson
Bird vs. Canadian fighter jet
4 posted on 04/26/2012 5:08:02 PM PDT by Vince Ferrer
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To: SJackson
U.S. Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand on Wednesday proposed making it easier to round up geese from a federal refuge near Kennedy Airport and kill them, an idea that's meeting opposition from wildlife advocates.

Canada geese are rats of the air. Getting rid of a few dozen or a few hundred near an airport has zero effect on their population.

5 posted on 04/26/2012 5:11:18 PM PDT by Vince Ferrer
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To: SJackson
Attention PETA and Sierra Club...please pick up the white courtesy phone. One of your loons has left the asylum.

LOL...I just love it when the libtards form a circular firing squad.

6 posted on 04/26/2012 5:12:40 PM PDT by LaybackLenny
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To: Gay State Conservative

Actually, the solution to the problem is pretty simple. Airliners just need the right technology to see when birds are on a collision course. If you can see them, you can avoid them. I know. The buzzard I hit at 500 knots was the one I hadn’t seen. I easily managed to miss all of his buddies that I did see. BTW, the collision put a 2-3 foot hole in the canopy of the F-4 I was flying. And the canopy on the F-4 is about 1/2 inch thick.

The co-pilot flying the USAir flight that went into the Hudson saw the geese, but he didn’t have the presence of mind to put some G on the plane, and pull up to avoid the floxk. Didn’t want to scare the passengers you know. But if he had known early enough, he could have started a gentle pull and missed them easily.


7 posted on 04/26/2012 5:12:57 PM PDT by LukeSW (The truth shall make you free!)
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To: Gay State Conservative

Actually, the solution to the problem is pretty simple. Airliners just need the right technology to see when birds are on a collision course. If you can see them, you can avoid them. I know. The buzzard I hit at 500 knots was the one I hadn’t seen. I easily managed to miss all of his buddies that I did see. BTW, the collision put a 2-3 foot hole in the canopy of the F-4 I was flying. And the canopy on the F-4 is about 1/2 inch thick.

The co-pilot flying the USAir flight that went into the Hudson saw the geese, but he didn’t have the presence of mind to put some G on the plane, and pull up to avoid the flock. Didn’t want to scare the passengers you know. But if he had known early enough, he could have started a gentle pull and missed them easily.


8 posted on 04/26/2012 5:13:26 PM PDT by LukeSW (The truth shall make you free!)
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To: SJackson

Maybe some sort of grate over the engine intake sized just smaller than the average goose would help.


9 posted on 04/26/2012 5:14:00 PM PDT by HerrBlucher
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To: SJackson

Kirsten Gillibrand can go f____ herself. Not only is she just a Schumer Mini-Me rubber stamp, without a brain to call her own, but she doesn’t know what she is talking about. The Federal preserve that she would just so casually exterminate the geese out of is Jamaica Bay Wildlife Refuge. It’s one of the gem birding spots of the East Coast.

It utterly breaks my heart, to the point of real tears, that after the July molting season, Bloomberg (may he drop DEAD VERY SOON, the b____d)has the then helpless and flightless Canada geese rounded up out of every NYC park—fathers, mothers, and their babies of the year—and stuffed into metal boxes which are then pumped full of carbon monoxide. It’s not the painless death you read about. You can hear the poor frightened frantic birds beating around inside. And then the parks are ghostly quiet until the fall, when more Canada geese migrate in. I want to shout out to them, “No, don’t make your home here, the Mayor will have you exterminated”, but of course, I can’t. So the only Canada geese one can see then are in the Jamaica Bay preserve. Which she wants to kill.

I have not heard that any program using Canada geese as food for the “homeless” has been successful. That’s just a pathetic way to try and justify the deaths of the geese.

If they didn’t want a bird problem, why did they build airports right near the migratory flightways of millions of birds? Duh. Then they’ll have to kill not only the geese, but starlings, sparrows, pigeons, and any other species which is unfortunate enough to be overtaken by a speeding jet.


10 posted on 04/26/2012 5:14:00 PM PDT by EinNYC
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To: SJackson
Senator seeks to allow goose kills near NY airport after multiple collisions with planes

"Say what?!"


11 posted on 04/26/2012 5:16:52 PM PDT by Lazlo in PA (Now living in a newly minted Red State.)
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To: Vince Ferrer

I’m with you. feed the homeless. (I think only the breast meat is worthwhile)
Anyone who opposes this wants the poor to starve to death.


12 posted on 04/26/2012 5:17:07 PM PDT by steve8714 (The answer, surprisingly, is Carnahan.)
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To: EinNYC
Send them to me. I love goose. Eggs fried in goose fat is the BEST breakfast I've every had.

Mmmmm. Goose. It's what's for dinner. And breakfast.

/johnny

13 posted on 04/26/2012 5:20:09 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: LukeSW
Hey...you're the pilot and I'm not so I guess I have to accept what you say.I must admit that it's hard for me to imagine something a big as an A380 or 747 being able to avoid something like that when they're,say,50 feet off the ground.
14 posted on 04/26/2012 5:20:55 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Unlike Mrs Obama,I've Been Proud Of This Country My *Entire* Life!)
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To: LukeSW
Hand salute, sir. And thank you for your service.

/johnny

15 posted on 04/26/2012 5:21:30 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: steve8714
(I think only the breast meat is worthwhile)

DUDE! No! I've got tons of recipes for goose. I use the entire carcass and all the giblets.

Heck, if I had enough of 'em and I processed them myself, I'd use the feathers for pillows and quilts.

Everything but the honk.

/johnny

16 posted on 04/26/2012 5:24:50 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: SJackson

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KhZwsYtNDE


17 posted on 04/26/2012 5:25:28 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Unlike Mrs Obama,I've Been Proud Of This Country My *Entire* Life!)
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To: Gay State Conservative
You might not believe a 707 can do a barrel roll. But it can. Test pilot during development did it.

Normal airline operations don't allow extreme manuevers. But one hostile environment landing in a airliner being used for a troop carrier lets you know that they can do a whole lot more than we ever see in airline operations. I needed to change pants after the first one.

/johnny

18 posted on 04/26/2012 5:30:19 PM PDT by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: SJackson

These idiots don’t realize grenades are set off routinely at military installations and airports to scare off birds. Its a big deal..


19 posted on 04/26/2012 5:30:23 PM PDT by goseminoles
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To: SJackson

They should hire some hawks.


20 posted on 04/26/2012 5:51:14 PM PDT by caveat emptor (Zippity Do Dah)
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To: SJackson

Said the animal rights whacko: “The killing just doesn’t work,” she said. “We have to focus on learning to coexist with these birds.”

Says the Guru: In all known cases, dead birds killed in airport avian population reduction programs were never found to be impacting aircraft.

As for coexisting with birds, mankind has, over the centuries, developed numerous and time tested methods of “coexisting” with birds. Recently, the microwave oven has opened new vistas in human-avian coexistence.

Yummers!


21 posted on 04/26/2012 5:58:42 PM PDT by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon freedom, it is necessary to examine principles."...the public interest)
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To: LukeSW

“But if he had known early enough, he could have started a gentle pull and missed them easily.”

True, very true.

Also, if pigs could fly, the price of bacon would be sky high.

But, as no man knows in which direction a flock of birds will turn, nor when, I suggest not holding your breath until such a program is written, tested, and validated.

Until then, kill ‘em and eat ‘em.


22 posted on 04/26/2012 6:07:12 PM PDT by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon freedom, it is necessary to examine principles."...the public interest)
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To: SJackson

Border Collies are an excellent choice for scaring the 5hit out of these big birds. Borders can run all day, they’re obedient, they are incredibly smart, and they love to please their owners. These big birds will are far more likely to land if they see other birds there, but if they see borders, they won’t land.

End of problem.


23 posted on 04/26/2012 6:23:45 PM PDT by HighWheeler
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To: caveat emptor; SJackson
Here's an article I read about a year ago.

Some have soft-sounding names like Juliet, Pablo, Ivan, Tally, Remy and Dante. Others bring to mind warriors or super heroes: Apache, Attila, Mav, Flash and Baron.

The faces behind the names have hooked beaks. Their toes are flesh-piercing talons.

They are falcons, hawks and one nasty bald eagle named Ivan. They work at Pearson International Airport, from one hour before sunrise until one hour after sunset.

As “employees” of Falcon Environmental Services, they are charged with frightening away nuisance birds, eating them if necessary, so they don’t wind up in airplane engines. Their payoff for a job well done? A tasty hunk of raw quail served by hand.
....



Interesting stuff, as far as it goes, but but near the end of the article...

For larger nuisance birds, such as geese, Shevalier relies on a five-year-old golden Lab, Tucker. Even as big as Ivan is, even the bald eagle won’t take on an aggressive goose.

Oops. Memory didn't serve me well.
24 posted on 04/26/2012 6:25:41 PM PDT by caveat emptor (Zippity Do Dah)
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To: SJackson

That goose killing liberal biatch, no more PETA money for her. What happened to the raptor program at JFK?


25 posted on 04/26/2012 6:26:22 PM PDT by Harley (Will Rogers never met Harry Reid.)
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To: SJackson
When I was still working at U of Dayton we had a big bird-strike project.

Part of the project was to develop computer models for predicting the effects of bird strikes on aircraft windscreens. That was funded by the Air Force. Our design of windscreens saved quite a few pilots lives.

My part of the project was funded by the FAA. It was in two parts. One involved developing statistical models to predict the likelihood of a bird being sucked into a jet engine, as a function of season, time of day, etc. The other was to develop a model for the likelihood of damage to the engine, as a function of bird weight. We had data available to us on literally hundreds of bird ingestions, world-wide.

That was nearly 20 years ago. I have no idea what the current situation is.

26 posted on 04/26/2012 6:57:39 PM PDT by JoeFromSidney (book: RESISTANCE TO TYRANNY. Buy from Amazon.)
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To: EinNYC

Yea just screw those people who will die by NOT taking care of the problem. I say kill all the geese and be done with it. There are plenty more all over the US and the world.


27 posted on 04/26/2012 7:31:39 PM PDT by packrat35 (When will we admit we are now almost a police state?)
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To: caveat emptor
I have the solution. I can let them use my lab pack.

Photobucket

28 posted on 04/26/2012 7:41:24 PM PDT by packrat35 (When will we admit we are now almost a police state?)
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To: Harley
The raptor program is being replaced by the new Pirate Penguin Program (PPP).

Photobucket

29 posted on 04/26/2012 7:54:29 PM PDT by packrat35 (When will we admit we are now almost a police state?)
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To: packrat35

What an utterly STUPID reply. Yeah, and why don’t we just pave over everything so we won’t attract any birds? That would make it so worthwhile to take a nature hike through the woods to relax. There are other ways to reduce the goose population in a much more humane fashion. You can oil their eggs, which then don’t hatch. You can use border collies to make certain areas not pleasant for the geese. You can cut the grass in certain areas so as not to attract them. Etc. Etc.

Just love black and white “thinkers” like you.


30 posted on 04/26/2012 10:51:04 PM PDT by EinNYC
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To: SJackson

Build this in the sanctuary. It's the perfect politically correct solution.

31 posted on 04/26/2012 11:31:54 PM PDT by BerryDingle (I know how to deal with communists, I still wear their scars on my back from Hollywood-Ronald Reagan)
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To: GladesGuru

With respect to the comment that “no man knows in which directin a flock of birds will turn” that isn’t exactly true.

All birds in flight behave in a single manner when scared: the tuck their wings and dive. It isn’t a matter of turning. It is a matter of altitude.

If you can see them, you can miss them. Sully’s co-pilot who was at the controls saw the geese. He could have pulled up rapidly (G on the airplane) and the USAIR flight would have been goose free.

The problem is in seeing the birds soon enough. Having some FAA dude on the ground looking at an area-wide bird radar and then relaying what he sees by voice to applicable pilots won’t work.


32 posted on 04/27/2012 2:30:10 AM PDT by LukeSW (The truth shall make you free!)
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To: LukeSW

“All birds in flight behave in a single manner when scared: the tuck their wings and dive. It isn’t a matter of turning. It is a matter of altitude.”

Agreed, but from flying a Republic RC-3 in Florida where there are all too many buzzards, seagulls beyond number, and other avian pests, I agree with you about bird behavior when collision is at the SPLAT stage.

One flies below the avian pests at the risk of a batch of bird through the plexiglas. However, the flock can, and often will, turn into an approaching plane with no warning.

“Birdbrain” became proverbial for a reason. Hence, I am for hunting avian pests because it works, it brings to those deserving trough feeders in the gubbament hunting fees to keep their trough filled, and it provides small arms opportunities for the citizenry.

Besides, where else can one obtain fowl with bits of shot embedded at random intervals?

;-)


33 posted on 04/27/2012 4:00:01 AM PDT by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon freedom, it is necessary to examine principles."...the public interest)
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To: SJackson
Best thing ever to hunt geese with..


34 posted on 04/27/2012 4:05:46 AM PDT by IamConservative (Shall I try and perhaps fail or shall I do nothing without fail?)
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To: SJackson

Does’t a sitting US Senator have better things to do?

Howsabout the owner of the damn airport exercising some of their own common sense.....and a 12 gauge.


35 posted on 04/27/2012 4:08:36 AM PDT by mo (If you understand, no explanation is needed. If you don't understand, no explanation is possible.)
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To: LukeSW

The F-4 is just a tad bit more maneuverable than a fully loaded commercial passenger jet on takeoff. But you knew that, I hope.


36 posted on 04/27/2012 4:46:27 AM PDT by Locomotive Breath
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To: EinNYC

Lets see now. People or birds??? Which will I pick? People win! I think you are a sad individual to pick birds over your fellow man but maybe that’s just me.


37 posted on 04/27/2012 6:55:41 PM PDT by packrat35 (When will we admit we are now almost a police state?)
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