Thousands in Spain protest budget cuts

World Bulletin ^ | April 29, 2012

[Oldeconomybuyer]

(Reuters) - Thousands of people protested across Spain on Sunday against government cuts aimed at tackling a debt crisis that has pushed the country back into recession and sent unemployment close to 25 percent.

Protesters closed central parts of the capital Madrid on a wet Sunday to protest against cuts to education and health services the government says must be made to help slash the public deficit.

Many people waved labour union flags and held banners against the cuts to the country's prized healthcare system that will add to medicine costs, and to its education budget, which will increase the hours worked by teachers and the number of pupils per classroom.

Some protesters were disappointed by the numbers turning out in support, which they said was down to the rain, and fatigue at the length of a crisis.

"People are not protesting in huge numbers; I don't know what it's going to take for the people to really stand up. The disenchantment is so brutal that people will not stand up and protest," said Julian, a pensioner.

[Oldeconomybuyer]

Coming to America.

[johniegrad]

The disenchantment is so brutal that people will not stand up and protest," said Julian, a pensioner.

Or, Juiian, it could be possible that people don't care as much for your goodies as you think they do. But that never crossed your mind, did it?

[mongo141]

“Coming to America.”

Yes and sooner than we probably want. Those who are not self sufficient to one degree or another or who are unable to defend them selves are going to pay a terrible price. Its going to make the 92 LA riots look like a playground squabble and the closer you are to the big population centers the more dangerous things will be.

[Huskrrrr]

We've seen the beginnings of this in California. College students with the cheapest tuition in the country marching on Sacramento protesting budget cuts. These marches are organized, mostly, by the faculty... who also manage to show up at all the Occupy BS. Of course they've all been voting in big spending Dem representatives for decades

[livius]

You can be a pensioner starting at age 55 (or even younger) in Spain and most of the rest of Europe, so Julian’s idea of “brutal” is probably pretty distorted. He’s probably 60, has a few adult kids on welfare...er, unemployment...and is enraged by the fact that the state health system is now asking for a tiny co-pay for medications.

[kabar]

You can be a pensioner starting at age 55 (or even younger) in Spain and most of the rest of Europe,

LOL. Where did you come up with that one?

You must be 65 to get a state pension in Spain. In the US you can get SS at 62, albeit reduced.

Retirement ages across the OECD

[livius]

Perhaps they’ve changed it (although I doubt it), but I know many Spaniards who retired at 55. They have something they call “pre-jubilacion,” which we would call early retirement, and naturally, most people take advantage of it. Benefits might be a little lower, but they also have their pensions to rely on, especially if they were civil servants. And then all these things kick in to their full amounts when they hit 65.

[kabar]

Anecdotal stories don't constitute facts. I gave the links that provide the data for not only Spain, but the rest of the OECD and EU countries.

Your statement, You can be a pensioner starting at age 55 (or even younger) in Spain and most of the rest of Europe, is clearly false. Just admit it and move on. We all make mistakes.

[SamAdams76]

Prejubilacion is basically Spanish for "early retirement" that companies will sometimes offer their employees in lieu of being laid off. It's not unique to Spain or Europe by any means. We have it here in United States as well.

On the subject of retirement, I don't understand why that is something that people aspire to. I want to work as long as I can.

[livius]

Sorry, but it’s not false. I spend a lot of time in Spain and am very familiar with their institutions.

[livius]

Yes, but in Spain you get government benefits and it is not a private company decision. Civil servants do it all the time.

The original purpose may have been to get older employees to move out of the way for younger ones, but the effect is that people go into prejubilacion (or even pre-prejubilacion, believe it or not, where their duties are reduced) and essentially get to retire at 55. Don’t forget, many of our civil servants in the US can retire at 45 or after 20 years on the job, so this is not unique to Spain.

However, it is a big problem for Spain because it is so extended. In addition, there is a huge underground labor market, since most of the “prejubilados” secretly continue working (for somebody else or perhaps they have their own businesses) and of course do not report their income or pay taxes on it.

[kabar]

You are obviously not familiar with their pension laws and your statement covered “most of Europe,” which is patently false. I have lived 13 years in Europe in five different countries.