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EPA POWER GRAB TO REGULATE DITCHES, GULLIES ON PRIVATE PROPERTY
human events ^ | june 11, 2012 | Audrey Hudson

Posted on 06/11/2012 11:56:23 AM PDT by lowbridge

Lawmakers are working to block an unprecedented power grab by the Environmental Protection Agency to use the Clean Water Act (CWA) and control land alongside ditches, gullies and other ephemeral spots by claiming the sources are part of navigable waterways.

These temporary water sources are often created by rain or snowmelt, and would make it harder for private property owners to build in their own backyards, grow crops, raise livestock and conduct other activities on their own land, lawmakers say.

“Never in the history of the CWA has federal regulation defined ditches and other upland features as ‘waters of the United States,’” said Rep. John Mica (R-Fla.), chairman of the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee, Rep. Nick Rahall (D-W.Va.), the ranking committee member, and Rep. Bob Gibbs (R-Ohio), chairman of the Subcommittee on Water Resources and Environment.

“This is without a doubt an expansion of federal jurisdiction,” the lawmakers said in a May 31 letter to House colleagues.

(Excerpt) Read more at humanevents.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: agenda21; epa; obama
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1 posted on 06/11/2012 11:56:30 AM PDT by lowbridge
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To: lowbridge

The EPA is totally out of control and must be stopped.


2 posted on 06/11/2012 11:59:56 AM PDT by beethovenfan (If Islam is the solution, the "problem" must be freedom.)
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To: lowbridge

Remember when the commie libs kept whining about President Bush trying to take away their rights, liberty and freedom? Where the hell are the lowlifes from the aCLU?


3 posted on 06/11/2012 12:00:04 PM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (Free Stuff or Freedom! You Decide 2012.)
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To: lowbridge

Everyone wants big government, and big government all they are going to have before long.


4 posted on 06/11/2012 12:01:07 PM PDT by pallis
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To: lowbridge

I think on most farms & ranches, if some bureacrat EPA thug moron shows up to monitor culverts & ditches with rain water or snow melt, they might just end up picking themselves out of the manure pile. Most farmers will tell these bastards to take a hike and get off their land before the dogs are loosed on them.


5 posted on 06/11/2012 12:06:24 PM PDT by rcrngroup
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To: lowbridge
I was at a town meeting in a small MA town a couple years ago when the issue of a “ditch warden” came to the floor. The First Selectman actually said, “We need to vote for the ditch warden because Beacon Hill has directed us to have one.” When I asked why we were voting if the state had already made up our minds I got blank stares. The ditch warden position was voted in with only my dissenting vote.
6 posted on 06/11/2012 12:07:06 PM PDT by Cowman (How can the IRS seize property without a warrant if the 4th amendment still stands?)
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To: lowbridge
It's the butterfly affect. A soda-burp in Central Park may cause a Typhoon in China. An errant corn seed dropped in a gully in Iowa could cause a drought in Kansas. A 100 watt light bulb switched on in Pennsylvania could cause a blackout in New England. Therefore, anything and everything is the government's business.
7 posted on 06/11/2012 12:08:40 PM PDT by trubolotta
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To: lowbridge

When I first saw this I thought — what about clouds? That’s where the water comes from!

CCR was ahead of their time:

Long as I remember the rain been comin’ down
Clouds of mystery pourin’ confusion on the ground.

...Who’ll Stop The Rain? (The EPA will)


8 posted on 06/11/2012 12:11:23 PM PDT by Scrambler Bob (If you could read my mind ... just count up the felonies!)
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To: FlingWingFlyer
Indeed..

THE ACLU LOVES OBAMA/HOLDER/NAPOLITANO'S DRONES TOO?

9 posted on 06/11/2012 12:12:56 PM PDT by GeorgeWashingtonsGhost
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To: lowbridge

those sons of a ditches.


10 posted on 06/11/2012 12:14:26 PM PDT by listenhillary (Courts, law enforcement, roads and national defense should be the extent of government)
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

Excellent point! It appears the aCLU only cares when religion and/or homosexuality is involved.


11 posted on 06/11/2012 12:15:33 PM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (Free Stuff or Freedom! You Decide 2012.)
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To: lowbridge

One of the first things a GOP presidency should do is dismantle to EPA and the Energy Dept. These hacks are out of control.


12 posted on 06/11/2012 12:15:40 PM PDT by formosa (Formosa)
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To: rcrngroup
...they might just end up picking themselves out of the manure pile.

No, they will become part of it.......

13 posted on 06/11/2012 12:16:14 PM PDT by Red Badger (Think logically. Act normally.................)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

Are there no gay farmers, then?...........


14 posted on 06/11/2012 12:18:27 PM PDT by Red Badger (Think logically. Act normally.................)
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To: lowbridge
How low can this republic sink and still be a republic?

In the very first clause of the first section of the first Article of our Constitution, we the people granted limited legislative powers to our representatives.

Said representatives now petition, request, implore the commissars of their own making to stop issuing certain diktats. The unconstitutional and tyrannical administrative state is killing us.

There is no moral nor legal imperative to obey any law or reg from our government that has not been passed by Congress and signed by the Prez.

15 posted on 06/11/2012 12:18:39 PM PDT by Jacquerie (No court will save us from ourselves)
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To: lowbridge

Just wait until the UN p0wnz your gutters and downspouts (and personal pee output).


16 posted on 06/11/2012 12:20:19 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: rcrngroup

Are you not aware that the Fed Gov shut off 100% of the water to many central California farms, deferring to EPA and in favor of a 2” long fish. This caused their land to go completely barren and they lost an entire years produce. Some have gone bankrupt.

If Farmers will let their farms go barren without water, and lose a year’s income due to EPA enforcement, then I don’t see them fighting over a ditch.

In a sane world, we would be charging the doors of EPA with ropes in hand, but that is not the world we live in. Instead, EPA destroys farms with impunity.


17 posted on 06/11/2012 12:22:41 PM PDT by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (REPEAL OBAMACARE. Nothing else matters.)
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To: lowbridge

We do not live in what would be considered an overly environmentally conscious state and I guarantee you if the Indiana Department of Environmental Management sees water somewhere it is water of the state in their eyes. Been that way for some time.


18 posted on 06/11/2012 12:23:40 PM PDT by John W (Viva Cristo Rey!)
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To: Red Badger

or a strange smell in the hay mow. sd


19 posted on 06/11/2012 12:27:56 PM PDT by shotdog (I love my country. It's our government I'm afraid of.)
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To: beethovenfan

The Corpse of Engineers tried this with the irrigation districts and it didn’t go well for COE...


20 posted on 06/11/2012 12:30:15 PM PDT by shotgun
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To: shotdog

Just a couple of rabbits caught in the mower.....happens all the time...........


21 posted on 06/11/2012 12:31:17 PM PDT by Red Badger (Think logically. Act normally.................)
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To: lowbridge

Ah yes, the four branches of gov’t; Executive, Legislative, Judicial and Regulatory.


22 posted on 06/11/2012 12:33:10 PM PDT by umgud (No Rats, No Rino's)
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To: Paladin2

Here in King County, Washington you need to get a permit to put a rain barrel under your downspout. (I think it has to do because it is so dry here in Seattle!).

The guy up the road was working on filling in the dry ditch in his front yard to give him some extra room for parking. A city truck happened to see him, and told him he couldn’t as it was the headwaters of the creek a half-mile away. (There is a spring about 500’ “upstream” from his ditch, but soaks into the soil about 30’ downstream of the spring. The ditch is dry year round).

I mentioned to the new owner the story when he was preparing to fill it in. He waited until the weekend to do it. So a lot of these rules are already in place.

Of course if the U.N. is in charge of them, just wait until they pass some rule that says “no firearms within 2000 feet of any U.N. peace zone” or something.


23 posted on 06/11/2012 12:39:59 PM PDT by 21twelve
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To: lowbridge
The average voter is clueless.
A complete failing when many conservative candidates campaign in my opinion; not to use these issues.

Liberal politicians should be clubbed over the head like a baby seal with these types of issues.

24 posted on 06/11/2012 12:44:46 PM PDT by HereInTheHeartland ("The writing is on the wall - Unions are screwed. reformist2 10:04 PM #27"\)
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To: Baynative

Might be of interest.


25 posted on 06/11/2012 12:45:00 PM PDT by 383rr (Those who choose security over liberty deserve neither; GUN CONTROL= SLAVERY)
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To: 21twelve

” “no firearms within 2000 feet of any U.N. peace zone” “

That would sure cause sales of scopes to skyrocket....


26 posted on 06/11/2012 12:46:51 PM PDT by Uncle Ike (Rope is cheap, and there are lots of trees...)
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To: umgud

I’d bet that on a multiple choice test for high schoolers, your “regulatory” would get as many hits as the three correct ones.


27 posted on 06/11/2012 12:50:50 PM PDT by nascarnation
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To: lowbridge

ALL YOUR PROPERTY ARE BELONG TO GOVERNMENT


28 posted on 06/11/2012 12:53:37 PM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: Freedom_Is_Not_Free
If Farmers will let their farms go barren without water, and lose a year’s income due to EPA enforcement, then I don’t see them fighting over a ditch.

Nor do I. Furthermore, if the Dept. of Ed. has swat teams, how far behind can the EPA be, if they are behind at all.

If citizens resort to civilized methods like the courts, the agencies have virtually unlimited resources to fight back. Sure, citizens occasionally win and the EPA retaliates by releasing a new flurry of regulations. I hear a lot of people talk big about resisting, but when push comes to shove, they see they are outgunned and back down.

I agree with your conclusion; this is not a sane world.

29 posted on 06/11/2012 12:56:28 PM PDT by trubolotta
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To: lowbridge

As so many have remarked here, this is government over-reach, YET IT KEEPS HAPPENING! When asked why I am in favor of smaller government, this is my answer, the fewer government employees, the fewer there are to create new regulations and intepretations of laws.

When the Social Security Act was passed by FDR, no one envisioned ‘Supplemental SSI’ or any of its variations. When the ‘Endangered Species Act’ was passed, all people thought about were Bald Eagles and the such. Now there are fungi that meet this protection. These same expansions apply to most government acts and do not come from anything but logical progression of an apparent need.

Having said this about past laws and how they have expanded, NOW think about what it will look like in 20 years of full implementation of Health Care and ‘Dodd-Frank’. The trend is not our friend! See my tag-line!


30 posted on 06/11/2012 1:22:06 PM PDT by SES1066 (Government is NOT the reason for my existence!)
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To: Freedom_Is_Not_Free

The 2” fish is not the real issue. It’s only what the fed says.

The farmers’ bankruptcies tell the feds that their policies are working. They want to get rid of all private farms so they can easily control the food supply through governement run farms with peasant labor.


31 posted on 06/11/2012 1:30:03 PM PDT by MichiganCheese (It's now or never!)
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To: beethovenfan
I would have a signed Executive Order doing away with the EPA within 24 hours after being sworn in. It ends here!
32 posted on 06/11/2012 1:31:29 PM PDT by DoughtyOne (Republicanism: Y1 Rant Y2 Rant Y3 Rant Y4, Oh nevermind, vote for him anyway. Rinse & Repeat!)
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To: trubolotta
Nor do I. Furthermore, if the Dept. of Ed. has swat teams, how far behind can the EPA be, if they are behind at all.

Armed EPA Agents? - The Truth about Guns

33 posted on 06/11/2012 1:33:00 PM PDT by ProfoundBabe ("Every real thought on every real subject knocks the wind out of somebody or other." - OW Holmes)
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To: lowbridge
Dismantle the EPA down to three personnel and one small office,
and let them dicatate themselves into sitting in a corner, not the rest of us.



Unelected fascists are taking more power illegally, and under the guise of
some idiotic law that allows this BS if they deem it necessary for children
or whatever necessity they can spin up.


The idea here is for the EPA to make as many regulations (LAWS) possible to
make it impossible to piecemeal them to the supreme court. They believe that
it would take decades to stop just a few laws while they are enacting hundreds per month.

Congress not having the fortitude to do anything is the only way to stop
them, and the question is when or ever.

34 posted on 06/11/2012 1:33:54 PM PDT by MaxMax
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To: lowbridge

Nothing new really. When I worked for a retirement housing development company in the early 1990s the company was developing a project in Massachusetts near what had been a horse farm. A ground along a long used bridle path bordering the road to our site was depressed from decades of horse traffic. Because water collected there after heavy rains, state EPA officials ruled it to be a waterway. We were thus forced to purchase easements to build an alternative entrance to our site least we impeded this waterway.


35 posted on 06/11/2012 2:16:48 PM PDT by The Great RJ
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To: 21twelve

I’m no civil engineer, but I’m pretty sure those ditches that run along people’s front yards are there for a reason. They basically take the place of a storm drain. If you fill it in, the water will collect there and could run off into the street, other properties, etc. Private property is one thing, but the front several feet of your property is a pseudo public right of way.


36 posted on 06/11/2012 2:23:48 PM PDT by j_hig
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To: beethovenfan

You wrote: “The EPA is totally out of control and must be stopped.”

All Freepers need to look up “Agenda 21” and what the UN and Globalists are attempting to do.

Our County Republican Party is sponsoring an expert and frequent speaker about Agenda 21.

You all should do the same!


37 posted on 06/11/2012 2:28:27 PM PDT by Joe Marine 76 ("It's The Natural Born Citizenship, Stupid!")
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To: lowbridge

OK, here’s the rule: if they want to designate it a navigable waterway, the official in question is required to navigate it in a vessel of sufficient size to be used in commerce. No portage allowed.


38 posted on 06/11/2012 2:33:34 PM PDT by JimRed (Excising a cancer before it kills us waters the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW AND FOREVER!)
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To: 21twelve
A city truck happened to see him, and told him he couldn’t as it was the headwaters of the creek a half-mile away.

It must'a been one of them newfangled "smart" trucks!

;^)

39 posted on 06/11/2012 2:38:44 PM PDT by JimRed (Excising a cancer before it kills us waters the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW AND FOREVER!)
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To: FlingWingFlyer
Remember when the commie libs kept whining about President Bush trying to take away their rights, liberty and freedom? Where the hell are the lowlifes from the aCLU?

The commie libs don't believe property is a right. They believe that they are free and at liberty to confiscate property from you.

Of course, being endowed by my creator with certain inalienable rights including life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, I believe property IS life, and therefore my inalienable right.
40 posted on 06/11/2012 2:39:54 PM PDT by rottndog (Be Prepared....for what's coming AFTER America...)
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To: lowbridge

When my computer goes wacko, I reboot it.


41 posted on 06/11/2012 4:08:04 PM PDT by TexasRepublic (Socialism is the gospel of envy and the religion of thieves)
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To: trubolotta

The only solution is to dispand the EPA. I’m not holding my breath that the spineless twins McConnell and Boner have the will to do that.


42 posted on 06/11/2012 4:27:42 PM PDT by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (REPEAL OBAMACARE. Nothing else matters.)
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To: MichiganCheese

No doubt the US central government is on a quest to destroy both our constitutional rights and property rights. The better to control us.


43 posted on 06/11/2012 4:28:47 PM PDT by Freedom_Is_Not_Free (REPEAL OBAMACARE. Nothing else matters.)
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To: j_hig

Good point. Although lots of other homes don’t have ditches. I wonder if at some time in years long gone if the spring didn’t produce more water. Our yard, “upstream” of the spring, never had a ditch.


44 posted on 06/11/2012 4:37:10 PM PDT by 21twelve
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To: lowbridge

Several of the worst busybody, socialist NIMBYs in my area are living with “water rights” on a creek that flows down from the nearby mountains. Every one of them has been or is government-employed and complaining against every private sector family that they know of.

If you know similar commies with a similar situation, make sure that they are dealt with by their beloved EPA first. Chaos and starvation for the beast—not us. It’s time to go on the offensive.


45 posted on 06/11/2012 4:47:18 PM PDT by familyop ("Wanna cigarette? You're never too young to start." --Deacon, "Waterworld")
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To: lowbridge

EPA deserves to be 100% dismantled forever. It’s just a front for taking away regular citizens freedoms and liberty.


46 posted on 06/11/2012 5:27:37 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man (I can neither confirm or deny that; even if I could, I couldn't - it's classified.)
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To: trubolotta; Freedom_Is_Not_Free; rcrngroup
"Nor do I. Furthermore, if the Dept. of Ed. has swat teams, how far behind can the EPA be, if they are behind at all."

Armed EPA Agents Visit Asheville Man
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2892453/posts

The EPA also uses drones to spy on farmers and ranchers. IMO, farmers should prepare to get by for a few years and shut down agriculture for a time.

Have fun. Enjoy the slide.


47 posted on 06/11/2012 5:36:35 PM PDT by familyop ("Wanna cigarette? You're never too young to start." --Deacon, "Waterworld")
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To: lowbridge

Florida is getting the EPA’s California treatment!


48 posted on 06/11/2012 5:49:34 PM PDT by Randy Larsen (I hate pragmatists!)
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To: 383rr; TEXOKIE; ELVISNIXON.com; SunkenCiv; E. Pluribus Unum; CharlyFord; cripplecreek; ...
Thanks for the ping. You're damn right this is of interest. We've been trying to wake people up and rally the troops for years, but folks just aren't interested until it impacts them.

"When they came for the shoreline property, I didn't stand up because I live inland. When they came for the wells, I didn't act because I have muni district water" - ...and so on. Now they are coming for everyone.

The time to get people to understand how vulnerable every citizen is is running out fast.

I deal with the EPA and the Department of Ecology in my business as well as being part of an active property rights group. Believe me----
THE ENVIRONMENTAL MOVEMENT HAS VERY LITTLE TO DO WITH THE ENVIRONMENT!

49 posted on 06/11/2012 6:18:32 PM PDT by Baynative (REMEMBER: Without America there is no free world!)
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BTW-Ya'all do know that Obama has given the EPA the ability to create and ENFORCE it's own law, don't you?
50 posted on 06/11/2012 6:26:11 PM PDT by Baynative (REMEMBER: Without America there is no free world!)
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