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Protesters pack heat in Birmingham public meeting(MI)
clickondetroit.com ^ | 11 June, 2012 | NA

Posted on 06/12/2012 7:01:42 AM PDT by marktwain

BIRMINGHAM, Mich. -

Gun carrying protestors let their voices be heard during a Birmingham City Commission meeting.

A number of protestors came armed with AK-47’s, a variation of rifles and pistols during Monday night’s meeting. The advocates of Michigan’s open carry law attended the meeting to support a young man who was arrested for openly carrying a weapon.

“We understand that it’s not something that’s apart of the public norm or something you see in everyday life, but there is not a law against it,” said open carry advocate Phillip Hofmeister.

Sean Combs, 18, from Troy was arrested back in April after he was spotted with a loaded rifle slung across his back in downtown Birmingham.

According to Combs, he did nothing illegal. His lawyer wants to see the charges against him dropped, which range from brandishing a firearm to obstructing an officer.

“You stand up for your rights period, regardless of what the right may be you stand up for it. So even if it’s a firearm right, if you want a firearm you have to stand up for those rights,” said Combs.

“He has no driving tickets, no parking tickets, no speeding tickets, or any kind of ticket. I would hate to see his record marked by this especially when he did everything legally right,” said Sean’s mother Pam Combs.

Combs, his mother and attorney did not attend the meeting.

“I hope that council sees that good people carry guns,” said Hofmeister.

Combs pleaded not guilty to all charges.

(Excerpt) Read more at clickondetroit.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; News/Current Events; US: Michigan
KEYWORDS: banglist; birmingham; combs; donutwatch; mi; michigan; opencarry
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If the police can claim that you are resisting and obstructing the police by exercising your Constitutional rights, then you do not have Constitutional rights.

Video at the site.

1 posted on 06/12/2012 7:01:49 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

Even though it’s legal and I’m all for open-carry, why would an 18yo carry a loaded rifle into a downtown area? That just doesn’t sound smart. He may as well have been waving a flag and yelling ‘look at me’.


2 posted on 06/12/2012 7:08:10 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: marktwain

USC Title 18. Section 242. Deprivation of Civil Rights under color of
law. It’s a felony. The cops that arrested this kid need to be charged in turn.


3 posted on 06/12/2012 7:08:53 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (Steampunk- Yesterday's Tomorrow, Today)
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To: Springman; sergeantdave; cyclotic; netmilsmom; RatsDawg; PGalt; FreedomHammer; queenkathy; ...
If I'm still missing anyone from the pinglist let me know.

Image Hosted by ImageShack.us
4 posted on 06/12/2012 7:13:37 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: marktwain

I have a CCL. I would NEVER consider carrying a weapon openly. It’s not about protection when they do this.

It’s a stupid, stupid, stupid idea.

They can’t leave well enough alone. Just to be able to carry should be enough.

Did I mention, it is a stupid, stupid idea.


5 posted on 06/12/2012 7:14:19 AM PDT by TribalPrincess2U (Criminaliens or Crimigrants...0bamao's people?)
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To: stuartcr

We used to carry guns like that in my hometown into the 1990s when I still lived there. Used to carry them right into the grocery store and even the bank.

Nobody even flinched about it. They just assumed we were on our way to the woods.


6 posted on 06/12/2012 7:20:17 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: marktwain

I grew up in Birmingham. It is a very well to do suburb of Detroit. It is one of the most desirable suburbs to live in with home values starting at around a half million. I would have to win the lottery just to move back there.

When we lived there, the police were viewed as a joke since nothing really big happened there. If the charges are not dropped, then the city will probably face a law suit. Publicity that the city does not want.

What is ironic is that there were ( and are) Birmingham kids that are using drugs and are probably stoned in Shane Park and other public places in B’ham. Are the police doing anything about it? Based on my experience when I lived there, no.


7 posted on 06/12/2012 7:22:34 AM PDT by TMA62 (Al Sharpton - The North Korea of race relations)
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To: marktwain
then you do not have Constitutional rights.

No one has Constitutional rights.

We all have Constitutionally protected rights. The document only outlines the limits placed on our government. Any rights mentioned there were granted to us at birth by our Creator.

I know this is something you knew. Just picking nits since it is critical that we all understand the distinction.

8 posted on 06/12/2012 7:22:52 AM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (My dog, yes. My wife, maybe. My gun....NEVER!)
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To: stuartcr
Even though it’s legal and I’m all for open-carry, why would an 18yo carry a loaded rifle into a downtown area? That just doesn’t sound smart. He may as well have been waving a flag and yelling ‘look at me’.

Umm, that was clearly his intent. They want this fight, and it will lead to some interesting debate if they get it rolling.

9 posted on 06/12/2012 7:24:15 AM PDT by Teacher317 ('Tis time to fear when tyrants seem to kiss.)
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To: cripplecreek
"We used to carry guns like that in my hometown into the 1990s when I still lived there. Used to carry them right into the grocery store and even the bank.

Nobody even flinched about it. They just assumed we were on our way to the woods."

Sean Combs, 18, from Troy was arrested back in April after he was spotted with a loaded rifle slung across his back in downtown Birmingham.

********************************

Agreed. Imho, the police overreacted.

10 posted on 06/12/2012 7:25:22 AM PDT by trisham (Zen is not easy. It takes effort to attain nothingness. And then what do you have? Bupkis.)
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To: stuartcr

Actually, waving a flag and yelling ‘look at me’ could conceivably, depending on the circumstances, constitute disorderly conduct or a breach of the peace (on the other hand, it might just be the preliminary part of an exercise of free speech, if once people were looking at the flag-waver he went on to communicate something either by the content of the flag or saying something besides ‘look at me’.)

In this case, the young man was simply exercising his natural *and* constitutionally-protected right to bear arms. Why? Maybe as an oblique reminder that we all have that right, maybe because he found out that the right to bear arms is untrammeled by Michigan law if the arms are borne openly and he thought it would simply be cool to exercise his rights, maybe because he was on his way on foot to a rifle range or other place where discharging the rifle would not have been a breach of the peace. It doesn’t matter why: the cops and the prosecutor are depriving him of his civil rights under color of law and should be so charge and prosecuted themselves and the young man should go free and be compensated for the maltreatment by law enforcement.


11 posted on 06/12/2012 7:26:39 AM PDT by The_Reader_David (And when they behead your own people in the wars which are to come, then you will know. . .)
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To: The_Reader_David
The Constitution of the State of Michigan of 1963 Article 1, Section 6 reads:

Every person has a right to keep and bear arms for the defense of himself and the state.
12 posted on 06/12/2012 7:30:38 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: stuartcr
He may as well have been waving a flag and yelling ‘look at me’.

He very well may have been doing that. If so, we need more like him.

13 posted on 06/12/2012 7:36:04 AM PDT by Balding_Eagle (Liberals, at their core, are aggressive & dangerous to everyone around them,)
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To: marktwain

Free men own guns, slaves don’t.


14 posted on 06/12/2012 7:37:05 AM PDT by BuffaloJack (End the racist, anti-capitalist Obama War On Freedom.)
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To: cripplecreek

I did too when I was a kid in rural Wisconsin. Did you live in an affluent suburb of Detroit?


15 posted on 06/12/2012 7:38:44 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: Teacher317

Obviously they already have open-carry. What do they want to fight? The cops attitudes? I don’t think it was very smart.


16 posted on 06/12/2012 7:42:38 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: The_Reader_David

Maybe he was a muslim terrorist? Perhaps they were profiling?

I agree, charges should be dropped, but he should also try to be smarter and people shouldn’t be so surprised that the police accosted him.


17 posted on 06/12/2012 7:46:42 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: stuartcr
Did you live in an affluent suburb of Detroit?

Nope. Not sure it makes any difference.
18 posted on 06/12/2012 7:47:29 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Balding_Eagle

Why? They already have open-carry.


19 posted on 06/12/2012 7:47:47 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: cripplecreek

Really? ok then


20 posted on 06/12/2012 7:48:34 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: Balding_Eagle
This freaky looking young guy wanders the streets of Jackson armed all the time. On the day of this protest I noticed that he seems to be very well known and friendly with police.

Photobucket
21 posted on 06/12/2012 7:53:13 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: stuartcr
Obviously they already have open-carry. What do they want to fight? The cops attitudes?

Obviously, the police need to be educated. If the police arrest you for exercising a constitutionally protected right, it is clear that some serious education is called for.

22 posted on 06/12/2012 7:56:49 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

Just think, if the kid hadn’t walked through dowtown with a rifle, the police might still need educating but no one would know it, and the city could save money and officers time. Still think it’s stupid and brings negative attention.


23 posted on 06/12/2012 8:01:05 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: stuartcr
Why? They already have open-carry.

If it's on the books, it's not in the minds of the police, and it needs to be planted there too.

24 posted on 06/12/2012 8:08:54 AM PDT by Balding_Eagle (Liberals, at their core, are aggressive & dangerous to everyone around them,)
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To: Balding_Eagle

You don’t think the police know about the open-carry law in their own state? I’m sure it’s not on their minds all the time, as it’s a dumb thing to do and they probably don’t expect someone to be walking around an affluent dowtown area with a loaded rifle.


25 posted on 06/12/2012 8:18:15 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: TribalPrincess2U
I have debated that on several threads about open carry...its stupid on several counts...if someone is looking for trouble, the first one they take out is the idiot open carrying a gun...Its not for self defense in those cases, its an in your face I got a gun attitude...The guy you want to be afraid of is the one with the concealed gun, you never know who that guy is...

My dad retired from the detroit mounted division after 25 years....he open carried all those years. When he retired he concealed carry...it was for defense not for being a smart ass show off..

There is no legitiment reason to open carry, like you say except to yell out LOOK AT ME I HAVE A GUN. Then the bad guy can take you out first...it then becomes LOOK AT ME I HAVE A GUN AND AM DEAD.....

I want the guy with the concealed weapon close to me....

26 posted on 06/12/2012 8:21:29 AM PDT by goat granny
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To: goat granny
What makes you more of a target? Looking like a threat? Or looking like easy pickings?

You have logic fail.

either way, it should be an individual choice. The Right of the people to Keep and BEAR arms, shall not be infringed.

Period. Open, concealed, blade, blackpowder, machine gun, anti-aircraft canons, GAU-8, or a fully appointed Navy Destroyer...

Shall not be infringed.

27 posted on 06/12/2012 8:26:48 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (Steampunk- Yesterday's Tomorrow, Today)
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To: Dead Corpse

Shall not be infringed. It may be “stupid” to open carry, but it is your God-given right. I’m all for freedom. In some circumstances, some of us choose to mkeep quiet rather than speaking-up. It is a choice. It is freedom. The cops need educated...possibly by lawsuit.


28 posted on 06/12/2012 8:37:03 AM PDT by hal ogen (First Amendment or Reeducation Camp?)
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To: stuartcr; All
You don’t think the police know about the open-carry law in their own state?

If they do, and they still arrested this patriotic young man, then they should be fired for corruption.

If they do not, then they need to be educated. This case is getting a fair amount of publicity, so quite a number will be educated.

29 posted on 06/12/2012 8:37:17 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

I imagine that if a person wants to open-carry, then they already know their states laws.


30 posted on 06/12/2012 8:44:16 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: goat granny
f someone is looking for trouble, the first one they take out is the idiot open carrying a gun.

And that's why we need more people carrying openly and concealed.
31 posted on 06/12/2012 8:49:35 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Dead Corpse

A difference of opinion is what makes a horse race...but I have noticed that the open carry opinions never go open carry in the inner cities. They wouldn’t make it 2 blocks. And no one would know which direction the shots came from....Those that use their guns for self defense don’t advertise it...they have nothing to prove to others...just a difference of opinion....


32 posted on 06/12/2012 8:58:37 AM PDT by goat granny
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To: stuartcr
Even though it’s legal and I’m all for open-carry, why would an 18yo carry a loaded rifle into a downtown area?

Maybe because according to law he is a second class citizen, he is only 18 and cannot get a concealed carry permit.

33 posted on 06/12/2012 9:06:10 AM PDT by Ratman83
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To: TribalPrincess2U

Consider this, until age 21 he is not allowed to carry a hand gun nor obtain a concealed carry license. So he put his long gun over his shoulder and went to town, legally.


34 posted on 06/12/2012 9:08:37 AM PDT by W. W. SMITH (Maybe the horse will learn to sing)
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To: Ratman83

So why carry a rifle dowtown?


35 posted on 06/12/2012 9:09:27 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: Dead Corpse

You are correct, shall not be infringed. But because the state is already infringing on his rights he had to carry this way. The state infringes when it says he cannot purchase a handgun, therefore he has no choice but to carry openly.


36 posted on 06/12/2012 9:11:33 AM PDT by Ratman83
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To: stuartcr

Because he is going from one place to another, because he wanted to or maybe for no reason at all, he needs no reason. He is a free man and breaking no laws so why not.


37 posted on 06/12/2012 9:16:13 AM PDT by Ratman83
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To: goat granny
but I have noticed that the open carry opinions never go open carry in the inner cities. They wouldn’t make it 2 blocks.

You ain't looking. There are open carry groups in the inner city.

Open Carry Being Encouraged in Detroit . . .
38 posted on 06/12/2012 9:17:44 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: goat granny
They wouldn’t make it 2 blocks.

Without the SWAT team being called out on them.

I agree. Inner cities are liberal controlled hell holes that no one in their right mind should ever want to visit.

39 posted on 06/12/2012 9:18:29 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (Steampunk- Yesterday's Tomorrow, Today)
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To: Ratman83

Why not? Because all of this doesn’t have to happen. I don’t think getting in peoples’ faces about gun rights is the smart thing to do, even though it’s legal. He’s old enough to carry a loaded weapon, he should be smart enough to know what will probably happen. All this is going to do, is cost the taxpayers money. There’s no law that will be changed or corrected.


40 posted on 06/12/2012 9:27:07 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: stuartcr

Both reasons you cited are good reasons for someone to open carry.

No need for you to bolster my arguments for me, I can do that on my on.


41 posted on 06/12/2012 9:32:46 AM PDT by Balding_Eagle (Liberals, at their core, are aggressive & dangerous to everyone around them,)
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To: stuartcr
I don’t think getting in peoples’ faces about gun rights is the smart thing to do

He wasn't getting in anyone's face, he was walking down the street.
42 posted on 06/12/2012 9:33:38 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: stuartcr
Why not? Because all of this doesn’t have to happen. I don’t think getting in peoples’ faces about gun rights is the smart thing to do, even though it’s legal. He’s old enough to carry a loaded weapon, he should be smart enough to know what will probably happen.

All of this does not have to happen if the police follow the law. Why should you, I or this 18 year old have to follow the law but the police do not. You want to restrict the rights of a law abiding citizen, why do you want to do that.

All this is going to do, is cost the taxpayers money.

The cost to the taxpayers is because of the police and the prosecutor. They are the ones who broke the law and are wasting taxpayer money; the kid is not spending a cent of taxpayer money except for that which is provided for in the constitution (I mean a public defender possibly).

There’s no law that will be changed or corrected.

That is correct it is the mindset of the police, the prosecutor and possibly you that need to be changed. The state should not be trampling our rights and we should not let them do it nor should we encourage them to do so.

43 posted on 06/12/2012 9:44:35 AM PDT by Ratman83
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To: goat granny; TribalPrincess2U
There is no legitiment reason to open carry, like you say except to yell out LOOK AT ME I HAVE A GUN.

I disagree; while it can be true that you're saying "I have a gun" with open carry it does not necessarily make it the point of open carry. While deployed overseas I, and all of my company, were carrying openly. Yes, we were in a warzone, and in uniform, but that is irrelevant to this conversation because the point is that we were all openly carrying for purposes other than "look at me." (Quick, unfettered access.)

Even so, "look at me" may be needed in order to raise awareness among the general populous (yes, it does impact comfort zones to think about why someone might feel the need to be armed), and that may be needed in order to avoid a [real] warzone over here.
In truth though, the NDAA recognizes the continental US as a warzone, so the argument "he's not in a warzone" doesn't apply any more.

44 posted on 06/12/2012 9:48:50 AM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: stuartcr
So why carry a rifle dowtown?

There plenty of possible reasons; here's one:
His car wasn't working and he needed/wanted to take the gun to a gunsmith for repairs, accessories, whatever.

45 posted on 06/12/2012 9:52:33 AM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: OneWingedShark

Even into the early 80s it was fine to bring guns to my school for hunting purposes after school. If you drove they had to stay in your car. They couldn’t be carried on the bus so a parent had to bring you and the gun left in the office. I rode my bike to school with a gun and left it in the office a few times as well.

In those days, walking around with a gun wasn’t activism, it was transporting it. Our local cops never gave us a second look if they saw us with a gun.


46 posted on 06/12/2012 9:57:45 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: TribalPrincess2U
I have a CCL. I would NEVER consider carrying a weapon openly. It’s not about protection when they do this.

Glad you have a CCL, unfortunately this citizen is not allowed to have one, so concealed carry is not an option for him. He has already been made a second class citizen by the state.

They can’t leave well enough alone. Just to be able to carry should be enough.

Obviously you have missed the point, he could not carry. The police, the state and you feel that he cannot carry. You are all upset that he did carry just like the police were upset. If he could carry then the police would not have arrested him.

47 posted on 06/12/2012 10:01:06 AM PDT by Ratman83
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To: cripplecreek

Interesting blog, but under comments even some of the retired cops opt for concealed weapons and not open carry...the bad guys are all carrying concealed. My granddaughter graduated from U of M and is living in Detroit. Needless to say it bothers me some, but when I went to her apartment, is was a nice old home in Cork Town. She recently moved, staying in that area, and hope she soon has a CC weapon. A shotgun in the bedroom also is a good idea. As somenme told me, the thief will head for the bedroom, with the bed between you and the door and the sound of a shot gun being racked can change a lot of minds. It doesn’t necessaryily need a great shot at that distance, the doorway frames the thief pretty good..


48 posted on 06/12/2012 10:11:39 AM PDT by goat granny
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To: goat granny

I have yet to see ANY evidence that an openly carried weapon draws fire.


49 posted on 06/12/2012 10:18:16 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Dead Corpse
****I agree. Inner cities are liberal controlled hell holes that no one in their right mind should ever want to visit.******

I had to chuckle at that remark...:O) My granddaughter graduated for U of M a few years ago and lives in Detroit. Its a worry for me but she is due to get her gun permit...Her place is nice and in a relativly nice area of detroit...A nasty dog is next on the list...:O)

There is an area of artists that have moved into the area. She graduated with a Fine Arts degree...

50 posted on 06/12/2012 10:19:52 AM PDT by goat granny
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