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An endless stall (NY Says No to Fracking)
New York Post ^ | June 14, 2012 | Staff

Posted on 06/14/2012 7:28:11 AM PDT by C19fan

Will hydraulic fracturing ever come to New York? And if it does, will it be sufficiently commonplace to actually boost Upstate’s sadly dilapidated economy? These are fair questions — given that the Cuomo administration has slowed the approval process for the controversial natural-gas-extraction method to a crawl. And now comes word, via a careful leak to The New York Times, that Team Cuomo is pushing a plan that would severely limit both the number of drilling permits and their location to just a few counties. And even that assumes that the process itself is approved by the Department of Environmental Conservation — which is still a mighty big if.

(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; News/Current Events; US: New York
KEYWORDS: fracking; newyorkfracking
New York state beyond Orange County should be allowed to succeed.
1 posted on 06/14/2012 7:28:23 AM PDT by C19fan
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To: C19fan

I think NY is part of Cuba now.....


2 posted on 06/14/2012 7:33:53 AM PDT by EagleUSA
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To: C19fan

re: “controversial natural-gas-extraction method”

It is only controversial if you are dead-set against carbon based energy production. The technique works. It is not particularly new. Using it below water bearing strata/aquifers has been done in many places. It works so well, that in many areas, the price of gas has dropped to below the cost of production. Life is good if you are gas consumer. I imagine the good folks in Pennsylvania are hoping the gas on the NY side percolates over to their wells.


3 posted on 06/14/2012 7:38:10 AM PDT by RedElement
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To: EagleUSA
The amazingly, incredible infusion of tax money the land owners would infuse to the state in a relatively short time would boggle the politicians' minds.

My little 2.25 acre piece of SW Pa got me 13K plus that I had to pay taxes on.

I'm a gnat compared to the hundreds of acre owners around here .. just in my community.

The state is awash in tax revenue because of the gas companies and drilling/fracking.

4 posted on 06/14/2012 7:39:13 AM PDT by knarf (I say things that are true ... I have no proof ... but they're true)
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To: C19fan

And so the effort to depopulate the Adirondack park and the rest of upstate NY via Agenda 21 continues unabated.

I miss the geography but not the geopolitics.


5 posted on 06/14/2012 7:41:58 AM PDT by Norm Lenhart
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To: C19fan
New York sees that taxes can be eliminated like the Dakota plan so they are dead set against losing their tax strangle hold on their peeons.
6 posted on 06/14/2012 7:47:26 AM PDT by mountainlion (I am voting for Sarah after getting screwed again by the DC Thugs.)
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To: knarf
The New York City Water Authority owns a fantastic chunk of the land where fraking could be used. A lot of the rest is in use as public parks, charitable trusts (owned by the government), and a wide variety of other boutique activities.

They used eminent domain early in the last century to force sale of that land to the government or the government's agents for the primary purpose of serving as a watershed with limited public access.

The second they allow another use for the property they'll definitely have some heirs and assigns telling them "let's open those original land sales up again ~ there's no attainder of blood and you are misusing your authority".

I know I'll be there with a lawyer or two! Get your genealogies in order for a piece of the big prize ~ gas from New York! And it's outta' sight!

Otherwise there's not a lot of privately owned land in the area and a lot of that is tied up in family trusts owned by the grandchildren of the NYC Mob families.

Cuomo may know what he's doing here ~ and I really hate to say it.

7 posted on 06/14/2012 7:48:01 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Norm Lenhart
The original issue was watershed for the water supply for New York City ~ a commendable enough issue. That's long before Agenda 21 was thought of, or even the United Nations, or actually, Euclid V. Ambler with its authorization of planning and zoning.

Yes, the long term idea has been to remove as much potentially contaminating activity from the Adirondaks as possible so that New York City denizens can drink water.

Alternatives are limited. You got an idea about how to do it, tell it to them.

8 posted on 06/14/2012 7:51:39 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: C19fan

I wonder if NY will soon turn into Detroit?


9 posted on 06/14/2012 7:52:24 AM PDT by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote; then find me a real conservative to vote for)
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To: RedElement
my sister in law's family is reaking tons of money in upper, western Pa......

its too bad about NYS...my home state....all of its resources yet a govt that restricts it at every turn....

must be that Cuomo and the rats aren't getting enough under the table money from the drillers...

10 posted on 06/14/2012 7:54:58 AM PDT by cherry
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To: C19fan

Hypocritical environmentalists supported wind power until the cost/benefit started looking reasonable.

Now, wind power murders birds, disrupts bats and are an eyesore across our land.

Hypocritical environmentalists supported natural gas until we found hundreds of years worth of supply under our feet.

Now, natural gas is evil, unsafe and needs to be stopped.

The pattern is clear.


11 posted on 06/14/2012 7:58:25 AM PDT by Erik Latranyi (When religions have to beg the gov't for a waiver, we are already under socialism.)
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To: cherry

Cuomo has to run for re-election next year. He is not going to disrupt the environmental/Hollywood money train yet.

When re-elected, expect Cuomo to approve fracking everywhere.


12 posted on 06/14/2012 8:01:34 AM PDT by Erik Latranyi (When religions have to beg the gov't for a waiver, we are already under socialism.)
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To: muawiyah

When I grew up in the blue line, water was one of a number of issues the greens pushed. The eradication of the logging industry had nothing to do with water. That;s just their latest excuse.

A21 and a number of other green plans target the upstate area. No, it isn’t the first, won’t be the last and no ‘suggestions’ thousands of which have been offered by individuals, groups and legislators alike will be accepted if they interfere with the agenda.

Take a look at how the Sierra Club took over Whitney Park as an example. That was just disgusting. Last I heard that’s their new Adk private retreat.


13 posted on 06/14/2012 8:05:23 AM PDT by Norm Lenhart
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To: C19fan

My question is . . If Northeast libtards tax each other to death and freeze in the dark . . and if inner city thugs shoot each other . . . and feminazis abort female babies . . and homos marry each other and fail to procreate . . What happens to the Democrat party?


14 posted on 06/14/2012 8:08:10 AM PDT by 2nd Amendment
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To: C19fan
The Fracking HOAX replaces the Global warming HOAX. These Marxists have to have something to hate. Our Governor Coomo was PRO fracking, but the Communists got to him. We want to be the next Colliefournia. We are driving businesses and wealthy taxpayers out of the state, just like Colliefournia.

I closed my business and retired. I am so sick of regulations and gubmit interference that I got out of the grind at my first opportunity. So sorry for the rest of you not old enough to drop out.

15 posted on 06/14/2012 8:13:02 AM PDT by faucetman ( Just the facts, ma'am, Just the facts)
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To: muawiyah

Oh BS!

Fracking isn’t going to do one thing regarding water.
NYC is not the be all of NY although it is most amenable to Liberal control - How about move technology forward and stop getting in the way of progress in America instated of nonsensical green enviro nut issues.


16 posted on 06/14/2012 8:17:44 AM PDT by bill1952 (Choice is an illusion created between those with power - and those without)
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To: C19fan
“Team Cuomo is pushing a plan that would severely limit both the number of drilling permits and their location to just a few counties.”

Instead of a COMPLETE ban. Trying to get SOMETHING so they can maybe expand it later. They are trying to prevent an all out ban, which appears likely.

17 posted on 06/14/2012 8:17:55 AM PDT by faucetman ( Just the facts, ma'am, Just the facts)
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To: bill1952
As usual someone doesn't read the response ~ just what he's made up in his own mind to answer.

Fraking won't do a darned thing to the water, you know that, I know that, Cuomo knows that, everybody knows that.

Now, tell it to the several million voters in NYC first and get back to me with your answer ~ I just whizzed right on by that problem since it's obvious that the science isn't relevant when you have the original political problem.

Now, regarding the billions of dollars the government could make on the taxes ~ on government owned land.

Well, there, you see that's the greater part of the problem. The benefit to New York state is minimal ~ since so much of this territory is owned by New York City!

About private use of land ~ there is some of course but not as much as you imagine.

On the other hand if they change the use of this land (having gone to court to force the sale through eminent domain for a specific purpose ~ water for NYC) what happens is people like me find lawyers and we go to court and ask that the land revert to the owners/heirs since the terms of the taking were violated. We then drill for gas, do all the fraking we want, and the people in NYC can just go take a hike.

Do you see the problem for Cuomo? He's between a rock (shale) and a hard place (Democrats become unviable in NYC).

BTW, everybody knew New York would be the hardest sell for any of this because of the political problems. The science didn't change just because it jumped a stateline.

18 posted on 06/14/2012 8:34:42 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: RedElement

There is no shortage of New York license plates working the gas fields around here in SW Pennsylvania.


19 posted on 06/14/2012 8:35:31 AM PDT by Vigilanteman (Obama: Fake black man. Fake Messiah. Fake American. How many fakes can you fit in one Zer0?)
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To: Erik Latranyi
Windpower has never looked reasonable ~ without subsidies it's a loser.

Enviros stopped worrying about it when governments cut off the subsidies. The current technology is simply not advantageous. Maybe someday they'll figure out to build some sort of magnetohydrodynamic device or grid that charges up as the air passes overhead. Until then, everybody knows it's just a waste of perfectly good steel, aluminum and fiberglass.

20 posted on 06/14/2012 8:39:59 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: C19fan

It’s time to prohibit the export of energy in any form to the Northeast. Let them produce their own and, if they import it from abroad, make them refine it in their own backyard.

Pennsylvania and New Jersey could do this by themselves by declaring that the environmental hazards of pipelines, power lines, and truck/train shipments of fossil fuels were too high to bear simply to accommodate states that refused to produce energy. Or you could draw the line through PA-DE, PA-MD, OH-WV-VA, etc. Lots of possible combinations. The point is, the northeast is a diseased appendix that could be easily quarantined.

Let ‘em freeze in the dark.


21 posted on 06/14/2012 8:45:22 AM PDT by sphinx
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To: C19fan

What was that line??? Something about illegitimately-conceived progeny should hasten their demise by hypothermia without the benefit of artificial light??? It was a really snappy comeback to situations such as this back in the 80s...

;-)


22 posted on 06/14/2012 8:46:52 AM PDT by T-Bird45 (It feels like the seventies, and it shouldn't.)
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To: bill1952
Every time you say "BS" you are undertaking a personal attack on me. Cut it out. I'm just giving you the bad news ~ most of the land involved is already owned by the government of New York City for the purpose of providing water to the taxpayers and industries of New York City.

They'll be the ones to ultimately decide if they want to also pump gas, and when they do I'm going to go after it myself in the exercise of my own property rights.

Why do you want to get in my way?

23 posted on 06/14/2012 8:53:26 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: cherry

Upstate NY is beautiful but dying.......they have taxed the industry right out of the state, I swear if they could figure out a way to tax every breath one takes, they would do it


24 posted on 06/14/2012 8:59:24 AM PDT by Kimmers (Fair isn't everybody getting the same thing, fair is getting what you need to be successful)
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To: C19fan

When will the New Yorkers realize that they have been sold down the toilet by communists Democrats?


25 posted on 06/14/2012 9:04:11 AM PDT by Logical me
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To: muawiyah

So in NY state, water for the city of NY takes precedence over local needs, but in AZ, the city of Tombstone is forbidden from maintaining waterways and reservoirs which supply the city because those waterways pass through federal land.

Interesting.

NY has so much natural gas that it is not uncommon for farmers in the Northern part of the state to pump their own gas to run their farms. I met a woman at a conference who told me about this. She was a music teacher at a local community college and lived on a farm.

NY would do much better to reassure people that the state oversight of drilling and fracking practices would be thorough and protective of drinking water, with regulations that would include the drilling companies paying for all damages to water systems.


26 posted on 06/14/2012 9:05:18 AM PDT by Eva
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To: Norm Lenhart

A pox upon the whole of New Yawk State. Having graduated from high school upstate, and having attended a secondary school in the Big Sh*tty, IMHO, the state is as treasonous now as it was when the Tory’s were a major faction during the Revlutionary War.

Let their beloved gubbament feed and cloth them. Then they will get what their imported Senator thinks the proles should get.

Those fools imported and elected the HillaBeast, thus earning all their misery.


27 posted on 06/14/2012 9:10:51 AM PDT by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon freedom, it is necessary to examine principles."...the public interest)
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To: muawiyah

“Alternatives are limited. You got an idea about how to do it, tell it to them.”

In response to your request for input:
1. Declare NYC to be critical habitat.
2. Import bear, puma, and wolves to ‘recreate historic populations”.
3. Allow only conservatives to determine the carrying capacity of the new habitat.
4. Diligently disarm all the prey organisms (previously known as Urban Ferals and over taxed Libtards) to assure no loss of precious Predators during feeding or the certain to occur ‘killing frenzies’.
5. Wait until the predator population has increased to the point of becoming a ‘predator pit’, then sell safari permits to cull the excess predators.


28 posted on 06/14/2012 9:17:48 AM PDT by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon freedom, it is necessary to examine principles."...the public interest)
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To: Logical me

“When will the New Yorkers realize that they have been sold down the toilet by communists Democrats?”

Never happen.

To their end, the leftist liberal “cidiots” and downstaters will go their last breaths blaming the “Republicans”, the “evil capitalists”, the “greedy corporations”, and Bush.

They are true believers, and will never change.


29 posted on 06/14/2012 10:05:42 AM PDT by Road Glide
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To: C19fan

in a few years the NY-PA state line is going to resemble the DMZ in Korea...


30 posted on 06/14/2012 10:08:23 AM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: C19fan

Agreed!


31 posted on 06/14/2012 10:16:59 AM PDT by b4its2late (A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own.)
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To: muawiyah
BTW, everybody knew New York would be the hardest sell for any of this because of the political problems.

Illinois is not far behind. According to an editorial in the June 3 Champaign News Gazette our speaker of the house Madigan threw a monkey wrench in southern Illinois fracking by "calling for a two year moratorium on horizontal hydraulic fracturing and for the creation of a 13 member task force that would gather information and make recommendations about regulating fracking in Illinois."

32 posted on 06/14/2012 10:36:54 AM PDT by Western Phil
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To: Western Phil
But what's her real motive ~ can't be fresh water ~ like they have Lake Michigan right there!

I suspect Mad-again is, as usual, simply mad and imagines being against fraking is highly popular ~ well, it is in her circles, but none of us know any of those people.

Who owns the mineral rights is probably own the minds of some legal beagle there and he'll get rich off any conflict.

33 posted on 06/14/2012 11:40:16 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: knarf

“...The state is awash in tax revenue because of the gas companies and drilling/fracking...”

::::::::::::

Something TOTALLY outside the grasp or admission of a radical, America-hating, “envirowhacko”-pandering socialist like Obama. A clear and present danger to America and its wants and needs.....an understatement.


34 posted on 06/14/2012 2:55:12 PM PDT by EagleUSA
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To: muawiyah

BS


35 posted on 06/14/2012 7:09:56 PM PDT by bill1952 (Choice is an illusion created between those with power - and those without)
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