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Romney’s conversion on abortion - Is it authentic?
LifeSite News ^ | June 18, 2012 | Dr. Jack Willke

Posted on 06/20/2012 7:41:28 AM PDT by hocndoc

The conversion of a political candidate prior to an election is naturally met with questions and even skepticism. Mitt Romney has been no exception. It has led even the casual observer to say, “Is this authentic?”

In History

To fully understand why this can be true, we must first review some history. Pro-life conversions have happened in the past at the highest levels of politics. Central to this was President H. W. Bush. As a vice presidential candidate, George Bush changed his position from pro-abortion to pro-life after a lengthy meeting with me.

My relationship with George H. W. Bush, who was to eventually become president, began in August 1980. Mr. Bush and Ronald Reagan had run against each other in the Republican primary. Reagan won that race and was nominated for president at the Republican National Convention in Detroit. During the primary campaign, it was evident the two men did not see eye-toeye on several issues. Most of us had the distinct impression that while Ronald Reagan was quite pro-life, George Bush was not.

At the convention, Reagan—probably for political reasons—chose George H. W. Bush as his vice presidential running mate. This came as quite a surprise to us, and immediately presented a problem. I had just been elected president of the National Right to Life Committee. We very much wanted to have our people support the Reagan ticket, but now it was complicated because his running mate seemed to be proabortion. I decided to see what I could do to change the situation.

On the last day of the convention, I took an elevator in the Pontchartrain Hotel up to the 14th floor, which was Republican headquarters, and knocked on the door. I explained who I was and asked to talk to Mr. Bush. The young lady answering the door seemed somewhat taken aback as I explained that this was important for the upcoming election.

A few minutes later she came back and said, “Mr. Casey will be seeing you.” Bill Casey later became head of the Central Intelligence Agency, and I would become well acquainted with him. We sat and talked for a bit. Mr. Casey was quite sympathetic to our issue, and said that he would arrange for me to meet Mr. Bush.

After about 30 minutes, I was ushered into what obviously had been a committee meeting room. The smoke still hung heavy, and there were a number of folding tables, some with empty drink glasses and cups. Mr. Bush got up from his chair and came over, shook my hand, and we sat down alone in the room. I explained who I was and that we supported Ronald Reagan’s pro-life stand. We wanted to support the ticket, but there seemed to be some real question about his position on our issue. Due to that uncertainty, I didn’t know whether pro-life people would support the ticket.

Mr. Bush thanked me for my straightforward comments and said, “Let me tell you where I stand.” I held up my hand, interrupted and said, “Please don’t. I think perhaps if I could brief you on this entire issue, then you could think this over and I might possibly change some of your thinking. I would like to give you a professional briefing.”

Mr. Bush relaxed, sat back, smiled and said, “I think that is a good idea, Doctor.” He fished for his business card and said, “We are all taking some time off now, but when we get back to Washington, call. I’ll have (he mentioned her name) set you up with an appointment.” I said, “I would like to be very respectful here, sir, but that won’t be sufficient.” “Oh,” he looked at me. “To do this right would take the better part of three or four hours and that is what I’d like to request from you.” He almost swallowed his teeth. “Four hours?” I interrupted and said, “Of course I would like to change your opinion and make you pro-life. I am probably not going to do that. But if I can report in our National Right to Life News that you were so interested in this issue and so respectful of it that you gave me this kind of time, that is going to make a profound impression on our people.” He sat back, mulling this over for a bit. Then he said, “You’re pretty convincing.”

He paused again, then said, “Okay . . . look, I am going back to Kennebunkport, which is our home in Maine, umm . . . let me carve out a time up there and umm . . . here is the person you want to talk to, we’ll set you up there for a morning meeting. Will you come alone?” I said, “I would probably bring one lady with me.” “That’s fine,” he said, “I will have one of my aides with me. We will meet at my home.” “Fine, Mr. Bush, we’ll meet in the morning. My presentation will be medical and scientific with moral overtones. Would you mind then, perhaps after lunch, if I could bring a few other more political people with me? Then we could discuss the campaign.” Another long pause and he said, “All right, let’s do it.”

Several weeks later, I found myself entering the Bush home with my Political Action Committee director, Sandra Faucher. I had brought my trusty Kodak carousel projector and some literature. It was a very pleasant day, which I have never forgotten. The house was on a small peninsula extending into the ocean, and on a bit of a rise. The French doors and windows were all open with a gentle ocean breeze wafting through. Barbara Bush was very gracious, serving iced tea and some snacks. I set my projector on a small coffee table. Mr. Bush was on one side and I on the other. The aide provided a screen and the briefing began. For about three hours, I would speak, then flip on a slide, then speak some more. Mr. Bush would question. I would answer. His aide spoke occasionally, as did Sandy, but basically it was a dialogue between the two of us.

Barbara Bush sat about 10 or 15 feet away, knitting. She only spoke once, asking “Well, what if the life of the mother is in danger?” I answered. She seemed to be satisfied and went back to her knitting.

Lunch was served and then the other pro-life leaders joined us. For another two hours that afternoon we all discussed the campaign. When it was time to go, I said, “Well Mr. Bush, back in Detroit you offered to tell me where you stand. Now I am going to ask you, would you be so kind as to answer?” He smiled, looking at me with an “Okay you did it” sort of look. He said, “I wasn’t here before, but I am now. I will support an amendment to the Constitution to forbid abortion and to overturn Roe v. Wade, but it will be a states’ rights amendment. I can’t support a federal amendment.”

When we publicized this news, the pro - l i f e movement strongly supported the Reagan-Bush ticket and the rest is history.

As of June 1988, Reagan and Bush had served two terms, a total of eight years. I was in the White House with some frequency during those years. Sometimes I met with President Reagan, sometimes with Vice President Bush, and occasionally both. My acquaintance with Mr. Bush grew during those years, and we worked together on several things.

After the Reagan administration, it was a pleasant four years with George H. W. Bush in the White House. We didn’t get everything we wanted, but we got the important things. Every time we asked him to threaten a veto, he did. While we are still not sure that this good man is completely pro-life in his heart, he certainly was prolife in his actions. He was a man of his word.

What does this mean for Romney?

As this is written, Barack Obama has proven to be the most pro-abortion president of modern times and he is now seeking a second term. Former Massachusetts Governor, Mitt Romney, is the presumptive nominee for the Republican Presidential slot in November. Naturally, some have questioned his pro-life credentials and convictions so let’s examine the details of Governor Romney’s conversion.

When he was first elected Governor of Massachusetts, it was generally presumed that his position was “prochoice.” However, about half way into his first term as governor in 2005, Romney announced that he was opposed to embryonic stem cell research and proceeded to veto a bill making the “Morning After,” plan B contraceptive pills available. In the same year, he declared that he was pro-life.

Governor Romney tells us that he changed his mind in November 2004. At that time, he was obviously searching and had questions. He met with Douglas A. Melton, PhD, a scientist from the Harvard Stem Cell Institute on November 9. In that interview the Governor said this researcher told him, “Look, you don’t have to think about this stem cell research as a moral issue because we kill the embryos after fourteen days.” This had a major impact on Romney and his chief of staff, as they saw it recognizing that such embryonic stem cell research in fact was killing what they were convinced were human lives already in existence. Later, through a spokesperson, Dr. Melton disputed that he used the word “kill.”

But Governor Romney, wanting to know more, consulted with one of the best people available in February 2005. This expert was William B. Hurlbut, a physician and professor at Stanford University Medical Center Neuroscience Institute. Dr. Hurlbut is a dedicated pro-lifer.

The two of them met for several hours, discussing the issue in great detail. They went through the dynamics of conception, embryonic development and repercussions of the various research and experimentation that has been going on aimed at exploring the first weeks after fertilization. At that point, Romney was under intense pressure to change a state law that, at the time, still protected human embryos from lethal stem cell research. Some of the pressure came from Harvard, his own almamater. After this in-depth consultation, Romney stated that he was pro-life.

Asked about their meeting by columnist Kathleen Parker, Dr. Hurlbut said, “Several things about our conversation still stand out strongly in my mind. First, he clearly recognized the significance of the i s s u e, not just as a current controversy, but as a matter that would define the character of our culture way into the future. Second, it was obvious that he had put in a real effort to understand both the scientific prospects and the broader social implications. Finally, I was impressed by both his clarity of mind and sincerity of heart. He recognized that this was not a matter of purely abstract theory or merely pragmatic governance, but a crucial moment in how we are to regard nascent human life and the broader meaning of medicine in the service of life.”

Similar to my time with President H. W. Bush, Dr. Hurlbut presented Governor Romney with sound scientific and medical information. The Governor responded by changing his position to support the protection of innocent human life from the point of fertilization. He declared himself pro-life and has repeatedly done so since that time.

For over twenty years, Life Issues Institute has been solely dedicated to prolife education. It has been my primary contribution to the pro-life movement since the 1960s. Our strength comes from the central fact that we are daily changing the hearts and minds of Americans on abortion. And our efforts have greatly be en assisted by science. The tool of ultrasound has resulted in an entire generation having their first baby picture taken within the womb, and it’s greatly impacted people’s opinion on abortion. Every pro-life individual and organization should rejoice when anyone—political or otherwise—responds to the unmistakable fact that human life begins at fertilization and that it should be protected.

Life Issues Institute and I are confident that Governor Romney’s conversion is real, heartfelt and authentic. Since the Institute is a 501(c)(3) organization, we cannot endorse a political candidate. As such, this article should not be construed as an endorsement of Governor Romney’s candidacy but rather a testament to the fact that we believe Mitt Romney is truly pro-life.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: election2012; prolife; romney; willke
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Dr. Willke is an unimpeachable source. He is responsible for inspiring action against abortion all over this nation. I learned last week that the men who founded our local pregnancy crisis center did so after hearing Dr. Willke speak.
1 posted on 06/20/2012 7:41:45 AM PDT by hocndoc
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To: wagglebee

Romney is definitely not my first choice but I was encouraged to see this article by Dr. John Willke.


2 posted on 06/20/2012 7:43:40 AM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: hocndoc

Interesting brief image about Barbara Bush and her knitting. She remained pro-abortion, but evidently she stuck to her knitting while in the White House and refrained from saying anything.


3 posted on 06/20/2012 8:09:19 AM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: hocndoc

No. Are you going to vote for barry by not voting?


4 posted on 06/20/2012 8:13:06 AM PDT by onedoug
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To: Cicero

Sometimes all we can hope for is silence.

However, in this case, Mitt Romney hasn’t been silent.

I’m praying for our Nation and that the Lord will give us the leader we need, one who will follow Him, and not the one we deserve.


5 posted on 06/20/2012 8:14:23 AM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: hocndoc

Is this the original Dr Wilke from 30+ years ago ???

or his son ???

The Dr Wilke then was just about THE authority on exposing abortion...


6 posted on 06/20/2012 8:15:17 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: hocndoc
I saw this article last night.

The problem is that Romney is all about political expediency. He will say ANYTHING to get votes.

It was interesting to read Dr. Wilke's account of what happened with GHWB in 1980. However, there are two big points that need to be considered:
1. 1980 was the first time that abortion had ever been an issue in a national election. It wasn't unusual that Bush hadn't ever really considered the pro-life position (and note that in the end he still wanted a "pro-choice-by-state" approach). Abortion has been an issue for Romney's ENTIRE POLITICAL CAREER and he had been fully aware of pro-life positions the entire time, yet he remained devoutly pro-abortion; it seems all to convenient that his position changed when he decided to run for president.
2. The fact still remains that whatever transpired between Wilke and GHWB, Bush was never really pro-life. I'm sick of supporting politicians who claim to be pro-life to get votes and then ignore it later.

If Romney was genuinely pro-life HE would get up and tell the story of what changed his mind, HE would explain how wrong he was -- Romney hasn't done anything like this. His advisers told him that he was going to need to say he was pro-life to get the nomination and that's what he did.

7 posted on 06/20/2012 8:16:01 AM PDT by wagglebee ("A political party cannot be all things to all people." -- Ronald Reagan, 3/1/75)
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To: onedoug

I don’t understand your question. This article supports the fact that Romney is truly prolife.


8 posted on 06/20/2012 8:16:04 AM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: Tennessee Nana

This is THE Dr. Willke.
See the note on the bottom of the article at http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/romneys-conversion-on-abortion-is-is-authentic


9 posted on 06/20/2012 8:18:33 AM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: hocndoc

Ted Kennedy went from pro life to pro choice because he saw which way the political winds were blowing in the Democratic party.

George H.W. Bush went towards the pro life position because he thought it was advantageous politically in the Republican party.

Mitt Romney advocated a pro choice position while running in liberal Massachusetts and a pro life position which running in the Republican primary.

I don’t believe any of those men had strong feelings either way, they simply adopted the position the would confer the most political advantage to them.


10 posted on 06/20/2012 8:23:25 AM PDT by FewsOrange
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To: wagglebee

Romney told this story during the debates.

I don’t doubt the word of either Dr. Willke or Dr. Hurlbut. For one thing, the testimony goes back to that veto by Romney of the embryonic stem cell bill and the morning after pill bill.

Dr. Hurlbut reports:
“Finally, I was impressed by both his clarity of mind and sincerity of heart. He recognized that this was not a matter of purely abstract theory or merely pragmatic governance, but a crucial moment in how we are to regard nascent human life and the broader meaning of medicine in the service of life.”


11 posted on 06/20/2012 8:24:04 AM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: hocndoc
I don’t doubt the word of either Dr. Willke or Dr. Hurlbut.

Neither do I; however, I believe Romney to be a pragmatic narcissist who has a long track record of masking his true agenda.

12 posted on 06/20/2012 8:29:20 AM PDT by wagglebee ("A political party cannot be all things to all people." -- Ronald Reagan, 3/1/75)
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To: hocndoc
Romney's “conversion” on abortion is 100% bogus. He has continually lied and changed his story about the timeline of his “evolving” views on abortion and the influences that cause his supposed “conversion”.

When he makes claims like “I was never pro-choice” and “Every decision I made in MA came down on the side of life”, it is clear he is lying through his teeth.

To the extent Romney has any real conviction on the subject, I have no doubt he is still “pro-choice”. The best we can hope for with Romney is that he doesn't really care about “abortion rights” OR the lives of the unborn and will support pro-life positions, as long as it is politically expedient to do so.

If Romney is elected, pro-lifer’s will need to keep enormous pressure on Romney to live up to his “pro-life” claims and be careful NEVER to trust him on issues of life, especially when it come to Supreme Court nominees.

13 posted on 06/20/2012 8:33:03 AM PDT by Above My Pay Grade (The candidate I vote for will NOT have a CARE after his name.)
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To: hocndoc

The first time I saw photos of cut up and napalmed babies was in his material...

He was one of the leaders in pro-life ...

In the 1970-80s when he was exposing abortion for the evil murder that it was, and for the need to overturn Roe V Wade, Willard was not listening...

In 1994 when Willard ran for US Senate and in 2002 when he ran for Gov of MASS Willard promised to “sustain the law of the land” Roe V Wade...

During a debate in 2008 Willard told about his aunt who had an abortion back in the 60s when it was illegal and he said thats why he was pro-abortion...for the need for SAFE abortions...

and then he boasted he was proud of his own mother who had ran for US Senate on an abortion platform in 1970 again while abortion was illegal...THREE YEARS BEFORE ROE V WADE...

The phony “pro-life” thingy is just for political expediency...


14 posted on 06/20/2012 8:34:10 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: hocndoc

This cycle.


15 posted on 06/20/2012 8:35:52 AM PDT by onedoug
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To: FewsOrange; wagglebee

Romney has told the story of his conversion in the debates and in interviews. He followed through by vetoing anti-life bills.

The Legislature over-rode his veto of the requirement to dispense the morning after pill to rape victims at hospitals.

He vetoed a bill in 2005 that would have allowed embryonic stem cell research in Massachusetts http://www.lifenews.com/2005/05/27/bio-997/ The Legislature over-rode that veto, too.
http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2005/5/31/154950.shtml


16 posted on 06/20/2012 8:39:06 AM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: Tennessee Nana

Your timeline is way off - Romney’s conversion was in 2004/2005.

The story about his aunt was told in October, 1994.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9IJUkYUbvI


17 posted on 06/20/2012 8:43:46 AM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: wagglebee

Agree. He hasn’t even expressed regret over the fact that the cheap (and sometimes free) abortions he enabled in Massachusetts are still happening today.


18 posted on 06/20/2012 8:47:55 AM PDT by CatherineofAragon (Time for a write-in campaign...Darryl Dixon for President)
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To: hocndoc

The story about his aunt dying during an illegal abortion in the 1960s was also told by Willie Mitty during a debate in 2008...

Thats when I personally heard about it fir the first time...

I didnt know the guy and I thought he was going to say thats why he was pro-life...

BUT NOOOOOOOOOO..

he went on to say thats why he was for SAFE abortions...

that if abortion had been legal then his aunt would not have died..

From him in living color LIVE during the debate...

followed up by the story of how proud he was of his Mommy Lenore pushing abortions in her platform for US Senate...

I was sick to my stomach...

the guy was a twisted freak..


19 posted on 06/20/2012 8:54:26 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: hocndoc
Mr. Bush relaxed, sat back, smiled and said, “I think that is a good idea, Doctor.”

So a doctor calls the president "Mr." but the president calls a doctor by a title?

And you wonder why I bring up medical arrogance?

20 posted on 06/20/2012 9:00:12 AM PDT by humblegunner
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To: Tennessee Nana

Can you find a Link or source? I’ve looked and can only find references to that 1994 debate.


21 posted on 06/20/2012 9:01:26 AM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: humblegunner

I’m not responsible for Dr. Willke’s use of titles, but this account is from a 1980 interview.


22 posted on 06/20/2012 9:03:37 AM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: hocndoc

MISTER Willke published it a couple of days ago, but perhaps
he is unaware that PRESIDENT Bush was eventually elected to
some minor non-medical make-work job unworthy of his notice.

OK, I’m done. Carry on.


23 posted on 06/20/2012 9:11:47 AM PDT by humblegunner
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To: Tennessee Nana

I have never liked Dr. Wilke. While he was in charge of National Right to Life, more abortions were performed each year. Sure, they have the big rally once a year in Washington, but what have they actually done to stop abortion? His group actually promoted exceptions for rape and incest under his watch, which goes against what being pro-life is all about. If another group would stand up to them and be against exceptions, NRTL and Wilke would push against them and try to minimize them. Sometimes I actually thought he and his group were working for the other side. They may as well have for all the good they did.

I don’t believe Wilke knows what he’s talking about regarding Romney. Romney is a political opportunist and has changed his mind too many times to be taken seriously. If he had changed to pro-life at a time when it wouldn’t have been political expedient for him, I would be inclined to believe he had a real conversion. But his stands on abortion always coincided with what would do him the most good politically at the time.


24 posted on 06/20/2012 9:17:07 AM PDT by murron (Proud Mom of a Marine Vet)
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To: humblegunner

At least we in the medical field have never pretended to be able to predict future elections.


25 posted on 06/20/2012 9:35:06 AM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: hocndoc

It weas the 1st or 2nd debate...

I didnt know Willard Mitt romney before that and there were about 12 candidates on the stage...

I only knew about 1/2 of them...

When he was asked an abortion Q Romney answered it starting with the death of his aunt and my heart went out to him...

I felt sad for him...

But then he did a 180 on what i thought he would say next...

and i was angry at him for my wasted sympathy..

Check the early 2008 debates...


26 posted on 06/20/2012 9:37:15 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: hocndoc

It wouldn’t be such a stretch, given the omniscience and all...


27 posted on 06/20/2012 9:39:27 AM PDT by humblegunner
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To: hocndoc

I’ve looked and can only find references to that 1994 debate.
____________________________________

What about the 2002 debate where there was a discussion on the age of the child for parental notification ???

Willie Mitty states that if the parents wont let the underage child get an abortion then the child can get permission from a judge who will overrtuled parental authority...

Oh yes Willie Mitty is NOT and never has been pro-life...

(so much for happy families forever)


28 posted on 06/20/2012 9:42:41 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: murron

His group actually promoted exceptions for rape and incest under his watch, which goes against what being pro-life is all about.
_________________________________________

Yes unfortunately that is true...

the very “reason” for Roe V Wade...


29 posted on 06/20/2012 9:47:23 AM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: wagglebee
1980 was the first time that abortion had ever been an issue in a national election.

Yes, the timing is important. Way back then, most people hadn't thought about abortion, one way or another. They hadn't given the issue any serious consideration, or really looked into the pros and cons.

Romney, on the other hand, converted from pro-life to pro-abort while he was Governor of Massachusetts. By that time, the issue was perfectly clear, and everyone had heard the arguments from both sides.

Now he's converting back to pro-life? That might make sense if he had had a religious conversion, but there are no signs of that. He has been an LDS leader all his life, top of the heap.

The same difference applies to Ronald Reagan. When he signed off on the bill in California, he really hadn't considered the issues. But his advisers clued him in, later, and when he ran for President he HAD experienced a genuine conversion.

That seemed obvious enough to me at the time, so I gladly voted for him. But it is FAR from obvious with Mitt Romney. Somehow, he always announces these changes when it is politically convenient, although by now he is fully aware of what the issues are.

30 posted on 06/20/2012 10:45:57 AM PDT by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
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To: hocndoc

RomneyCare Covers Abortions.
Mitt & Ann Romney: Planned Parenthood Donors
Abortions now FREE under RomneyCare.

31 posted on 06/20/2012 12:25:16 PM PDT by Lady4Liberty (Watch Romney DESTROY Obama at his own game: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYvx4UfM8RA)
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To: hocndoc; BlackElk; Diogenesis

Willard is and will always be a pathological liar. Period.


32 posted on 06/20/2012 12:34:22 PM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (If you like lying Socialist dirtbags, you'll love Slick Willard)
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To: fieldmarshaldj

Thank you for your baseless prognostication, as well as a completely unsourced opinion.

However, regardless of your unchangeable bias about Romney, Dr. Jack Willke is not a liar. Dr.William Hurlbut is not a liar.

It’s doubtful that a phoney would have used up political capital on vetoing the morning after pill and the embryonic stem cell bills, as Romney did in 2005.


33 posted on 06/20/2012 2:07:06 PM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: Lady4Liberty; Tennessee Nana

Whatever you want to believe about Romney, you have to remember who Jack Willke is and what his testimony is worth, as well as the heat Romney took for vetoing the embryonic stem cell and morning after pill bills.

Those vetoes were each over-ridden by the Mass. legislature.


34 posted on 06/20/2012 2:11:08 PM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: hocndoc; BlackElk; EternalVigilance; Diogenesis

Shove it and your ignorant comments. I’ve known Willard 18 years. Have you ? He is a pathological liar who will say ANYTHING to get elected. He was raised in a pro-abort family, both parents, whom were infamous in their stance. Anyone who trusts anything he says as gospel is a complete fool, especially when running for the highest office.

BTW, a Gubernatorial “veto” in MA is nothing short of a worthless farce. With super-majorities of 90% Democrats in the MA legislature, ultraleft legislation will get through, period.


35 posted on 06/20/2012 2:29:16 PM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (If you like lying Socialist dirtbags, you'll love Slick Willard)
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To: fieldmarshaldj

Had coffee with someone you consider a “pathological liar” for 18 years? Maybe that means *you* changed your mind, but won’t believe anyone else could.

I doubt Romney hangs out much in Tennessee or that you “know” him better than anyone else on FR..

Read the article about the “conversion.” Are you calling Dr. Willke a liar or “a fool?”


36 posted on 06/20/2012 2:35:26 PM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: Cicero

Romney, on the other hand, converted from pro-life to pro-abort while he was Governor of Massachusetts.
_____________________________________________________

No

Willard was always pro-abortion...

he ran for Gov of MASS in 2002 as pro-abortion...argued during a debate he was the most pro-abortion...wanted judges to allow underage girls to get abortions if their parents said no...

He was pro-abortion when he and Ann were giving money to Planned Parenthood...

he was pro-abortion back in 1994...ran to the left of Teddy as more pro-abortion than he was...

In 1980 He was a liberal pro-abortion Independant or Democrat and never met Reagan or voted for him...

and as Ann said they had no Republican friends nor knew anyone who was republican till 1994...

he agreed with his mother on her pro-abortion platform in 1970...

He wanted abortion to be safe and legal when his aunt died durinbg an abortion in the early 1960s...

Lifelong pro-abortion...


37 posted on 06/20/2012 2:43:00 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: Cicero

Romney, on the other hand, converted from pro-life to pro-abort while he was Governor of Massachusetts.
_____________________________________________________

No

Willard was always pro-abortion...

he ran for Gov of MASS in 2002 as pro-abortion...argued during a debate he was the most pro-abortion...wanted judges to allow underage girls to get abortions if their parents said no...

He was pro-abortion when he and Ann were giving money to Planned Parenthood...

he was pro-abortion back in 1994...ran to the left of Teddy as more pro-abortion than he was...

In 1980 He was a liberal pro-abortion Independant or Democrat and never met Reagan or voted for him...

and as Ann said they had no Republican friends nor knew anyone who was republican till 1994...

he agreed with his mother on her pro-abortion platform in 1970...

He wanted abortion to be safe and legal when his aunt died durinbg an abortion in the early 1960s...

Lifelong pro-abortion...


38 posted on 06/20/2012 2:45:01 PM PDT by Tennessee Nana (Why should I vote for Bishop Romney when he hates me because I am a Christian)
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To: hocndoc

In brief, here’s Romney’s record, ending with the 4th time
for abortion so NO actions on his part to show he is for
life. Did Romney ever “act” for life?

- pro-choice in ‘94; pro-life in ‘01; choice ‘02; pro-life ‘04; choice ‘05; life in ‘06; then funded abortion in ‘06

I would call this, the record of a habitual liar.

Pray for Mitt’s conversion, Mormons are not Christian.


39 posted on 06/20/2012 2:50:11 PM PDT by stpio
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To: hocndoc
There you go again obsessing over my locale, as if that has one iota to do with the discussion at hand. But you are always big on red herrings since you lose every argument you ever have with me.

I'm calling anyone who believes anything the man says in the quest for the Presidency to be either #1, blindly partisan (and hence willing to overlook facts), #2, being paid off for their support, or #3, a fool.

But don't you fret none, honey, it ain't like Willke is the first person to have been hosed by a master con-artist.

Here's that ardent "pro-lifer" Willard being dragged kicking and screaming into signing off on cheap abortions and Socialist medicine. Can't you just see how heartbroken he is here ?

40 posted on 06/20/2012 2:51:48 PM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (If you like lying Socialist dirtbags, you'll love Slick Willard)
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To: Tennessee Nana

Read the article. Dr. Willke outlines a change and the reason for the change in 2004/5. Romney has told the same story many times.

These quotes aren’t on chronological order, but they’re dated:
http://www.ontheissues.org/News_Stem_Cells.htm
http://www.ontheissues.org/2012/Mitt_Romney_Abortion.htm

This is not 1980 or 1970. This is not 1994. This is not 2002. Why ignore Dr. Willke?


41 posted on 06/20/2012 3:04:48 PM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: fieldmarshaldj

That was then, this is now.

If you’re unable to read the article, it outlines the change after conversations with two stem cell/cloning experts in 2005, one pro-life and one not. He realized that the embryo is a living human being and that scientifically he could only believe that life begins at fertilization.


42 posted on 06/20/2012 3:24:40 PM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: hocndoc
Spare me. There's no conversion. Willard doesn't give a damn about life issues, only what is expedient to get himself elected at a given moment. No ethics, no morals. Just more lies from a world-class liar and fools rationalizing and excusing him as if he is somehow on the Conservative side. He never was, never is, and never will be a Conservative. What part of that don't you comprehend ?
43 posted on 06/20/2012 3:36:50 PM PDT by fieldmarshaldj (If you like lying Socialist dirtbags, you'll love Slick Willard)
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To: hocndoc

I dont know if Romney’s conversion is legit or not. He could have really had a change of heart, which would be great. He could be just moving to the pro life side to get elected, which means he’ll probably stay there throughout a first term if that was the case). Or he could be a complete and total liar, and will be just as pro choice as he has always been from the second he takes the oath, and preform the proceedure himself in the west wing on alternate Tuesdays.

One thing I am 100% sure of is Obama’s position on abortion is, and that it hasn’t changed. He is for free and total legalized abortion, regardless of how the woman got pregnant, how far she is into the pregnancy, the age of the woman/girl involved. Obama is for abortion on demand. Period. And he isn’t denying any of it. In fact, he’d wear it as a badge of honor if you asked him.

I can understand being skeptical of Romney. I sure am. I dont know the Dr’s in the article (a little before my time). I sure want a president that is against abortion except in extreme cases (rape, life of mother, etc...). But I just dont see how this issue would make up anyone’s mind to vote against Romney, considering who his opponent is.

If you are one of the folks that in good conscience cant vote for either overall, then as I’ve said before, while I dont agree with you, I understand and respect your right to that position. But if you’re someone for whom abortion is issue #1, then this seems to be a choice between a chance (albeit slight) and no chance.


44 posted on 06/20/2012 3:59:49 PM PDT by SoCalTransplant (Honey badger's level of concern is negligible.)
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To: hocndoc; fieldmarshaldj; daisy mae for the usa; BlackElk; joanie-f; Steve Schulin; Gelato; ...

On the Romney campaign site, to this day, his own words prove that he is not in any true sense pro-life.

Pro-life means that you stand in agreement with the self-evident truths of the Declaration of Independence, that our individual right to life comes from God, not from any man, and that that sacred right is therefore unalienable.

Romney’s default position, as stated currently, is that whether or not to kill babies is up to the courts. In other words, the practical outcome of his default position is abortion on demand. He calls that “law,” just like he has since he tried to run to the left of Teddy Kennedy for the U.S. Senate in the early nineties. No flip-flopping on this core position for him, no-sir-ee. He is a completely unreconstructed judicial supremacist, in other words anti-republican.

His secondary position is that whether or not to kill babies should have been left up to a majority vote of the people. That is by definition a pro-choice democrat position. One that denies the self-evident truths of the founding of this free republic.

His last and most ridiculous position is a Stephen A. Douglas democrat position if there ever was one, which is that it should be left up to the states whether or not to butcher helpless, defenseless little boys and girls.

Of course the whole package is wrapped up in a thin tissue of pro-life sounding lies, but that is, at its core, where he says he stands, right now.


45 posted on 06/20/2012 4:52:30 PM PDT by EternalVigilance (TomHoefling.com)
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To: EternalVigilance
EV, this post is PERFECT!
46 posted on 06/20/2012 5:03:32 PM PDT by wagglebee ("A political party cannot be all things to all people." -- Ronald Reagan, 3/1/75)
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To: fieldmarshaldj

Sure, because you “know” Governor Romney. 18 years, wasn’t it?

Most prolife people know Dr Wllke by the results of his work and I was privileged to spend a day with Dr Hurlbut when he testified on cloning and stem cell research in Austin. in addition, I got to watch two days of the President’s Bioethics Council in ‘04. These men are trustworthy.


47 posted on 06/20/2012 5:04:01 PM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: EternalVigilance

I think most of Romney’s fans know that Romney is not pro-life. Some of his fans like him, anyway. Some of his fans favor abortion. But, I think they all know that his recent pro-life statements are made solely for political purposes.


48 posted on 06/20/2012 5:07:08 PM PDT by Tau Food (Tom Hoefling for President - 2012)
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To: EternalVigilance

You, on the other hand, are completely trustworthy and would apologize immediately if you found out your information was false, right?

How are “Beverly” and “ Davida,” BTW?


49 posted on 06/20/2012 5:08:44 PM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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To: wagglebee

So you don’t trust Dr Willke?

“Life Issues Institute and I are confident that Governor Romney’s conversion is real, heartfelt and authentic. ”


50 posted on 06/20/2012 5:11:26 PM PDT by hocndoc (WingRight.org Have mustard seed, not afraid to use it. Hold Rs to promises, don't watch O keep his.)
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