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Church to host gun class(TX)
gosanangelo.com ^ | 21 June, 2012 | Matthew Waller

Posted on 06/22/2012 3:41:21 AM PDT by marktwain

SAN ANGELO, Texas — Whether people should be allowed to carry guns into churches has been a matter of debate, although in Texas, unless the church says otherwise, it's legal to carry a concealed handgun into a place of worship.

Come Saturday, not only will people be allowed to carry a weapon onto one church premises, but there will be a class on how to use that weapon.

The Heights Baptist Church will hold a concealed handgun class from 8 a.m. to 6 p.m. Saturday, with a break for lunch, church staff said.

"I want to be a responsible owner," said worship leader JoAnna Alexander, who initiated the class. "The majority of this is learning the rules and the laws. I can't imagine why that wouldn't be a wonderful thing to know."

She said she has not heard any complaints about the gun class happening in the church. She said several people had asked her to get a class going, so she invited instructor Stephen Jones to conduct it.

Jones charges $75 for classes. To get a license, a person must not have a criminal record that would prohibit firearm possession, such as having committed a felony. People also must pay $10 for fingerprinting, $10 for a passport photo and $140 for the Texas Department of Public Safety to perform a background check, he said.

Part of the class will consist of going to a gun range on Saturday where people will be required to shoot 50 rounds of ammo, which class participants must furnish.

He said he has held small classes in a church before.

"We had about eight people show up for the previous one and it went very well," Jones said. "It works just about like anything else. I like doing it in them.

(Excerpt) Read more at gosanangelo.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Texas
KEYWORDS: banglist; ccw; church; tx
I have taught concealed carry courses in churches. It is a natural match. People who take the courses are some of the most responsible people in the community. It is only natural that many of them are church members. Christian morality and moral responsibility are pillars of our civilization.
1 posted on 06/22/2012 3:41:31 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

Churches and all other private property owners should have the right to prohibit entrants from carrying weapons.

You have the right to be armed, but you don’t have the right to be on private property against the wishes of the owner, regardless of whether his conditions are wise or not.


2 posted on 06/22/2012 4:06:54 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Sherman Logan

I understand who owns a Catholic church, the Catholic church does and presumably, the hierarchy would make that decision but I’m southern Baptist and the S.B.C. doesn’t own our church and neither does the Pastor, the people ostensibly do, what would we do? Vote on it? We have 3 trustees, of which I am one. Maybe I’ll have one third say in the matter.

Not really a question that will likely come up any time soon as I live in Illinois, where it’s a felony to think about guns.


3 posted on 06/22/2012 4:38:15 AM PDT by Graybeard58 (Come quickly Lord Jesus.)
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To: Sherman Logan
You have the right to be armed, but you don’t have the right to be on private property against the wishes of the owner, regardless of whether his conditions are wise or not.

You are correct, of course. I have not seen anyone argue that churches must allow people with guns to come into their private property.

I have seen numerous arguments that the *state* must make it illegal for people with guns to enter churches, even if the church wants them there.

Usually the argument is roughly this: Guns should not be in churches, therefore the government must make it illegal for guns to be in churches.

I have even seen it argued that it is a *violation* of a churches religious freedom to have to make the choice to prohibit people from having guns in the church, because the state should prohibit them so the church does not have to!

4 posted on 06/22/2012 4:41:01 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: Sherman Logan

They do have the right in Texas to do just that. Post a 30.06 sign and it is all taken care of, no sign=ok to carry in most places including church. Relevant sections of Texas law below

Sec. 30.06. TRESPASS BY HOLDER OF LICENSE TO CARRY CONCEALED HANDGUN. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder:
(1) carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, on property of another without effective consent; and
(2) received notice that:
(A) entry on the property by a license holder with a concealed handgun was forbidden; or
(B) remaining on the property with a concealed handgun was forbidden and failed to depart.
(b) For purposes of this section, a person receives notice if the owner of the property or someone with apparent authority to act for the owner provides notice to the person by oral or written communication.
(c) In this section:
(1) “Entry” has the meaning assigned by Section 30.05(b).
(2) “License holder” has the meaning assigned by Section 46.035(f).
(3) “Written communication” means:
(A) a card or other document on which is written language identical to the following: “Pursuant to Section 30.06, Penal Code (trespass by holder of license to carry a concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code (concealed handgun law), may not enter this property with a concealed handgun”; or
(B) a sign posted on the property that:
(i) includes the language described by Paragraph (A) in both English and Spanish;
(ii) appears in contrasting colors with block letters at least one inch in height; and
(iii) is displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public.
(d) An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor.
(e) It is an exception to the application of this section that the property on which the license holder carries a handgun is owned or leased by a governmental entity and is not a premises or other place on which the license holder is prohibited from carrying the handgun under Section 46.03 or 46.035.

Sec. 46.035. UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE HOLDER. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder carries a handgun on or about the license holder’s person under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, and intentionally fails to conceal the handgun.
(b) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of whether the handgun is concealed, on or about the license holder’s person:
(1) on the premises of a business that has a permit or license issued under Chapter 25, 28, 32, 69, or 74, Alcoholic Beverage Code, if the business derives 51 percent or more of its income from the sale or service of alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption, as determined by the Texas Alcoholic Beverage Commission under Section 104.06, Alcoholic Beverage Code;
(2) on the premises where a high school, collegiate, or professional sporting event or interscholastic event is taking place, unless the license holder is a participant in the event and a handgun is used in the event;
(3) on the premises of a correctional facility;
(4) on the premises of a hospital licensed under Chapter 241, Health and Safety Code, or on the premises of a nursing home licensed under Chapter 242, Health and Safety Code, unless the license holder has written authorization of the hospital or nursing home administration, as appropriate;
(5) in an amusement park; or
(6) on the premises of a church, synagogue, or other established place of religious worship.
(c) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of whether the handgun is concealed, at any meeting of a governmental entity.
(d) A license holder commits an offense if, while intoxicated, the license holder carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of whether the handgun is concealed.
(e) A license holder who is licensed as a security officer under Chapter 1702, Occupations Code, and employed as a security officer commits an offense if, while in the course and scope of the security officer’s employment, the security officer violates a provision of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code.
(f) In this section:
(1) “Amusement park” means a permanent indoor or outdoor facility or park where amusement rides are available for use by the public that is located in a county with a population of more than one million, encompasses at least 75 acres in surface area, is enclosed with access only through controlled entries, is open for operation more than 120 days in each calendar year, and has security guards on the premises at all times. The term does not include any public or private driveway, street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area.
(2) “License holder” means a person licensed to carry a handgun under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code.
(3) “Premises” means a building or a portion of a building. The term does not include any public or private driveway, street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area.
(g) An offense under Subsection (a), (b), (c), (d), or (e) is a Class A misdemeanor, unless the offense is committed under Subsection (b)(1) or (b)(3), in which event the offense is a felony of the third degree.
(h) It is a defense to prosecution under Subsection (a) that the actor, at the time of the commission of the offense, displayed the handgun under circumstances in which the actor would have been justified in the use of deadly force under Chapter 9.

Text of subsection as added by Acts 2007, 80th Leg., R.S., Ch. 1214, Sec. 2

(h-1) It is a defense to prosecution under Subsections (b) and (c) that the actor, at the time of the commission of the offense, was:
(1) an active judicial officer, as defined by Section 411.201, Government Code; or
(2) a bailiff designated by the active judicial officer and engaged in escorting the officer.

Text of subsection as added by Acts 2007, 80th Leg., R.S., Ch. 1222, Sec. 5

(h-1) It is a defense to prosecution under Subsections (b)(1), (2), and (4)-(6), and (c) that at the time of the commission of the offense, the actor was:
(1) a judge or justice of a federal court;
(2) an active judicial officer, as defined by Section 411.201, Government Code; or
(3) a district attorney, assistant district attorney, criminal district attorney, assistant criminal district attorney, county attorney, or assistant county attorney.
(i) Subsections (b)(4), (b)(5), (b)(6), and (c) do not apply if the actor was not given effective notice under Section 30.06.
(j) Subsections (a) and (b)(1) do not apply to a historical reenactment performed in compliance with the rules of the Texas Alcoholic Beverage Commission.
(k) It is a defense to prosecution under Subsection (b)(1) that the actor was not given effective notice under Section 411.204, Government Code.


5 posted on 06/22/2012 8:10:37 AM PDT by An American! (Proud To Be An American!)
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