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Hey Romney Supporters - 51 Votes in the Senate Overturns Obamacare If It's a Tax
me ^ | 7/3/2012 | vbmoneyspender

Posted on 07/03/2012 10:45:21 PM PDT by vbmoneyspender

Romney's spokesman has said that Obamacare does not impose a tax. But if that's true then it will take 60 votes to get past a Democratic filibuster in the Senate.

On the other hand, if Obamacare does impose a tax, then it will only take 51 votes to overturn Obamacare in the Senate.

This is not some obscure fact. So why on God's green earth would Romney's spokesman being seeking to characterize Obamacare as not imposing a tax? Are they trying to make it harder to overturn Obamacare?

I'd love to get straightforward answers to those questions from Romney supporters.


TOPICS: Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: abortion; dailykosishere; deathpanels; obamacare; occupymitt; romney; vanity; zerocare
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1 posted on 07/03/2012 10:45:30 PM PDT by vbmoneyspender
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To: vbmoneyspender

It is a tax. The SCOTUS said so


2 posted on 07/03/2012 10:46:30 PM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: tsowellfan

You know, I would value Herman Cain’s viewpoint on this, and foreward strategy, much more than I would for ANY Mitt Romney advisor, no matter how seasoned or qualified.


3 posted on 07/03/2012 10:49:07 PM PDT by AmericanInTokyo (Rebel Colonists, tax-harassed by a government out of control, fed up,set up their OWN "death panels")
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To: vbmoneyspender

If OmebaCare is not a tax...then it is unConstitutional and Congress should immediately cut all funding and repeal the law.

Do you think Boehner and McConnell will do this?

Romney?


4 posted on 07/03/2012 10:49:24 PM PDT by Amadeo
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To: tsowellfan

You know, I would value Herman Cain’s viewpoint on this, and foreward strategy, much more than I would for ANY Mitt Romney advisor, no matter how seasoned or qualified.


5 posted on 07/03/2012 10:49:46 PM PDT by AmericanInTokyo (Rebel Colonists, tax-harassed by a government out of control, fed up,set up their OWN "death panels")
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To: vbmoneyspender
So why on God's green earth would Romney's spokesman being seeking to characterize Obamacare as not imposing a tax? Are they trying to make it harder to overturn Obamacare?

Very good questions that need answers. I am not a Romney supporter but I will likely vote for him if it's a choice between him and Obama. Obama's way too radical. I do wish we had a better choice. Unfortunately the conservative circular firing squad resulted in the wrong man left standing.

6 posted on 07/03/2012 10:49:46 PM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: vbmoneyspender
On the other hand, if Obamacare does impose a tax, then it will only take 51 votes to overturn Obamacare in the Senate.

Whatever is in it, 51 should be adequate for repeal because they went with a procedure that allowed them to pass it with 51. You can't very well say 51 is adequate for passage but repeal takes 60.

7 posted on 07/03/2012 10:50:55 PM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: Still Thinking
You can't very well say 51 is adequate for passage but repeal takes 60.

Oh yeah, watch the Democrats and their propaganda arm in the media do exactly that.

8 posted on 07/03/2012 10:52:58 PM PDT by vbmoneyspender
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To: Amadeo
If OmebaCare is not a tax...then it is unConstitutional

We've already crossed that bridge. According to the highest court in the land ObamaCare IS a tax and is Constitutional. We may disagree with that finding but it is what it is.

We need to do away with ObamaCare based on that premise otherwise we accomplish nothing.

9 posted on 07/03/2012 10:53:56 PM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: vbmoneyspender

Technically, the 51 really only needs to be 50 + VP.


10 posted on 07/03/2012 10:55:21 PM PDT by Suz in AZ
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To: vbmoneyspender
So why on God's green earth would Romney's spokesman being seeking to characterize Obamacare as not imposing a tax?

Perhaps Romney does not want to help conservatives gain control of the Senate. He may feel too pressured as President with a bunch of conservatives in control. If he calls it a tax then that would encourage conservatives to fight hard for a majority big enough to repeal ObamaCare.

11 posted on 07/03/2012 10:57:01 PM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: Suz in AZ
Technically, the 51 really only needs to be 50 + VP.

50 + VP = 51 votes

Votes to Break Ties in the Senate

12 posted on 07/03/2012 10:59:00 PM PDT by vbmoneyspender
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To: vbmoneyspender

Donor assume the spokesman is speaking correctly ...or with authority. If Romney says it himself, there’s a problem. Anything the spokesman says can, and in this case will, be walked back.


13 posted on 07/03/2012 11:00:54 PM PDT by Scott from the Left Coast
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To: Scott from the Left Coast

Don’t not Donor...damn iPad and it’s keyboard.


14 posted on 07/03/2012 11:04:25 PM PDT by Scott from the Left Coast
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To: Amadeo

Do you think Boehner and McConnell will do this?


neither of these two idiots belong in leadership let alone office.

McConnell has already said “well... we’ll try.. but it’s not easy to over turn passed laws”

WTF! He just laid down and gave up. There is no fight in either of these two idiots.

Both of them should be tared and feathered.


15 posted on 07/03/2012 11:09:29 PM PDT by cableguymn (For the first time in my life. I fear my countries government.)
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To: vbmoneyspender
I'd love to get straightforward answers to those questions from Romney supporters.

The straightforward answer is that you are almost certainly a whining, lying little tool who wants Obama to win the election.

16 posted on 07/03/2012 11:11:35 PM PDT by rogue yam
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To: rogue yam

Put away the schnapps and get working on your beauty sleep.


17 posted on 07/03/2012 11:15:46 PM PDT by vbmoneyspender
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To: vbmoneyspender

18 posted on 07/03/2012 11:17:39 PM PDT by NoLibZone (We must get down on our knees each day and thank God that McCain/Palin didn't win in '08.)
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To: vbmoneyspender

Mittens said if it’s a tax it’s constitutional.

If it’s a penalty it’s unconstitutional.

Stop eating the government run Pablum.


19 posted on 07/03/2012 11:17:53 PM PDT by Clint N. Suhks
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To: Clint N. Suhks

Mitt said he agrees with the dissent.

All the rest is gorilla dust.


20 posted on 07/03/2012 11:20:36 PM PDT by rogue yam
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To: rogue yam

That’s the MSM spin.


21 posted on 07/03/2012 11:21:57 PM PDT by Clint N. Suhks
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To: vbmoneyspender

So who are you going to vote for for President on November 6th?


22 posted on 07/03/2012 11:22:17 PM PDT by rogue yam
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To: Clint N. Suhks

It’s already been declared constitutional. That battle has been fought and lost. There is no Supreme Supreme Court to go to. The next battle is to get it repealed. That battle will take place in the House and Senate. So it is going to be easier to get it repealed if it only takes 51 votes than if takes 60 votes. The math is real simple for everyone except apparently Romney’s spokesman and some of his supporters on FR.


23 posted on 07/03/2012 11:23:59 PM PDT by vbmoneyspender
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To: Clint N. Suhks
That’s the MSM spin.

You make no sense.

Mitt said flat out "I agree with the dissent."

How is that "MSM spin"?

24 posted on 07/03/2012 11:24:52 PM PDT by rogue yam
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To: rogue yam; vbmoneyspender
The straightforward answer is that you are almost certainly a whining, lying little tool who wants Obama to win the election.

As a person who plans on voting for Romney your answer makes me doubt Romney will end. Your answer mirrors exactly how Romney is running his campaign. Basically, "I am not Obama". I have yet to see any substance from the man. As someone here in FR said:

Romney has no attack other than “Im not Obama” pretty much...everything else is generic statements about how bad the economy is and that’s about it and even his statements about the bad economy sounds like he’s making a cheap television commercial with no passion

Well, that's not going to cut it. vbmoneyspender who started this thread asked some very good questions and not even a Romney supporter can answer it?

25 posted on 07/03/2012 11:25:04 PM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: rogue yam
It doesn't matter what anyone says, the mandate was upheld by the SCOTUS as a tax. It therefore requires only 51 votes in the Senate for repeal.
26 posted on 07/03/2012 11:26:32 PM PDT by srmorton (Deut. 30 19: "..I have set before you life and death,....therefore, choose life..")
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To: tsowellfan

Two things:

1) Use HTML better.

2) Say something that makes sense.


27 posted on 07/03/2012 11:28:06 PM PDT by rogue yam
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To: tsowellfan

The answer to the posted question is Romney’s spokesman is weak at his job. He is not a polished community organizer.

Who do you support as an alternative to Obama?


28 posted on 07/03/2012 11:28:29 PM PDT by NoLibZone (We must get down on our knees each day and thank God that McCain/Palin didn't win in '08.)
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To: vbmoneyspender; rogue yam

Mittens agrees it’s penalty that is unconstitutional.

That doesn’t mean he won’t support a bill to overturn it if it’s done on reconciliation.


29 posted on 07/03/2012 11:31:58 PM PDT by Clint N. Suhks
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To: vbmoneyspender

The answer to the posted question is Romney’s spokesman is weak at his job.

He is not a polished community organizer. No one in Mitt’s camp is a community Organizer of Hollywood celeb.

Do you support an alternative to Obama?


30 posted on 07/03/2012 11:32:05 PM PDT by NoLibZone (We must get down on our knees each day and thank God that McCain/Palin didn't win in '08.)
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To: vbmoneyspender

Do you really have to ask a question to which the answer is so bloody obvious?


31 posted on 07/03/2012 11:32:58 PM PDT by HANG THE EXPENSE (Life's tough.It's tougher when you're stupid.)
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To: srmorton

The number of votes it will require in the Senate to repeal Obamacare will be determined by Senate rules. The Senate rules are whatever the Senate says the Senate rules are.

Step 1: Get GOP control of the Senate.

Step 2: Have the GOP Senate caucus pass a bill repealing Obamacare.

The details can and will be worked out by the GOP Senate caucus once they have the majority.

The ‘Rats did not let any previously-existing rules stop the adoption of Obamacare.

There is no reason the GOP should let any previously-existing Senate rules stop the repeal of Obamacare.

People need to wake the heck up.


32 posted on 07/03/2012 11:34:12 PM PDT by rogue yam
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To: rogue yam
Mitt said flat out "I agree with the dissent."

We ALL agree with the dissent but we cannot ignore the fact that the SCOTUS has ruled ObamaCare as a tax therefore it's consitutional. If we do not go after ObamaCare based on that premise then there is no way to put it down.

There are two reasons why Romney is approaching this the wrong way (whether it be intentional or by mistake).

1) It is legally considered a tax therefore constitutional by the highest court in the land.

2) Politically it's a slam dunk because A) it's the largest tax hike in the history of the United States and it's happening during a recession. B) Obama lied because he insisted it is not a tax for political reasons. Nobody wants higher taxes.

33 posted on 07/03/2012 11:34:55 PM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: vbmoneyspender
This a big enough issue to amend the senate rules to eliminate the filibuster assuming we regain the Senate
34 posted on 07/03/2012 11:36:45 PM PDT by BOBWADE (RINOs suck)
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To: tsowellfan
Open primaries gave us romney and your statement about a conservative circular firing squad is all wet.Does it not make you wonder why romnutts would spend so many millions of dollars attacking fellow conservatives for a job that pays 400 K a year including unending headaches? My bet is he takes a dive in this election.
35 posted on 07/03/2012 11:37:49 PM PDT by HANG THE EXPENSE (Life's tough.It's tougher when you're stupid.)
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To: Clint N. Suhks
That doesn’t mean he won’t support a bill to overturn it if it’s done on reconciliation.

If and when the bill hits his desk he'll sign it.

It will be up to others to draft the bill and pass it through Congress.

36 posted on 07/03/2012 11:38:26 PM PDT by rogue yam
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To: vbmoneyspender; Aetius; Travis McGee; ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas; stephenjohnbanker; DoughtyOne; ...

51 can overturn much of Obama-care but not all of it under budget reconciliation. That is how Dems got the House to pass the original Senate Obam-ney-care bill, a second budget reconciliation modification bill that increased both the spending and taxes.

There are so many ironies to ‘this is a tax, not a tax’ argument. Calling it a tax to repeal most of it sides with the SCOTUS (and Roberts) on their decision. Alternatively Romney cant call it a tax because he already is on record saying the mandate in his MA Romney-care bill was not a tax the same as the Obama argument.

It was ruled constitutional by the SCOTUS as a tax and congress can clearly tax us.


37 posted on 07/03/2012 11:39:39 PM PDT by sickoflibs (Romney is a liberal. Just watch him closely try to screw us. (it's Obam-ney Care))
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To: NoLibZone
Who do you support as an alternative to Obama?

I'm likely voting for Romney. The only other alternative is stay home. But I do not support Romney, I'm just voting for him. That means I'm not giving him money, I'm not going door to door for the man, I do not believe in the man, he's our version of John Kerry because he's been on every side of every issue and even if I wanted I could not post any positive articles about the man because there are none out there. Sad but true.

38 posted on 07/03/2012 11:40:26 PM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: tsowellfan

Please see my Reply #32.


39 posted on 07/03/2012 11:40:26 PM PDT by rogue yam
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To: cableguymn

Oh theres fight in them alright,just noit for the conservative causes.They are really demorats.


40 posted on 07/03/2012 11:40:56 PM PDT by HANG THE EXPENSE (Life's tough.It's tougher when you're stupid.)
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To: sickoflibs
Calling it a tax to repeal most of it sides with the SCOTUS (and Roberts) on their decision. Alternatively Romney cant call it a tax because he already is on record saying the mandate in his MA Romney-care bill was not a tax the same as the Obama argument.

Basically RomneyCare is coming back to bite him.

41 posted on 07/03/2012 11:43:54 PM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: vbmoneyspender

That’s what I said. :)
Only need 50 pubs in the Senate. Not 51.


42 posted on 07/03/2012 11:45:25 PM PDT by Suz in AZ
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To: HANG THE EXPENSE
My bet is he takes a dive in this election.

Unfortunately I think you're right. I say unfortunately because Obama is the worst pResident in my lifetime. I'd vote for Jimmy Carter over this man we got in the White House. We may have seen Romney's peak. It may be time for that 4 year vacation in Costa Rica.

43 posted on 07/03/2012 11:49:21 PM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: tsowellfan
RE :”Basically RomneyCare is coming back to bite him.

How could this happen? They said he was the most electable, just like McCain.

44 posted on 07/03/2012 11:50:32 PM PDT by sickoflibs (Romney is a liberal. Just watch him closely try to screw us. (it's Obam-ney Care))
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To: tsowellfan
Perhaps Romney does not want to help conservatives gain control of the Senate. He may feel too pressured as President with a bunch of conservatives in control. If he calls it a tax then that would encourage conservatives to fight hard for a majority big enough to repeal ObamaCare.

Excuse me, tsowellfan, I say this with the utmost repect and lack of rancor (I've admired many of your posts over the years; I am a Sowell fan as well and my late, very wise, beloved father was well read on Sowell and considered his political mind the best of the best) but ... you're still willing to sanction Romney, consent to Romney, because you think he'd be better than Obama?

When it is abundantly clear that he would only be different?

You are on the verge of giving Romney your blessing -- no matter your intent, your vote for Romney would be perceived and acted upon as your blessing and support for everyting Romney is.

There is much more liklihood of conservatism being dealt a death blow in a Romney landslide than if Obama won on a plurality. (That alone is reason enough to vote FOR a plurality by voting third party.)

I am just dumbfounded reading your true and wise assessments of Romney here and there on FR, and then reading that you are planning to vote for him if it comes down to O v R. Truly, if one need evidence of how deranged ABO is ... it is in abundance here.

Voting for Romney in hopes of even the tiniest improvement, is like drinking salt water while stranded at sea in the hopes that it's better than no water at all. Hard and illogical as it seems, the only option at sea is to hunker down and wait for rain of fresh water; better to vote how you can (and that is third party) to weaken the mandate of whichever statist wins, and hunker down and fight Obama with the fresh water of conservatism.

45 posted on 07/03/2012 11:53:12 PM PDT by Finny (A deal with the devil is ALWAYS a losing proposition. Voting for Romney to avoid Obama is just that.)
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To: vbmoneyspender
Here is a straight forward answer: Romney is the RINO from Hell. His staff are demons bent on imposing and retaining liberal policies. Personally I despise him as I am aware the vast majority on this board do.

I can't imagine a worse candidate on the Republican ticket. You have no special knowledge nor unique analysis different than that of the others posters on this site. No one here is a Romney supporter so can that BS.

ROMNEY SUCKS AND WILL THINK, SAY AND DO THINGS THAT SUCK.

As America politics has become Hell on Earth it is almost certain that in November either Romney or Obama will be our next president. Now, I'm not asking who you will vote for or if you will vote. I'm asking which of the candidates do you prefer is president after the vote in November? A straight forward answer of one word will do.


46 posted on 07/03/2012 11:58:03 PM PDT by I see my hands (It's time to.. KICK OUT THE JAMS, MOTHER FREEPERS!)
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To: rogue yam; vbmoneyspender
The straightforward answer is that you are almost certainly a whining, lying little tool who wants Obama to win the election.

As a person who plans on voting for Romney your answer makes me doubt Romney will win. Your answer mirrors exactly how Romney is running his campaign. Basically, "I am not Obama". I have yet to see any substance from the man.

As someone here in FR said:

"Romney has no attack other than “Im not Obama” pretty much...everything else is generic statements about how bad the economy is and that’s about it and even his statements about the bad economy sounds like he’s making a cheap television commercial with no passion"

Well, that's not going to cut it. vbmoneyspender who started this thread asked some very good questions and not even a Romney supporter can answer it?

How's that html, any better for you?

47 posted on 07/03/2012 11:58:42 PM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: Finny

I cannot argue with anything you said. You are 100% correct!


48 posted on 07/04/2012 12:03:12 AM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: tsowellfan

Oh course the bummer is the worst resident ever but the powers that be want him in there again and romnutts is their patsy this time around.Costa Rica sounds great to me for the duration.


49 posted on 07/04/2012 12:09:18 AM PDT by HANG THE EXPENSE (Life's tough.It's tougher when you're stupid.)
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To: tsowellfan

Watch the Senate pass a resolution that states that 0bamacare is officially ‘a penalty’.


50 posted on 07/04/2012 12:09:24 AM PDT by GeorgeWashingtonsGhost
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