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Initiative would let voters overrule federal law
Arizona Daily Sun ^ | // | Howard Fischer

Posted on 07/06/2012 9:37:58 PM PDT by BigEdLB

PHOENIX -- Voters could get the right to overrule federal laws and mandates under the terms of an initiative filed late Thursday.

The Arizona Constitution already says the federal Constitution "is the supreme law of the land." This measure, if approved in November, it would add language saying that federal document may not be violated by any government -- including the federal government.

More to the point, it would allow Arizonans "to reject any federal action that they determine violates the United States Constitution."

That could occur through a vote of the state House and Senate with consent of the governor.

But that also could occur through a popular vote on a ballot measure, effectively allowing voters to decide which federal laws they feel infringe on Arizona's rights as a sovereign state.

Read more: http://azdailysun.com/news/local/state-and-regional/initiative-would-let-voters-overrule-federal-law/article_50d0e77c-d27c-5828-a3b6-d818c0042700.html#ixzz1zuNKE6ZN

(Excerpt) Read more at azdailysun.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Front Page News; Government; Politics/Elections; US: Arizona
KEYWORDS: 10thamendment; 2012; arizonaoverrule; donttreadonme; federalism; federallaws; govtabuse; iwillnotcomply; stateoverrule; statesrights; tyranny; unconstitutional
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Oh-oh... The seeds of a Civil War? God helpus. Obama's Executive Order Goon-Gestapo coming to Arizona to enforce edicts of THE ONE? I will have my digital camera ready for the drone that buzzes my house here in Republica Popular de California.. after posting this...
1 posted on 07/06/2012 9:38:08 PM PDT by BigEdLB
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To: BigEdLB

Damn. I may end up moving to Arizona yet...


2 posted on 07/06/2012 9:41:32 PM PDT by ThunderSleeps (Stop obama now! Stop the hussein - insane agenda!)
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To: ForGod'sSake

Ping.


3 posted on 07/06/2012 9:42:57 PM PDT by Army Air Corps (Four Fried Chickens and a Coke)
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To: BigEdLB

If its not between the States its none of the feds business...


4 posted on 07/06/2012 9:42:57 PM PDT by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole..)
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To: Gilbo_3; B4Ranch; MrB; DakotaGator; null and void

Thought you guys might find this interesting.


5 posted on 07/06/2012 9:44:19 PM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: BigEdLB

Oh the horror of it all ... voters could override the Fed. Oh, the horror of it all. LET FREEDOM RING.


6 posted on 07/06/2012 9:44:44 PM PDT by doc1019 (Voting for the lesser of two evils is still voting for evil.)
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To: HiJinx

Have you seen this thread Jinx?

Interesting times coming possibly.


7 posted on 07/06/2012 9:44:52 PM PDT by SandRat (Duty - Honor - Country! What else needs said?)
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To: BigEdLB

AZ is poised to be Ground Zero for for standing its ground against this lawless Regime.


8 posted on 07/06/2012 9:45:06 PM PDT by wjcsux ("In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." - George Orwell)
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To: ThunderSleeps


Well the next thing the legislature of Stalinists is going to consider is a new state flag. Politically incorrect to have a bear without the bear's permission. All speakers of the bear language have died out, or are all running their lucrative casinos. So we have to have a new flag without a bear. Instead we will use the undead, which is regularly contacted by many officials in all levels of state government, with an addition of the hammer and sickle to show the one-party pride in this state.
9 posted on 07/06/2012 9:46:59 PM PDT by BigEdLB (Now there ARE 1,000,000 regrets - but it may be too late.)
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To: wjcsux

It is simply a matter of being righteously pi**ed. And, justifiably so!


10 posted on 07/06/2012 9:50:13 PM PDT by BigEdLB (Now there ARE 1,000,000 regrets - but it may be too late.)
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To: BigEdLB

” - - - effectively allowing voters to decide which federal laws they feel infringe on Arizona’s rights as a sovereign state.”

Newton said: “For every action there is an opposite and equal reaction.”

Duh, Traitor John Roberts decided that the SCOTUS has the right to tax EVERYBODY, sooooooooooooo, the good citizens of Arizona are going to interpret the Constitution the way that THEY want to.

What goes around comes around.


11 posted on 07/06/2012 9:52:57 PM PDT by Graewoulf ((Traitor John Roberts' Obama"care" violates Sherman Anti-Trust Law, AND the U.S. Constitution.))
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To: ThunderSleeps

“moving to Arizona yet..”

My first reaction, also! And I love the snow:(


12 posted on 07/06/2012 9:55:26 PM PDT by huldah1776
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To: Graewoulf
Newton said: “For every action there is an opposite and equal reaction.”

Precisely!
13 posted on 07/06/2012 9:56:14 PM PDT by BigEdLB (Now there ARE 1,000,000 regrets - but it may be too late.)
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To: BigEdLB

This has been tried before. Twice. I think we’ve learned just who has the bigger stick. Arizona is dependent on the Federal government anyway through block-grants. This is the 21st century. The feds don’t need to resort to anything as crude as using direct force. All they have to do is hold back funding until Arizona gives in- and give in they will.


14 posted on 07/06/2012 10:07:50 PM PDT by JerseyanExile
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To: huldah1776

Flagstaff is at 7,000 feet, and gets plenty of snow. That is where I would move if I went to Arizona.

Glad to see the states beginning to give the feds the finger. Turnabout is fair play.


15 posted on 07/06/2012 10:13:12 PM PDT by HerrBlucher ("The cross opens its arms to the four winds; it is a signpost for free travelers." GK Chesterton)
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To: BigEdLB

I’m really liking the Republicans in Arizona and Wisconsin.
They are conservative and know how to play hardball.


16 posted on 07/06/2012 10:16:11 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: BigEdLB

Nullification Principle..

The actual basis for the Civil War...


17 posted on 07/06/2012 10:33:18 PM PDT by tcrlaf (Election 2012: THE RAPTURE OF THE DEMOCRATS)
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To: OneWingedShark

The seeds of unrest....socialism vs liberty and the Constitution


18 posted on 07/06/2012 11:02:03 PM PDT by B4Ranch (There's Two Choices... Stand Up and Be Counted ... Or Line Up and Be Numbered .)
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To: doc1019

I find it interesting that none of this is necessary in a constitutional republic. Conservatives didn’t create this dilemma. Most of us would be OK, for example, if California voted to go Communist so long as the rest of our states were left alone. The current crisis can be blamed ENTIRELY on the left who are intent on forcing everyone, in every state, to bend to the leftist’s will. Even worse, these evil control freaks want to up their game to a global scale.


19 posted on 07/06/2012 11:04:50 PM PDT by CitizenUSA (Why celebrate evil? Evil is easy. Good is the goal worth striving for.)
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To: BigEdLB

For a “Civil War” you have to have 2 sides willing to fight each other. We have nothing to gain from fighting the left and the left have nothing to fight us with LoL.

I think we can convince both sides that both would be a lot happier if we did not live together under the same overbearing central government.


20 posted on 07/06/2012 11:30:09 PM PDT by Monorprise
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To: CitizenUSA

“I find it interesting that none of this is necessary in a constitutional republic. Conservatives didn’t create this dilemma. Most of us would be OK, for example, if California voted to go Communist so long as the rest of our states were left alone. The current crisis can be blamed ENTIRELY on the left who are intent on forcing everyone, in every state, to bend to the leftist’s will. Even worse, these evil control freaks want to up their game to a global scale.”

I agree whole heatedly. Let California create their own version of hell on earth for themselves and themselves alone for all I care. Any virtuous Californian needs to make like Lot and leave while they still can.

Eventually when the corrupt people of that state hit bottom the state will reform itself.


21 posted on 07/06/2012 11:34:15 PM PDT by Monorprise
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To: BigEdLB; 17th Miss Regt; 2001convSVT; 2ndDivisionVet; A_Former_Democrat; A_Tradition_Continues; ...
Thanks AAC! Pinging the group to a good idea whose time has come, well, way past time but, better late than never. But, what to do about our tax dollars being used as extortion and intimidation to coerce "proper" behavior by the states...

Arizona once again leading the charge!





Please ~ping~ me to articles relating to the 10th Amendment/States Rights so I can engage the pinger.

If you want on or off the ping list just say the word.

Additional Resources:

Tenth Amendment Chronicles Thread
Tenth Amendment Center
Firearms Freedom Act
Health Care Nullification

CLICK HERE TO FIND YOUR STATE REPRESENTATIVES

22 posted on 07/06/2012 11:43:26 PM PDT by ForGod'sSake (You have only two choices: SUBMIT or RESIST with everything you've got!!!)
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To: BigEdLB

Can NOT be done. Supremacy clause. Unconstitutional on it’s face. We want to make changes? let’s not do the fundamentally stupid. It is a waste of time.


23 posted on 07/06/2012 11:47:30 PM PDT by RIghtwardHo
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To: RIghtwardHo
Can NOT be done. Supremacy clause. Unconstitutional on it’s face.

Actually it can be done; the supremacy clause applies only to laws made pursuant to the Constitution, therefore all laws made by Congress Repugnant to the constitution are not so protected.

24 posted on 07/07/2012 12:02:25 AM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: RIghtwardHo
Unconstitutional on it’s face.

So is the government being able to force you to buy something, and giving you a fine for not buying said thing.

25 posted on 07/07/2012 12:04:26 AM PDT by wastedyears ("God? I didn't know he was signed onto the system.")
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To: BigEdLB

Oh boy, this sounds like fun. I’m going to talk to some of my activist friends and legislators in Virginia.


26 posted on 07/07/2012 2:19:51 AM PDT by 103198
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To: BigEdLB

The states accepted offers of candy from the feds with strings attached, now this habit is a hard thing to break


27 posted on 07/07/2012 3:50:43 AM PDT by ronnie raygun (B B)
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To: BigEdLB

Great idea, good to know we still have patriots in America that are willing to bet it all.
Obama of course will throw a childish temper tantrum.

But ideally we should consider even if its just talk the concept of most or all red states opting out of Obamacare first off, and also opting out of the upcoming election.

The electors will not be used, instead it will be done by a popular vote. The field will be reset and so will the play clock.

Its first and ten...


28 posted on 07/07/2012 3:56:18 AM PDT by Eye of Unk (Going mobile, posts will be brief. No spellcheck for the grammar nazis.)
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To: CitizenUSA
I find it interesting that none of this is necessary in a constitutional republic. Conservatives didn’t create this dilemma. Most of us would be OK, for example, if California voted to go Communist so long as the rest of our states were left alone. The current crisis can be blamed ENTIRELY on the left who are intent on forcing everyone, in every state, to bend to the leftist’s will. Even worse, these evil control freaks want to up their game to a global scale.

That is it in a nutshell. When EVERYTHING has been nationalized the stakes are very high indeed.

29 posted on 07/07/2012 4:21:49 AM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va

In a return to the Revolutionary period of America its also time to re-invent the Continental Militia.
Not quite a National Guard, not quite a police force.


30 posted on 07/07/2012 4:27:20 AM PDT by Eye of Unk (Going mobile, posts will be brief. No spellcheck for the grammar nazis.)
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To: RIghtwardHo

Its always Freepers from the east and west coast who are most afraid of states standing up to the Feds. I hope the “sit down to pee’ers” get a new lesson in secession. At first you don’t secede....


31 posted on 07/07/2012 4:27:39 AM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: ThunderSleeps
Damn. I may end up moving to Arizona yet...

I'm with you - the humidity in S, Mississippi is a bit much; some dry air might be just the ticket.

32 posted on 07/07/2012 4:50:49 AM PDT by trebb ("If a man will not work, he should not eat" From 2 Thes 3)
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To: trebb

Having recently returned from Arizona where it was 107, I can testify that even though it is a dry heat......... it is still hot, hot, hot!


33 posted on 07/07/2012 4:53:50 AM PDT by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 ..... Present failure and impending death yield irrational action))
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To: Eye of Unk
Not quite a National Guard, not quite a police force.

...totally under the control of the governor and has the pwer to patrol border and other functions.

In my estimation if Isreal,which is the size and population of New Jersy, can have a full blown military then any state could muster one.

34 posted on 07/07/2012 4:56:58 AM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: RIghtwardHo
Can NOT be done. Supremacy clause. Unconstitutional on it’s face. We want to make changes? let’s not do the fundamentally stupid. It is a waste of time.

Ah, not exactly!

Supremacy Clause:

Article 6, paragraph 2

“This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States
which shall be made in pursuance thereof;
and all treaties made, or which shall be made,
under the authority of the United States,
shall be the supreme law of the land;
and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby,
anything in the constitution or laws
of any state to the contrary notwithstanding.”

Many use this clause when arguing that all laws written by the US Congress are supreme over any other. This is true, only in so far as when Federal laws are Constitutional.

If congress passes an unconstitutional law, in other words, a law that is passed which requires power not enumerated to the Federal government in the Constitution, this is an unlawful law, it is null and void; and neither the States, nor the people are obligated to abide by it.

Thomas Jefferson made the following statement regarding powers assumed by the Federal government (not enumerated by the Constitution):

“Whenever the General Government assumes undelegated powers,
ITS ACTS ARE UNAUTHORITATIVE, VOID AND OF NO FORCE."

–Thomas Jefferson: Kentucky Resolutions, 1798

35 posted on 07/07/2012 4:58:04 AM PDT by Conservative Vermont Vet
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To: bert

I agree it can be HOT! (vs. hot), but I spent 6 years in SW Oklahoma and 105 felt better there than 95 with 95% humidity does here. It’s depressing when you step out of the house at 5 AM and your underwear are “stuck” within 5 steps...


36 posted on 07/07/2012 5:06:50 AM PDT by trebb ("If a man will not work, he should not eat" From 2 Thes 3)
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To: OneWingedShark

i like it, although my pessimism is maxed out for anything to happen to slow the beast in the near future...


37 posted on 07/07/2012 5:26:42 AM PDT by Gilbo_3 (Gov is not reason; not eloquent; its force.Like fire,a dangerous servant & master. George Washington)
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To: Monorprise; BigEdLB

Rebellion would be a more appropriate term. Were it to happen.

An uprising against the feral government.

Nice dream. Don’t see it happening.


38 posted on 07/07/2012 5:42:30 AM PDT by ChildOfThe60s (If you can remember the 60s....you weren't really there)
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To: OneWingedShark

And who determines what federal laws are unconstitutional? Not the states, that has been determined in a long string of court cases going back to the earliest days of the Republic.


39 posted on 07/07/2012 6:32:53 AM PDT by JerseyanExile
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To: JerseyanExile
And who determines what federal laws are unconstitutional? Not the states, that has been determined in a long string of court cases going back to the earliest days of the Republic.

Roberts has rendered the Constitution moot. If he can grant fictitious powers to the Feds then I as a citizen will look to the state houses for relief. Finding none there then the last "box" will have to be employed.

40 posted on 07/07/2012 6:36:45 AM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: BigEdLB

Each state SHOULD be able to determine its own details of government...including the extent of Federal involvement it chooses.

NONE of us signed on for 8.2 trillion of debt DC has generated out of failure to provide oversight of out of control Federal agencies.


41 posted on 07/07/2012 6:40:01 AM PDT by mo (If you understand, no explanation is needed. If you don't understand, no explanation is possible.)
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To: JerseyanExile

“The feds don’t need to resort to anything as crude as using direct force....”

Ya might want to think about that a little bit...

“... in May 2010 “ the US federal budget deficit was $83 billion, or about $8.90 per person per day. Now the Washington Times (hat tip: the American Thinker) reports that the US government has posted its largest monthly deficit in history, $223 billion in February. Now that means that the US government borrowed nearly $26 per person per day. “

http://righteousinvestor.com/tag/us-dollar/

I could not find the change from March 2011 to 2012....but a TRIPLING from 2010 to 2011 means the end game is right around the corner...IMHO. Arizona knows it. California denies it.


42 posted on 07/07/2012 6:46:24 AM PDT by mo (If you understand, no explanation is needed. If you don't understand, no explanation is possible.)
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To: RIghtwardHo

Clearly constitutional under the Tenth Amendment:

“The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.”


43 posted on 07/07/2012 7:30:00 AM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: ForGod'sSake

The Constitution was established with the concept of sovereign states, but it has been subverted to have the states ruled from DC. This is a first step in re-establishing The Tenth Amendment!


44 posted on 07/07/2012 7:51:46 AM PDT by The Sons of Liberty ("Get that bastard out of MY White House!")
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To: JerseyanExile
And who determines what federal laws are unconstitutional? Not the states, that has been determined in a long string of court cases going back to the earliest days of the Republic.

Well no, obviously not the federal government; otherwise they will construe the Constitution to allow anything.... just as Obamacare shows.
I think there's another way to force the issue, and it involves the next step on the immigration issue: the USSC declared that the state couldn't enforce Federal laws... but they said nothing about prohibiting the State from defending itself from invasion.

45 posted on 07/07/2012 8:31:30 AM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: central_va
Its always Freepers from the east and west coast who are most afraid of states standing up to the Feds.

Precisely because those states will lose power. (I think it also has to do, tangentially, with the destruction of States being represented in Congress [the 17th Amd].)

46 posted on 07/07/2012 8:34:39 AM PDT by OneWingedShark (Q: Why am I here? A: To do Justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with my God.)
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To: BigEdLB
The Arizona Constitution already says the federal Constitution "is the supreme law of the land." This measure, if approved in November, it would add language saying that federal document may not be violated by any government -- including the federal government.

More to the point, it would allow Arizonans "to reject any federal action that they determine violates the United States Constitution."

We could be seeing the return fire in what appears to be a looming, potential civil war. However, this raises some interesting questions. Let's assume that, in Nov., the voters throw zero out on his keester and the new administration is, shall we say, "friendlier" to the red states than zero has been. Additionally, let's assume that the AZ voters approve this initiative.

When the new administration is sworn in, will the AZ governor sign this bill? Right now, passions are high and people are ready to jump. But, if zero is thrown out, those passions could quickly die off and this bill might get "lost" on the governor's desk.

That's one "what-if" scenario. The other scenrio involves the passage of the initiative and zero manages to remain in the WH. How far are both sides actually willing to go in this "turf" war?

Potentially interesting times ahead. Invest in popcorn stock!

47 posted on 07/07/2012 10:14:33 AM PDT by DustyMoment (Congress - another name for white collar criminals!!)
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To: Graewoulf
Traitor John Roberts decided that the SCOTUS has the right to tax EVERYBODY, sooooooooooooo, the good citizens of Arizona are going to interpret the Constitution the way that THEY want to.

Interesting observation. Adds a little extra flame to a smoldering fire.

48 posted on 07/07/2012 10:17:51 AM PDT by DustyMoment (Congress - another name for white collar criminals!!)
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To: The Sons of Liberty
The Constitution was established with the concept of sovereign states, but it has been subverted to have the states ruled from DC.

Pretty much a given IMHO since the states via their delegations created the feral government. Not the first time a created vessel has rebelled against its creator. Babel on the Potomac will somehow have to be brought to heel but with so many states and people beholden to the federales by way of a carrot generated from confiscated taxes, it won't be a pretty sight. The feral tentacles reaching into EVERYTHING we and the states do has created a fur ball that will be hard to cough up.

The emasculation of the states and We The People by our feral leaders AND their media enablers has brought us to a precipice. Many of the states; even those that might want to, will not unilaterally choose to assert their powers under the Constitution until they are pretty sure their respective citizens are behind them. It's up to US to apply the pressure. There are a lot of states who have no intentions of standing up because for whatever reasons, are on board the centralized government train.

God help us...

49 posted on 07/07/2012 11:05:54 AM PDT by ForGod'sSake (You have only two choices: SUBMIT or RESIST with everything you've got!!!)
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To: BigEdLB

Fantastic! I may move back there.


50 posted on 07/07/2012 12:07:53 PM PDT by The Mayor ("If you can't make them see the light, let them feel the heat" — Ronald Reagan)
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