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Gallon of Gas Equivalent for Electricity Prices (Where is the savings? NYC = \$8 per gal)
Electricity Choice ^ | May 2012 | Electricity Choice

Posted on 07/09/2012 10:12:14 AM PDT by Titus-Maximus

7 cents per Kwhr equals \$2.338 per gallon.

Electricity Costs for 1 GGE = 33.40 kWh For Local Rate Per kWh \$/Gallon Equivalent

\$0.07 = \$2.338

\$0.08 = \$2.670

\$0.09 = \$3.006

\$0.10 = \$3.340

\$0.11 = \$3.674

\$0.12 = \$4.000

\$0.13 = \$4.342

\$0.14 = \$4.670

\$0.15 = \$5.010

\$0.16 = \$5.344

\$0.17 = \$5.678

\$0.18 = \$6.012

\$0.19 = \$6.346

\$0.20 = \$6.680

\$0.25 = \$8.350

\$0.27 = \$9.018

\$0.28 = \$9.352

\$0.29 = \$9.686

\$0.30 = \$10.020

KEYWORDS: electricity; electricrates; gasprices; gge
NYC has 25 cent power - so that brings you to about \$8.35 per gallon. Who in their right mind would pay that to run their car?

Gasoline is cheaper as is natural gas, so even if someone figures out the battery technology, it is insane to go electric in the Northeast and in California. When Cuomo closes the Indian Point Nuclear Plant in NY, the power prices will be even higher.

What is ironic is that the economics are better in the Red States, where renewables are small and power comes in at a lower price. The blue states which are heavy in renewable energy have very expensive retail power as they use retail rates as a source of taxation and public policy. It is a green house of cards set up to fail.

1 posted on 07/09/2012 10:12:23 AM PDT by Titus-Maximus

To: Titus-Maximus

NYC has 25 cent power - so that brings you to about \$8.35 per gallon. Who in their right mind would pay that to run their car?

Wasn’t it Secy Chu who said gas should be \$9 a gallon?

2 posted on 07/09/2012 10:15:34 AM PDT by jimmyo57

To: Titus-Maximus

...but I don’t like the GGE number unless you’re comparing an old Coleman gasoline stove vs. an electric hotplate!

It doesn’t comprehend the additional efficiencies (inefficiencies) of the final conversion (where the rubber meets the road.)

3 posted on 07/09/2012 10:17:35 AM PDT by sam_paine (X .................................)

To: Titus-Maximus

The only reason to have electric capability is mobility in the event of fuel shortage (I lived through the Nixon/Carter years). The economics obviously suck at today’s prices.

Nat gas may be the hot setup if we get enough public filling stations and the home compressor setup gets cheap enough.

4 posted on 07/09/2012 10:22:05 AM PDT by nascarnation

To: sam_paine
Electricity is "high quality" power. Gasoline, not so much.

http://www-old.me.gatech.edu/energy/brett/four.htm

5 posted on 07/09/2012 10:23:43 AM PDT by Paladin2

To: Titus-Maximus

\$6.68 around my way.And the filthy Rats that run this state love it just where it is.Coupe Deval,our beloved (but not by me) Governor,is making \$150K/yr state salary on top of a million dollar advance on a trash book so \$6.68 is a piece of cake.

6 posted on 07/09/2012 10:28:59 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative

"It makes sense to match energy sources to their end uses.

Electricity is high-quality energy, so it’s best for running motors, light sources, electronics, and other devices requiring high-quality energy. Turning it into low-grade heat is a thermodynamic folly! A really smart strategy is cogeneration, in which the waste heat from electric power generation is used to heat buildings.

In Europe, whole communities are heated that way, and institutions in the United States are increasingly turning to cogeneration to reduce energy costs and carbon emissions."

7 posted on 07/09/2012 10:32:14 AM PDT by Paladin2

To: Titus-Maximus
There is more to the equation. What is your time worth? If I was inclined to make a weekend trip to Las Vegas from San Diego, it would entail 5 1/2 hours driving each was (300 miles one way). Fueling time of about 30 minutes for 2 stops at Barstow and one in Vegas. The electric car driver can go 100 miles before taking an 8 hour recharging stop. That turns into a 22 hour transit each way instead of 5 1/2 hours. The extended down time likely injects need for a hotel room and means.

Extend that trip to the 900 mile trek I make from Pocatello to San Diego. That averages 15 hours including fuel stops. Making that trip in a plug-in electric would be a nightmare.

8 posted on 07/09/2012 10:32:28 AM PDT by Myrddin

To: Titus-Maximus

When comparing efficiency of electric to internal combustion, there are at least two relevant comparisons.

Energy efficiency. This involves comparing the percentage of energy used to actually drive the car as compared to the potential energy at point of origin. For IC this requires factoring in all the energy losses associated with transporting the energy, refining it, etc. And of course vehicle efficiency. For electricity this requires the same calculations about transportation of fuel, as well as generator efficiency, transmission losses, efficiency of transfer to battery and from battery to vehicle.

Those who run the energy efficiency calculations honestly find that while electricity is usually more efficient, it’s not nearly as much more efficient as is usually claimed.

Cost effectiveness. This involves comparing the cost of energy to drive a given distance using IC vs. electricity. Numbers are hard to find, as people with an ax to grind play too many games with them. But again electricity is not nearly as superior in this regard as commonly claimed.

9 posted on 07/09/2012 10:51:21 AM PDT by Sherman Logan

To: Titus-Maximus
Who in their right mind would pay that to run their car?

A friend's employer has free charging stations at his work. He fills up for free (to him anyway). Company's contribution to the environment?

10 posted on 07/09/2012 10:53:41 AM PDT by super7man

To: Titus-Maximus
NYC has 25 cent power -

Really? Ouch! I'm paying about 11 cents per kWh.

Most of the waste in electricity production is at the power plant and the wiring. Once you get it into the car it is pretty efficient, especially if you use things like regenerative braking where the car's kinetic energy is converted back to electricity rather than heat. On the other hand a lot of the energy in gasoline in a car is converted to heat rather than motion. Unless you take that into account, your conversion isn't very good.

A Nissan Leaf has a 24 kWh capacity battery and claims around 100 miles range (although most web reports say it is less). At 11¢/kWh that is \$2.62 for a fill up or \$0.0262 per mile at the rated distance. If you had a 40 mpg subcompact (just guessing by similar size), that would be the equivalent of \$1.05 per gallon. Adjust the price upward if you don't like Nissan's estimate of 100 miles/charge or you pay more than \$0.11/kWh.

With your NYC electricity price that would be the equivalent of \$2.38 per gallon gasoline price.

11 posted on 07/09/2012 10:57:55 AM PDT by KarlInOhio (You only have three billion heartbeats in a lifetime.How many does the government claim as its own?)

To: KarlInOhio

Your real question is the MPG equivalent. An electric motor is far more efficient than a gasoline engine in its use of energy and therefore the GGE is not a sufficient metric to compare mileage costs.

12 posted on 07/09/2012 11:45:44 AM PDT by Titus-Maximus (Light from Light)

To: Titus-Maximus

A Volt can run around 42 miles per battery charge.
A Cruz (Volt car with a gas engine) gets a combined city/highway average of 30 mpg.
Thus a Volt battery holds the equivalent of 42m/30mpg = 1.4 gallons of gas.
The best battery chargers have an efficiency of 65% so the Volt charger consumes the electrical equivalent of 1.4g/65% or 2.15 gallons of gas to fully charge the Volt battery.
The transmission and distribution network is about 50% efficient. Thus the power station must produce the electrical equivalent of 2.15g/50% = 4.30 gallons of gas.
Half of all electricity in the US comes from coal fired plants. That means that half of the Volts are charged by burning coal.
The best coal fired power plants are 50% efficient. Thus a coal fired plant must burn the coal equivalent of 4.30g/50% = 8.60 gallons of coal to charge one Volt battery.
How much coal is the equivalent of 8.60 gallons of gas?
Subbituminous and Bituminous probably average 10,000 BTUs per pound. A gallon of gas averages 125,000 BTUs.

8.60 gallons of gas times 125,000 BTUs/gallon = 1,060,000 BTUs.
1,075,000 BTUs / 10,000 BTUs/pound of coal = 107.5 pounds of coal.

Hey Volt owner, thanks for burning 107.5 pounds of coal to run your car for 42 miles.

13 posted on 07/09/2012 12:13:48 PM PDT by american_ranger

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