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The Duty to Throw off Such Government
Crisis magazine ^ | July 9, 2012 | Rev. James V. Schall, S.J.

Posted on 07/14/2012 4:23:32 AM PDT by iowamark

"“Mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the Forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of Abuses and Usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object, evinces a Design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their Right, it is their Duty to throw off such Government and to provide new Guards for their future Security.”" —The U. S. Declaration of Independence, 1776.

David Goldman, in a recent article in the Asia Times (June 26), was struck by the fierce loyalty that his countrymen showed to Napoleon, even after several spectacular defeats. Goldman attributed this reaction to Napoleon’s ability to break the bonds of society and to concentrate all hope and loyalty into himself. The people no longer had sufficient interior virtues and standards whereby they themselves could form judgments about what was right and wrong. That function was subsumed into dependence and confidence in the emperor’s force of personality and external mission.

Readers of Plato and Aristotle know their recurring thesis: a tyrant arises out of a democracy when the citizens have little or no inner principle of order other than what they will for themselves. The tyrant becomes the “leader of the people” and, finally, their master. He can impose on them his cure for their well-being. But he is seen as a savior because the people, no longer in contact with the rationale of their own tradition, have little else in their souls with which to judge him. Hence, the loyalty and enthusiasm follow the “leader.” What struck Goldman about both Napoleon and Hitler was not so much that they failed, but how close they came to succeeding. The wonder is whether we will always be so lucky.

When we read the powerful words of the Declaration, we are struck by the truth of its observation that mankind is disposed to suffer evils, if it can, rather than to take the effort to throw them off. Custom, for all its good contributions to stability, makes us slow to see things as they go wrong. A people are accustomed to its own political “Form,” even if they retain the capacity to “right themselves” from its abuses. A point can come where they no longer retain such a capacity or a will to exercise it.

The Declaration of Independence is mostly remembered for its ringing words of principle, the “We hold these truths.” But as a document, the greater part is a bill of particulars that recounts the abuses of the British Crown as seen by the colonists, themselves nurtured in this same English tradition. The reason why the abuses are so diligently listed is to make a rational case before mankind that a “design” was being followed to reduce the people to “absolute despotism.”

The British Crown, no doubt, would have denied that such was its real intention. It merely wanted to restore order to its hot-headed colonial subjects. And no doubt with some considerable prudence on its part, the Crown might well have prevented the Revolution. As we watch the British Empire after both the French and American Revolutions, it did learn many lessons that were more benignly applied to other colonial outposts, some of which are still in existence today.

The American founders saw that the kind of limited government that they formed was likely to be strong enough to withstand most external enemies. What some of them also recognized was that the most dangerous threats to the country’s future would come from within and not without. The American system was put together to prevent despotism. Hence, all its offices were constrained. They were to be limited, checked, and balanced so that the enthusiasm which we associate with Napoleon did not arise among us. This nation, under God, was to be a country of citizens not of masses.

What we see today, I think, is the awareness that we must form a careful list of abuses, analogous to those composed by the writers of the Declaration. This time, the abuses are not against any colonial power but against our own rulers. Who would ever have imagined that freedom of religion would come to be on the government’s agenda as an item to be restricted? We see that marriage itself is no longer understood and its supposed alternatives promoted by official policy. The list is getting longer every day.

Though the courts have often been contributors to this list, we see that the Supreme Court may still function as a check on governmental despotism. But what seems clear is that the very idea of a Constitution, of a form of order according to which we should govern ourselves, is called into question when it conflicts with what the democracy or its leader wants. The American Republic was established so that a people who could rule themselves did rule themselves also in the public order. But it was also a Republic based on the idea that such a thing as virtue of soul and order in human affairs existed. They were not simply created in any form we wanted.

Reflecting now on the Fourth of July 2012, we have to wonder about a regime now manifesting a growing list of abuses to the fundamental nature of human worth. These abuses are put into effect by elected rulers themselves. They are accepted by many citizens who themselves are “democratic” in the classic Greek sense, that in their soul they have little principle of order.

Hence, they have no reason to object to anything on any other basis than that of personal whim or want. The term “unconstitutional” is meaningless. This situation is not a far cry from that list found in the Declaration. In describing these abuses, it read: “He (the King) has made Judges dependent on his Will alone.” “He has refused to assent to Laws.” And “He has combined with others to subject us to a Jurisdiction foreign to our Constitution.”

Constitutional rule derives from a people who understand the nature and demands of the virtues and their relation to our final end. It is aware of an order transcendent to politics. Arbitrary rule arises when a leader, seeing that the people have no real order of soul, sees himself able to impose whatever form of rule that he thinks good for the people. Unless they acquiesce in this rule and its decrees, they are no longer citizens, whatever a written Constitution might say.

In 2012, when we read the Declaration of Independence and its appeal to the judgment of mankind, it seems more addressed to our own government rather than to the British Crown.


TOPICS: Activism/Chapters; Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Editorial; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: catholic; declarofindependenc
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Rev. James V. Schall, S.J., teaches political science at Georgetown University. His latest book, The Mind That Is Catholic, is published by Catholic University of America Press.
1 posted on 07/14/2012 4:23:37 AM PDT by iowamark
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To: iowamark

I am ready for the call.


2 posted on 07/14/2012 4:29:33 AM PDT by Robert Drobot (Fiat voluntas tua)
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To: iowamark

bump


3 posted on 07/14/2012 4:36:02 AM PDT by VTenigma
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To: Robert Drobot
I am ready for the call.

Something tells me it's never going to come, so depraved is this age.

4 posted on 07/14/2012 4:38:26 AM PDT by the invisib1e hand (A Dalmation was spotted wagging its tail.)
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To: iowamark
Worth posting again

Constitutional rule derives from a people who understand the nature and demands of the virtues and their relation to our final end. It is aware of an order transcendent to politics. Arbitrary rule arises when a leader, seeing that the people have no real order of soul, sees himself able to impose whatever form of rule that he thinks good for the people. Unless they acquiesce in this rule and its decrees, they are no longer citizens, whatever a written Constitution might say.

Bump...

5 posted on 07/14/2012 4:38:41 AM PDT by Popman (When you elect a clown: expect a circus...)
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To: iowamark

Americans... this is your future.

6 posted on 07/14/2012 4:39:14 AM PDT by Blado (When the government controls your healthcare it owns your body and you are a slave.)
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To: iowamark

Obama isn’t “leader” enough to be mentioned in the same sentence as Hitler or Napoleon and yet here we are...


7 posted on 07/14/2012 4:42:54 AM PDT by the invisib1e hand (A Dalmation was spotted wagging its tail.)
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To: the invisib1e hand

More depraved than Sodom and Gomorrah?


8 posted on 07/14/2012 4:44:46 AM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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A Jesuit who apparently hasn’t lost his mind and been seduced by the prince of darkness.


9 posted on 07/14/2012 4:44:56 AM PDT by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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10 posted on 07/14/2012 4:46:45 AM PDT by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: iowamark
“The great and chief end, therefore, of men uniting into commonwealths, and putting themselves under government, is the preservation of their property; to which in the state of Nature there are many things wanting.”

“Men, therefore, in society having property, they have such right to the goods which by the law of the community are theirs, that nobody hath a right to take their substance or any part of it from them, without their own consent …”

(John Locke, The Second Treatise of Government, chapter 11, paragraph 138.)

11 posted on 07/14/2012 4:47:09 AM PDT by saywhatagain
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To: Robert Drobot
In fact I finally read it and it stops short of any kind of "call" to anything except perhaps to "make a list.". Has all of mankind been emasculated?

when America stops slaughtering infants for convenience and profit, maybe, just maybe, the Almighty will relent. Until then, fuh-freaking-geddaboudit.

a-moral-and-religious-people-It-is-wholly-unsuited-to-any-other-alert.

12 posted on 07/14/2012 4:52:51 AM PDT by the invisib1e hand (A Dalmation was spotted wagging its tail.)
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Comment #13 Removed by Moderator

To: the invisib1e hand

>>Obama isn’t “leader” enough to be mentioned in the same sentence as Hitler or Napoleon and yet here we are...

Hitler and Napoleon had the best interests of their nations in mind when they began. Obama has never been interested in improving the USA’s way of life or position in the world. He has been a destroyer from the beginning. He is more like a biblical plague than a leader.


14 posted on 07/14/2012 4:55:31 AM PDT by Bryanw92 (Sic semper tyrannis)
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To: Bryanw92
He is more like a biblical plague than a leader

pls see 12.

15 posted on 07/14/2012 5:00:14 AM PDT by the invisib1e hand (A Dalmation was spotted wagging its tail.)
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To: driftdiver
More depraved than Sodom and Gomorrah?

no, I suppose not. Nor Babylon. But we seem to be a composite kingdom. And our Towers have already been torn down.

16 posted on 07/14/2012 5:04:53 AM PDT by the invisib1e hand (A Dalmation was spotted wagging its tail.)
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To: driftdiver
More depraved than Sodom and Gomorrah?

no, I suppose not. Nor Babylon. But we seem to be a composite kingdom. And our Towers have already been torn down.

17 posted on 07/14/2012 5:05:30 AM PDT by the invisib1e hand (America has enemies. And friends.)
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To: iowamark

“We have met the enemy and he is us”

Pogo Possum - Okefenoffee Swamp - many years ago


18 posted on 07/14/2012 5:12:19 AM PDT by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever.)
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To: the invisib1e hand

>>pls see 12.

I saw it. There is more to “the call” that needs to be made than just ending abortion. This nation worships idols and other gods and that is its greatest sin against God. Even in many of our churches, we worship the things of this world. Ending abortion is not even a good start. The place to start is returning America to being a Christian nation, and then the abortion problem will solve itself.


19 posted on 07/14/2012 5:13:24 AM PDT by Bryanw92 (Sic semper tyrannis)
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To: iowamark
The people no longer had sufficient interior virtues and standards whereby they themselves could form judgments about what was right and wrong. That function was subsumed into dependence and confidence in the emperor’s force of personality and external mission.

Readers of Plato and Aristotle know their recurring thesis: a tyrant arises out of a democracy when the citizens have little or no inner principle of order other than what they will for themselves.

I'm convinced this is what has happened to our nation. This undoing of our love of freedom has taken decades to accomplish and much of it has been subtle and seemingly innocent. With a tidal wave there is drama and shock- with erosion there is slow and steady change. But look at the results- they are the same.

20 posted on 07/14/2012 5:17:27 AM PDT by SE Mom (Proud mom of an Iraq war combat vet)
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To: iowamark
Bastiat:

“This question of legal plunder must be settled once and for all, and there are only three ways to settle it:"

"1. The few plunder the many. 2. Everybody plunders everybody. 3. Nobody plunders anybody.”

We are certainly at #2. When the plunder runs out, and it soon will, I doubt the public will return to Founding era virtue. A corrupted people will need totalitarian government, being suitable for no other.

21 posted on 07/14/2012 5:21:57 AM PDT by Jacquerie (I want my America back.)
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To: Robert Drobot

THis is why the government should not have UAVs and things of that sort. These inlets into our decisions and consciousnesses is completely ridiculous. I mean, do I need a little public trial every time before deciding if I am going to use a fork to pick my broccoli vs. my french fry up?

This is obviously genocide excuse into making people non-entities. Playing with UAV robots or what not is going to be their sole role model. It’s bad enough the K9 unit tries to train people the way they do their own dogs.


22 posted on 07/14/2012 5:23:03 AM PDT by JudgemAll (Democrats Fed. job-security Whorocracy & hate:hypocrites must be gay like us or be tested/crucified)
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To: driftdiver

Jeremiah 17:5 Cursed is the man who puts his trust in man,who makes flesh his arm-and is turned from God.” We have trusted our Government.We have excused their error fearing we might be ridiculed for questioning authority.Yet I have been saying for twenty years that the American Government has replaced the role played by the Brits in the Founding era. For the same reasons.We have forgotten God(as President Lincoln so rightly put it March 30,1863.Except the Lord of Hosts had preserved to us a very small remnant we would have been made like Sodom and like unto Gomorrah.Romans 9:29 quoting Isaiah 1:9 see also Isaiah 13:19 Is America the new Babylon?


23 posted on 07/14/2012 5:24:43 AM PDT by StonyBurk (ring)
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To: iowamark

What’s most remarkable about this article is that it was written by a Jesuit who serves on the faculty at Georgetown University. When you start to see this sort of thing from “Catholics” who had spent most of the last 60 years turning from God and getting very comfortable with Mammon, you know something is up.


24 posted on 07/14/2012 5:35:06 AM PDT by Alberta's Child ("If you touch my junk, I'm gonna have you arrested.")
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To: iowamark
The term “unconstitutional” is meaningless.

I want to see our republican leaders take this part and throw him out by impeachment. I know, I am dreaming.

25 posted on 07/14/2012 5:40:43 AM PDT by Arrowhead1952 (It's time to take out the trash in DC.)
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To: StonyBurk

I’m not saying that things are great, just that the cycle has been seen before and there is hope for those who accept Jesus.


26 posted on 07/14/2012 5:44:00 AM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: Bryanw92
Ending abortion is not even a good start.

...but "being Christian" is, eh? So let's keep on slaughtering babies, until we get that worship right, is that it?

[heroically restrains self]

I suppose it should be repeated because it seems you missed it: nothing improves until abortion stops. Nothing. Ever.

27 posted on 07/14/2012 5:56:46 AM PDT by the invisib1e hand (America has enemies. And friends.)
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To: Bryanw92
I think there's a story in the bible about Soddom and Gomorrah rising in judgment of those who "had the worship right" but continued to lie, cheat, steal, murder...

in other words, aquinas, a heathen who doesn't murder his baby will judge the religious person who does -- or who, perhaps, doesn't think it's as important to put a stop to as it is to go to church on Sundays and Wednesdays.

28 posted on 07/14/2012 6:02:24 AM PDT by the invisib1e hand (America has enemies. And friends.)
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To: Robert Drobot
"Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, Give me Liberty, or give me Death!"

See you there, fellow Patriot!

29 posted on 07/14/2012 6:12:55 AM PDT by DTogo (High time to bring back the Sons of Liberty !!)
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To: the invisib1e hand

>>I think there’s a story in the bible about Soddom and Gomorrah rising in judgment of those who “had the worship right” but continued to lie, cheat, steal, murder...

Exactly. They had the worship right. They did all the “things” required. They had a temple, a priest, they walked through the sacraments, they had the right artwork, they gave the required amount to the right charities. They did everything but love God with all their hearts. And then with an evil heart, they went out and committed murder, etc.

The average American Christian does the exact same thing. They show up on Sunday and maybe Wednesday, if there isn’t something else to do, and they go through the motions of performing the act of worship.

The. Act. Of. Worship.

That’s all. Just the act. Just AN act.

Outlawing the murder of babies will not fix that. And God will not favor a nation that does not favor Him.

Now, I’m not saying that we shouldn’t outlaw abortion. It is a crime against humanity, no different than herding people into poision gas showers. But, the line of thinking that God will favor us for doing just that is flawed.


30 posted on 07/14/2012 6:39:11 AM PDT by Bryanw92 (Sic semper tyrannis)
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To: the invisib1e hand

>>...but “being Christian” is, eh? So let’s keep on slaughtering babies, until we get that worship right, is that it?

No. I already made my statement on the difference between worship and the act of worship.

>>[heroically restrains self]

There’s nothing heroic in telling others to not do something that you would never do yourself. Heroism is having a half-dozen unwanted foster children living in your house.


31 posted on 07/14/2012 6:43:36 AM PDT by Bryanw92 (Sic semper tyrannis)
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To: iowamark
The most contentious -- and paradigm-blasting -- idea in the Declaration is that governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed. Citizen rights do NOT derive from the government down, but vice versa.

Jefferson's thesis -- upon which he expounds at length -- is that the Crown had violated the precepts of Lockeian social contract, that the obligations of the government to its citizens had been ignored, while the obligations of the citizenry were being enforced at gunpoint. To Locke and Jefferson, that meant the social contract was dissolved; no contract can be unilateral.

We are at that same point (and beyond) today. Our government is NOT "just." It does NOT derive its powers from the consent of the governed; how could Obamacare have passed if it did, when a vast majority of citizens opposed it? And it is not protecting the rights of its citizens; it is merely perpetuating itself and its own elitist vision. Therefore, the social contract, if not dissolved, is certainly eroded, and we find ourselves in much the same position the Founding Fathers did in the days of tri-corn hats.

That is the lesson we've forgotten. That is the lesson we must relearn if America is to once again be free.

32 posted on 07/14/2012 7:39:19 AM PDT by IronJack (=)
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To: Arrowhead1952
The federal administrative and judicial branches have turned their collective backs on our Constitution. The Congress has been morally corrupt since its surrender of its Constitutional duty to control our currency in 1913 to the .

Your conclusion ".... I know, I am dreaming." would have been an unthinkable American thought in the forties and fifties, and yet it is what it is.

Greed and sloth coupled with apathy and narcissism have overtaken a once fiercely independent America to the point of drowning in a suicidal drug induced arrogance.

The Congress is now preparing their script to deliver our ‘no compromise’ Constitutional freedom to bare arms to a contemptable store front fraud that would not exist, but for the billions of our wealth our Congress has flushed down its money sucking throat to ‘buy’ their sewer slime respect.

I’ll write it again :

I’m ready for the call.

There are no peaceful options remaining to redress the betrayal of America’s Citizens by a governing body of fools in denial of their precarious vulnerability.

33 posted on 07/14/2012 7:44:27 AM PDT by Robert Drobot (Fiat voluntas tua)
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To: Robert Drobot

We have used the soap box, the ballot box turned out to be a joke. Now the bullet box is our only remaining option.


34 posted on 07/14/2012 8:13:07 AM PDT by Arrowhead1952 (It's time to take out the trash in DC.)
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To: All
The federal administrative and judicial branches have turned their collective backs on our Constitution. The Congress has been morally corrupt since its surrender of its Constitutional duty to control our currency in 1913 to the most secret private entity in the world. The FED.

It is the FED that came to control our wealth through the secret financing other governments - including those posing the greatest threats to our national security.

The FED has never permitted a complete disclosure of how it has abused the use of our money, and made necessary the expenditure of greater assets in response to historical security threats. For the past ninety-nine years Congress has surrendered America to a monster that has been squandered everything we have and held for future generations.

We really don't know the gravity of the debt, and the Congress wants it kept that way.

35 posted on 07/14/2012 8:26:17 AM PDT by Robert Drobot (Fiat voluntas tua)
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To: iowamark; All
"Constitutional rule derives from a people who understand the nature and demands of the virtues and their relation to our final end. It is aware of an order transcendent to politics. Arbitrary rule arises when a leader, seeing that the people have no real order of soul, sees himself able to impose whatever form of rule that he thinks good for the people. Unless they acquiesce in this rule and its decrees, they are no longer citizens, whatever a written Constitution might say."

What a powerfully insightful statement! Others, including Supreme Court Justices have stated it clearly before; yet, for generations, we have failed, as a people, to study the ideas essential to our liberty which were carefully laid out in our Declaration of Independence and the writings of the Founders and Framers of our Constitution. Instead, we allowed so-called "progressives" to work, like termites, gradually to censor those ideas from our textbooks and our public discourse.


The U. S. Constitution's Precious Cargo*

"Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court even can do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

The Constitution's words are only the vehicles which carry great ideas across the centuries. The precious cargo must be defined, protected, and treasured by "We, the People" in order for its benefits to accrue to each generation. Take the word, "liberty". What message does this semantic vehicle bring?

Abe Lincoln: "We all declare for liberty, but

in using the same word we do not mean the same thing...."

"The shepherd drives the wolf from the sheep's throat, for which the sheep thanks the shepherd as his liberator,

While the wolf denounces him for the same act...."

"Plainly," said Lincoln, "the sheep and the wolf are not agreed

upon a definition of liberty."

To some, he said, "liberty" means: that each individual in the society may do as he sees fit with himself and the earnings from his labors. To others, "liberty" means: that some persons may do as they see fit (or arbitrarily determine to be best) with other persons' earnings. Lincoln wisely observed that each respective view can be called by the other party by two "different and incompatible" names: "liberty" (unbridled license) and "tyranny" (power abused).

Down through the centuries since 1787, America's constitutional vehicle has traveled, proclaiming right up front that its primary purpose is to "secure the Blessings of Liberty." This is not just any old vehicle. This is the Constitution of the United States of America! Its makers left volumes of writings and definitions of the cargo of priceless treasure its words carry. Its intent to secure a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common Defense, and promote the general Welfare (common good) and "secure the Blessings of Liberty" relies on a clear understanding of, and strict adherence to, its underlying philosophy that each individual possesses Creator-endowed rights, as well as its structural provisions for protecting them from abuses of power by those they elect to positions of power in public office.

"Liberty"--the word--can become "liberty"--the blessing--only to those who care enough to know the difference between "license" and "tyranny": to those who will never mistake the real treasure of liberty envisioned by America's Founders for its counterfeits--rampant, unbridled license among the citizenry or abuse of power by those to whom power is delegated. Both are equally fatal to true liberty.

* "Lessons In Liberty" Series by La Vaughn G. Lewis, Free Lance Writer and Co-Editor of "Our Ageless Constitution" & "Rediscovering the Ideas of Liberty"

36 posted on 07/14/2012 9:02:42 AM PDT by loveliberty2
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To: iowamark

BFL


37 posted on 07/14/2012 9:07:44 AM PDT by PoliticalArsonist
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To: A.A. Cunningham

One of my favorite professors.


38 posted on 07/14/2012 2:16:44 PM PDT by Defiant (If there are infinite parallel universes, why Lord, am I living in the one with Obama as President?)
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To: iowamark; All

One of the most important threads of this year...

I believe there are several FReepers capable of coming up with some very well worded “pariculars” to list the abuses of the government, and its representatives have imposed upon us over just the last 40-50 years...

But since we still have the mechanism to throw off these very representatives...It comes down to what is anyone prepared to do about it, and what are you prepared to sacrifice for it???

When we lose that ability to effect change every two years, then it might be time to throw off that government in a manner fitting and honorableto those whoactiually did to get this Union started...

When it ever comes time to go to guns, everyone loses, lets not forget that...


39 posted on 07/14/2012 2:22:29 PM PDT by stevie_d_64 (It's not the color of one's skin that offends people...it's how thin it is.)
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To: Arrowhead1952

Really. Just how is that going to work?


40 posted on 07/14/2012 5:02:20 PM PDT by Ajnin (Neca eos omnes. Deus suos agnocet!)
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To: iowamark
If the blood ever flows, it will be because fools rejected intelligence and learning in favor of war, and died for their ignorance and abandonment of the greatest mechanism for justice ever conceived by mankind - the US Constitution.

How Chief Justice Roberts Saved America

41 posted on 07/14/2012 6:19:11 PM PDT by Talisker (One who commands, must obey.)
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To: JudgemAll
THis is why the government should not have UAVs and things of that sort. These inlets into our decisions and consciousnesses is completely ridiculous. I mean, do I need a little public trial every time before deciding if I am going to use a fork to pick my broccoli vs. my french fry up?

This is a bit of a side note, but I always believed that if they have any gun control laws, they apply equally across the board, both the "little guy" and the "big fish" have to follow it. If full-auto firearms were banned for example, then no one should be allowed to have them, if you or I cannot have one, then that will, or should, apply the same to the police, Secret Service and even the military. Naturally, I'm not for gun control at all, but I'm just using it to illustrate my point.
42 posted on 07/14/2012 10:13:10 PM PDT by Nowhere Man (June 28th, 2012, the Day America Jumped The Shark.)
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To: iowamark
Last Sunday our pastor stood up and announced that he was joining a nation wide group of pastors who were ready to take a stand.

They're willing to challenge the IRS and the Power of the government, and ready to call out the evil that is now taking over our society. He's answering a call to rise up and speak the truth and he's willing to suffer if need be, to lose leadership of our church.

Then the most amazing thing happened: The entire congregation erupted in jubilant applause!

43 posted on 07/14/2012 10:21:37 PM PDT by Humidston (For the first time in my adult life I FEAR my government.)
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To: Ajnin
There are a number of people posting on FR that CW II is coming. I talked to a neighbor yesterday and he just bought several thousand rounds of ammo. I have a good supply of various calibers myself.
44 posted on 07/15/2012 4:53:33 AM PDT by Arrowhead1952 (It's time to take out the trash in DC.)
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To: Humidston

The key to challenge these asswipes like the IRS and the whole behemoth is to do it in secrecy.

If they know it’s coming they have time to go on defense. If they have no clue it hits them like a ton of bricks and they shit all over themselves.

It will take a massive effort but I see a major tax revolt as the only option to cut these bastards off at the knees.


45 posted on 07/15/2012 4:56:39 PM PDT by unixfox (Abolish Slavery, Repeal The 16th Amendment!)
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To: Arrowhead1952
CWII is not coming. Our circumstances now don't even remotely resemble circumstances prior to the civil war that started in 1861. You and your neighbors can buy all the guns and ammo you want, it won't do you any good because none of you will ever get to use it.

Who are you going to shoot at? Who is going to lead this so called civil war? Who and where are the rebels?

46 posted on 07/15/2012 6:18:33 PM PDT by Ajnin (Neca eos omnes. Deus suos agnocet!)
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To: the invisib1e hand

I think what he means is that if the culture and people are Christian, both in belief and actions, it means little what the actual laws are. If you are moral, there is no need for outside forces. As far as a half dozen foster kids, a lot of them are in foster care because of the sins of their parents. If people take care of their own, there would be less need for foster care.


47 posted on 07/15/2012 6:57:42 PM PDT by gracie1 (Look, just because you have to tolerate something doesnÂ’t mean you have to approve of it.)
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To: the invisib1e hand

The USA might eventually be boycotted and become an abandoned shell, but a second Revolution? Closest thing would be a con-con.


48 posted on 07/15/2012 8:25:52 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (let me ABOs run loose, lew (or is that lou?))
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To: the invisib1e hand

And abortion won’t stop until enough people have it in mind to hate it.


49 posted on 07/15/2012 8:27:31 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (let me ABOs run loose, lew (or is that lou?))
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To: iowamark

Fantastic article! Well spoken words that get down to the heart of the matter. A free man must have a free soul ordered by God.

Without a religious & God fearing people any hope for long term Constitutional Government may be in vain. Figuring out how to turn our population back to God is anther challenge I have yet to seriously contemplate. I’ve been so wrapped up in trying to solve the problem of restoring the structure of liberty I seem to overlook its foundation.

Of course there is the potential problem of the church collaborating with the State to instead of freeing souls to stand upon their own with God, enslaving them to an early institution.


50 posted on 07/16/2012 2:39:52 AM PDT by Monorprise
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