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Tea Party Express picks Marco Rubio for VP (Article says Tea Partiers not TPX)
Tampa Bay.com ^ | JULY 18, 2012 | Amy Hollyfield

Posted on 07/18/2012 9:07:28 AM PDT by Perdogg

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To: Perdogg
"Florida Sen.-elect Marco Rubio announced his top staff, which included three former Romney campaign hands. Sally Canfield, who served as Romney's policy adviser, will be Rubio's legislative director and chief policy adviser; Joe Pounder, who was in charge of rapid response for Romney, will be Rubio's communications director; and Alex Burgos, who directed specialty media for Romney, will serve as director of media affairs for Rubio." -- RCP/Time, Jan. 4, 2011"

51 posted on 07/18/2012 10:17:43 AM PDT by StAnDeliver (2008 + IN, NC, FL, VA, OH, NV o/r IA = 271EV)
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To: W. W. SMITH

Beautiful.
And Washington didn’t own a single seed corn cap so he is disqualified...


52 posted on 07/18/2012 10:22:33 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: ilovesarah2012

If 0bama was born in Hawaii, and he wasn’t the son of an ambassador or King or other HoS, or, if he wasn’t the son of an enemy occupier, then yes end of story.

Please refer to Us V Wong-Ark and the 14th Amendment.


53 posted on 07/18/2012 10:24:13 AM PDT by Perdogg (Let's leave reading things in the Constitution that aren't there to liberals and Dems)
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To: Perdogg

“Rubio in nbC under the 14th Amendment Art 1. since he was not the son of an ambassador or the son of an occupier. He was born in Fla and therefore he is nbC and he accepted the jurisidiction of the US. Therefore he is Jus Solis.”

Not sure how you can be a “natural born” citizen if it requires a law to make it so. The 14th amendment does not confer “natural born” citizenship on anyone.

Not sure where in “article” or rather Section 1 of the 14th amendment you’re referring to:

“Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.”

Since Rubio’s parents were both Cuban citizens at the time of his birth, Rubio was also born a Cuban citizen and “subject to the jurisdiction” of Cuba. Now, unless Rubio has formally renounced his Cuban citizenship he still might be considered a Cuban citizen and subject to being charged and executed as a traitor, should he return there. Haven’t had the time to verify this yet, but it’s on my bucket list.


54 posted on 07/18/2012 10:24:18 AM PDT by Larry - Moe and Curly (Loose lips sink ships.)
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To: Perdogg

The big question is this…how did George and Gaskell Romney get their US Citizenship back if they still had it at all? If Gaskell (son) and Miles Park Romney (father) who were both Mexican citizens how could they transfer US Citizenship to George Romney? Mitt Romney, however, may be a birthright baby because he fell under the 14th Amendment (I doubt they were under the jurisdiction of the US) but it is absolutely clear that Mitt Romney is NOT a Natural Born Citizen unless he can prove that George Romney gained citizenship from naturalization prior to Mitt’s birth in 1947. I have found no records showing this to be the case.

Edward C. Noonan
President 2012

http://noonan4president.blogspot.com/2012/01/mitt-romney-is-not-natural-born-citizen.html

It will be interesting to see if the dems question Romney’s eligibility. I don’t know why we can’t find a regular American to be president that doesn’t have any these questions. Allen West’s parents are Americans.


55 posted on 07/18/2012 10:35:42 AM PDT by ilovesarah2012
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To: Perdogg

Pass the popcorn...I prefer Col. Allen West’s combat boots, over tassle-toe loafers.


56 posted on 07/18/2012 10:35:55 AM PDT by gitmogrunt
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To: Perdogg
“I disagree about Jindal and Rubio not being nbC.”

Then you would be wrong and uninformed.

57 posted on 07/18/2012 10:44:49 AM PDT by faucetman ( Just the facts, ma'am, Just the facts)
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To: biggredd1
rubio and jindal are not eligible.

Says you and a very small percentage of kooks. This matter has been settled. Get over it, move on and wise up.

58 posted on 07/18/2012 10:47:56 AM PDT by New Jersey Realist (America: home of the free because of the brave)
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To: Perdogg
Tea Party Express picks Marco Rubio for VP

Then we know who Romney probably won't.

59 posted on 07/18/2012 10:49:31 AM PDT by Colonel_Flagg (Conservatism is not a matter of convenience.)
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost
Please explain why/how Rubio is a natural born citizen. Were both of his parents United States citizens at the time of his birth?

There is no law that requires citizen parents. Wise up!

60 posted on 07/18/2012 10:51:01 AM PDT by New Jersey Realist (America: home of the free because of the brave)
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To: biggredd1

Bingo


61 posted on 07/18/2012 10:51:19 AM PDT by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: Perdogg

This thread is a perfect example of how we got Romney & McCain in the first place. Everybody plays the Rino card on everyone else’s choice. Meanwhile only the real Rinos are left standing.


62 posted on 07/18/2012 10:52:30 AM PDT by Starstruck
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To: Perdogg

I attended local tea party rallies... a long long time ago.
However, I must admit I do not know much about the National orgs like TPE..or maybe it should be called TGOPE?


63 posted on 07/18/2012 10:57:08 AM PDT by Leep (Enemy of the Statist)
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To: svcw
“Both Rubio and Jindal are citizens of the USA”

Yes, but they are NOT Article II, Section 1, Clause 5, NATURAL BORN CITIZENS. BOTH parents have to be “U.S. citizens” at the the time of the child's birth.

EVERYONE at the time of the founding knew exactly why “citizen” was changed to be “Natural Born Citizen”. They relied on Vattel’s “The Law of Nations” definition. Copies of which were in the library, in French AND English, where the constitution was written.

The Supreme Court has stated the same in several opinions/decisions.

There is NO DOUBT,

64 posted on 07/18/2012 10:57:08 AM PDT by faucetman ( Just the facts, ma'am, Just the facts)
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To: exit82

What I know is what the Constitution says: 35 years of age, lived here for fourteen years and born in the USA, by this definition both men are eligible to be president.


65 posted on 07/18/2012 10:57:41 AM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: faucetman

Well, there are many people who do not agree with your interpretation, actually most people do not agree.


66 posted on 07/18/2012 10:59:46 AM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: Larry - Moe and Curly
We ARE with the program and wish all the rest of you were, too.

You most certainly are NOT with the program. There is not one congressman, senator, judge or conservative talk show host that agrees with you. Only the nuts and kooks! Why don't you call up Mario Apuzzo or Donofrio and ask them if they've won any cases yet?

67 posted on 07/18/2012 10:59:47 AM PDT by New Jersey Realist (America: home of the free because of the brave)
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To: faucetman

BOTH parents have to be “U.S. citizens


Or, Democrats/Progs/Commies/American Haters?


68 posted on 07/18/2012 11:03:02 AM PDT by Leep (Enemy of the Statist)
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To: W. W. SMITH

Do you look under your bed every night before retiring? If not you should; a conspirator might be hiding there to spook you. Get professional help!

This is a settled argument. The law is if you are born in U.S. you are NBC. You can talk till you are blue in the face and you won’t change that fact.

Name the statute or part of the Constitution that says you need citizen parents to be NBC. JUST ONE!


69 posted on 07/18/2012 11:05:32 AM PDT by New Jersey Realist (America: home of the free because of the brave)
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To: W. W. SMITH

Yes, And we are here to keep Sorass and his ilk from taking over. What I’ve read, some how and inexplicably, Soros got out of the Soviet controlled, Eastern Europe’s Iron Curtain. It appears, Soros turned from Nazi collaborator to Communist agent.


70 posted on 07/18/2012 11:05:42 AM PDT by Red Steel
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To: New Jersey Realist; GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

“There is no law that requires citizen parents. Wise up!”

lololol...the law states that only Natural Born Citizens are eligible to be president......The Founding Fathers didn’t coin the term Natural Born Citizen, it was well used and understood in the 18th century to mean a person born in a country to parents who were it’s citizens.

Your post makes no sense.


71 posted on 07/18/2012 11:08:36 AM PDT by Forty-Niner (The barely bare, berry bear formerly known as..........Ursus Arctos Horribilis.)
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To: W. W. SMITH

I don’t think Romney is going to chose RINO Rubio as his VP. Romney the politician, as we all know, (LoL) knows how to stick his finger in the wind and who will chose to avoid the NBC controversy.


72 posted on 07/18/2012 11:14:59 AM PDT by Red Steel
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To: New Jersey Realist

Not only kooks but dim bulbs and loons.


73 posted on 07/18/2012 11:18:30 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: svcw

But you know that is NOT what the Constitution says.

It puts the additional qualifier of “natural born” for the position of President as a requirement.

The 14th Amendment did not modify the qualifier.

Therefore it still must be met.


74 posted on 07/18/2012 11:20:14 AM PDT by exit82 (Pass the word: Obama is a FAILURE!! Democrats are the enemies of freedom!)
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To: Perdogg

“Please refer to Us V Wong-Ark and the 14th Amendment.’

Purr-dog both you and I know that WKA and the 14th Amendment provide “born” citizenhip to people who are NOT Natural Born Citizens..... and neither WKA nor the 14th Amendment expand the meaning of NBC to persons not so born.... lololol
....Once again repeat after me....born in a country to parents who are it’s citizens......see Minor....not the altered one in the links you’re so fond of, but the real decision using the real words written by the court......

Now you’re not gonna post the links to that Redstate article that blatently changes key words in Minor/WKA etc to make your case again are you?????

lolololol......sigh


75 posted on 07/18/2012 11:20:50 AM PDT by Forty-Niner (The barely bare, berry bear formerly known as..........Ursus Arctos Horribilis.)
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To: Forty-Niner
Your post makes no sense.

I wonder if this guy is related to this "Realist?

The real location of "kooks but dim bulbs and loons."

76 posted on 07/18/2012 11:23:34 AM PDT by Red Steel
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To: W. W. SMITH

chose = choose


77 posted on 07/18/2012 11:26:02 AM PDT by Red Steel
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To: Forty-Niner

The founding fathers were natural born subjects of England. Yet they were not born in England.

To be natural born under English law - the law the founders were familiar with and many trained practitioners of - one had to be born into that condition.

The Constitution only mentions or envisions three types of citizen - those at the time of the founding, those who would be natural born, and those who would have to be naturalized.

U.S. law is consistent - one is either born a citizen or naturalized as a citizen.


78 posted on 07/18/2012 11:29:25 AM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: exit82

Article 2, Section 1, Clause 5

No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.

Until a few years ago, natural born citizen was understood to mean not a naturalized citizen, and it still is by most people.
You do what you need to, there aren’t many people who agree with and I am one of those.
Have a good day.


79 posted on 07/18/2012 11:32:28 AM PDT by svcw (If one living cell on another planet is life, why isn't it life in the womb?)
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To: ilovesarah2012

“If Gaskell (son) and Miles Park Romney (father) who were both Mexican citizens....”

Could you please provide a link to this?

I have always understood that George Romney’s parents were American citizens living in Mexico......also, can you show me where living in another country results in the forfeiture of your US citizenship? As I understand it, it takes a sworn declaration of the citizen before a State Department official for that to happen. Did Gaskell and Miles Park Romney do that????? There should be State Department records of this. Do you have a link????

If you are talking about George Romney, then I would agree that he shouldn’t have run for president because he was born in Mexico (not jus solis) to American citizen Parents (meets jus sanquins, absent proof of your assertion) and while George was therefore a born citizen, his citizenship did not rise to the quality of being natural born.......

Anyway please provide the links to the assertion from your post. Thanks.


80 posted on 07/18/2012 11:36:57 AM PDT by Forty-Niner (The barely bare, berry bear formerly known as..........Ursus Arctos Horribilis.)
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To: New Jersey Realist

“Says you and a very small percentage of kooks. This matter has been settled.”

Count me as one of your “kooks.”

Settled????? By who, and when? Please provide links to your assertions.


81 posted on 07/18/2012 11:39:53 AM PDT by Forty-Niner (The barely bare, berry bear formerly known as..........Ursus Arctos Horribilis.)
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To: svcw

“...and born in the USA...”

That is NOT the Article II standard......


82 posted on 07/18/2012 11:43:08 AM PDT by Forty-Niner (The barely bare, berry bear formerly known as..........Ursus Arctos Horribilis.)
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To: allmendream; Forty-Niner
The founding fathers were natural born subjects of England. Yet they were not born in England.

Natural Born Subject (NBS) was never the same as Natural Born because the usage of term NBS also includes naturalized Subjects.

Gray who wrote the 1898 WKA opinion quoted (dicta) the famous jurist Blackstone, but he did inform the uninformed that the British NBS law was of British statute or regulation and that it was not natural law. Blackstone who in his published "Commentaries" completely agreed with deVattel that Natural Born and Natural subject are NOT the same.

83 posted on 07/18/2012 11:43:37 AM PDT by Red Steel
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To: Red Steel

The difference between a natural born subject and a natural born citizen is one of being either a free citizen or the subject of a sovereign.

The issue is what it takes to be natural born - and there was OBVIOUSLY no requirement under English law that one be born in England of English parents to be a natural born subject.

But one who was naturalized, as a subject OR as a citizen, WAS NOT natural born. The origins of the word naturalization was that it would confer the state of natural allegiance that otherwise had to be granted through the natural act of being born.

One is either natural born or naturalized.

Do you think women have a natural law right to participate on and equal footing with men in representative government?

Where did that natural right come from? Was it always there and only recently recognized - or is it an unnatural impulse to allow women to participate in representative government?


84 posted on 07/18/2012 11:51:53 AM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: New Jersey Realist

“Name the statute or part of the Constitution that says you need citizen parents to be NBC. JUST ONE!”

Finally You’re right!!!! Yeah! the parents of a NBC citizen need not themselves be NBC., but they must be citizens. Many people (see below) confuse the terms (on purpose?) but most can see that they have.

“This is a settled argument. The law is if you are born in U.S. you are NBC.”

That has never been or is now the case. Simple birth in the US may, may, result in being a born citizen. It depends upon your parents legal status in the US when you are born.

To jump from born citizen to Natural Born Citizen is a leap even Evel Kanevil wouldn’t make. (Hope you have a parachute.)

Yes it is settled law, just not in the way you think it is.


85 posted on 07/18/2012 11:52:37 AM PDT by Forty-Niner (The barely bare, berry bear formerly known as..........Ursus Arctos Horribilis.)
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To: New Jersey Realist

“You most certainly are NOT with the program. There is not one congressman, senator, judge or conservative talk show host that agrees with you. Only the nuts and kooks! Why don’t you call up Mario Apuzzo or Donofrio and ask them if they’ve won any cases yet?”

Just because these people you mentioned are cowards doesn’t make the truth any less the truth.

Don’t talk to me about judges. None of them have ruled on the merits of the case, except the couple that completely ignored Minor and misapplied Ark and the obviously flawed Ankeny as justification to avoid the hard truth, because they are afraid of what may happen if THEY are responsible for 0bama getting his ass kicked out of office. Heck, even “Justice” Thomas said that the Supreme Court was evading the issue.

A person born in a country of citizen parentS of that country can be NOTHING BUT a natural born citizen. Any other “arrangement” is a legal construct and negates the “natural” in natural born.

That’s why I said, “We ARE with the program and wish all the rest of you were, too.”


86 posted on 07/18/2012 11:55:44 AM PDT by Larry - Moe and Curly (Loose lips sink ships.)
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To: biggredd1

Neither appear to be Natural Born Citizens do they. But apparently no one knows what it means or cares.


87 posted on 07/18/2012 11:58:16 AM PDT by arrogantsob (Obama must Go. Sarah herself supports Romney.)
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To: ilovesarah2012

Do we have any evidence that Mittens’ grandfather renounced his US citizenship when he moved to Mexico?

Not trying to stir up a hornet’s nest here, but I’ve heard the “talk”, just haven’t seen this piece of evidence.

Hoping someone can help out here.


88 posted on 07/18/2012 12:02:08 PM PDT by Larry - Moe and Curly (Loose lips sink ships.)
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To: New Jersey Realist

“Name the statute or part of the Constitution that says you need citizen parents to be NBC. JUST ONE!”

Finally You’re right!!!! Yeah! the parents of a NBC citizen need not themselves be NBC., but they must be citizens. Many people (see below) confuse the terms (on purpose?) but most can see that they have.

“This is a settled argument. The law is if you are born in U.S. you are NBC.”

That has never been or is now the case. Simple birth in the US may, may, result in being a “born” citizen. It depends upon your parents legal status in the US when you are born. Natural Born citizenship, by defination of the term as understood by the Founders (they didn’t make up the term ya know) only results from being born in a country to parents who are its citizens. And that sir IS settled law in the US....

To jump from born citizen to Natural Born Citizen is a leap even Evel Kanevil wouldn’t make. (Hope you have a parachute.)

Yes it is settled law, just not in the way you think it is.


89 posted on 07/18/2012 12:03:29 PM PDT by Forty-Niner (The barely bare, berry bear formerly known as..........Ursus Arctos Horribilis.)
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To: svcw

You still have not addressed what the phrase natural born means historically or legally.

What people “think” or “feel” it means is not at issue.

The words, and the concept, have a legal and a historical meaning that has not been changed.

The path of least resistance is to go with the flow.

If you are a conservative, you want the truth, not what is convenient.

It matters not if few agree with me—the issue is the truth.

Since 1830, there have been four cases where the phrase “natural born” has been defined.

and it has been held to mean a citizen born of two citizen parents.

I hope you have a nice day as well


90 posted on 07/18/2012 12:04:00 PM PDT by exit82 (Pass the word: Obama is a FAILURE!! Democrats are the enemies of freedom!)
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To: allmendream
One is either natural born or naturalized.

The 14th Amendment naturalizes citizens at birth by statute, and that man-made law does not encompass natural born citizens, and it did not overturn A2S1C5. You do know the intent and the purpose of the NBC clause? It's natural law and not positive law; the 14th Amendment is not natural law.

Do you think women have a natural law right to participate on and equal footing with men in representative government?

They have a right by Amendment or law but that law is not natural law. BTW, The right to vote, is not absolute. Age, criminals, aliens are examples of people who cannot legally vote in the United States.

91 posted on 07/18/2012 12:05:31 PM PDT by Red Steel
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To: svcw

The fourteen yrs was a means of grandfathering the Founding generation into eligibility (Alexander Hamilton particularly).

“No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.” Article II, Section 1, paragraph 4.

It does not say the last fourteen yrs consecutive either which would have made Jefferson ineligible in 1800.


92 posted on 07/18/2012 12:09:00 PM PDT by arrogantsob (Obama must Go. Sarah herself supports Romney.)
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To: Red Steel
That is a rather bizarre view of the law and not one consistent with the Constitution, natural law, or U.S. law.

One is, under U.S. law - either born a citizen or naturalized as a citizen.

U.S. law should always reflect our best understanding of natural law. That is why women are currently seen to have the natural right to vote - women voting is in no way unnatural - they have the natural right to be free and to participate in representative government.

Vattel’s definition was about indigenous or natives of a nation - and even if you change it to “natural born” he did nothing to differentiate between “natural born citizens” and “natural born subjects”.

So by the laws the founders were familiar with - to be “natural born” one had to be born into that condition - as opposed to being “naturalized”.

Vattel was consistent in this as well, one either was born into a condition of allegiance and was therefore “natural born” or one had to be “naturalized”.

Rubio was born a citizen of these United States according to U.S. law, which should always reflect our best understanding of natural law.

Natural law is not the sum total of that which is encompassed by what one Swiss philosopher wrote in one book in the 1700’s.

93 posted on 07/18/2012 12:16:23 PM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: ilovesarah2012

Humor sites prove your point?


94 posted on 07/18/2012 12:17:54 PM PDT by arrogantsob (Obama must Go. Sarah herself supports Romney.)
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To: Happy Rain

“Mitt is anti-amnesty for illegals (so he says) but a liberal while Rubio is pro-amnesty for illegals (so he says) but a conservative. I think both can be persuaded to act conservative on the issue and I fear if we get too nit picky Mitt will go Pawlenty, Rice or Christie and then we get four more years of the brown Bolshevik.”

You make a very logical argument.

I agree that Rubio is preferable to Pawlenty, Rice, and Christie. Rubio does express opposition to continued deficit spending and I assume he is more conservative on tax and spending issues than the other three.

But what would prevent Romney from nominating DeMint, Mike Lee, or Rand Paul? Are they too conservative for him or is the problem that they are not from swing states?

I am sick of having weak immigration Republicans in high office. Why not just farm out our border control to the Chamber of Commerce?


95 posted on 07/18/2012 12:18:21 PM PDT by SharpRightTurn ( White, black, and red all over--America's affirmative action, metrosexual president.)
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To: faucetman

The Supreme Court has stated the same in several opinions/decisions.

____________________________

Such as?


96 posted on 07/18/2012 12:18:30 PM PDT by SumProVita (Cogito, ergo...Sum Pro Vita. (Modified Decartes))
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To: Happy Rain

“...the Founders gave one branch of the government the power to be corrupt with impunity and that was their failing....” Huh? What branch is that?


97 posted on 07/18/2012 12:20:58 PM PDT by arrogantsob (Obama must Go. Sarah herself supports Romney.)
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To: Forty-Niner

“...it’s citizens....”

it’s = it is

its = belonging to it


98 posted on 07/18/2012 12:23:15 PM PDT by SumProVita (Cogito, ergo...Sum Pro Vita. (Modified Decartes))
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To: Red Steel
They have a right by Amendment or law but that law is not natural law.

Are you saying that, by natural law, women do not have the right to participate on an equal footing with men in a representative government?

99 posted on 07/18/2012 12:24:17 PM PDT by Conscience of a Conservative
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To: Red Steel

“The Constitution leaves no room for doubt upon this subject. The words ‘natural born citizen of the United states’ appear in it, and the other provision appears in it that, “Congress shall have power to pass a uniform system of naturalization.” To naturalize a person is to admit him to citizenship. Who are natural born citizens but those born within the Republic? Those born within the Republic, whether black or white, are citizens by birth—natural born citizens.”


100 posted on 07/18/2012 12:32:45 PM PDT by Conscience of a Conservative
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