Nestle blames biofuels for high food prices

BBC ^ | July 18, 2012 | James Melik

[nascarnation]

Here’s what I got that’s at least 20 yrs old run its whole life on Indiana E10 (FWIW all our gas comes from BP Whiting):

John Deere tractor (Kawasaki)
Wheel Horse tractor (Kohler)
Sears mower (Tecumseh)
MTD mower (Briggs)
MTD trimmer (Mitsubishi)
Sears gen set (Briggs)
Troy-Bilt tiller (Briggs)
Unkn power washer (Honda)
Polaris ATV (Subaru)
67 Camaro

I haven’t seen any of the problems you seem to have. Maybe we got better alky here in corn country.

[Spktyr]

All of those (except maybe the Camaro and Polaris) are low RPM low power low heat engines. These seem to be less prone to the problem - but it’s a huge problem for motorcycles and boats for sure, and it’s not unknown even with lawn equipment.

Just because you’re not having problems doesn’t mean that problems aren’t widespread. Also, when was the last time you checked inside the Camaro’s fuel bowls?

[nascarnation]

I’ll let you know when stuff starts breaking down.
Or maybe I’ll die first.
All my stuff and me is old and getting older.

Well except my other street cars.

[Spktyr]

More info re: the corn shit gas damaging stuff:

http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/1900-2000-2600-1950-1968/191780-ethanol-fuel-has-screwed-up-my-carburetors.html

http://www.wind-sun.com/ForumVB/showthread.php?4315-EU2000-Honda-generator-troubleshooting

[nascarnation]

Why don’t you folks just buy E0 if your having all these problems?
http://pure-gas.org/

I sure would if I was having all the headaches, or maybe avgas like 100LL which is 5 bucks but has some nice lead in it.

[Nowhere Man]

Do you know the history of those engines? Were they the original engines? Were they rebuilt, or what?

True, maintenance does play a role as well as bum luck itself. I have nothing against biofuels in general but the feds should not be in the business of mandating anything of that sort, period. If there is a way and/or demand, the free market will decide. I think we should be eating our food and not burning it in our engines, we have plenty of oil, coal, methane, etc., here. The two big obstacles are the EPA and Jugears himself.

[Spktyr]

I have to drive over 60 miles to get to the nearest station selling E0. The economics start not making sense real fast.

[Spktyr]

Hit post too soon - E0 is not available within economical radius of most people in the US thanks to EPA mandates.

[Nowhere Man]

It is proven to be ruining smaller engines, such as those in boats, lawn equipment, and motorcycles. Some of them have their carbs destroyed, others are actually seeing destructive deposits in the engine proper.

It’s less of an issue with cars, but older carbureted cars are having fuel system problems as are older fuel-injected cars that are needing to have every rubber part (and the injectors) replaced because of it.

I work in an auto parts store and we do carry additives for older cars to help with the ethanol problem. I'll have to take a closer look at it though.

[Clay Moore]

I don’t understand it either. I finally went to the new high dollar low VOC pass thru jacketed line to see if I can get some durability.

I would think it would be cracking from the inside out if it was the diesel fuel. What I see is fine checking on the outside jacket followed by cracks on the end of the hose that progress further inside over time. I have split the line and don’t see checks in the middle of inner line. I don’t see where (max) 10% waste engine oil (mostly) or mineral based hydraulic fluid (rarely) should wipe it out. It lasts a few months.

It wouldn’t be so bad but the tank switch valve is even with the front of the side tank and so you can hardly get to the lines.

[Sioux-san]

I should have said newer cars with fancier engines — my 2001 Saturn with 172,000 miles doesn’t seem to care what I feed it.

[nascarnation]

Yeah but if you’re having all these problems, wouldn’t it make sense to put in bulk storage or have a jumbo tank in the back of a pickup to fuel out of?

[DainBramage]

Ask hispanics how much corn toritlllas cost since ethenol.

[nascarnation]

I’m retired so I don’t have access to any of the suppliers any more. You might try emailing the mfgr tech service if you can find an address off the net, and maybe include some pics.

If you can get past the gatekeeper and actually find an engineer or service guy they usually are interested in looking at failures.

[Spktyr]

Your 2001 Saturn was designed with an eye towards potentially running on E85 (though it was never certified for it) and many GM corporate parts were rated for E85 as they were intended to be used in FFVs, so your Saturn is at least in part prepped for higher levels of ethanol in its fuel than most other vehicles.

[Spktyr]

Can’t do either without permitting and storage safety issues around here. There is also the matter of how much I go through - in a busy week, I will easily empty a 55 gallon drum before the week is out, even with the motorcycle.

[Sioux-san]

Basically, I have no idea what I am talking about, and you just made me feel better that my car isn’t going to crap out if they put more corn in my tank. Aren’t there other biofuels we could be mass producing that won’t price food out of people’s reach?

[CutePuppy]

No mention of the drought that is hitting 26 states.

There was an "honorable mention" by Paul Conway, COB of Cargill, who also strongly opposes mandates for biofuels, but points to other contributary factors for high food prices.

< snip > ..... "In the last five months we lost roughly 100 million tonnes of crops, largely in South America and most recently in the US grain belt, which has been dealing with 100 degree temperatures," he says. ..... < snip >

He said that these and other factors, including demographics, worldwide rise in the standards of living and the 20% reduction in agricultural investment, all have contributed to higher food prices.

He also noted that most of these crops, particularly in the U.S., are later converted into sweeteners (read corn syrup) and animal feed which then raises the prices of meat and other products.

[rem_mitchell]

Thanks. I was sloppy in my reading.

[Spktyr]

Yes - we can and should be (if we’re going to mandate alcohol in fuel) making alcohol from stuff like switchgrass and other such weeds that don’t replace food crops or take up food crop growing space.

As for the Saturn - well, it may crap out soon, but that’s because it’s a Saturn, not because of the fuel. :)