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July 20, 1993 - The mysterious death of Vince Foster
Crime Library ^ | archive | Matthew MacAdam

Posted on 07/20/2012 9:28:38 AM PDT by Baynative

Foster left at a few minutes after 1:00 p.m. He told Pond that there were M&M candies on his lunch tray, which Tripp had bought for herself in the cafeteria. "I'll be back," he said, walking out without a briefcase or anything else in his hands.

~~~~~

"There was a tiny bit of dried blood around the mouth and nose, so I thought maybe he'd been hit on the back of the head," he said later. Kyle went in to take a closer look. He would later recall flies buzzing around the dead man's mouth and nose, the dead man laying on his back, clad in a white business shirt unruffled and clean with his arms and hands out straight at his sides, palms up. "He looked as if he'd been dead for a long time; I mean hours." Kyle then looked for a gun, and didn't see one, an act which would make him famous to the legion of conspiracy theorists who would accumulate around the case presented by this dead body.

(Excerpt) Read more at trutv.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: arkancide; foster; suicide
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
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The first people to view Foster, Kyle and Fornshill, saw no gun. No one in his immediate family could identify the black .38 Colt, though his wife Lisa was aware of a silver handgun Foster kept in their bedroom.
The way Foster's thumb was jammed into the gun's trigger was also viewed as odd by forensics experts. There was a lack of gunpowder on Foster's tongue, strange for someone who shot off a gun in his mouth. The bullet was never found.

Four of the emergency workers first on scene with Foster's body testified before Congress that they saw a wound on his neck, with two describing it as a gunshot wound. The way the blood collected around his shirt collar and shoulder was observed by some as unusual, as was the overall lack of blood seen by rescue workers as strange. Even though he'd walked hundreds of feet into the park, no soil samples were found on Foster's shoes.

Patrick Knowlton, who'd also stopped at the park to urinate that day, saw a brown Honda with Arkansas plates as well. He also reported a man sitting behind the wheel of a Japanese car who "glowered" at him as he walked past, according to Evans-Pritchard. In the brown Honda, assumed to be Foster's car, he said he saw a briefcase, though Park Police never found any case. Foster's car was also never logged in or out of the White House parking lot that day, Evans-Pritchard writes.

1 posted on 07/20/2012 9:28:43 AM PDT by Baynative
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To: Baynative

His car drove itself there as the keys were at the white house.


2 posted on 07/20/2012 9:30:52 AM PDT by boomop1 (term limits will only save this country.)
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To: Baynative

I read he was pregnant with Hillary’s baby...


3 posted on 07/20/2012 9:31:33 AM PDT by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: Baynative

A number of FReepers have postulated that the Chicago political mob was able to blackmail the Clintons over Arkancide.

Hillary couldn’t use the vaunted Clinton private detective squad to uncover Baraq’s most well kept secrets.

Mutually assured destruction between evil forces....


4 posted on 07/20/2012 9:36:05 AM PDT by nascarnation
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To: boomop1
"It was [Craig]Livingstone, recall, who was dispatched to the morgue along with Associate White House Counsel Bill Kennedy to I.D. Foster's body. Unresolved questions about the discovery of Foster's car keys, which couldn't be found at the death scene, still linger. Circumstantial evidence suggests that Livingstone may have planted them in one of Foster's pants pockets during the morgue visit. The keys were retrieved later by Park Police who had already searched Foster's pockets at the scene."
5 posted on 07/20/2012 9:43:56 AM PDT by Baynative (A man's admiration for absolute government is proportionate to the contempt he feels for others)
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To: Baynative

Thanks for refreshing my memory, I remember now, his death is peanuts compared to what we are facing now.


6 posted on 07/20/2012 9:52:45 AM PDT by boomop1 (term limits will only save this country.)
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To: Baynative
.....He was five and she was six
They rode on horses made of sticks
He wore black and she wore white
She would always win the fight

Bang bang she shot him down
Bang bang he hit the ground
Bang bang that awful sound
Bang bang Vince Foster hit the ground.

Mansions, limos, seasons blurr,
Slick porked his girls and he porked her
Yet she would always laugh and say
Remember when we used to play

Bang bang I shot you down
Bang bang you hit the ground
Bang bang that awful sound
Bang bang Vince Foster hit the ground....

Power, money, intrigue and
the one day trips to Switzerland
Unlaundered money in a bag
So heavy that it made him sag

and then that final, fateful day,
he knew too much, and heard her say

Bang Bang.......

7 posted on 07/20/2012 9:55:45 AM PDT by varmintman
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To: Baynative

Anniversary of the sinking of the Kennedy at Chappaquiddick, too.


8 posted on 07/20/2012 9:58:23 AM PDT by Lady Lucky (If you believe what you're saying, quit making taxable income.)
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To: Baynative

There was nothing particularly “mysterious” about it; it was a clear case of Arkancide.

The real mystery is how many in the US - and around the world - went the same way.


9 posted on 07/20/2012 10:06:55 AM PDT by Jack Hammer
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To: Baynative
I've put down close to 100 head of cattle through the years, and I can assure you it was impossible for VF to shoot himself in the mouth with a .38

If he was in fact shot in the mouth, he was already dead when he was shot.

According to reports, the nuzzle was pressed against the soft palate in the back of the mouth.

That leads straight to the easel cavity.

Physics 101. Snot and blood would have blown out his nose if he had been alive. It didn't, there was a small trickle of blood.

His nose was plugged with dried blood when the trigger was pulled.

A small trickle of blood from the nose is consistent with a small caliber weapon, possibly even an ice pick.

10 posted on 07/20/2012 10:22:03 AM PDT by IMR 4350
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To: Baynative
I'm comfortable with the gist of the Freeh report for Penn State University as it pertained to Graham Spanier, Tim Curley, Gary Schultz, and Joe Paterno.

However (if you check my posts), from the moment he was appointed, it was skeptical about Freeh's ability to issue a report that didn't already draw conclusions in favor of his employer (the Penn State Board of Trustees). Indeed, he apparently missed the 2004 aborted attempted by the Board to reign in Spanier, Curley, Schultz, and Paterno that's now been disclosed.

Why was I skeptical of Freeh?

His censure was recommended at Ruby Ridge.

He handled the Vince Foster investigation.

He personally leaked Richard Jewell's name to the press as the Atlanta Olympic Centennial Park Bomber.

He was head of the FBI's Waco "nope, we didn't do anything wrong" investigation.

TWA Flight 800. Wen Ho Lee. Khobar Towers.

He was forced to resign over Richard Hanssen.

The only thing he got right is that asked Janet Reno for a special investigator into Chinese political contributions during the Clinton reelection - a request she turned down and an investigation he dropped.

I imagine we'll find out more and more about the Penn State Board of Trustees, things Freeh left out of his multi-million dollar, 400+- person interviewed, million+document reviewed, eight-month report.

11 posted on 07/20/2012 10:26:26 AM PDT by Scoutmaster (You knew the job was dangerous when you took it)
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To: Lady Lucky

Oh those rascally democrates! Someone contact ron brown for the info, oh............he’s gone to?


12 posted on 07/20/2012 10:27:04 AM PDT by ronnie raygun (bb)
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To: Baynative

IIRC, the New York Post hired an independent detective to investigate this case. They ran an entire insert of their findings. There were 40 or so inconsistencies that have never been explained. Any investigative freepers out there who know how to search archives?


13 posted on 07/20/2012 10:42:36 AM PDT by printhead (Standard & Poor - Poor is the new standard.)
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To: Baynative
The mysterious death of Vince Foster

He's now just another notch on the klinton's death list.

14 posted on 07/20/2012 10:52:48 AM PDT by The Sons of Liberty ("Get that evil, foreign, muslim, usurping bastard out of MY White House!" FUBO)
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To: varmintman

Did you write that? If so, BRAVO! If not? Who did write it?


15 posted on 07/20/2012 11:06:52 AM PDT by mkjessup (Romney is to conservatism what Helen Thomas is to a high fashion model walkway.)
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To: IMR 4350

I would bet he was shot with a .22 and the bullet disintegrated in his head. It did not exit. A .38 would have exited -unless it was a wadcutter, maybe.


16 posted on 07/20/2012 11:21:44 AM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson)
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To: Jack Hammer

“The real mystery is how many in the US - and around the world - went the same way.”

Remember that man named Brown (?), Sec’y of Commerce, if I remember correctly? An entire airplane went down with him.


17 posted on 07/20/2012 11:56:14 AM PDT by Elsiejay
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To: Baynative
FWI: My stepbrother was one of the FBI agents involved in this investigation—before the FBI was told to back off and let the Barney Fifes of the Park police have jurisdiction.

I asked him at the time (off the record, of course): “So, did Vince Foster really kill himself?”

His answer:
“No. Well, let's put it this way: If he did, he didn't do it in the park, and not in those clothes!”

18 posted on 07/20/2012 12:17:11 PM PDT by ROLF of the HILL COUNTRY
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To: arthurus
By all accounts there was an exit wound but very little blood.

That's also consistent with shooting something after it's already dead. The blood has already started to coagulate and thicken which would explain no large splatter.

There is no blood pressure in the veins or arteries to to bleed off which again is constant with the reports.

You're right, the small trickle of blood is consistent with a .22 and even with that it doesn't sound like the muzzle was pressed against the skin.

Even the pressure from a .22 shell along with blood pressure of a live person, will cause blood vessels to burst and the pressure will be forced out somewhere.

You might recall there was a report he was found in his car in the WH parking lot, then the story changed.

More than likely somebody walked by his car and popped him with a .22, then the body was moved, or possibly the body was moved twice.

Popped somewhere else, moved to the WH parking lot, then moved a second time the Ft Marcy Park.

19 posted on 07/20/2012 1:31:01 PM PDT by IMR 4350
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To: Baynative

20 posted on 07/20/2012 3:31:28 PM PDT by Emperor Palpatine (Tosca, mi fai dimenticare Iddio!!!!!)
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To: Jack Hammer
The Clinton's body count is almost as large as the list of decedents associated with the JFK assassination....



"But Michael, senators and presidents don't have people killed

Who's being naive now, Kay?
21 posted on 07/20/2012 3:42:31 PM PDT by Emperor Palpatine (Tosca, mi fai dimenticare Iddio!!!!!)
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To: Baynative
The mysterious death of Vince Foster

It is difficult to consider this discussion complete without including G. Gordon Liddy's confidentail witness.

Deposititon of Confidential Witness

In-Depth Investigative report On Vince Foster Sucide

22 posted on 07/20/2012 3:54:46 PM PDT by MosesKnows (Love many, Trust few, and always paddle your own canoe)
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To: boomop1

All five witnesses say a Honda that was a different color than Vince’s Honda.


23 posted on 07/20/2012 3:58:01 PM PDT by bmwcyle (Corollary - Electing the same person over and over and expecting a different outcome is insanity)
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To: IMR 4350

That’s how it looked to me back then.


24 posted on 07/20/2012 6:50:55 PM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson)
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To: Elsiejay

Yes, I remember him.

I believe he was found with a hole in his head, and there was speculation he was shot by someone early at the crash site; then an examination “found” that, no, he was hit by a piece of flying debris.

Then it was all hushed up.


25 posted on 07/20/2012 7:35:31 PM PDT by Jack Hammer
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To: IMR 4350
"If he was in fact shot in the mouth, he was already dead when he was shot."

I agree. The brain has a massive blood-flow supply, and when the brain in disrupted by a bullet while the heart is still beating, blood loss is profuse.

I had the sad duty of putting a large stray dog out of her misery after her back was broken when a car hit her. I put a plastic trash bag under her head before I put a 9mm Glaser into her skull via the foramen magnum. Aside from the jolt of the bullet strike, she had zero reaction (instant oblivion) -- but the blood flow from her cranial orifices was copious.

Foster's shirt was reported to have virtually no blood on the front or sleeves. That is totally inconsistent with a brain shot while the heart is still beating. If he had held that gun and shot himself, his hands and sleeves --- and shirt front -- would have been bloody.

I've read everything I could find on the case. The reported evidence does not support the theory of Foster shooting himself in Ft. Marcy Park.

26 posted on 07/21/2012 1:35:59 AM PDT by TXnMA ("Allah": Satan's current alias...)
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To: TXnMA; Justice Seeker

I hope I live to hear the true story of Vince.


27 posted on 07/21/2012 2:00:11 AM PDT by Yaelle
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To: IMR 4350
I just read the Confidential Witness' deposition again. He insted that VF's arms were straight down by his sides with his palms turned UP.

Lie down and let your arms fall down by your sides. Which way are your palms facing?

My hands fall palm downward -- and it takes considerable effort to turn them palms upward! (To get them completely upward, I have to "tuck" my elbows into my sides -- with still more effort.)

How can the hands of a dead man fall with palms upward???


28 posted on 07/21/2012 2:23:14 AM PDT by TXnMA ("Allah": Satan's current alias...)
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To: Yaelle; Justice Seeker

See #28...


29 posted on 07/21/2012 2:27:05 AM PDT by TXnMA ("Allah": Satan's current alias...)
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To: Jack Hammer

0.45” round hole in the top of his skull — and a “shower” of lead fragments inside his skull...


30 posted on 07/21/2012 2:47:48 AM PDT by TXnMA ("Allah": Satan's current alias...)
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To: justiceseeker93; ml/nj

#


31 posted on 07/21/2012 3:19:32 AM PDT by firebrand
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To: Baynative; All
Foster's car was also never logged in or out of the White House parking lot that day, Evans-Pritchard writes.

That part of the mystery isn't quite so mysterious. Foster never drove his car to the White House that day. Either his wife or son drove him or he went by public transit or cab. He never used that car that day. Who had the car most of the day? In all probability, his "high maintenance" wife, with whom he wasn't getting along well and who, shortly after his death, remarried to a Clinton-appointed federal judge. She said she played tennis that morning with another White House wife from Arkansas. How do you think she got to her tennis game?

Take another look at the day's events and keep the wife in mind as a key suspect in the plot and you can explain things a lot more readily!!!

32 posted on 07/21/2012 7:34:05 AM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: boomop1; Yaelle; firebrand; exit82; Fedora; ml/nj
His car drove itself there as the keys were at the White House.

Please see my post # 32. The wife had the car most of the day, then provided it to the killers who drove it to the park after the dirty deed was done to fake the "suicide."

When you consider the wife as a suspect and her story of the day's events as a cover-up, you can solve an important part of this mystery.

33 posted on 07/21/2012 7:47:24 AM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: nascarnation
Mutually assured destruction between evil forces....

I can buy that theory.

34 posted on 07/21/2012 7:54:02 AM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: IMR 4350; All
According to reports, the nuzzle was pressed against the soft palate in the back of the mouth.

You are referring to the coroner's autopsy report. Consider the autopsy report a fraud and an important part of the cover-up. The forensic pathologist was told what to do and he followed orders.

35 posted on 07/21/2012 7:59:28 AM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: TXnMA
It was also reported his legs were straight.

Men do not sit with their legs straight and flat on the ground. If he straightened his legs when shot, there would have been signs of a “kick” and the heels of his shoes digging into the dirt. There wasn't.

The body was placed there, then he was shot with the .38

There is also no evidence of any damage to his mouth from the recoil of the gun or from the gun being forced into his mouth.

Not possible if he shot himself, and it's also not possible if someone else shot him when he was alive.

36 posted on 07/21/2012 8:15:12 AM PDT by IMR 4350
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To: IMR 4350; Yaelle; Cicero; exit82; firebrand; Fedora; ml/nj; ExTexasRedhead; Atom Smasher; ...
The body was placed there, then he was shot with the .38.

He was never shot with that ancient .38 of WWI era vintage that was find on the scene. He was killed with a .22 shot to the neck elsewhere, then the body was transported the park. The ancient .38 was added to the scene to fake a "suicide." It turned out to be a pretty clumsy fake, with a weapon that a real suicide would most unlikely to choose.

37 posted on 07/21/2012 9:06:12 AM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: justiceseeker93

I never heard that type of personality attributed to his wife. But, I found it strange that she made one statement about the gun not being his and then just flat out disappeared, never to be heard from again.


38 posted on 07/21/2012 9:36:40 AM PDT by Baynative (A man's admiration for absolute government is proportionate to the contempt he feels for others)
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To: Baynative; Yaelle; Cicero; exit82; ml/nj; ExTexasRedhead; seekthetruth
I found it strange that she made one statement about the gun not being his and then just flat out disappeared, never to be heard from again.

No way. She was heard from again all right, making a phony statement and audacious request to government investigators (don't recall exactly who) through her Clintonista lawyer several months after the death.

And she did a big interview in the left-leaning New Yorker magazine with a writer named Peter Boyer (who you might see on TV occasionally these days), published in 1995. There are about five important false statements regarding the fatal day in that interview which are inconsistent with the evidence, false statements used in all likelihood to cover up her involvement in the plot. In one she states that her husband drove the car to the White House that morning, whereas there is no record of the car ever being on the White House campus that day. The truth is that she herself probably had control of that car for the morning and early afternoon.

39 posted on 07/21/2012 12:11:41 PM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: justiceseeker93

I don’t have a doubt he was killed somewhere else, and it was probably a .22, but he was apparently shot a second time after he had been moved to the park. In fact the body may have been moved twice.

It may or may not have been that .38, but everything indicates he was shot a second time after he was dead.


40 posted on 07/21/2012 1:47:56 PM PDT by IMR 4350
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To: justiceseeker93

BTTT for a MOST EXCELLENT THREAD on the Vince Foster murder.

Especially justiceseeker93’s posts 32,33,34,35,37 & 39.

Someday the truth will emerge.

Someday.


41 posted on 07/21/2012 1:56:53 PM PDT by exit82 (Pass the word: Obama is a FAILURE!! Democrats are the enemies of freedom!)
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To: IMR 4350; exit82; Fedora; seekthetruth; Yaelle; ml/nj; ExTexasRedhead; Cicero; Baynative
It may or may not have been that .38, but everything indicates he was shot a second time after he was dead.

Now why would the gunmen want to shoot him a second time after he was dead? Hardly makes any sense for them. No advantage whatsoever to them to do that. And two major disadvantages: (1) the second shot could possibly be heard and attract attention from people within hearing distance and (2) two or more shots rule out "suicide" as an explanation and definitely make it a homicide as far as investigators are concerned.

42 posted on 07/22/2012 6:19:50 AM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: justiceseeker93

The fact the the Clintons sent Craig Livingstone to the morgue to identify the body was probably one of the most curious elements to me.


43 posted on 07/22/2012 7:51:43 AM PDT by Baynative (A man's admiration for absolute government is proportionate to the contempt he feels for others)
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To: Baynative; exit82; Fedora; ml/nj; ExTexasRedhead; seekthetruth; IMR 4350; Cicero; Yaelle; All
The fact the the Clintons sent Craig Livingstone to the morgue to identify the body was probably one of the most curious elements to me.

The "identification of the body" was just a ruse for Livingstone to slip into the morgue and put the car keys in his his pocket in order to give credibility to the "suicide" farce. There were no car keys in his pocket when the Park Police saw him in Fort Marcy. Unfortunately, in an incredible lapse of police procedure, the Park Police allowed Livingstone a few minutes with the body unattended.

44 posted on 07/22/2012 8:27:29 AM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: justiceseeker93

More needs to come out publicly about this murder.


45 posted on 07/22/2012 8:37:48 AM PDT by Yaelle
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To: justiceseeker93
If there was a .22 or an ice pick to the back or side of the neck, suicide is ruled out.

A .38 in the mouth would wipe out the traces and make it appear as if he had killed himself with a shot to the mouth. The small wound to the neck would go unnoticed. A .38 to the mouth is definitely fatal whereas a small wound to the neck isn't.

Because of the isolated location, a single gunshot would go unnoticed, and even if it was noticed a single gunshot is almost untraceable especially in an urban setting with other loud noises.

Even I can't trace where someone is if they are poaching on my property and there is a single gunshot. One shot doesn't tell me if they are on my property or the property next to me. It takes at least two shots to locate where the sound is coming from, and even then I'm still not sure if it's from my property or the next property.

You might want to check out all the “suicide” cases associated with the Clinton's before you make ridiculous claims about suicide being ruled out for any reason.

46 posted on 07/22/2012 8:42:34 AM PDT by IMR 4350
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To: justiceseeker93
Here's another little tidbit about Craig Livingston.

The FBI files CL got were also a ruse.

That was done to cover up for the real FBI files, files that were used to blackmail the DEMOCTATES.

You saw it during BC’s impeachment when the dems voted in lockstep to keep the Clinton trash in office.

The real files were the files Janet Reno said she would release if she was confirmed as AG, but instead of releasing the files she fired all the US Attorneys to cover up what was in the files.

It's a matter of public record, so all you left wing freaks out there reading this can cram it, Bill Clinton was in a number of those files and he needed the US Attorneys fired to cover it up.

Vince Fosters job was to surround Bill Clinton with people that also needed the US Attorneys fired. Janet Reno, Warren Christopher, Lee Brown, Henry Cisneros all need the US Attorneys fired.

In VF’s so called suicide note, he makes a comment something to the effect that “destroying people's lives is considered sport”, that's a reference to Kimba Wood and Zoey Baird.

They were nominated with the intent of torpedoing their nomination so they could bring Reno in since Reno needed the US Attorneys fired.

In short, VF was spilling his guts when suddenly he went silent.

47 posted on 07/22/2012 9:10:05 AM PDT by IMR 4350
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To: justiceseeker93

It’s a wonder Livingstone is alive. He could make millions off a book. Maybe when Bubba’s days are done, he’ll come out of the shadows and tell the truth about Hillary.


48 posted on 07/22/2012 12:56:48 PM PDT by Baynative (A man's admiration for absolute government is proportionate to the contempt he feels for others)
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To: IMR 4350
You saw it during BC’s impeachment when the dems voted in lockstep to keep the Clinton trash in office.

The Clinton White House didn't need any Dem FBI files to keep their troops in line. Just perhaps a reminder of the Clinton Body Count.

In VF’s so called suicide note, he makes a comment something to the effect that “destroying people's lives is considered sport”, that's a reference to Kimba Wood and Zoey Baird.

Keep in mind that VF himself did not write that "suicide" note. Expert handwriting analysis revealed it was not in his writing.

49 posted on 07/22/2012 3:53:25 PM PDT by justiceseeker93
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To: justiceseeker93
Yes he did.

The files would have pretty much wiped out the dem party.

It wasn't a direct threat against any one member of congress but a threat to the dem party as a whole.

Pretty tough to get yourself elected as a dem without the black vote.

That was the initial threat.

Expose the dems as being responsible for police not being held accountable for abuse and corruption, not the BS story of Repub racism that was developed with the R King case.

I said so called suicide note for a reason.

Next.

50 posted on 07/22/2012 8:03:15 PM PDT by IMR 4350
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