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SECULARISM, not guns to blame for mass shootings
GeorgeWashingtonsGhost | July 20, 2012 | GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

Posted on 07/20/2012 12:58:56 PM PDT by GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

So here we have 'Jared Loughner #2' with a twist; James Eagen Homles as Batman's nemesis 'The Joker'.

Are guns to blame? I say no. Secularism taught in the schools is to blame. Children today are indoctrinated into their social media culture where religions of all kinds are mocked, especially Christians and God Almighty. The mere mention of God is subject to attack and relentless bullying. The 'G' word is met with the same fierce reaction as the 'N' word. Blaming guns for a person's actions is a diversion from the REAL culprit in our society; The secular, Godless individual.


TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: culture; religion; schools; secularism; vanity
Don't you think that if children today believed in our Creator and the sanctity of life, incidents the kind of which occurred today would be less likely to happen?

What is your own personal experience with your children's school and their attitude towards Christmas, Easter, Christianity or other religions and God?

1 posted on 07/20/2012 12:59:10 PM PDT by GeorgeWashingtonsGhost
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

Just FYI the shooter and his family have been described as being “very active” in the Presbyterian Church.


2 posted on 07/20/2012 1:02:09 PM PDT by Strategerist
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

Spelling correction: “Holmes” instead of “Homles”.


3 posted on 07/20/2012 1:02:58 PM PDT by GeorgeWashingtonsGhost
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

Romans 1:18-

The wrath of God is being revealed

in our country. It’s obvious.

Maranatha.


4 posted on 07/20/2012 1:04:34 PM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter knows whom he's working for)
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To: Strategerist

My focus is on the schools, however. Today, in households where both parents work, the Godless schools take control. We all know about their politics, but it’s the EMPHASIS and mockery of one’s belief in God and ‘values’ that is the culprit, in my opinion.


5 posted on 07/20/2012 1:07:29 PM PDT by GeorgeWashingtonsGhost
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To: Strategerist

Pastor Bonhoeffer (the martyr) saw in America by 1931—the same destruction within the Christian churches as was done to most German “Christian” churches—the Removal of God-—paid for by John D. Rockefeller in the USA and other Marxist/socialist elites to destroy God from within—pastors were bought and paid for at Riverside Church and in many communities and all of Germany—the “spokesperson” put on all covers of magazines in the 30’s to promote the “Religionless Christianity” which is nothing but Secularism. Even the Catholic Church was infiltrated by homosexuals and Satanists before Vatican II.

Many so-called “Christian” churches are no more. They exist INO. Many now glorify sin and perversion and call themselves “Christian” but they practice Satanism/Marxism. Words mean nothing in Marxist societies.


6 posted on 07/20/2012 1:13:05 PM PDT by savagesusie (Right Reason According to Nature = Just Law)
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

I have no idea what schools you are familiar with but I can tell you what you say is not true of any of the schools with which I am familiar.


7 posted on 07/20/2012 1:13:09 PM PDT by DallasSun (Courage~Fear that has said its prayers.)
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

A kid at my Catholic school shot another kid for giving him bad weed. So take that for what it’s worth.


8 posted on 07/20/2012 1:19:06 PM PDT by Ace of Spades (Sed quis custodiet ipsos custodes?)
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

I agree with you wholeheartedly. I would add that the making of violent movies, music...is part of the problem too.


9 posted on 07/20/2012 1:19:32 PM PDT by Linda Frances (Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness)
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To: Strategerist
Just FYI the shooter and his family have been described as being “very active” in the Presbyterian Church.

Like he said, "Secularism...."

Anyway, really, the guy was just nuts. Lots of religious people kill while yelling words like "Allah Akbar" or something like that.

10 posted on 07/20/2012 1:25:10 PM PDT by the invisib1e hand
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

It was like shooting fish in a barrel for James Holmes because fish are unarmed.


11 posted on 07/20/2012 1:25:10 PM PDT by 353FMG
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To: DallasSun

Does your school call ‘Easter Vacation’ ‘Spring Break’? Does your school call ‘Christmas Vacation’ ‘Holiday break’??? I don’t think you’re seeing the forest for the trees.


12 posted on 07/20/2012 1:25:32 PM PDT by GeorgeWashingtonsGhost
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

I also agree with you re: the schools. Government schools are inherently Marxist.


13 posted on 07/20/2012 1:31:28 PM PDT by Marathoner (Palin/West 2012. Yes, I'm dreaming but as Pete said to Rudy, "Dreams are what make life tolerable.")
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

My grandson knows what Easter is and what it celebrates. He knows exactly what Christmas is. That is not up to the school. It is up to his mother and my husband and me. He has jewish friends. So does my daughter. She had one Jewish friends who celebrated the Christmas holiday with us..she celebrated Hannukah with her friend’s family. This is the family’s role.


14 posted on 07/20/2012 1:34:02 PM PDT by DallasSun (Courage~Fear that has said its prayers.)
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

I should have said I understand exactly what you are saying. They are good points and have substance. Schools have certainly changed since I attended. My family and I have adjusted accordingly.


15 posted on 07/20/2012 1:35:47 PM PDT by DallasSun (Courage~Fear that has said its prayers.)
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To: DallasSun
I have no idea what schools you are familiar with but I can tell you what you say is not true of any of the schools with which I am familiar.


When kids can't mention God's name in school, that tells them everything to do with God is out, including his commandments like, Thou shalt not kill.

Along with the schools and almost worse in my opinion is the media's assault on God and His commands. How many times has you seen someone on tv or in a movie treated like they were crazy if they wasn't having sex before they are married? Or when Christians are painted in a negative way. The media is trying to sexualize our kids as early as possible. Watch Nickelodeon or Disney and the commercials you will see what I mean

16 posted on 07/20/2012 1:36:16 PM PDT by Linda Frances (Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness)
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To: Linda Frances

Children can mention God’s name in school. The teachers, coaches cannot. The children can pray. The teachers, coaches may not lead them in prayer. Having said that, trust me, I know what you are saying to an extent. I do not think any teacher is going to tell a child that Thou Shall Not Kill is wrong. But schools have changed greatly. When I was in sixth grade, our teacher took us on the train, from a small town west of San Antonio to the capitol building in Austin. We all..about 19 of us...stood under the mezzanine and sang Precious Lord and Were You There? Then we prayed. Can you imagine now?


17 posted on 07/20/2012 1:41:07 PM PDT by DallasSun (Courage~Fear that has said its prayers.)
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To: Linda Frances

Oh wait...how could I forget? And The Old Rugged Cross. I had a solo part in it. Still love the song and have taught it to my nine year old grandson. He loves gospel now.


18 posted on 07/20/2012 1:42:39 PM PDT by DallasSun (Courage~Fear that has said its prayers.)
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

Sickening! Your post is a loathsome attempt to exploit this tragedy push your religious agenda. It is just as slimy as Bloomberg doing the same to push his gun control agenda. At least let the grieving parents bury their dead children before you try to use them for your crude proselytizing.


19 posted on 07/20/2012 1:51:35 PM PDT by Vigilant1 (The price of liberty is eternal vigilance.)
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To: Vigilant1

Thanks for proving my point. I’ll not say the “G” word. I don’t want to offend you.


20 posted on 07/20/2012 2:04:13 PM PDT by GeorgeWashingtonsGhost
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost
GWG:
"Thanks for proving my point."

Your point was to claim people shoot children because they are "godless". I would ask you to explain exactly how your point was somehow "proven" by me calling you out on crassly exploiting this tragedy to push your religiousity, but we both know that you cannot.
---

"I’ll not say the “G” word. I don’t want to offend you."

You know nothing about me or my beliefs.

21 posted on 07/20/2012 2:15:01 PM PDT by Vigilant1 (The price of liberty is eternal vigilance.)
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

BTW, I am done with you, so do not bother to respond. Your thread turns my stomach.


22 posted on 07/20/2012 2:16:53 PM PDT by Vigilant1 (The price of liberty is eternal vigilance.)
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

What a pant-load!

This nut was one of your “God fearing devout Christians”, or at least went through the motions very convincingly.

I, on the other hand, am a genuine real world atheist, gun owner, and conservative.
I’ve never shot anybody, not even a couple of thugs I probably should have, and certainly could have, with both a clear conscience and backing of the law.

I’m tired of self-righteous zealots attempting to blame myself and others who happen to share an appreciation for what can be confirmed in the real world, over “Faith”, for all the evils of the world.

Get a grip, your diatribe is as irrational as something Bin laden would spout off!

In any large population there will always be a few nuts, irrespective of “Religion” or it’s absence.

I hear medical school is tough, this wacko cracked, for all you know he found some conflict between Med. school and your precious religious doctrine which drove him over the edge.

It will be days, probably months, before enough FACTS are known to begin drawing any conclusions from this tragedy.
Your attempt to exploit this for holy zealotry is unbecoming, it puts you on a level with Chuck Schumer in his attempt to blame gun ownership in order to curtail our RKBA.

Shame on you!


23 posted on 07/20/2012 2:59:19 PM PDT by Loyal Sedition
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

The greatest godless influence on our nation’s children are GODLESS government schools! Just to cooperate in the classroom the child **MUST** learn to think and reason godlessly! How could it be otherwise?

Oh!....And please don’t think that going back to some magical era is a solution. In the past government schools offered children a lukewarm and generic Protestantism. What does Christ do with the lukewarm? Answer: He spits them out of His mouth!

Children who attend government owned and run socialist-entitlment schooling risk learning to be comfortable with socialism and worshiping at the pagan altar of government goodies. It only took one to three generations of socialist-entitlment schooling to give the nation Woodrow Wilson and Franklin D. Roosevelt.


24 posted on 07/20/2012 6:00:25 PM PDT by wintertime (:-))
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To: DallasSun
Every reasonably cooperative child in our nation's godless socialist-entitlement schools ( misnamed “public” schools) **WILL** learn to think and reason godlessly . They **must** just to cooperate with the classroom instructions, understand the godless textbooks, and turn in their godless home assignments.

All schools have a religious worldview. **ALL** of them! Private and socialist-entitlement government schools have a religious worldview. Why? Because religious neutrality can not exist in the mind of any sentient being.

So?...What are the religious worldview choices that **all** schools must decide upon? Answer: godless or God-centered. Neither choice is religiously neutral in content or consequences for the child or the nation.

25 posted on 07/20/2012 6:09:24 PM PDT by wintertime (:-))
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To: DallasSun; GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

Lucky you! You get to have the taxpayer to support and establish your anointed religious worldview of atheism.

Government schools: The government established Church of Godless Indoctrination.


26 posted on 07/20/2012 6:15:05 PM PDT by wintertime (:-))
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To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

“Does your school call ‘Easter Vacation’ ‘Spring Break’? Does your school call ‘Christmas Vacation’ ‘Holiday break’??? “


So what?

My kids(now middle aged) and my grandchildren always attended public school in a town with a large Jewish population.They have used those terms for years are are all decent,hard working people.


27 posted on 07/20/2012 6:16:45 PM PDT by Mears
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To: Mears
Please read my posts #24, 25, and 26.

Essentially, you are very lucky that the taxpayers are supporting and establishing your religious worldview.

Fundamentally, government schools are not religiously neutral and never have been. Why?

Answer: A religiously neutral education is impossible because it is impossible for any sentient human to be religiously neutral. Every human must choose between a godless or God-centered worldview and neither worldview is neutral in content or consequences. Just as all sentient humans must choose between the non-neutral positions of godless or God-centerrd, so must **all** schools!.

28 posted on 07/20/2012 6:43:26 PM PDT by wintertime (:-))
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To: Loyal Sedition

I support and agree with your argument.


29 posted on 07/20/2012 6:45:43 PM PDT by wintertime (:-))
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To: wintertime

I read your posts and respect your opinion.


30 posted on 07/20/2012 7:14:38 PM PDT by Mears
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To: wintertime

I never wanted religion taught to my child in public schools. They are not qualified to teach religion. That is the role of the church and the family. I now do not want the school to teach religion to my grandson. That is still the role of the church and the family.


31 posted on 07/24/2012 1:47:06 PM PDT by DallasSun (Courage~Fear that has said its prayers.)
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To: DallasSun
I never wanted religion taught to my child in public schools. They are not qualified to teach religion.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Fundamentally, government schools are a First Amendment and freedom of conscience abomination. The only solution is to begin the process of privatiization.

Axiom: It is** impossible **to have a religiously neutral government school because religious neutrality can not exist in the mind of a sentient human.

God-centered government schools are ** not ** religiously neutral because it violates the rights of parents who want their children to think and reason godlessly. There is also the knotty problem of which religion?

Godless government schools are NOT religiously neutral because they teach the child to think and reason godlessly which is in absolutely contradiction ) even and abomination) to that which many God-centered worldviews teach.

We must get rid of government owned and run socialist-entitlement K-12 schooling.

32 posted on 07/24/2012 1:57:08 PM PDT by wintertime (:-))
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To: DallasSun

Again....Lucky you! You get the taxpayer to fund the religious worldview ( godless) of your children.


33 posted on 07/24/2012 1:58:25 PM PDT by wintertime (:-))
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To: DallasSun

I can see you are struggling with this.

I can hardly think of anything that the government does that has completely neutral religious, political, and cultural consequences. It is for this reason our Founding Fathers wanted government ( especially on the federal level) to be as **limited** as possible.

Education has **enormous** political, cultural, and religious content and consequences that are never neutral. It if for this reason we should attempt, in every way possible, to see that education is** privately** delivered and that these political, cultural, and religious decisions are **privately** decided between the **private **school administration and the parent.

In an ideal world there would be complete separation of school and state.


34 posted on 07/24/2012 2:06:01 PM PDT by wintertime (:-))
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To: wintertime

And there should be separation of church and state. When I was in school the only difference in religions were protestant and Catholic. Because we were a very small town, we oft times had school functions at one of our churches. The Catholics were not allowed to attend anything in a Protestant church. That was the biggest conflict we had. Now there are so many different religions represented, it would be impossible to bring religion into education. Which religion do we choose? Everyone says...MY religion of course. Only mine. It does not work that way nor should it. And this is no struggle for me at all. But I do thank you for your response and I do respect your point of view. I just cannot agree with it, with all due respect, wintertime.


35 posted on 07/24/2012 2:10:39 PM PDT by DallasSun (Courage~Fear that has said its prayers.)
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To: wintertime

Wintertime, I have no problem with my tax dollars going to public education. The founders saw public education as being for the good of society. And it is. You are free to place your children in private school or religious schools. I chose not to after Kindergarten for my daughter who attended a Christian school until she started first grade in public school. She did the same for her son. We both chose public schools for our own reasons. And have not regretted it. Again, I never wanted the teachers in school to teach my daughter or grandson religion. That is the role of the church and the family. You and I can differ and no harm done. I respect your opinion and hope you will respect mine. Thank you for the debate though. I always enjoy, well, most of the time, hearing the other side of the argument. It is oft times thought provoking and interesting. It does not mean one of us is right and the other wrong. It simply means we disagree. It is wonderful for a democracy.


36 posted on 07/31/2012 2:14:52 PM PDT by DallasSun (Courage~Fear that has said its prayers.)
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To: wintertime

Also, wintertime, it has been pointed out several times that the shooter in Aurora attended the Presbyterian Church with his family where they are very active. This had absolutely nothing to do with the shootings.


37 posted on 07/31/2012 2:16:46 PM PDT by DallasSun (Courage~Fear that has said its prayers.)
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To: wintertime

We will never get rid of public schools. The majority overwhelmingly choose public schools. And there is no need to “begin the process of privatization.” Private schools are a choice you are free to make. They have been available for a very long time. You are free to place your children in private school. You are not free to place my children or my neighbor’s children in same. That is a choice we get to make.


38 posted on 07/31/2012 2:20:18 PM PDT by DallasSun (Courage~Fear that has said its prayers.)
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