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Colorado Batman shooting, more than an act of Depravity
Libertarian Party Platform ^ | 7-21-2012 | Patriot Smith

Posted on 07/21/2012 2:16:47 PM PDT by libertarian2patriot

NY Mayor Bloomberg is calling for gun control while Colorado Gov. John Hickenlooper calls this an "act of depravity". Are you kidding me! These killing were by a Colorado University PHD candidate; a kid who had achieved a higher level of education than both the governor and the mayor. Depravity in this case is not just the kid, if anything is morally corrupt as Hickenlooper calls it, its liberal universities that spawn James Holmes types. If Hickenlooper wants to talk about depravity he should include the root cause of moral decline in our country today consisting of a liberal media, liberal welfare state, liberal court system, a manipulative White House, and a dumbed down Democratic Party. Bloomberg just doesn’t want to waste an opportunity for reviving an old party line. The outcome could have been different had one person in the theater had a gun; even if only used as a distraction against the shooter with a bullet proof vest. If guns are made illegal only outlaws will have guns. But gun control isn’t about a scenario in public and how the outcome could have been different; it’s about our rights as citizens to be armed under any condition. In hindsight, how many people with guns if asked would have left them at the door? Not me, and a couple guys like me could have made a difference just like airplane incidents where passengers are the ones who save the day. This is just the beginning of this media blitz and how this Batman shooting incident will be played out as a tool of the left, for example, early television coverage by Brian Ross, ABC news reporting James Holmes as a member of the "Tea Party"; and don’t forget the skewed early reporting about Trayvon Martin. These are just recent reminders about left wing agenda’s and how the news on the left reports. An empty can, not an empty gun, makes the most noise.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Colorado
KEYWORDS: colorado; media; shooting

1 posted on 07/21/2012 2:17:01 PM PDT by libertarian2patriot
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To: libertarian2patriot

Does anyone else think it is odd that he gave up willingly instead of killing himself, as is the pattern of most of these serial shooters? I think something else is going on here.


2 posted on 07/21/2012 2:21:14 PM PDT by stansblugrassgrl (PRAISE THE LORD AND PASS THE AMMUNITION!!! YEEEEEHAW!)
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To: libertarian2patriot
It's always to our advantage to have a *liberal who is a democrat in power than have a liberal or PC republican puking out such nonsense and claiming to represent the Republican party (ie Bloomberg, McCain).

* Obama is not a liberal. He's a marxist America-Hating commie dictator wannabe whose sole purpose is to destroy this nation.

3 posted on 07/21/2012 2:23:32 PM PDT by tsowellfan (http://www.cafenetamerica.com/)
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To: stansblugrassgrl
Does anyone else think it is odd that he gave up willingly

He could have been a drugged patsy set up for the fall.

Kinda strange that this happens just before the UN anti gun treaty vote just like Columbine happened just before another anti gun vote.

4 posted on 07/21/2012 2:25:26 PM PDT by mountainlion (I am voting for Sarah after getting screwed again by the DC Thugs.)
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To: stansblugrassgrl

Although Colorado has a death penalty, the last execution was 35 years ago.

He knows the risk of dying is little (other than at the hands of inmates), SO my guess is that he wants his moment in front of the witness stand to spew forth whatever it is he wants to spew forth.


5 posted on 07/21/2012 2:30:27 PM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! Those who truly support our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: libertarian2patriot
. . . and don’t forget the skewed early reporting about Trayvon Martin.

It's still skewed, or hadn't you noticed? Try to keep up. And welcome to FR!

6 posted on 07/21/2012 2:36:07 PM PDT by Misterioso (They tried to get me to hate white people, but someone would always come along and spoil it. - Monk)
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To: mountainlion

Just the day before I was saying to a friend “they have to come up with some distraction since The Disaster is going from one blunder to the next and is catching hell all across the front.”

I wasn’t necessarily thinking about something like this but a “Natalie Holloway” kind of thing to allow the yammering fools in the media to talk about ANYTHING other than The Disaster’s horrible situation.

As regards the UN I think Russia and China may wind up protecting our Second Amendment rights better than the Democrat Party.

BTW this is the kind of incident you see happening in Pakistan which is also intriguing.


7 posted on 07/21/2012 2:36:34 PM PDT by arrogantsob (Obama must Go. Sarah herself supports Romney.)
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To: stansblugrassgrl
Does anyone else think it is odd that he gave up willingly instead of killing himself, as is the pattern of most of these serial shooters? I think something else is going on here.

Yes, and along with "How did he pay for all of the ordnance?; Where did he learn to operate all of the weapons the way he did - in the dark with a mask on? Who trained him?. "

8 posted on 07/21/2012 2:52:53 PM PDT by MeneMeneTekelUpharsin (Freedom is the freedom to discipline yourself so others don't have to do it for you.)
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To: libertarian2patriot
"he should include the root cause of moral decline in our country today consisting of a liberal media, liberal welfare state, liberal court system, a manipulative White House, and a dumbed down Democratic Party."

But, very much to the whole point of the article, behind all of those corrupted factors is a terribly corrupt, both intellectually & morally, Academia! (See Myths & Myth Makers In American "Higher" Education.)

William Flax

9 posted on 07/21/2012 2:55:39 PM PDT by Ohioan
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To: xzins

A Lee Harvey Oswald type of incident is still a possibility.

It will just put gasoline of the flames that were started by the gun-control crowd.


10 posted on 07/21/2012 3:00:13 PM PDT by 353FMG
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To: mountainlion
Kinda strange that this happens just before the UN anti gun treaty vote just like Columbine happened just before another anti gun vote.
Yup. And where'd an unemployed med student get the money for all that equipment?
11 posted on 07/21/2012 3:00:48 PM PDT by samtheman (Obama. Mugabe. Chavez. (Obamugavez))
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To: MeneMeneTekelUpharsin
Where did he learn to operate all of the weapons the way he did - in the dark with a mask on? Who trained him?. "

What makes you think he was "trained?" There's nothing he used you can't get a basic familiarization with from YouTube.

Hell, I've been able to tighten my groups from ten inches to three just by watching videos, myself.

12 posted on 07/21/2012 3:08:51 PM PDT by papertyger ("And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if..."))
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To: samtheman
Yup. And where'd an unemployed med student get the money for all that equipment?

One of my coworker's ex-wife has been supplementing her income by riding student loans for over ten years.

It ain't that hard for a guy with his obvious IQ to figure away around such minor impediments.

13 posted on 07/21/2012 3:14:31 PM PDT by papertyger ("And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if..."))
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To: stansblugrassgrl

Maybe he has a little manifesto, like Mr. Breivik did in Norway.

I think he just wanted the attention; a way to get into the history books, and by surrendering as passively as he did, now he gets to see it.

I really don’t see anything else. As to his motive, if he’s not quite literally insane, then I hearken Leopold & Loeb - they committed their (one and only) murder simply to see if they could; to prove to the world (and themselves) that they were Nietzschean “übermensch”, free of laws and petty morality.

I suspect that may well be the case here - he just wanted to see if he could pull it off. Intellectual curiosity of a most twisted sort, if you will.

In my book, that’s the most terrifying motive of them all.


14 posted on 07/21/2012 3:16:21 PM PDT by AnAmericanAbroad (It's all bread and circuses for the future prey of the Morlocks.)
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To: MeneMeneTekelUpharsin

Also, how did he walk into a theater with a gas mask? Was he carrying a large bag? Was he wearing a long coat? Didn’t anyone notice? So many question. Also, except for a few noticeable exceptions, the media isn’t clamoring to link this to right wingers.

I compared the picture of the CO shooter to the one of Loughner, the AZ shooter (after the initial onslaught, notice how nothing is ever said about the AZ him?). It’s striking. If I knew how to post pictures, I’d put them side by side, but, alas, never have figured out how to do that on FR.


15 posted on 07/21/2012 3:42:25 PM PDT by stansblugrassgrl (PRAISE THE LORD AND PASS THE AMMUNITION!!! YEEEEEHAW!)
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To: stansblugrassgrl
Does anyone else think it is odd that he gave up willingly instead of killing himself, as is the pattern of most of these serial shooters? I think something else is going on here.

If there is, he will be killed by his handlers before anything else comes to light. If he's a Monarch disposable who filed to dispose of himself, then he's a problem who will soon be disposed of. An "accident", a jail cell "suicide"...

16 posted on 07/21/2012 3:55:18 PM PDT by Sirius Lee (Goode over evil. Voting for mitt or obie is like throwing your country away.)
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To: stansblugrassgrl

He bought a ticket, entered the cinema, went to the emergency exit, propped the emergency exit door open, went to his car which was parked close to the emergency exit, suited and armed up, went back into the cinema, and unleashed hell.

As per eyewitnesses and the Aurora police department.


17 posted on 07/21/2012 3:57:00 PM PDT by AnAmericanAbroad (It's all bread and circuses for the future prey of the Morlocks.)
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To: MeneMeneTekelUpharsin

Also, how did he walk into a theater with a gas mask? Was he carrying a large bag? Was he wearing a long coat? Didn’t anyone notice? So many question. Also, except for a few noticeable exceptions, the media isn’t clamoring to link this to right wingers.

I compared the picture of the CO shooter to the one of Loughner, the AZ shooter (after the initial onslaught, notice how nothing is ever said about the AZ him?). It’s striking. If I knew how to post pictures, I’d put them side by side, but, alas, never have figured out how to do that on FR.


18 posted on 07/21/2012 4:00:53 PM PDT by stansblugrassgrl (PRAISE THE LORD AND PASS THE AMMUNITION!!! YEEEEEHAW!)
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To: MeneMeneTekelUpharsin
"....along with "How did he pay for all of the ordnance?; Where did he learn to operate all of the weapons the way he did - in the dark with a mask on? Who trained him?. "

You are asking questions which will never be answered. Similarly, tear gas canisters are not available to the civilian population. Who then provided him with military/police ordinance????

Fast and Furious comes to mind.

Killing has been a political option employed since the murder of President John Kennedy by the Lyndon Johnson conspiracy. I am not at all surprised at the hellish killing of innocents, be they civilians or military, for the singular purpose of propelling the candidacy or distraction away from scandal by heartless men and women who view our lives as nothing more than tools to expand upon their self aggrandizement.

19 posted on 07/21/2012 4:02:30 PM PDT by Robert Drobot (Fiat voluntas tua)
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To: Robert Drobot

Similarly, tear gas canisters are not available to the civilian population.
_____________________________

You can buy them online. I’m looking at the site right now. $16.49 each. Not too bad, actually. 6 ounce size. Not huge, but two or three will clear a room, I’ll bet.


20 posted on 07/21/2012 4:07:23 PM PDT by AnAmericanAbroad (It's all bread and circuses for the future prey of the Morlocks.)
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To: Robert Drobot

I should hasten to add, this is military grade tear gas; OC/CS. One tear gas grenade will affect an 23,000 cubic foot area in 60 seconds.

Fairly decent body armor selection, too.


21 posted on 07/21/2012 4:13:35 PM PDT by AnAmericanAbroad (It's all bread and circuses for the future prey of the Morlocks.)
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To: libertarian2patriot

Bloomberg is senile and Hickenlooper speaks just like a moron. The good people of Colorado must have been high on weed when they voted for this buffoon!!! I would not let Hickenloper take out my garbage. But.......none of that matters. What matters is that the likes of Limbaugh, Hannity, Drudge, etc. get on the stick and skinny this murderer out. Without getting into details, the close observation of the facts, reveal James E. Holmes most likely could not pull off this intricate “high dollar” plan without help from outside, both financial and operational support. I suggest “you” big guys get to digging. I smell a rat!!! Now, Obama and Eric Holder will do nothing. They both glorify guys like Holmes!!! And.....they could care less about the Americans murdered in cold blood, nor their grieving families and loved ones!!!


22 posted on 07/21/2012 5:07:35 PM PDT by JLAGRAYFOX (My only objective is defeat and destroy Obama & his Democrat Party, politically!!!)
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To: libertarian2patriot

Bloomberg is senile and Hickenlooper speaks just like a moron. The good people of Colorado must have been high on weed when they voted for this buffoon!!! I would not let Hickenlooper take out my garbage. But.......none of that matters. What matters is that the likes of Limbaugh, Hannity, Drudge, etc. get on the stick and skinny this murderer out. Without getting into details, the close observation of the facts, reveal James E. Holmes most likely could not pull off this intricate “high dollar” plan without help from outside, both financial and operational support. I suggest “you” big guys get to digging. I smell a rat!!! Now, Obama and Eric Holder will do nothing. They both glorify guys like Holmes!!! And.....they could care less about the Americans murdered in cold blood, nor their grieving families and loved ones!!!


23 posted on 07/21/2012 5:08:01 PM PDT by JLAGRAYFOX (My only objective is defeat and destroy Obama & his Democrat Party, politically!!!)
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To: stansblugrassgrl

It’s actually common. Most active shooters surrender or commit suicide when faced with armed resistance. They really, truly, are cowards that want to stroll along killing the unarmed. Also, many shoot enough people to satisfy their rage, then go into a corner and kill theirself when they still have large amounts of remaining ammo and potential victims. It’s like their rage is spent.

Think Klebold and Harris, committing suicide hours before the cops came in. They could have strolled around much longer. Think Cho at Virginia Tech, used barely half of his ammo before committing suicide.

Basically, the guy was a coward, and when confronted by cops who had the drop on him, he surrendered. Remember, his car was at the BACK of the theater, cops were there in about a minute. He was out the emergency exit and at his car, thinking he was about to make his get away, when he saw guns aimed right at him. It does happen sometimes.


24 posted on 07/21/2012 5:23:43 PM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: AnAmericanAbroad

The URL from which you are sourcing is .....?


25 posted on 07/21/2012 5:25:16 PM PDT by Robert Drobot (Fiat voluntas tua)
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Comment #26 Removed by Moderator

To: Robert Drobot
How do we ( the citizenry ) learn where/from whom the shooter obtained his ordinance ????
27 posted on 07/21/2012 5:28:49 PM PDT by Robert Drobot (Fiat voluntas tua)
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To: AnAmericanAbroad

How do we ( the citizenry ) learn where/from whom the shooter obtained his ordinance ????


28 posted on 07/21/2012 5:31:56 PM PDT by Robert Drobot (Fiat voluntas tua)
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To: Robert Drobot

www.KeepShooting.com


29 posted on 07/21/2012 5:31:56 PM PDT by AnAmericanAbroad (It's all bread and circuses for the future prey of the Morlocks.)
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To: Robert Drobot

Here’s a direct link to the product in question:

http://www.keepshooting.com/clear-out-6oz-tear-gas-grenade.html


30 posted on 07/21/2012 5:33:31 PM PDT by AnAmericanAbroad (It's all bread and circuses for the future prey of the Morlocks.)
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To: mountainlion
Does anyone else think it is odd that he gave up willingly

I did until I found out his gun jammed and the bomb that was supposed to draw police to his apartment didn't go off.

I think he actually planned to get away with it!

The best laid schemes gang aft agley.

31 posted on 07/21/2012 5:36:16 PM PDT by eddie willers
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To: libertarian2patriot; All
From the article: These killing were by a Colorado University PHD candidate; a KID who had achieved a higher level of education than both the governor and the mayor. Depravity in this case is not just the KID...

OK, I know most prisoners are literally in places where they have to babysat 24/7 because they've yet to learn how to behave socially...
...which includes being "taken care of" 100% by the ultimate "welfare" program...
...but do conservative writers have to cater to liberal euphemistic tendencies by referencing 24 1/2-yr-old MEN as "kids"????

This seems to detract from the level of responsibility society should hold men in their mid-20s to...
...And just because our educational systems allow men (& women, for that matter) in their 20s to indulge in perpetual adolescence...
...doesn't mean conservatives have to prop up this cultural trend as well.

You know, the liberals ALREADY do this when they claim "babies" (15 yo/14 yo) are having babies...Sorry, liberals...15 and 14 yo are NOT "babies." [Just ask Mary, mother of Jesus]

Let's not lose perspective and cater to liberal euphemistic tendencies. And -- unlike liberals and their entitlement mentality -- let's reinforce responsibility.

32 posted on 07/21/2012 5:42:04 PM PDT by Colofornian (Saying Mitt would keep past political promises is like prophesying that Gumby won't bend anymore)
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To: DesertRhino

You have a point; and of course, there’s the rather darkly-humorous end to the Port Arthur massacre in Australia in 1996 (35 dead, 26 wounded):

(Martin) Bryant (the perpetrator) was captured the following morning (29 April 1996) when he presumably started a fire in the guest house where he was holed up. Bryant taunted police to ‘come and get him’, but the police, believing the hostage he claimed to be holding was already dead, decided that the fire would eventually bring him out. A large amount of ammunition had also ignited and was exploding sporadically as the house burned. He eventually ran out of the house with his clothes on fire and quickly removed his burning clothes. He was promptly arrested by the police, and taken to hospital for treatment.

Guess Mr. Bryant didn’t go out in the blaze of glory he wanted.

Like you said, sometimes but not always, after that rush of rage and adrenalin is exhausted, they shoot themselves. Other times, they rather meekly surrender. It all depends on the individual.


33 posted on 07/21/2012 5:42:49 PM PDT by AnAmericanAbroad (It's all bread and circuses for the future prey of the Morlocks.)
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To: eddie willers

Exactly, hadn’t heard that his weapon had a stoppage. But he sure had that car at the back exit. They caught him there, and i agree, he wanted to get away. He has to be smart enoug to know he would eventually get caught, especially after the bomb. Maybe he had a grandiose plan to go elsewhere and do more.
Remember Klebold and Harris were “planning” to leave and go hijack a plane or some such.


34 posted on 07/21/2012 5:45:46 PM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: stansblugrassgrl
Also, how did he walk into a theater with a gas mask? Was he carrying a large bag?

He likely didn't. We know he propped open an exit door and went to his car parked behind the theater, where he had access to all he brought.

He's responsible for what he did; but some responsibility here is corporate.

What I mean by that is even from a sheer economic situation only (potential freeloaders) -- never mind security -- theaters SHOULD HAVE automatic alarms going to their security people any time a door is propped open a given length of time...and more attention should be given to that early in the movie (again, just from an economic angle).

AMC will be hit up big time re: lawsuits from victims' families for this ONE thing!

35 posted on 07/21/2012 5:47:35 PM PDT by Colofornian (Saying Mitt would keep past political promises is like prophesying that Gumby won't bend anymore)
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To: AnAmericanAbroad

Completely forgot about that one. That was a very bad one.


36 posted on 07/21/2012 5:47:53 PM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: stansblugrassgrl

It does have a particular smell. First off, where did an unemployed kid get the major cash to purchase the body armor, weapons, ammo, explosives, etc. etc. etc...? Tear gas grenades? Now that is a very interesting twist.

How did he know that theater door (normally locked) would be open?

And then he just strolls outside, waits for the police and surrenders?

My WTF meter is pegging...


37 posted on 07/21/2012 5:49:05 PM PDT by Ronin (Dumb, dependent and Democrat is no way to go through life - Rep. L. Gohmert, Tex)
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To: Colofornian

Good observation. When he went out the emergency exit from the theater to get his weapons, that door should have been alarmed.


38 posted on 07/21/2012 5:50:20 PM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: Ronin
where did an unemployed kid get the major cash to purchase the body armor, weapons, ammo, explosives, etc. etc. etc..

Credit Cards would be my guess. He'd receive some nasty letters a few months down the road, but....

39 posted on 07/21/2012 5:54:28 PM PDT by eddie willers
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To: Colofornian

RE: AMC will be hit up big time re: lawsuits from victims’ families for this ONE thing
I don’t see how. Or how anything but a navy seal could have stopped it


40 posted on 07/21/2012 5:57:24 PM PDT by Dosa26
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To: Ronin

First off, where did an unemployed kid get the major cash “to purchase the body armor, weapons, ammo, explosives, etc. etc. etc...? Tear gas grenades? Now that is a very interesting twist.”

Student loans, for the semester he was not completing. As a Phd student im sure we paid for it all. An AR15, an 870, and two glocks can be had a total of 2500 bucks.

“How did he know that theater door (normally locked) would be open?”

Opens from the inside of each theater, emergency exit. Almost a certainty he did a dry run to see how the doors work. Watch a movie, walk out emergency exit and see if you get a reaction.

“And then he just strolls outside, waits for the police and surrenders?”

He wasn’t waiting, there was a VERY fast police response, and he took several Vicoden to stay calm. He was in the process of leaving when he found himself looking straight down police guns. As fun as that armor, helmet, and mask was, he was at a mobility and vision disadvantage, and surprised, was confronted for something he didnt expect, froze and surrendered. Happens to bank robbers and gang members every single day.


41 posted on 07/21/2012 6:00:42 PM PDT by DesertRhino (I was standing with a rifle, waiting for soviet paratroopers, but communists just ran for office.)
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To: DesertRhino
Student loans, for the semester he was not completing. As a Phd student im sure we paid for it all. An AR15, an 870, and two glocks can be had a total of 2500 bucks.

Now that's the basis of a helluva doctoral dissertation! "Random Violence: Shooting A Crowd At A Batman Movie And Its Social Effects."

42 posted on 07/21/2012 6:03:04 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (let me ABOs run loose, lew (or is that lou?))
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To: DesertRhino

Until Anders Breivik came along, I think the Port Arthur massacre was one of the worst in terms of death toll.

I notice a certain tactical similarity between Holmes and Breivik; the bomb, the music set up loud on a loop designed to lure the cops (or someone) who would inadvertently set it off, and then the shooting attack itself. The body armor, the SWAT look of the shooter.

I don’t think Breivik’s little shoot-’em-up in Norway was a direct inspiration, but at the same I do wonder if Holmes took some ideas from it into his head. Certainly, this young man is no dummy; he’s highly intelligent. He might have looked at the general outline of the Breivik attack and thought to himself, “Hey......I could do that too!”

One thing I’m sure about, this wasn’t some spur-of-the-moment incident; this required planning, weapons procurement deliberation, and premeditation.


43 posted on 07/21/2012 6:05:10 PM PDT by AnAmericanAbroad (It's all bread and circuses for the future prey of the Morlocks.)
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To: DesertRhino

Aren’t theater emergency exits usually alarmed?

They certainly were when I was a kid. Back in the day, I had the bright idea of sneaking out into the back alley to smoke halfway through a boring chick-flick my gf dragged me to. The alarm scared the crap out of me and the house lights came up automatically.

Besides, if they weren’t alarmed, one kid would buy a ticket, open the doors and let in five friends. I’m still suspicious.


44 posted on 07/21/2012 6:10:59 PM PDT by Ronin (Dumb, dependent and Democrat is no way to go through life - Rep. L. Gohmert, Tex)
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Keep FR Running
Fight back.

45 posted on 07/21/2012 6:13:46 PM PDT by RedMDer (https://support.woundedwarriorproject.org/default.aspx?tsid=93destr)
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To: Ronin

Guess that embarrassed you.

I’d think he’d take the emergency exits at face value.


46 posted on 07/21/2012 6:14:17 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (let me ABOs run loose, lew (or is that lou?))
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To: HiTech RedNeck

You have no idea...

My girlfriend was super pissed because the incident occurred at one of the more “sensitive” moments of the film. I got kicked out, she stayed.

It was a week before she’d pick up when I called, and THEN I had to listen to her tell me exactly what she thought about my selfishness...

She dumped me shortly after that anyhow.


47 posted on 07/21/2012 6:23:02 PM PDT by Ronin (Dumb, dependent and Democrat is no way to go through life - Rep. L. Gohmert, Tex)
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