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I tried to fire a TEC-9, but it took control (Chicago IL,barf or laugh?)
suntimes.com ^ | 3 August, 2012 | Carol Marin

Posted on 08/04/2012 5:40:26 AM PDT by marktwain

In 1989, I came close — we’ll never know how close — to shooting a producer and cameraman with a TEC-9 assault weapon.

We were at a suburban gun range with a law-enforcement agent doing a story on how semiautomatic weapons can be illegally modified into automatic weapons, making them deadlier still.

The gun I was given to fire was a fully automatic TEC-9 pistol with a magazine of bullets. The target was straight ahead. My crew was far off to the right and safely — or so we all thought — out of the way.

But with one trigger pull, the weapon took control. My right arm jolted in an arc upward and to the right.

My crew, with lightning speed, dropped to the ground. The whole thing took just seconds.

Terrified?

We all were.

You could argue that’s what happens when an inexperienced person handles an assault weapon.

Tom Ahern, senior special agent for the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives in Chicago and an expert marksman, would tell you otherwise.

“I’ve been shooting for 32 years,” he said by phone Thursday. “If I fired a fully automatic TEC-9 one-handed, it could jump up or down, right or left . . . the gun could flutter . . . and you could dump a 50-round clip in under five seconds. It’s going to spray all over the place.”

And holding it with both hands, he said, won’t significantly improve accuracy.

Why are we talking about this?

Because on the streets of Chicago, there are all kinds of guns — legal and illegal. And all kinds of people getting shot — intended victims plus people who end up as the collateral damage of a barrage of bullets.

(Excerpt) Read more at suntimes.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: Illinois
KEYWORDS: banglist; chicago; il; tec9
Carol Marin is the political columnist for the Chicago Sun-Times. It is easy to see why the MSM is dying.
1 posted on 08/04/2012 5:40:34 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

You know if he was holding the TEC-9 sideways gangster style, he would not have the problem he had / S


2 posted on 08/04/2012 5:46:35 AM PDT by Popman (In a place you only dream of Where your soul is always free)
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To: marktwain

Some people just shouldn’t be around guns.

And others shouldn’t be journalists.

We need a study to confirm that the “dumb gene” is fully correlated with media dorks and politicians.


3 posted on 08/04/2012 5:46:35 AM PDT by Da Coyote
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To: marktwain

“Carol Marin is the political columnist for the Chicago Sun-Times. It is easy to see why the MSM is dying.”

Let me guess - because their guns are shooting each other?


4 posted on 08/04/2012 5:46:44 AM PDT by SquarePants
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To: marktwain

“Even legal, semiautomatic assault weapons aren’t precision instruments. Though each bullet fired requires a separate squeeze of the trigger (unlike fully automatic weapons), after the first round is fired, the trigger loosens for subsequent rounds. It still takes only seconds to dump a high-capacity magazine.”

Some elements of truth here but she has a long way to go in her journalistic accuracy. I do commend her on differentiating between semi-auto and fully automatic guns...even though she is a little hazy about what kind of gun’s trigger gets easier to pull after the first round.


5 posted on 08/04/2012 5:52:18 AM PDT by ChoobacKY
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To: Popman

Carol is a woman. This reminds me of the scene from one of the Dirty Harry movies where the police are demonstrating a LAW rocket launcher. Harry snatches his partner from the blast zone behind the weapon just before it is fired.

Giving a complete and clueless woman a fully loaded machine pistol and expecting her to be “safe” with it is the height of irresponsibility.


6 posted on 08/04/2012 5:52:51 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain
You could argue that’s what happens when an inexperienced person handles an assault weapon.

That I could and I could also argue that an honorable non agenda driven rangemaster would have never allowed it to happen like this.
7 posted on 08/04/2012 5:52:59 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: SquarePants

I’m thinking they are culled in the deadly “Walking and chewing gum” experience.

Remember journalists, “If you walk, don’t chew gum, because one of those pieces of Juicy Fruit might have your name on it!”


8 posted on 08/04/2012 5:54:10 AM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy
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To: cripplecreek

Carol Marin is the political columnist for the Chicago Sun-Times.

In addition to her work at the paper, she is the political editor for NBC5 News and an interviewer/contributer to WTTW’s Chicago Tonight program.

A former CBS News correspondent, she reported for the CBS News magazines 60 Minutes and 60 Minutes II. An award winning journalist, she is the recipient of broadcast journalism’s most prestigious awards. She has won two George Foster Peabody awards, two DuPont-Columbia awards and two national Emmys. In addition she is a member of the Chicago Journalism Hall of Fame and has received the Ethics in Journalism award from the Chicago Headline Club.

Born in Chicago, she grew up reading the legendary Mike Royko and listening to the television commentaries of Len O’Connor. Carol’s own news career began in Knoxville, Tennessee at WBIR-TV in 1972. In 1976 she moved to WSM-TV in Nashville as the anchor of the 6:00 news and established herself as one of the market’s top reporters. In 1978, she returned home to Chicago to anchor and report for WMAQ-TV. In 1985, she was promoted to anchor the station’s 10:00 newscast, a position she held until May 1997. In 1997 she joined CBS News and a year later joined the staff of 60 Minutes II. She left CBS in July 2002. In 2003 Carol began writing a weekly column for the Chicago Tribune and was hired by the Chicago Sun-Times in August 2004.

A graduate of the University of Illinois, Carol lives in Chicago with her husband and two sons.


9 posted on 08/04/2012 5:55:06 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain

I am not qualified to comment on the Tech 9, like most Americans I have never been close to one.

I can comment on the author and it is pretty easy to see her agenda.


10 posted on 08/04/2012 5:56:51 AM PDT by Venturer
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To: marktwain
"....doing a story on how semiautomatic weapons can be illegally modified into automatic weapons...."

Could just as well have been doing a story on how to manufacture a sawed-off-shotgun. In either scenario the cop was violating federal law and the news person was an accessory to the crime.

11 posted on 08/04/2012 5:58:00 AM PDT by Buffalo Head (Illigitimi non carborundum)
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To: marktwain

12 posted on 08/04/2012 5:58:55 AM PDT by real saxophonist (Proud to have been beat up and shot by the late Paul Gomez. RIP, 'Gnomez'.)
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Comment #13 Removed by Moderator

To: marktwain

Must be hard to shoot with a limp wrist.


14 posted on 08/04/2012 6:04:02 AM PDT by Sirius Lee (Goode over evil. Voting for mitt or obie is like throwing your country away.)
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To: marktwain
This guy is an idiot and had no training on any gun it appears. All he had to do was let up on the trigger. I suppose he froze when things did not go the way he expected. He apparently had no safety instruction at the range.
15 posted on 08/04/2012 6:10:39 AM PDT by mountainlion (I am voting for Sarah after getting screwed again by the DC Thugs.)
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To: marktwain

My conservative congressman’s son is a crime writer for one of the Chicago papers. I suspect that he would have written a far more rational piece.


16 posted on 08/04/2012 6:12:17 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Da Coyote

I worked in the media for many years. As bad and as stupid/unqualified as you think ‘journalists’ are, I assure you you have no idea. And you don’t really want to know. You might think you do, but trust me. I know. And that knowledge haunts me every time I read a news article.

I know the ‘thought process’ that goes into an article like this. The plagiarism, the google searches on gun control sites, calls to ‘unnamed sources and such...the same sources that will be picking them up from work to go home, ot the ‘source’ sitting in the next row of cubicles...

The dishonesty, ignorance ...believe me. you don’t really want to ‘know’. And as bad as you imagine it to be, it is far worse.


17 posted on 08/04/2012 6:19:04 AM PDT by Norm Lenhart
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To: marktwain

It is dependent to some degree on the person doing the shooting and also how well they have been instructed.

Around 35 years ago, I took several of my Nieces and Nephews down to a creek bank on my parents property. We did nearly all our shooting with .22 pistols and a 9mm.

One of my Nieces asked to shoot the Ruger Super Blackhawk in .44 magnum. I told her that was probably not a good idea for a beginner. She was insistent so I finally let her shoot it.

The shooter always had on ear muffs. I gave her some basic instructions on holding the gun two handed and to hold it firmly but not like she was strangling a weasel. Also not to fight the recoil just let it slide up.

Anyway she fired it six times with no problem at all.


18 posted on 08/04/2012 6:19:04 AM PDT by yarddog
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To: Norm Lenhart

‘swhy I left the scribbling profession and went into sales.


19 posted on 08/04/2012 6:31:43 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks (I didn't post this. Someone else did.)
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To: yarddog

I remember the only time I ever fired an automatic weapon. First my uncle had me fire a few single rounds in semi auto to get a feel for the recoil.

When I fired in full auto he told me to forget about aiming at the target and fire a few rounds downrange into the ground first again for the feel. The whole time he was at my shoulder ready to take control.


20 posted on 08/04/2012 6:33:45 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: marktwain

Far off to the rear is the safest place to be!!


21 posted on 08/04/2012 6:34:42 AM PDT by ontap
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To: yarddog

When I was about 8 or so I went shooting with my grandpa and a couple of uncles. I kept begging to shoot Grandpa’s shotgun so he finally relented. They set me on the hood of the car and showed me how to hold it, etc. Knocked me backwards off the car and thought I had broke my shoulder. lol I never asked to shoot that gun again.


22 posted on 08/04/2012 6:35:18 AM PDT by sheana
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To: marktwain

Don’t you just love it when a member of the MSM reports to the entire world they are in FACT an idiot.


23 posted on 08/04/2012 6:35:42 AM PDT by IMR 4350
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To: marktwain

Mz Marin fails to identify the organization of the “law enforcement agent” which set up the Tec-9 demo. She makes no mention of being taught even basic gun safety procedures nor of shooting any semi-automatic pistol to get a feel for recoil, noise, etc. Sounds as if she was handed the full auto conversion Tec-9 and told to point and yank the trigger. Don’t know if the “LEO” was ATF or local but his agenda is quite clear. And he found the perfect willing dupe to broadcast it.

Bet they had some great anti-gun footage of panic at the range, people eating dirt, lots of noise, and some “holy s***” screams”, as well her shaky frightened voice over. Perfect theater.

From her lead, it sounds as if the “LEO” ran through quick DIY conversion instructions. ‘See how easy it easy, any fool can do this.”. And by extension implying that all semi-auto handguns can be modified in similar fashion.

And the closer comes at the end after presenting the model victim.

“No gun was recovered, so we don?t know if it was an assault weapon that blew a hole in their lives. But what we do know is that, as a category of gun, assault weapons serve neither sporting nor marksmanship purposes.

Assault weapons just spray death.”

See proof doesn’t matter, ‘it’s the seriousness [sic] of the charge that matters.”


24 posted on 08/04/2012 6:38:51 AM PDT by Covenantor ("Men are ruled...by liars who refuse them news, and by fools who cannot govern." Chesterton)
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To: IMR 4350
Don’t you just love it when a member of the MSM reports to the entire world they are in FACT an idiot.

The problem is that even in America, a large minority do not know enough to know that the reporter is an idiot, and in the rest of the world, a large majority do not know enough to know that the reporter is an idiot.

There are only a few countries like Switzerland and Israel where a majority would know.

25 posted on 08/04/2012 6:41:18 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: ChoobacKY

I found her argument about a trigger getting easier to operate at variance with the laws of physics and basic metallurgy.

A spring does not loosen in a single actuation or even a few dozen. It is repeated actuations, in the 200,000 range that may have some nominal effect on a spring and more in the 2,000,000 range for a spring to start to show signs of metal fatigue and begin to relax in an amount that might be discernible to an inexperienced user.


26 posted on 08/04/2012 6:42:53 AM PDT by Ouderkirk (Democrats...the party of Slavery, Segregation, Sodomy, and Sedition)
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To: marktwain

I was reminded of Jamie Lee Curtis in True Lies.


27 posted on 08/04/2012 6:45:10 AM PDT by sportutegrl
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To: marktwain

The author is an idiot and Tom Ahern is no marksman if he’s saying crap like that.

I’ve been shooting full auto weapons for over 30 years and if you know what you’re doing in any fashion, you aren’t going to loose control of the gun at all.

Friggin morons.


28 posted on 08/04/2012 6:45:44 AM PDT by BCR #226 (02/07 SOT www.extremefirepower.com...The BS stops when the hammer drops.)
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To: marktwain

No matter where in the world you go, anyone above the level of idiot, knows she’s an idiot.


29 posted on 08/04/2012 6:47:28 AM PDT by IMR 4350
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To: marktwain
"Because on the streets of Chicago, there are all kinds of guns — legal and illegal.

In Chicago they're mostly all illegal. And the laws must be effective, because guns are far less common in the City of Chicago than they are in the Chicago suburbs and rural Illinois. Maybe the reporterette should ask herself, "Chicago has fewer guns and more crime. Why is that?"

30 posted on 08/04/2012 6:53:49 AM PDT by Sooth2222 ("Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of congress. But I repeat myself." M.Twain)
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To: Covenantor
Bet they had some great anti-gun footage of panic at the range, people eating dirt, lots of noise, and some “holy s***” screams”, as well her shaky frightened voice over. Perfect theater.

That's one of the things I hate about the gun shows on the Discovery channel. The pyrotechnics look cool but beyond that they're worthless and only feed the hysteria of the bed wetters.
31 posted on 08/04/2012 6:54:26 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: marktwain
She lost me in the third paragraph.

> The target was straight ahead. My crew was far off to the right and safely — or so we all thought — out of the way.

Which tells me that the producer and cameraman were downrange, thinking that by standing off to the side of the target, they'd be able to get some great dramatic footage of her firing the thing. They broke the 180-degree plane.

This woman is a moron. The producer and cameraman are morons. The law-enforcement agent who put this weapon in her hands without adequate training and the suburban gun range that let them set up their photo shoot this way are criminally negligent morons.

If she'd killed the producer and cameraman you could have put the cause of death down as "evolution in action."

32 posted on 08/04/2012 6:56:59 AM PDT by Flatus I. Maximus (OVERTHROW OBAMA!)
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To: Sooth2222

what fool handed this woman a fully automatic weapon and didnt give her at least some basic instruction in how to operate it safely


33 posted on 08/04/2012 6:57:59 AM PDT by jneesy (rough seas make skillful sailors)
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To: marktwain

Glads to see the barf alert. I get so sick of liberal lies and liberals in agencies like the FBI aiding and abetting the lies ...


34 posted on 08/04/2012 7:03:59 AM PDT by MHGinTN (Being deceived can be cured.)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

It’s unreal isn’t it? People get a general idea of what it might be like but if they ever saw it in action, no one but a kool aid kid would EVER trust a single thing they saw/read from a news outlet.

If a journo tells you water is wet, check to make sure. and that’s the truth. My fave was the standard speech from the Eds. Several I’ve worked with pretty much said the same thing. “This is how ‘I’ do things...”

And truth and honesty be damned. Out of all the journos I ever worked with, I can say one for certain was honest and one other was ‘situationaly’ honest. The rest were total hacks.


35 posted on 08/04/2012 7:05:23 AM PDT by Norm Lenhart
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To: marktwain

I have on of these in semi-auto 9mm.
It is a piece-o-crap weapon not worth owning.
Surprised me whenever it fired a full magazine without jamming.
Been locked up in the bottom of a chest rusting away for over 10 years now.

“Gangsta Cool Looking” +1
Practical / Reliable -10


36 posted on 08/04/2012 7:12:06 AM PDT by Repeal The 17th (We have met the enemy and he is us.)
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To: Ouderkirk; marktwain
Many semiauto pistols can be carried de-cocked, then cocked with a relatively stiff and hard first "double action" trigger pull. Subsequent trigger pulls (with the hammer already cocked by energy from the first shot) are much easier and crisper.

A good example is my HK4: my standard drill includes cocking it for the first shot with my weak-hand thumb -- so all trigger pulls are smooth, light and with a crisp let-off. Stiff, long trigger pull is why I dislike most double actions...

The dumbroad writer had, apparently been allowed to shoot such a semiauto pistol, and (deliberately?) no one explained the first-shot problem. And she was too stupid (or prejudiced) to ask...

37 posted on 08/04/2012 7:12:46 AM PDT by TXnMA ("Allah": Satan's current alias...)
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To: marktwain

A person with no familiarity or training should think twice before handling a weapon.


38 posted on 08/04/2012 7:13:51 AM PDT by kenmcg (t)
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To: marktwain
Tom Ahern. Shooter for 32 years...still doesn't know the difference between a magazine and a clip.

Yep, he's an authority.

39 posted on 08/04/2012 7:35:59 AM PDT by I am bigjohn
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To: marktwain

It makes you wonder how many bullets she launched skyward to come down where?


40 posted on 08/04/2012 8:03:42 AM PDT by Malone LaVeigh
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To: marktwain
feh...
41 posted on 08/04/2012 8:27:22 AM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist - *DTOM* -ww- NO Pity for the LAZY)
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To: Norm Lenhart
I think it was the cynicism that got to me.
Then there was the pay differential. Within two years, my income was up 300 percent.
42 posted on 08/04/2012 8:27:26 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks (I didn't post this. Someone else did.)
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To: marktwain

Yes, and give “a complete and clueless” man the same weapon and all is well.

/s


43 posted on 08/04/2012 10:05:11 AM PDT by coop71 (Being a redhead means never having to say you're sorry...)
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To: marktwain

Because she’s inept, my rights need to be curtailed? Leftist “logic” if you can call it that.


44 posted on 08/04/2012 10:25:12 AM PDT by muir_redwoods (Legalize Freedom!!)
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To: marktwain

***Giving a complete and clueless woman a fully loaded machine pistol and expecting her to be “safe” with it is the height of irresponsibility.****

Kind of like Jill St John in DIAMONDS ARE FOREVER when she picks up a submachine gun and fires it, the recoil backs her off the oil platform.


45 posted on 08/04/2012 10:52:25 AM PDT by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Tyrannies demand immense sacrifices of their people to produce trifles.-Marquis de Custine)
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To: Ouderkirk

“I found her argument about a trigger getting easier to operate at variance with the laws of physics and basic metallurgy......”

I kinda think what she was talking about is how the trigger pull of DA pistols gets easier when the pistol shifts into single action after the first shot. Her evident lack of firearms knowledge might lead her to believe this also applies to rifles? If, so, she is a mite ignerent.


46 posted on 08/04/2012 12:08:24 PM PDT by ChoobacKY
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To: Ouderkirk

“I found her argument about a trigger getting easier to operate at variance with the laws of physics and basic metallurgy......”

I kinda think what she was talking about is how the trigger pull of DA pistols gets easier when the pistol shifts into single action after the first shot. Her evident lack of firearms knowledge might lead her to believe this also applies to rifles? If, so, she is a mite ignerent.


47 posted on 08/04/2012 12:09:02 PM PDT by ChoobacKY
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To: marktwain
Well heck, the reporter forgot rule #7 of Red Neck gun safety tips:

7. If guns make you nervous, drink a bottle of whiskey before heading to the practice range.

48 posted on 08/04/2012 12:18:54 PM PDT by The Cajun (Sarah Palin, Mark Levin......Nuff said.)
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