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U.S. cop blasted for wishing to carry gun in Calgary park
Winnipeg Free Press ^ | August 10, 2012

Posted on 08/10/2012 6:10:23 PM PDT by george76

An off-duty Michigan police officer's public lament about not being able to carry a handgun in a Calgary park has him taking cyber fire from both sides of the border.

Walt Wawra of Kalamazoo, Mich., wrote a letter to the Calgary Herald this week complaining about a recent daylight encounter he and his wife had while visiting Nose Hill Park, a vast expanse of hilly grassland on the city's north side.

Wawra said two men asked twice in a "very aggressive tone" whether the couple had been to the Calgary Stampede yet. They were "disrespectful" and had a "menacing manner," he recalls.

He said he ignored the two men at first, but when they moved closer he responded: "Gentlemen, I have no need to talk with you. Goodbye."

Everyone walked away peacefully.

But in his letter to the editor, Wawra laments a man should have the right to protect himself when he needs to and said it felt strange not to be able to carry his handgun off duty.

"I thank the Lord Jesus Christ they did not pull a weapon of some sort, but rather concluded it was in their best interest to leave us alone," Wawra writes.

(Excerpt) Read more at winnipegfreepress.com ...


TOPICS: Canada; Crime/Corruption; Extended News; News/Current Events; US: Michigan
KEYWORDS: banglist; calgary; donutwatch; leo; waltwawra; wawra

1 posted on 08/10/2012 6:10:28 PM PDT by george76
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To: george76

No dog with them I guess.


2 posted on 08/10/2012 6:19:35 PM PDT by Steely Tom (If the Constitution can be a living document, I guess a corporation can be a person.)
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To: george76

I don’t think his problem was a lack of a gun. In fact, his problem is having a “cop” attitude in a time and place where that is inappropriate. If he had a gun with him, this could have resulted in tragedy.

The long and the short of it is that like many, he is using a gun as a “crutch”, when other means are called for. This can happen to anyone, and it’s important to look out for it as a gun owner.

Guns are at their best when they instill enough confidence so that you are able to resolve situations without having to use your gun.


3 posted on 08/10/2012 6:53:10 PM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy
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To: Springman; cyclotic; netmilsmom; RatsDawg; PGalt; FreedomHammer; queenkathy; madison10; ...
I'm confused. If this happened in Canada I can't really see that the guy has any real right to complain.

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4 posted on 08/10/2012 7:17:09 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

I certainly don’t assume that I have the same rights in another country as I have here.


5 posted on 08/10/2012 7:22:59 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
The long and the short of it is that like many, he is using a gun as a “crutch”, when other means are called for. This can happen to anyone, and it’s important to look out for it as a gun owner.

No, the long and short of it is that there are fully paid shills roaming around ready to dredge up the oldest, stupidest myths about gun ownership and re-plaster them into the minds of responsible people in order to keep the liberal buggaboo about guns making people insane, alive.

I'd ask how you live with yourself, but I don't assume you're really alive in the first place, so the question is pointless.

6 posted on 08/10/2012 8:16:13 PM PDT by Talisker (One who commands, must obey.)
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To: cripplecreek
"same rights"

Agree. If he doesn't like a country that forbids foreigners having handguns, he shouldn't go there.

7 posted on 08/10/2012 8:21:23 PM PDT by driftless2
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
If he had a gun with him, this could have resulted in tragedy.

If a couple is violently accosted, and the attackers refuse to back off, and the attackers get shot and killed, that is NOT a tragedy. That is an incredibly good outcome for all of mankind.

IF we had more armed people we'd have far fewer criminals

8 posted on 08/10/2012 8:54:10 PM PDT by John O (God Save America (Please))
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To: george76

Something sounds ‘fishy’ here.

Americans don’t ‘speak’ like the gentleman was quoted.
Especially one who wishes he had a gun with him.

Even reading it, it just doesn’t ‘sound’ right.

Just my NSHO.


9 posted on 08/10/2012 9:01:12 PM PDT by xrmusn (6/98 "It is virtually impossible to clean the pond as long as the pigs are still crapping in it")
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To: xrmusn
Something sounds ‘fishy’ here.

I agree.

I smell an "I'm special" attitude.

10 posted on 08/10/2012 9:49:59 PM PDT by Navy Patriot (Join the Democrats, it's not Fascism when WE do it, and the Constitution and law mean what WE say.)
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To: cripplecreek
I'm confused. If this happened in Canada I can't really see that the guy has any real right to complain.

Yeah, everybody knows Canadians don't have guns.

11 posted on 08/10/2012 10:32:01 PM PDT by Auntie Dem (Hey! Hey! Ho! Ho! Terrorist lovers gotta go!)
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To: george76
Overeact much? Letter to the paper because a couple of Canucks asked "Have you been to Stampede eh?" (Doofus, they were giving out free passes)

As The Batman said "The cop acted stupidly" "And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion".

12 posted on 08/10/2012 11:04:07 PM PDT by Oztrich Boy (Literals will believe anything.)
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To: xrmusn
Americans don’t ‘speak’ like the gentleman was quoted.

He put the text of the letter through Babelfish American to Canadian translation before sending it to the Calgary paper.

13 posted on 08/10/2012 11:13:58 PM PDT by Oztrich Boy (Literals will believe anything.)
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To: george76
Wawra said two men asked twice in a "very aggressive tone" whether the couple had been to the Calgary Stampede yet. They were "disrespectful" and had a "menacing manner," he recalls.

Good thing they didn't ask him if he ever shot a dog

14 posted on 08/10/2012 11:55:11 PM PDT by paul51 (11 September 2001 - Never forget)
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To: george76; All
We should be supporting the idea of legitimate carry of arms for self defense. Why criticize this guy because he was a police officer? What we should be doing is attempting to gain reciprocity for CCW with Canada.
15 posted on 08/11/2012 3:44:35 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: driftless2

Apparently a lot of Americans can’t grasp the concept of Canada being a separate nation. My cousin spent a long weekend in a Windsor jail mostly for throwing a tantrum about his constitutional rights. The charged him with disturbing the peace and let him sit in jail for 4 days before calling the American authorities.

He was really mad when the American consulate told him the same. “You don’t have constitutional rights in Canada”.


16 posted on 08/11/2012 3:45:46 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
I don’t think his problem was a lack of a gun. In fact, his problem is having a “cop” attitude in a time and place where that is inappropriate. If he had a gun with him, this could have resulted in tragedy. The long and the short of it is that like many, he is using a gun as a “crutch”, when other means are called for. This can happen to anyone, and it’s important to look out for it as a gun owner. Guns are at their best when they instill enough confidence so that you are able to resolve situations without having to use your gun.

His problem is the attitude of the a$$hats that will become aggressive for no reason just because they think they can. He managed to not get in trouble but if they had decided to press on, it could have turned very ugly for him. You seem to be saying that because he doesn't like being menaced for no reason, he has "issues". You also seem to imply that we need to place the safety of the a$$hats ahead of the safety of the everyday, mind-your-own-business citizen. Just be tween you and me, I'd rather that 100 a$$hats got shot because they threatened someone than one innocent citizen get a black eye from one of these yo-yos.

17 posted on 08/11/2012 3:47:24 AM PDT by trebb ("If a man will not work, he should not eat" From 2 Thes 3)
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To: Oztrich Boy; Navy Patriot

Americans don’t ‘speak’ like the gentleman was quoted
= = = == = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =

Kind of like the ‘spam-mails’ you get from Iraq...

“I am Captain Jonathan Paul Jones, USMC, a soldier posted in Iraq that has been entrusted with guarding 100 trillion bucks.
Would you care to share it with me etc”

Not that I bother to read these at all, but by the time I see USMC, a soldier and posted in the same sentence, the delete button goes to work a lot quicker than if I really thought there was a possibility of it being true.


18 posted on 08/11/2012 4:55:03 AM PDT by xrmusn (6/98 "It is virtually impossible to clean the pond as long as the pigs are still crapping in it")
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To: Talisker

If you check my postings in the forum, you will discover that I am not, in any way, anti-gun. Having done so, I will expect an apology from you.

This being said, I will elaborate on what I wrote. To start with, at any distance under 25 feet, I will generally prefer to use a knife than a gun, because at short range, it can be much more effective, and the gap can be closed very quickly.

The cop wished he had a gun at the time, but had these two had evil intent, the gap was already closed so the gun could have been less than useless. They might have overpowered him and shot him with his own gun, something that happens to police officers with far too much frequency.

So, without a gun, or a knife, he is pretty reliant on hand-to-hand combat with the two. And in that he has training for this, it is probably his best bet if necessary.

But he wished he had his gun, so it is a psychological crutch for him, an inappropriate tool for his situation. He didn’t have one, so it is not part of the equation.

To me this is a major red flag, and one that often happens to gun users. They assume a gun has “magical” powers, and is the end-all, be-all in any situation. That it automatically imparts control and dominance over any situation.

And this gets a lot of gun owners hurt and killed.

In truth, having a concealed carry gun imparts enormous tactical advantages, even against an assailant who is brandishing a gun. Added up, these can mean, my estimate, over two seconds of advantage, which is huge in a situation where fractions of a second make all the difference.

But as soon as the CC is exposed, the clock is ticking. So if a glib tongue and diplomacy extends this concealment, it gives more and more advantages to the CC holder. Optimally, the situation can resolve with no exposure at all.

This is why using a gun as a psychological crutch is so dangerous, because by exposing, or even brandishing your gun you lose a lot, and if the tactical situation is not optimal for using a gun in the first place, you are just begging to come out of the situation worse for wear.


19 posted on 08/11/2012 6:36:13 AM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy
I have seen cases where people had a gun, but did not draw it. They were then attacked because their opponent thought they did not have a gun. By the time they got the gun into play, they were severely injured and had to shoot the attacker.

What we more commonly see is the gun carrier gets the gun out before shooting is necessary, and the potential attacker runs away. This is the most common use of a gun for self defense, and is considered a more desirable result than having to shoot an attacker.

20 posted on 08/11/2012 6:50:19 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: marktwain
Why criticize this guy because he was a police officer?

Because he's a weenie that expects civilians to cringe and not to diss him?

21 posted on 08/11/2012 8:11:14 AM PDT by Oztrich Boy (Internet fun fact: There is 1 person named walter wawra in Kalamazoo, MI.)
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To: marktwain

Most critize him because they assume that his is saying that because he is a cop he should be able to have at gun. He is not saying we all should be able to have a gun, it is the I am special call.


22 posted on 08/11/2012 9:51:42 AM PDT by Ratman83
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To: marktwain

Most critize him because they assume that his is saying that because he is a cop he should be able to have at gun. He is not saying we all should be able to have a gun, it is the I am special call.


23 posted on 08/11/2012 9:51:42 AM PDT by Ratman83
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To: marktwain

Yes, but that is very situational. A lot of admittedly very fast thinking has to go into a judgment to brandish, including distance, attacker appearance, movement and momentum.

In some of the former cases, like Zimmerman, I imagine that it wasn’t that they chose not to draw, just that the attack was so fast they didn’t have the chance. Had the decedent in that case stopped 10 feet away from Zimmerman and just shouted at him or threatened him, he would have had a much greater opportunity to draw.

After noting that the decedent was not continuing to approach, whether or not his hands were empty, whether or not he appeared rational, and subjective stuff.

And of course, the assumption is that you have a gun. If you do not, your strategy has to be different.


24 posted on 08/11/2012 9:53:26 AM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy
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To: marktwain
What we more commonly see is the gun carrier gets the gun out before shooting is necessary, and the potential attacker runs away.

In New Jersey they categorize that as BRANDISHING, and send you to jail.

25 posted on 08/11/2012 10:23:14 AM PDT by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed &water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: JimRed; All
In New Jersey they categorize that as BRANDISHING, and send you to jail.

In Arizona we passed a special law simply to prevent that sort of abuse. It is called the defensive display law, and it allows you to let a potential attacker know you are armed without worrying about being charged with a crime because you did so.

26 posted on 08/11/2012 7:06:49 PM PDT by marktwain
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To: george76; Clive; exg; Alberta's Child; albertabound; AntiKev; backhoe; Byron_the_Aussie; ...

Although I support the idea of open carry, this cop needs to be reminded that (1) he is outside his jurisdiction and therefore a private citizen, not an LEO and (2) when visiting a foreign country one is subject to the laws of that country.


27 posted on 08/12/2012 2:58:09 PM PDT by Squawk 8888 (Tories in- now the REAL work begins!)
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