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Call to Stiffen Laws Worries Town Built by Guns
New York Times ^ | August 24, 2012 | THOMAS KAPLAN

Posted on 08/24/2012 7:32:53 AM PDT by Second Amendment First

ILION, N.Y. — This is the town that Remington built.

Almost 200 years ago, a young man named Eliphalet Remington Jr. forged his first rifle barrel at his father’s ironworks here in the Mohawk Valley. These days, the Remington Arms factory in this village, midway between Albany and Syracuse, is one of the few large manufacturers still prospering in a part of upstate New York that was once filled with them.

But now residents of Ilion, a community whose history and economy are indelibly linked to one of America’s more celebrated gunmakers, are starting to worry about Remington’s future. The recent mass shootings at a screening of “The Dark Knight Rises” in Colorado and at a Sikh temple in Wisconsin have galvanized advocates of tougher gun laws in Albany, and Remington has made it clear that such laws could prompt it to leave New York for a more sympathetic state.

While elsewhere the debate over gun control includes talk of balancing constitutional rights with public safety, here residents are most concerned with a little-discussed element of the gun industry: economics.

Diana Bower, who owns a small engineering business with her husband, a onetime engineer at the Remington plant, said politicians pressing for new gun laws — many of them from New York City — did not realize what was at stake upstate. For example, company officials have said one proposal under consideration would require costly plant retooling.

“If you don’t live here and work here,” Ms. Bower said, “you really don’t know what it means to say, ‘Pass this,’ or, ‘Pass that.’ ”

And Rusty Brown, a furnace technician in the powdered-metal products division at the plant and a former president of its union, spells it out bluntly: “In my eyes, Remington goes away, Ilion goes away.”

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: banglist
Remington and its competitors are not lacking suitors: in recent years, a number of states, including Alabama, Montana and South Dakota, have sought to persuade gunmakers in the Northeast and Midwest to move their plants to parts of the country with less restrictive gun laws, and, in many cases, a culture that is friendlier toward guns.
1 posted on 08/24/2012 7:32:58 AM PDT by Second Amendment First
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To: Second Amendment First

Come on down to the Missouri Ozarks !
Low taxes, friendly people, turkey, deer, planty of fishing opportunities.
Did I mention low taxes ?


2 posted on 08/24/2012 7:40:09 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks (I didn't post this. Someone else did.)
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To: Second Amendment First
“I think it’s ridiculous for them to argue that [Remington] would leave New York,” said Jackie Hilly, the executive director of New Yorkers Against Gun Violence, a group that wants microstamping. “Look, frankly, if we really want to keep jobs in New York, let’s invest more money in yogurt,” she added, referring to one of the state’s growing industries.

Empty-headed, hippy-dippy, feel-good, moronic liberal barking moonbat.

3 posted on 08/24/2012 7:40:09 AM PDT by Lazamataz (Funny but creepy!)
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To: Second Amendment First

I thought Remington was headquartered in Lexington, KY for some reason? Is it just the Manufacturing that is in NY?

Somebody help here. I don’t have time to research it at the moment.

If Remington does move it’s manufacturing, don’t be surprised to see it go out of America. They have to weight the potential damage to the Remington Brand but could likely save a lot of money by outsourcing or moving the manufacturing out of the country.

It’s “just business” and our government doesn’t know the first thing about it.


4 posted on 08/24/2012 7:45:35 AM PDT by Tenacious 1 (The Click-&-Paste Media exists & works in Utopia, riding unicorns & sniffing pixy dust.)
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To: Tenacious 1
It's the original plant.

Remington, which has its headquarters in North Carolina, employs more than a thousand people at its Ilion plant, a complex of four-story brick buildings, some still with creaky wood floors, that are connected by passageways. The plant looks like a relic of the Industrial Revolution; from the outside, at least, little has changed since close to a century ago, when Remington expanded to meet the demand for firearms during World War I.

5 posted on 08/24/2012 7:47:21 AM PDT by Second Amendment First ("Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..." - Thomas Jefferson.)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

We will take Remington here in Texas as well. However, associated unions will have to stay back there in NY. Sorry, die-union people not wanted. But hey, no worries, Obama will take care of you, lol :)


6 posted on 08/24/2012 7:47:21 AM PDT by snoringbear (Government is the Pimp,)
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To: Second Amendment First

“Remington has made it clear that such laws could prompt it to leave New York for a more sympathetic state.”

Or they could move east to NH. Plenty of room here next to the Sig Sauer and Thompson Fire Arms factories. Lots of skilled labor here and no unions.


7 posted on 08/24/2012 7:48:08 AM PDT by woodbutcher1963
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To: Second Amendment First

I believe Remington would be welcome in Mississippi, I know I would welcome them. I have several Remington firearms and they are all well made and do what they are supposed to do. My oldest is an 1858 revolver one of my relatives brought home from the war. I also have an 870, 1100, 700, and a 552. My next firearm may be the Remington 1911 clone.


8 posted on 08/24/2012 7:54:55 AM PDT by duffee (Romney 2012, NEWT 2016)
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To: Second Amendment First
Remington has made it clear that such laws could prompt it to leave New York for a more sympathetic state.

Why aren't they ALREADY gone, given New York's proven animosity to guns and gun rights? How can a person or a company have any self respect and willing cooperate in the continued existence of those who hate and denigrate them and their product? Besides this New York case, the fact that New England and Illinois are centers of gun manufacturing is an outrage.

9 posted on 08/24/2012 8:02:03 AM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: Tenacious 1
If Remington does move it’s manufacturing, don’t be surprised to see it go out of America. They have to weight the potential damage to the Remington Brand but could likely save a lot of money by outsourcing or moving the manufacturing out of the country.

That's not as true as many people think it is, nor as true as it once was. With transportation costs rising with the price of petroleum, language barriers, QC at the other end of a 8,000 mile and 8 time zone pipe and so on, some manufacturers of high value, high quality items are bringing manufacturing back onshore.

10 posted on 08/24/2012 8:06:23 AM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: Second Amendment First

Remington should already be gone from New York and should offer no support to the agencies of any gun control state.


11 posted on 08/24/2012 8:06:23 AM PDT by Navy Patriot (Join the Democrats, it's not Fascism when WE do it, and the Constitution and law mean what WE say.)
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To: Lazamataz
Empty-headed, hippy-dippy, feel-good, moronic liberal barking moonbat.

Thanks Laz...needed a good laugh this morning, even tho it is Fried-day.

FMCDH(BITS)

12 posted on 08/24/2012 8:10:51 AM PDT by nothingnew (I fear for my Republic due to marxist influence in our government. Open eyes/see)
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To: Still Thinking

I can’t understand why Smith and Wesson stays in Massachusetts or Springfield Armory stays in Illinois either.


13 posted on 08/24/2012 8:15:58 AM PDT by jospehm20
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To: Still Thinking

Isn’t Springfield Armory headquartered in Illinois? Figure that one out.


14 posted on 08/24/2012 8:18:41 AM PDT by ponygirl (Be Breitbart.)
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To: jospehm20

SIG is in NH.

I always wondered why many gun makers are up north , hell I’ve always wondered why any business is up north having to deal with unions, taxes etc


15 posted on 08/24/2012 8:34:08 AM PDT by manc (Marriage =1 man + 1 woman,when they say marriage equality then they should support polygamy)
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To: jospehm20

“....or Springfield Armory stays in Illinois either.”

Les Baer, a mgfr of high quality 1911 pistols and AR rifles, moved his company out of Ill. into Iowa several years ago.


16 posted on 08/24/2012 8:34:51 AM PDT by Forty-Niner (The barely bare, berry bear formerly known as..........Ursus Arctos Horribilis.)
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To: jospehm20

SIG is in NH.

I always wondered why many gun makers are up north , hell I’ve always wondered why any business is up north having to deal with unions, taxes etc


17 posted on 08/24/2012 8:47:46 AM PDT by manc (Marriage =1 man + 1 woman,when they say marriage equality then they should support polygamy)
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To: Still Thinking

It is NYC that is the problem. Once you cross the Tappenzee Bridge going north out of NYC, the state is far more conservative and normal. It is gun-friendly, too, outside of the cities. Upstate NY is an example of what happens when socialist governments (that of NYC) run things. The economy of upstate NY is miserable and the industries are museums of pre-1960 America. The NYC financial industry is what enables continuance of this situation. The dominant mill, transportation, and manufacturing industrial engines of upstate NY are no longer.


18 posted on 08/24/2012 9:28:12 AM PDT by iacovatx (Conservatism is the political center--it is not "right" of center)
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To: Tenacious 1

Remington wouldn’t go overseas because there are too many issues getting the guns back into the US. But nobody has mentioned NY trade unions. There has already been gun maker traffic away fron closed shop states ( Winchester left Conn. for ex.) Ruger has always had an edge being in AZ. While the government attitude in NY is bad enough I have expected for quite some time that Remington’s brain trust will take any more stupid gov’t action as an excuse to pack the whole thing up. My friends in the gun business won’t put up with stupid gov’t stuff for long. It’s not guns but it’s close and similar-—Buck knives bailed out of CA a few years ago and moved to NIdaho. Colt hasn’t moved yet but has indeed farmed out most, if not all, actual manufacturing to other places. Just keep waiting for the hammers to drop and all it takes is a litle state sponsored stupidity but you are watching a major re-configuring of most US manufacturing. And file this for future reference: the USA now has more gun manufacturers than ever and nearly all of the new ones are in non-union states.


19 posted on 08/24/2012 1:20:10 PM PDT by cherokee1 (skip the names---just kick the buttz)
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To: jospehm20

Both companies do most of the actual work out of state. S&W has always done much fabrication in Brazil (Bangor Punta) And commercial SA also uses Brazil and other places. It’s been awhile since I’ve been to either office but I expect all you’ll find at either place now is a chick answering the phone.


20 posted on 08/24/2012 1:26:01 PM PDT by cherokee1 (skip the names---just kick the buttz)
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To: manc

I am in NH sort of.. SIG is non-union, NH is not too bad on taxes and the work force is highly educated. Still hands off for the most part


21 posted on 08/24/2012 2:36:56 PM PDT by Article10 (Roger That)
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To: cherokee1

Not really, I do engineering consulting with Sig and S&W,the majority of the firearms for both companies are made in the US of A at there plants. SIG is moving to a huge facility in Portsmouth in the next 2-3 months to 3x there capcity. no chick answering a phone there dude. Yes vendors but mostly in the US with SIG being more for mims parts from outside the US.

SIG moved all but a small amount of manufacturing out of Switzerland and Germany to NH.

S&W makes just about everything in the US, very little comes from overseas.

Same with Ruger

All of them have vendors from around the US with a ton of them being in New England still


22 posted on 08/24/2012 2:43:52 PM PDT by Article10 (Roger That)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

Yeh or try Washington County Missouri. Lots of bitter clingers here.

One of the poorest counties in the state. We have plenty of room and plenty of people happy to get a job and not have to drive an hour or more to work.

When the mining areas shut down, our main industry was devestated. Bring the whole town(except for the liberals).


23 posted on 08/24/2012 4:15:50 PM PDT by greeneyes (Moderation in defense of your country is NO virtue. Let Freedom Ring.)
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To: Second Amendment First

Ya’ll move right down here to Georgia! The Atlanta area is just fine.


24 posted on 08/24/2012 6:56:44 PM PDT by GingisK
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To: Article10
SIG moved all but a small amount of manufacturing out of Switzerland and Germany to NH.

Really? You mean production for both US and European markets? If so, awesome!

25 posted on 08/24/2012 7:26:39 PM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: greeneyes
When the mining areas shut down, our main industry was devestated.

What was mined there?

26 posted on 08/24/2012 7:27:57 PM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: Tenacious 1

Remington has firearms plants in Ilion, New York and Hickory, Kentucky (extreme western part of the state), their ammo and component plant is in Lonoke, Arkansas (just outside Little Rock), and their R&R/technical facility is in Elizabethtown, Kentucky (about two miles from where I’m sitting right now).


27 posted on 08/24/2012 7:37:00 PM PDT by Stonewall Jackson ("I must study politics and war that my sons may have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy.")
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To: Still Thinking

Tiff and lead not sure what else


28 posted on 08/24/2012 7:50:12 PM PDT by greeneyes (Moderation in defense of your country is NO virtue. Let Freedom Ring.)
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To: greeneyes

What’s “tiff”?


29 posted on 08/24/2012 7:52:55 PM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: Still Thinking

Global market..... in a true sense .


30 posted on 08/24/2012 8:07:46 PM PDT by Article10 (Roger That)
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To: Still Thinking

Barite. I didn’t grow up here, so I don’t really know much about the mining industry really. I know that some have called the people here “tiff diggers”.

Lots of old mining land around that people use to ride horses around in. The mines are finally starting to sell off some of it - pretty cheap.

Dresser Minerals was one of the last companies to pull out. Most of the mining companies were already gone before we moved here. Dresser, Pea Ridge, and St Joe are the only ones I really heard about.


31 posted on 08/24/2012 8:16:05 PM PDT by greeneyes (Moderation in defense of your country is NO virtue. Let Freedom Ring.)
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To: jospehm20

Used to work with a guy that has some type of family connection to Springfield. According to him, Chicago and Springfield are where all the anti-gun noise comes from. Apparently the rest of the state is actually very pro-gun, but those two cities have all the pull in the state. See:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/23/illinois-concealed-carry-_0_n_1824269.html?utm_hp_ref=chicago

And S&W isn’t much different. Their plant is in Western Mass, far away from Boston and Menino. Western Mass, outside of the college towns, has a bit of a conservative streak. Again, the state is run by the big cities.


32 posted on 08/24/2012 8:23:20 PM PDT by qaz123
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To: greeneyes

Interesting — thank you! Free Republic is awesome. You learn new stuff on here all the time!


33 posted on 08/24/2012 9:40:40 PM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: qaz123

But it doesn’t really matter. If the cesspits of liberalism in a given state are populous enough that they form an electoral majority, they pass laws and still expect you to obey them even though you live or work in a sane part of the state. How is that a winning proposition?


34 posted on 08/24/2012 9:43:36 PM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: Still Thinking

Its not. Probably more like a shining example of the squeaky wheel, getting the oil. They are the loudest and most in your face, so they get their way so they’ll just STFU. Only thing, they never shut up.


35 posted on 08/24/2012 10:34:59 PM PDT by qaz123
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To: qaz123

Exactly. If the game has been rigged so that you can’t win, yet your cooperation is needed to keep the game going and they demand you give it, what self-respecting choice do you have but to opt out and go join or start another game?


36 posted on 08/24/2012 11:07:41 PM PDT by Still Thinking (Freedom is NOT a loophole!)
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To: Still Thinking
mining for "tiff", as barite is called locally

BARITE SPECIMEN LOCALITIES

37 posted on 08/25/2012 3:40:04 AM PDT by Dust in the Wind (U S Troops Rock)
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