Skip to comments.NYPD: 9 shooting bystander victims hit by police gunfire
Posted on 08/25/2012 1:50:12 PM PDT by servo1969
NEW YORK All nine people wounded during a dramatic confrontation between police and a gunman outside the Empire State Building were struck by bullets fired by the two officers, police said Saturday, citing ballistics evidence.
The veteran patrolmen who opened fire on the suit-wearing gunman, Jeffrey Johnson, had only an instant to react when he whirled and pointed a .45-caliber pistol as they approached him from behind on a busy sidewalk.
Officer Craig Matthews shot seven times. Officer Robert Sinishtaj fired nine times, police said. Neither had ever fired their weapons before on a patrol.
The volley of gunfire felled Johnson in just a few seconds and left nine other people bleeding on the sidewalk.
(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...
And they say we mere untrained civilians are not qualified to carry firearms.
I’m no marksman but on a scale of 1 to 10 how do these officers rate ?
What a load.
The guy didn't look like he could shoot his way out of a wet paper bag. When he drew his piece, he was holding it just above waist level, and kind of pointing it, instead of aiming it, and he was sort of limp-wristed about it, too.
The cops lost it.
Sounds like New York’s finest could use some brushing up on the use of deadly force.
Seven and nine shots? What happened to the “double tap”? Or even two center body-mass and one to the head if the first two don’t drop the target? Is this not taught in police academies any more?
I assume everyone involved was white. Otherwise it would have been construed as a racist incident.
A 2, and they should be at least a 6 or a 7 to be carrying in a heavily populated area.
These guys over reacted and panicked and they cost NINE people serious wounds and a great deal of pain. So much for everyday hero's.
16 shots hitting 9 moving targets...
those are some mad skillz
The salient point: they were 8 feet from him and hit 9 other people.
About a minus 3 or 4.
Definitely a panic shoot with nary an ounce of stress-fire training.
Trillions of dollars into “homeland” security and buttoning down NYC and this is an end result of the quality of performance training.
Sleep well America.
Go ahead - flame away.
If you’ve ever had the occasion to shoot any living thing, let alone a human, unless you can turn the lights out with one in the brainpan, the target simply does not instantly stop most times.
However.......from eight feet and wounding nine others...
Of course NY cops I bet are almost never exposed to stress such as scenario based IDPA, IPSC - USPSA type action shooting.
Unless they have been actively involved in combat, IDPA, IPSC or USPSA a once a year static qualification on a stationary paper target is woefully inadequate - as the results in this shooting have demonstrated.
8 ft.? Really? WOW! Sounds to me like they were just ducking, dodging and pulling the crap out of their triggers!
this guy wasn’t there to train those silly civilians
16 rounds fired with 10 bullet wounds to Johnson and 9 other people hit by bullets or fragments. 19 hits (at least) for 16 shots is pretty darn efficient. < /s>
NYPD fired 41 shots at unarmed Amadou Diallo...
As I said on an earlier thread, those folks who got shot should be glad the cops were using 9mm’s instead of 45’s.
One of the NRA’s four basic rules of gun safety is to know your target and what’s beyond. I find is tragically sad that the police - of all people - did not follow this very important rule.
Three bystanders were admitted to hospitals with direct gunshot wounds. Bullets were removed from two of the victims, implying the third had a through wound.
"Police officials have said the officers appeared to have no choice but to shoot Johnson, whose body had 10 bullet wounds in the chest, arms and legs."
This should be mandatory viewing by any one who carries.
The late Col. Jeff Cooper USMC retired.
The two officers were protégés of trainer/director Sam Peckinpah.
...19 of which struck Diallo.
If they're now getting 19 hits from 16 shots, the NYPD's percentages are much better today! 46.3% versus 118.7%!
I thought the cops did not do too badly, considering they were confronting an armed man at close range who had just murdered a man.
Most people miss when shooting in a gunfight. These officers did better than average. From the video, it appears to me that the closest officer probably got most of the hits. He is shooting two handed, is closer, and seems more focused. The officer who is farther away is retreating and firing one handed. He does not seem as focused.
All three participants are moving. Shooting while moving is difficult.
To me, it appears to be suicide by cop.
All that and you didn’t once mention the 9 who were hit by the police. If I did that to defend myself, I would be charged with some damn crime by the DA.
“...this is an end result of the quality of performance training...”
Unfortunately, that was probably never one of DHS’ real and measurable objectives. Was such a document ever made public? I honestly don’t remember.
Good grief - I'm an ole great granny - tooka CC class a couple weeks ago - hadn't shot but about 10 rounds the week before - for over 50 years -
Shot 2 10-round clips with a pistol I'd never touched before - and was further away than these cops were. One round jammed - got off 19 shots. ALL on target - all would've been in 'critical mass." 8 in the center green circle,
geeze - I hope these officers are given some intensive range time - with moving targets.
Many other people were mentioning that. Doing so again did not seem to add to the discussion.
I do not expect perfection. Could they have done better? Probably, but it is easy to criticize after the fact. I do not know that I would have done better. I am told that you never know until it happens to you.
Maybe its time we got guns off the street by taking them away from the police.
They can still defend themselves within the confines of the police station as long as they lock up their guns separately from the ammo.
>> 9 shooting bystander victims hit by police gunfire
9 victims hit by police gunfire shot the bystander.
ahahahah - best laugh of the day! Thanks for the link!
moral: don’t mess with Grammas -
Sounds like the Keystone Cops to me....
It was a defensible shoot, but not a good one. Poor marksmanship most likely stemming from lousy training.
I guess NYPD has never heard of IDPA?
Anyone know what type of ammo NYPD uses?
Explains why uncle Sam is buying 1 billion rounds of 9 mm ammo for their paramilitary forces...
No idea about the ammo but they use NY triggers which have a harder pull.
To counter the billion rounds us civilians are buying.
This is liberals for you. They call our “one shot one kill” operations abroad as baby killing, but it is OK to have their cops pray and spray on US civilians.
It’s why the British do not let their cops carry guns. When you have an army of cops, you cannot manage their professionalism with guns. It’s too expensive and they are too career oriented and completely gay for city hall. They could care less about bystanders, and that is the Bloomberg philosophy for gun control.
Yep, they shoot in the air worse than hadji.
No, cops are told that they need to empty the whole magazine so they can later cover their arses in court, crying to the judge: “I was so scared, I kept shooting”. If they do not like emotional shooters in court, it apparently makes them cold blooded killers in court. So, there goes...
“To counter the billion rounds us civilians are buying.”
Correction, To counter the billion rounds us civilians are buying to add to the already one hundred billion rounds had by us civilized citizens.
Now, in case you think that is an exaggeration, do the math...there are 300 million people in this country. That one hundred billion rounds is only 333 rounds per person, and if one third of ‘we the people’ are armed, that is an army of one hundred million with only 1,000 rounds each. So lets say that only fifty million of we the people are armed, that is only 2,000 rounds each...before we buy more.
We the people use that for plinking, practice and hunting every year...if we are ‘slackers’.
“Sounds like New Yorks finest could use some brushing up on the use of deadly force.”
I saw the security video and it looks like they DID hit him in the head at least once...could the bullets have then ricocheted or fragmented and struck the bystanders?
I suggest the lawyers for those maimed will sue for MILLIONS!! and will include Bloombutt, personnaly, for negligent supervision!! This is a disaster for New York city. BloomButt is directly involved and is a liar in my opinion.!!
I guess the Imperial Stormtrooper Marksmanship Academy has lost another client.