Skip to comments.What would have FDR done if the nazi thugs had breached the US embassy in 1939, in Berlin?
Posted on 09/12/2012 9:01:29 PM PDT by DallasBiff
IMO, FDR would have joined Churchill, immediately in fighting Hitler.
Biff. Pick up a copy of “Before the Deluge” about the chaos in Berlin in the runup to the war.
It takes more than a single event.
Well since we helped put the current Libyan government in power we would have had to help overthrown the German Weimer government with bombs to make your analogy work.
It doesn't deal with Roosevelt's penchant for the ladies, but with the internal incompetence of his Presidency. Not as salacious, but more interesting if one is interested in the behind the scenes of an administration.
If it had been Stalinists killing thousands of Polish leaders, he would have helped them cover their crime.
What makes you thing that the “Nazi thugs” (of undetermined nationality, as the term ‘Nazi’ preferred by the Soviets always implies) would do it? Your premise is wrong, wrong! Europe and her customs is not, has not been a barbarian land!
Please cite a historical precedent for what happened.
Read it years ago and have copies, great book and a real eyeopener on Roosevelt.
The isolationists, which then included most of the Republicans, wouldn’t have let FDR act in 1939, although he probably would have wanted to. He had to repeatedly promise to keep us out of the war during the 1940 election campaign, just as Wilson did during the 1916 one. It took a lot to bring the country around.
And FDR did nothing.
No, I don’t think so.
In ‘39, we were woefully unprepared. FDR was biding his time, ramping up war materiel production, playing for time.
We could have jumped into the fracas in ‘39. We could have jumped in in 1940. We could have jumped in earlier in ‘41.
The American mindset following the stupidity of our entry into WWI was highly, highly isolationist. We were still in the Depression, and the American attitude was “We’ll take care of our issues, leave Europe to Europeans.”
This is why FDR waited until Pearl Harbor to get the US involved.
More interesting is, now that we have our first “October Surprise” of the election season a few weeks early, what will the next one be? There must be several of these in store.
Islamist groveling : done (4 dead)
Some other possibilities.
War between Israel and Iran - coming soon
Chicago strike —
QE and financial meltdown — wrecked economy
Some immigration thingy—
Storyboard to be drafted soon.
This is what the MSM does - equates savage hordes of today’s barbarians with other disasters of history. “Nazi thugs”, whatever their crimes (which occurred long after 1938) did not murder ambassadors, case closed.
The American Ambassador to Berlin was murdered? Who knew?
Another book that I would recommend is, "The Forgotten Man".
Did we help to install the Nazis into power?
That’s the big difference, we helped the very people that did this.
The thugs were running in the street with government approval(nazi krystalnacht), aka modern day Egypt and Libya, IMO.
Unlikely, FDR's purpose was to promote Communist Socialism over Fascist Socialism.
He would not get strident until Hitler turned on his mentors, the Soviet Communists and attacked Stalin and Soviet Russia.
It would be 1941.
The thing is: As bat $#!t crazy as Hitler was, he wasn’t THAT stupid. He wouldn’t have wanted us in the war that early.
I’m guessing right about now that you probably wish you had asked this question of the morons that infest the E Channel forum posting about Kim, Khloe and Kourtney as opposed to FR.
Heck at that point, despite Von Ribbentrop’s deep Anglophobia, he still thought he could make a deal with Britain.
And I still suspect it was Hitler that ordered Hess to fly to Britain to try to negotiate a peace treaty.
In the book titled “A Man Called Enigma”, FDR wanted in on WWII before Congress did. Notice that, when Japan attacked Pearl Harbor, FDR declared war on Germany, NOT Japan.
And, to get American manufacturers ready for the war, FDR started Lend-Lease.
Oh, yeah, FDR knew it was just a matter of time.
I don’t have many issues with FDR regarding his handling of the war, except for his sellout of the Poles.
It was naive to think that Hitler didn’t have designs on the one country that after the annihilation of European Jews, would have contained the majority of the remaining Jews on the planet, why go through all of the trouble of getting rid of European Jews, if he ultimately didn’t intend on taking the rest of the Jews on US soil?
The point is that some savage tribes, those that have had to learn to exist alongside other savage tribes, friend and foe, have had to learn to observe some minimum diplomatic protocol, such as not killing and eating representatives of other tribes. However, the Muslim tribe, a billion member tribe at that, feeling its strength and observing its Koranic theology, does not appear to recognize or observe any inter-tribe rules, perhaps because it hasn’t had to, has it!
Sure, why not. He made the pact with Stalin to buy time. Of course it gave Stalin time to consolidate his forces.
Churchill would have never gone for it. He knew the evil that was in play.
And as an American president, FDR, did nothing about krystallnacht in 1938, another American president, Obama, is doing the same.
You are correct.
Without the benefit of hindsight, what would you have had FDR do regarding Germany after Krystallnacht?
Mind you, at that time, while people were generally appalled by Germany’s treatment of Jews, it wasn’t so far out of line with many other parts of Europe, anti-semitism was pretty rampant all across the continent, even outside of Nazi Germany.
Of course with the war, it got much, much worse.
It was Premier Neville Chamberlain's government that declared war on Nazi Germany. Churchill came to power in the spring of 1940.
He could have declared war, but it still would have taken several years till we would have been battle ready.
Of course, on the other hand, it certainly would have given Hitler pause. And frankly, at least at that point, Hitler wasn’t insane enough to think of provoking the US.
You are correct, and I am sorry, about the historical mistake.
But the question remains, what would FDR have done if the American embassy in Berlin had been breached in 1939, by nazi brownshirt, ss, thugs.
That's me. I will look that book up. thanks.
He rounded up hundreds of thousands of Germans AND Japaneses Americans and put them in Internment camps,
Then he firebombed a civilian city- Dresden.
He was a war criminal.
Depriving Americans of their liberty in a time of war was a crime against the Constitution. Firebombing Dresden was waging war on a nation who had declared war on us. I’m sick and tired of people moaning about what happened to Dresden. You want war crimes? The Luftwaffe bombing Warsaw, Rotterdam and Coventry were war crimes. As for Dresden- tough sh!t.
In The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, I think it’s made clear that even as late as 1939 Hitler didn’t think very much of FDR or American strength and wouldn’t have cared enough to attack our embassy. He didn’t think we’d enter the war and if we did wouldn’t make much of a difference.
FDR would have blamed BUSH, too!
Prescott Bush, that is.
War was declared against Japan by act of congress on December 8, 1941 and declared on Germany and Italy on December 11, 1941, only after Germany declared war on us. Isolationism and anti Semitic prejudices were strong in the USA and would have made any response against Krystallnacht politically impossible and FDR was always a politician. Many Southern Democrats were intensely racist and anti Semitic. Sam Rayburn and Theodore Bilbo were architects of the new deal.
According to Joe Biden, When the Nazis breached the US Embassy, Franklin D. Roosevelt got on the television and didnt just talk about the, you know, the Nazi thugs. He said, Look, heres what happened.
a little history for you.
Japanese of all types (Nisei, Ishi, etc, citizens, resident aliens, pro-Tojo) and interned, about 120,000. Many were not bothered at all to our citizens credit.
Germans (aliens), German-Americans, Bundists, etc. rounded up, in US, between 5-8,000 plus several thousand in Latin America.
NOT HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS.
Six US fliers bailed out over Germany and were brutally killed by German civilians (mainly rural farmers using pitchforks).
In retaliation, a US bomber squadron, who was unable to hit their primary target, wiped a German fishing village off the face of the earth. Big fucking deal.
My family was murdered in Lvov, Belzec and Auschwitz.
I’m just sorry we didn’t have more nukes to use on the 2 million Japanese troops who committed genocide against our Chinese allies, American, British, Commonwealth troops, and the one million Philippino civilians they wantonly killed.
Bataan Death March. Unit 731.
The enemy deserved everything they got, which was not enough.
No apologies except for not being able to kill several more million of these Axis bastards.
I’m currently reading a book about Count Ciano, Mussolini’s bro-in-law and foreign minister. He hated the Nazis but of course gleaned a lot of info from them about Hitler’s thoughts and actions. According to Ciano, Hitler didn’t think Britain and France would help Poland, and he thought the U.S. would stay out of the war. In fact, Hitler was wrong about virtually everything he thought wouldn’t happen as regards WWII. Ciano was eventually dismissed by Il Duce and later shot by a firing squad before the end of the war.
I’m sorry... Ciano was Il Duce’s son-in-law, not bro-in-law.
Factually inaccurate. We declared war on Japan Dec. 8 and three days later war on Germany. That's only because Germany first declared war on us.
On December 8, 1941, FDR asked Congress to declare war on Japan. The war with Germany and Italy came three days later when those countries declared war on the United States.
Yes, that's an interesting question.
In April, 1939, FDR sent Hitler a rather naive telegram essentially asking him not to invade a number of territories that he listed, ranging from Ireland to Iran. Using an ironic tone of voice, Hitler read it to the Reichstag, or diet, the German legislature, which by that time consisted solely of Nazis, and they burst out laughing.
Suppose, following the speech, a mob of "angry citizens" just happened to show up at the embassy and storm it, resulting in the loss of life of American personnel. My speculation would be that FDR would have demanded an apology and an indemnity, as he did after the Panay incident of December, 1937, when Japanese air and naval forces in China sank an American warship. An inadequate response would have led to a breach in diplomatic relations and maybe even war.
Great! Thank you for taking an interest.
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