Also, this isn’t new. It happened under Bush too.
It’s Beirut 1983 all over again.
The marines should have tossed her a** in the street as a human shield.
Organizationally, they work under the direction of a State Department Regional Security Officer who is in the Administrative Section and works for the Management/Admin officer. Everyone at the Embassy is under the authority of the Ambassador.
The MSG posts at an Embassy are behind bulletproof windows and doors, aka, the secure perimeter. The MSG's control access to the offices and spaces behind the secure perimeter. They literally buzz in visitors and locally engaged employees so they can access the various offices in the Embassy. American employees have access codes that can allow them to get thru the bulletproof doors. All visitors without security clearances including FSNs are escorted.
The primary duties of the MSGs are to secure classified equipment and materials and depending on the circumstances, protection of the facilities and personnel.
Contract guards and host country security personnel are responsibile for protecting the perimeter of the Embassy and screening visitors entering the compound or building outside the secure perimeter. They also screen all vehicles entering the compound and control vehicle access barriers. The RSO and MSGs coordinate their efforts with the contract guards and host country security personnel. Located in the MSG posts is a battery of TV monitors that allow them to monitor what is going on.
The ROE are usually set by the RSO in conjunction with the Department of State and the Ambassador. From my experience, the MSGs are armed with revolvers with bullets. In case of a major event like a breech of the perimeter, the MSGs activate an all-hands alarm, which includes getting more serious weaponry like rifles and donning bulletproof vests and helmets.
Normally, according to the Embassy Action Plan, the Marines will seek to secure the buildings and get everyone behind the secure perimeter. They would not be trying to shoot people coming over the walls or thru the gates. They are there to buy time until the host country can respond to the event and to provide sufficient time, if deemed necessary, to destroy classified material and equipment.
I find it hard to believe that the MSGs are not allowed to carry loaded revolvers. That has always been my experience and I used to be the person the RSOs reported to. Normally, the ROE on the use of deadly force will usually be limited to protecting one's own life or others who are in immediate danger. It is truly the last resort because of the ramifications it might entail with the host government, which is tasked with providing security for the Embassy or Consulate. There is no way the order would be given to shoot someone who is unarmed scaling a wall or taking down a flag.
Being familiar with the Embassy compound in Cairo, it primarily consists of two tall tower buildings, each one occupying a footprint about the size of a baseball diamond. The perimeter wall incorporates office space, e.g, consular facilities, so that people applying for visas don't gain access to the main compound. Consular facilites are hardened to protect consular employees. The Ambassador's residence is at the top of one of the two towers, i.e., penthouse type apartment. There is parking under the compound.
Again, I find it hard to believe that the MSGs would not be allowed to carry revolvers with bullets in them. Admittedly, it would be hard to use them since the MSG is inside the secure perimeter in a bullet proof booth. There have been occasional problems with Marines discharging their weapons accidentially inside the guard booths, but I don't find that to be something that would require that MSGs be disarmed.
I would not jump the gun on this report until it was better sourced. I retired some time ago, but I doubt things have changed that much in terms of security. And I find it very difficult to believe that an Ambassador would overrule an RSO or the Bureau of Diplomatic Security in terms of the ROE. So if such a rule is in place, it is coming from Washington, not the post.
Hudson: Is he f*%#in' crazy?
Frost: What the hell are we supposed to use man? Harsh language?
Sure not the same military that I proudly served for 26 years. DADT gone, security details not allowed to carry ammo, Chairman of Joint Chiefs calling private citizen to try to censor comments, Commander-In-Chief bowing to foreign leaders and apologizing for insulting those who wish to destroy us, and on and on. Tears running down my cheeks.
Relying on terrorists to protect your embassy personnel? No doubt Obama is an ass.
I would also like to enter a big Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.
Assumptions & Unknowns:
- Marines may or may have not been stationed in Bengazi; although always found in Embassies, some consulates do others do not depending on the country and Marine numbers available
- Marines may or may have not been escorting Ambassador Stevens when he was murdered; if they where they may or not may have been armed
Facts:
- Marines are under the supervision and control of the RSO (State Dept Security employee bureaucrat) at every US Embassy across the world who in turn works for the Ambassador
- Ambassadors can and often do mandate who in the Embassy can/cannot carry loaded weapons in country or hold weapons and ammo in their spaces to include DoD military Attaches, FBI LEGATT, DEA, DHS and others
- Extremely bad security conditions (criminal or terrorist) sometimes force Ambassadors to acquiesce and allow only trained personnel under unique circumstances (military & Federal agents of all sorts) to store, maintain and/or sometimes carry loaded weapons in country
Worst case scenario: If he had Marine escort when murdered, Ambassador Stevens likely did not allow his Marines to carry loaded weapons to prevent any Libyans from ever being injured or killed and avoid political heat. I have seen this rationale used in many places and I think it is borne of State Dept corporate distrust of trained young Marines with loaded weapons in volatile situations. The lack of any reports related to dead or injured perps who attacked the Consulate in Bengazi lead me to this conclusion until corroborated or disproved by credible sources; sad.
Regards
Tell her to “Go to Hell”.
Holy. F***ing. S**t.
What is WRONG with this Administration!??
Quickly going through Patterson’s bio it looks like she’s been around the block a few times. I’m not sure it was her that made the directive, I think it came from higher up, being Hillary or Barry Junior. Gonna bet on Hillary though given it was probably her that talked Bill into banning live ammo on military bases.
The USMC generals were LTs when the so-called Marine Corps barracks in Beirut was blown up, by a truck driver who ran over unarmed (no mags in rifles) guards.
This is even worse. The state dept would rather have dead Marines and ambassadors, then risk a “flap” not under their direct control.
Better that people die, than that loss of control.
Why have a military presence in an embassy if they can’t carry a weapon. That in and of itself is sheer ignorance. Better to put the liberal apology tour in those places. See how fast they can talk their way out of being sodomized, impaled and beheaded by the barbarians.
I have been awake nearly all of three days now except for catnaps following every detail of this madness. I have gritted my teeth so hard at times, one actually chipped. We are seeing outright treason from the man who ascended by fraud to decapitate the USA. He has done a damn fine job of it.
obama and his minions are a scourge on this earth. If there was any justice, the earth would open up and swallow them all.
Obviously failed History the first time, but now the entire class will have to repeat the course...
“Hey, what the hell are we supposed to use, man? Harsh language?” #Aliens #Frost
That koran burning minister should give Dempsey a ring back and ask him to stop endangering our soldiers by putting them in jihadiland as guards with no means of self defense.
This is outrageous. When the US military sees a mob of murderous jihadists storming US terrority (while chanting they are all Osamas), that is a target rich environment. Bullets and bombs are needed.