Skip to comments.What A Self professed Moderate Believes (Hold Your Nose)
Posted on 09/30/2012 8:23:03 PM PDT by robowombat
These are my very sincere personal reasons for having no current intention to vote for Mr. Romney in November. I post this because I 'went off' at another thread because of my love for OUR country and contentions there by a Poster still that our President is a Muslim and supporter of the Muslim Brotherhood. That level of absurd rhetoric and direct lying continues to create Divides instead of Common Grounds, and totally on purpose. That is not acceptable in a free country.
In stating these, I preface by saying quite clearly that I do not believe at ALL that the Democratic Party has all, or even necessarily most, of the right, or optimum answers, policies, or ideas.
But I demand cooperation and compromise, and see, still, absolutely no desire,even, from the GOP for compromise. That is arrogant, especially with the recent track record during the prior 2 GOP Administrations. The Parties need each other, period, because it is well proven that NEITHER has the optimum answers alone.
When that becomes clear to All, we will move forward again...together.
1.We are in wartime. We are normally very averse to changing leadership during wartime. Given the extreme nature of certain elements of the GOP and the history of Mr. Bush, I see nothing at all 'better' about Mr. Romney internationally and am impressed with the rise in our international 'status' again under Mr. Obama and I approve of his actions in Pakistan re Bin Laden, in Libya, and in staying out of Syria for now. I'm not certain how I feel about Afghanistan and I am perfectly ready and willing to continue to listen to all pleas and plans for more immediate withdrawal from there.
Our current President has built and re-built international relationships absolutely obliterated by the Bush Administration. I have no reason to believe Mr. Romney will continue that nor any reason to change from the President whose Admin has accomplished that in a rather remarkably short timeframe given that our international approval rating was at its lowest ever by 2008.
Whether some of you like it or not, that international cooperation is absolutely essential in the modern global world and will become absolutely more essential in the coming years. The days of 1950 are over; the U.S. cannot choose its own path only, world-wide. Cooperation is required if for no other reason than that we cannot DO IT alone.
2.The base of the GOP has always been its Moderates, a 'center-right' leaning, if you will. And that is the base for which I voted until 2004. However, the extreme elements of the GOP that have arisen in the past dozen years and seem to be getting worse, are the most harmful elements in the United States to our own future. Again, these are all my OPINIONS, not to be blasted as 'socialist' or any other label or term.
Note that I did not say that many things the tea party (when it becomes a party, the words get capitalized) is trumpeting are wrong; it is their approach and methods and expressed hatreds that I denounce. It is not proper, fair, nor accurate to continue to label our President as a 'socialist'. Neither he nor the Democratic Party are 'the enemy'.
While of course these groups are not supported by most of the GOP voters, it IS documented fact that the violence created by extremist groups such as white supremacists is on the rise; literally those groups have risen in number a few hundred times over what they were and those groups number far more variety than merely white supremacists.
This should upset and frighten all of us, given what we all see elsewhere in the world when violence erupts inside a country.
Violence within our own Country against our own Citizens is not a Solution, and does count as treasonous behavior, and suggestions of revolution and the rise in these violent groups can generally be traced to those we all would call 'right-wing' extremists. Those are not elements from the thinking of the Democratic Party, which is certainly not 'right-wing'. Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck are hate-mongers who fit into this element.
3.Compromise is the key to our government working. The GOP has refused, far more than the Democrats, to cooperate at all for the past 4 years, and Mr. McConnell's statement remains in bold-face type in many Citizens' minds, that the major goal of the GOP from 2008-2012 was to insure that Mr. Obama is a one-term President. He and his Party have certainly followed that credo for 4 years, paralyzing our government, all while offering nothing of substance in counterpoint, merely anti-Democratic rhetoric.
4.Health Care Reform has long been needed in this country. Costs are too high, and pre-existing conditions prevented coverage before for millions of Americans, among other ills of the past system.
Hillary Clinton (her political party is of NO importance here!) was squashed like a bug in 1992 when she initiated health care reform efforts and that squashing was not led by the Democrats. Nothing happened for reform in the Bush years, 2000-2008. And then the GOP absolutely and totally refused to even discuss the matter, even though the current reform includes many of the GOP's own thoughts from the past and even after Mr. Obama offered to take the entire PLAN off the table and engage in PUBLIC discussions.
The GOP refused. That shows no desire for cooperation and no concern with health care reform that was required and still is. The facts are that literally millions of Americans are now receiving care they would not have received before. It boggles my mind that so many seem to ignore that.
I am not at ALL saying I believe that 'government control' or mandates re health care is my method of choice, but something had to be done, and something was done, despite the GOP.
Could it/would it be better if there had been cooperation from the GOP? Undoubtedly.
5.The financial bailouts have had varying degrees of success/failure, to date. However, Detroit is quite happy and so is the U.S. auto industry, at least. The banks and financial institutions continue to run somewhat amok; I am not willing to have them sink on the 'principle' that the Federal Government should not become involved when its citizens need help. Again, something had to be done, and something was done, again over the refusal of the GOP to help.
Would cooperation and compromise, again, have led to better solutions? Quite likely, sure.
6.I am very much impressed and happy when leaders from either Party show flexibility; however, Mr. Romney's very clear history is one of what, IMHO, must be characterized more as 'waffling' than flexible, i.e. blowing with the political wind rather than him being a man of certain convictions.
7.Taxation Laws in this country are arcane, confusing, slanted, and ridiculous. We all know that. Yes, I am an advocate of a simple, flat tax and (speaking of smaller government) essentially the total elimination of the Internal Revenue Service and all the infernal sub-groups that spend wasted employment doing nothing productive, but merely adminstrating a system that can be stream-lined quite easily and needs to be..... but that is not important here.
What is important is that those below the level of 'rich' continue to pay a higher percentage of their wages and income in taxes than the rich do. This clearly robs us all of billions of dollars in tax revenue. The Rich and their unfair tax breaks are being supported by the GOP.
Simply put, it is not in ANY way 'fair and equitable' to have lower tax rates for those who make more money and income!
I see absolutely no reason for the cap on Social Security contributions at $110,000 income, and removal of that cap would generate more BILLIONS in revenue to SAVE that Social Security system, but, again, that is another issue.
But the GOP staunchly refuses to even discuss taxing the wealthy at a higher, fairer rate than currently. This to me is absurd, and the 'investment in business will go down' argument is poppycock perpetrated by the Rich who unfairly and greedily wish to have more, more, more with no concern that Others get less when that happens.
The TRUE base of our country, the 'working people', are squeezed more and more and more every year, and this is neither fair nor anything but disastrous for the future.
8.Energy...this Nation needs to become energy-independent. I have seen far more efforts from the Democratic Party than the GOP to attempt to make this happen. The very philosophies of the GOP seem far more 'in bed' with Big Oil and I have not agreed at all with most GOP positions in terms of their non-efforts toward solar, wind, and nuclear power, let alone ethanol. All they have produced is empty rhetoric while deflecting any and all actual concrete efforts to create new energy sources here that can and will provide new jobs HERE.
I reluctantly agree to more oil-drilling within our own territories; however, I want a cap on that drilling based on a very clear PLAN to wean us eventually from oil, also, but the FIRST priority, IMHO, is to become independent, so if that requires some more drilling here, I will live with that temporarily in order to achieve the first priority which is energy independence.
Once that happens, the Middle East can do as it wishes over there, and we have no further reasons for troops, lives, and monies to be wasted there.
We must become independent and that has never been something touted and worked for by the GOP. I shall leave it to Others to speculate as to how much if any of that refusal to work for alternates is due to Big Oil influences on the GOP.
9.The GOP is purposely attempting to keep legitimate voters from the Polls under the guise of needing an i.d. card to prevent 'voter fraud'. The number of cases of voter fraud is laughingly small (fortunately) and these efforts are not even smokescreens but clearly intended to disenfranchise various minority groups that likely would vote Democratic. I do not care what happened in the past, I am centering on the ridiculous idea of pushing this concept through in a very few months; likely, I have no problem with the I.D. at all as long as that is phased in and not forced in so that the GOP can win the White House.
10.Mr. Obama was a rookie. All too many of his top people were rookies. I see nothing of 'leadership' in Ms. Pelosi, some in Mr. Reid, but neither of them have been able to bridge divides either and come across quite negatively often. Some of Mr. Obama's people had to be replaced, some of his initial ideas and methods were not efficient.
And as I made quite clear in his first year, I disagreed strongly with the concentration on the health care issue in that first year, at the expense of so many other areas not being able to be attacked that needed solutions also.
Had the GOP cooperated in Health Care Reform, however, they all could have moved on far faster than in year Two to attempt TOGETHER to solve more problems.
After 4 years, however, my preference is to continue what at least has been some progress because I happen to believe in Mr. Obama's international approach far more than a strict hard-line, militaristic one. He has proven he has the courage to make the Big Decisions. I have no reason, based on what he has said, that Mr. Romney would be nearly as efficient nor able to work with the very complex series of inter-laced situations and peoples and world situations. I want to build on the new relationships, not destroy them or have to start over yet again, internationally.
We NEED international cooperation, period.
Those are my feelings as of today. I am not at all 'against' the GOP, nor anti-GOP.
My complaint is that the Party for whom I voted rather consistently until 2004 has become controlled not by its Moderate Base but by its right-wing elements and that limiting the thinking and policies to such right-wing solutions only is not what will work in 2012 and indeed what would harm us for years.
That is my single most over-riding reason, maybe, to strongly desire NOT to vote for a Group that I see as far too limited in thinking and scope, far too inflexible, and far too full of itself with no track record of its own success.
Those elements have a very narrow view of the world, and of our country, and all too many have a problem with the current and growing non-Caucasian make-up of our Nation. They must live with it, not attempt to change it, for it is no one's fault that non-Caucasian births outnumber Caucasian births.
It is not 1950, but that ultra right-wing element seems to wish nothing but return to 1950 and its policies. I shall ignore for the moment that the Civil Rights act was not passed until 1964, and what that alone says about the 1950 mentality.
We have grown to a Nation with 300,000,000 Citizens who are more diverse in make-up than ever; a melting pot we have continued to be.
Each and every one must be considered equally, and on that there can be no compromise.
Bigotry against ANY group of our Equal Citizens cannot be tolerated, no matter how it is couched, and while the word 'bigotry' is quite a strong one and not to be thrown out lightly, IMHO there are far more examples of various sorts of racial and ethnic bigotry among the ultra right-wingers of the GOP than anywhere in the Democratic Party.
One Citizen, one vote. That is who we are, no matter the make-up of our Citizenry. Again, there can be no compromise on that basic Principle of the United States of America.
She is painfully stupid.
Moderates who support Obama are like moderates who support Islam.
They’re not moderate about anything.
This does not come from a “moderate center-right Republican”, nor even from a RINO; instead it comes from a full-blown Liberal Democrat.
Either that or satire.
“One Citizen, one vote”....EXCEPT, if they are military members being DENIED their vote by Leon Panetta.
Why don’t you respond to your little marxist flower child acquaintance about the disenfranchisement of the people making sure she/he is safe?
I’d LOVE to hear her/his reply.
He should get robbed and beaten up by some minority urban youth seeking to bypass the big government middleman some dark night. I hope he doesn't get hurt too bad, but enough to knock some sense into him. I'm afraid he will obtain this education in no other way.
Bad judgment. Very sincerely, bad judgment. This guy/gal is a kool-aid addict. Not worth a second thought.
Clearly....it ain’t a “him”.
Only scorned women are this dull.
Your friend is delusional and an enemy of the Republic.
Probably right. In which case:
Every Vote For Obama Comes With Your Choice (size) Of A Burqa!!!!(some assembly required—removal of brain matter prior to donning.)
Whatever they call themselves, they are expressing democrat talking points straight down the line. And if Romney dosn’t please them, what repub would?
That alone exposes their lie.
Whoever wrote this was never a Republican, just some liberal pretending to have once been a Republican. It’s a pretty standard RAT meme. Libs use it all the time.
“She is painfully stupid.”
I’ll second that emotion. Thinks the Dems don’t have the right answers to our problems but is ticked off with the GOP for not compromising with them.
They have read what you have said and now they are just Trolling you Cripple.
We don’t need “International Cooperation”. We also know by now that we’re never going to get it. I don’t mind if our enemies throughout the world hate us, and they do... I want the world to once again respect us, and wherever necessary, fear us. Or are we only supposed to be afraid of them now as we watch our “leaders” apologize over and over again?
This screed describes a Democrat, not a Moderate Republican.
This is the classic RINO.
A Big Government, afraid to declare what is right and wrong, confused about wants/needs and the Constitution, unable to differentiate between the proper roles of government RINO!
The Conservative movement is thriving, growing and getting stronger everyday.
This relic of the past will be left behind with Bob Michael, base-line budgeting, the Departments of Education & HHS, the EPA, FED and about 40% of federal employees (uniformed military excepted).
This “so-called moderate” would probably vote for Ahmadinejad.
And for the record, Obama is a Muslim. This is a fact. He lived as a Muslim during his childhood and you cannot renounce your faith in Islam, or you become an apostate, (in which case he would have been killed when he went on his apology tour).
He is an active supporter of the Muslim Brotherhood. He brought them to power after getting rid of long-time ally Hosni Mubarak. Please educate this woman, because she’s either lying about being moderate, or is just stupid.
Moderate? as compared to what?
I had thrice gagged in an effort to not blow chunks, but after that line, I lost it.
My keyboard was spared, thank goodness, but now I have to clean the carpet.................... tis not a pretty site
They crapped in her brain and forgot to flush it.
waste of bandwidth and time, and I hope you are over any delusions that this person is either sane or intelligent. She is neither.
With the exception of 4 friends or family members who willingly embrace their well earned designation of “bleeding heart liberal”, every single other democrat/liberal of my acquaintance adamantly refers to themselves as a “moderate”, despite their impassioned defense of all things democrat/liberal. I think that in their deluded little minds, they think that calling themselves “moderate” makes them sound all centrist and enlightened and accepting, which of course is part of the liberal tendency toward “political correctness”. Therefor, whenever anyone self describes as a moderate, in my mind I am saying “liberal who wants to be liked by everyone”. That seems to fit with this person precisely.
You been had.
This is no Republican, and not sane.
The association of the Tea Party with white supremacists just makes no sense at all. Did you ask her where her evidence for these “extremists” in the Tea Party is? Is Allen West a white supremacist? Was Bush racist when he sent billions of aid to Africa? On the other hand, were Clinton and Obama perhaps racist when they refused to intervene in Rwanda and Sudan?
Having international people “like” us is an incredibly stupid goal. They like us when we are weak, because all nations are in a battle for power over each other and the world. Is she itching to find out what sort of “flexibility” Obama will have with the Russians in his second term? More opportunity to sell out our allies in eastern Europe and in Israel perhaps?
If you disagree with Obama’s policies, and think they’ll hurt the country, why would you not want him to be a one-term president? Did the Democrats not want Bush to be a one-term president? They didn’t even acknowledge that he had a right to serve his first term!
She wants the IRS diminished in power, yet she supports Obamacare, which includes a big expansion of the IRS to enforce it. Makes no sense at all.
Detroit is happy. Is the taxpayer happy, who lost billions and billions on the deal, from a company that may still fail? A lot of failing companies would love it if the taxpayer gave them a few free billion. That’s an argument for doing it?
We already had an article on here that said 97% of people pay a lower tax rate than Romney. His taxes are by no means low. The idea that the government is being “robbed” of tax revenue has things completely backwards, as anyone who is not a hardcore liberal should understand.
The idea that Obama wants us to become energy-independent is absurd. He encouraged South American countries to drill more oil so that we could happily buy it from them. He has frozen up federal offshore and land-based drilling as much as possible. He wants to put coal plants out of business. All that Obama’s efforts to alternative energy has produced is billions of dollars in wasted money paid to his cronies. Fossil fuels aren’t harming the environment, technology helps us retrieve more and more every day, and the private sector will develop alternative energy on its own through the good old profit motive as soon as it becomes possible or financially viable.
The idea that voter ID should be “phased in” not “forced in” makes no sense at all. Who is forcing anything? Laws have been passed and over many months the information is being given to voters on the change.
Everyone of us is entitled to his or her own opinion no matter how ill advised, myopic, mule headed, idiotic, hare brained, or just plain old flat-lined brain dead stupid it might be. That being the case I would appreciate it if you would keep your bilge water to yourself.
Bin golfin wit Obama?
Where did cripple come into this?
Delusionally articulate-—or articulately delusional?
Enquiring minds don’t give a crap.
Some people are mental giants, some people are giant mentals.
It saddens me that I could not see through my own bigotry and understand the wealth of humanity that IS the ONE. DAMN my lying eyes, ears, and corrupted mind!
Unfettered am I, after receiving a gift post of this enormity!
Had I understood the depravity of my views prior, I would turn my face in shame.
a kinda, sorta conservative.
You’re quite right.
It’s very much (IMO) like the elite intellectuals who have this idea that what they theorize is the best way to do things-—having never participated nor competed in the commercial world. So they speak from an utter lack of experience and exposure; and of course, this is what makes them so very self-righteous in their approach and is their justification for being qualified to advise business: They’ve never been polluted by the gritty travails of commercial, for-profit enterprise. And so, not only are they smarter than you and I, but their motives are unsullied. We luddites are just wasting time until that day when we embrace and adopt their theories which don’t even require proof that they’ll make our lives better. We’re clearly just Neanderthals waiting around for a clue and can’t see superior ideation when it’s thrown in our faces.
The GOP has never been more moderate.
This person says the GOP is not open to compromise, what about the Democrats do they want to compromise? Nope.
This is the statement recorded:
Adul Gheit said he had a one-on-one meeting with Obama, where the US President told him that He was still a Muslim, the son of a Muslim father, the step son of Muslim stepfather, that his half brothers in Kenya are Muslims, and that he was sympathetic towards the Muslim agenda.
Adul Gheit claimed Obama told the Arabs to show patience. Obama promised that once he overcame some domestic issues, like the Health care reform, he would show the Muslim World how to deal with Israel.
Source: Israeli magazine, Israel today (June 2010)
“Each and every one must be considered equally, and on that there can be no compromise.”
Neil Peart and Mark Steyn comment, in a duo, about which, to them, I apologize:
(Neil) There is unrest in the forest, there is trouble with the trees.
For the Maples want more sunlight and the Oaks ignore their pleas.
... (Mark) farce ... followed by farce ... followed by
(Neil) For they passed a noble law
... (Mark) farce ... followed by ...
(Neil) And the trees are all kept equal by hatchet, axe and saw.
... (Mark) ... tragedy.
from someone who lacks the courage to call themselves what they are...a liberal
i see that a lot down here especially in church going under 45 types
brainwashed with the PC crap at school-college
all about being nice and spouting the acceptable response
It’s a rare occasion when you are presented with unimpeachable proof that someone is an idiot. Consider yourself lucky.
The person is for certain, not a moderate. Liberal republican, possibly. Democrat posing as ‘moderate republican’, possibly.
Sane and intelligent my ass
Bump to insanity file
Well in excess of 2,000 words of pure, unadulterated pop-PC.
Yup. These are the kind of people that try to find a middle ground between right and wrong. They are completely shaped by the media. They will never espouse an opinion that hasn’t been thoroughly screentested to oblivion, and they consider them “above” us troglodytic ideologues simply because they never had a conviction about anything in their life except for their favorite band.
Know your enemy!
Its so sad that so many Americans are clueless....
A true moderate would not blather on for so long. And, a
real moderate would include a modicum of criticism of the
When liberals make hard left turns and conservatives predictably
stand their ground it is always the conservatives who are accused
of becoming radical. Those who believe this are called liberal, not
I believe El Rushbo would refer to this person as a “Seminar Caller”.
“Yup. These are the kind of people that try to find a middle ground between right and wrong.”
Guess I’m in a quote mood ... Ayn Rand said this best, you said it fine.
In any compromise between food and poison, it is only death that can win. In any compromise between good and evil, it is only evil that can profit.