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Those cement bubbles on sidewalk corners are costing you a lot of money! (858 Million)
Philadelphia Daily News ^ | 10/08/2012 | Stu Bykofsky

Posted on 10/08/2012 10:41:15 AM PDT by Kid Shelleen

First time hearing those words? The little bumps under your feet are picking the city's pocket.

Truncated domes - also known as "tactile warning strips" - are those bumps the size of elevator call buttons that blister the surface of recently installed ramps at street corners, by order of the feds. The cost to the city - meaning you, the taxpayer - is astronomical.

The outlay is required by changing federal regulations, according to Terry Gillen, director of federal affairs for the city of Philadelphia. She is, in effect, the liaison to President Obama from Mayor Nutter, who has been a ferocious advocate for the president's re-election. --snip-- The cost of installing the now-mandated ramps at each of the city's 22,000 intersections will be $858 million,

(Excerpt) Read more at philly.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events; US: Pennsylvania
KEYWORDS: ada; cementbubbles; cementdomes; philadelphia; sidewalks; tactilewarningstrips; warningstrips
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1 posted on 10/08/2012 10:41:19 AM PDT by Kid Shelleen
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To: Kid Shelleen

A billion here, a billion there, pretty soon you’re talking about real money!

And that’s just for little yellow strips.

The government is killing America one little strip at a time.

I did the math on a new train line in Washington State today, and it cost $433,333 per passenger to BUILD, before they ran the first train. With Operating Costs, it is likely to cost well over $50K per year, MORE COST FOR THE TRAIN THAN THE AVERAGE RIDER EARNS!!!!

Idiocy like this is the norm of government. The only real solution is to STARVE THE BEAST!


2 posted on 10/08/2012 10:45:20 AM PDT by Uncle Miltie (You didn't build that. The private sector is doing fine. We tried our plan and it worked.)
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To: Kid Shelleen

WHAT THE GD F-ING F??????????????????????

ISN’T ANYONE IN THE GOVERNMENT CAPABLE OF DOING COST-BENEFIT ANALYSIS?

THERE IS NOT AN INFINITE SUPPLY OF MONEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!


3 posted on 10/08/2012 10:45:29 AM PDT by Mr. K ("The only thing the World would hate more than the USA in charge is the USA NOT in charge")
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To: Uncle Miltie

That’s $50K / Rider / Year.


4 posted on 10/08/2012 10:46:03 AM PDT by Uncle Miltie (You didn't build that. The private sector is doing fine. We tried our plan and it worked.)
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To: Kid Shelleen
Welll.....

There's a bunch of new sidewalks that were just put in where I go walking. I like the bumps in the wintertime when it's icy, it helps give me some traction.

However, is it worth a Billion dollars to me to replace the lot? Not hardly. But, it likely makes sense to use them going forward as sidewalks are built / repaired / replaced.

Typical gov't stupidity. If a scalpel makes sense, then they'll use a sledgehammer.

5 posted on 10/08/2012 10:46:31 AM PDT by wbill
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To: Kid Shelleen

Politicians have to have their money laundering money.


6 posted on 10/08/2012 10:47:05 AM PDT by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote; then find me a real conservative to vote for)
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To: Kid Shelleen

WE were once a people who managed to cross and tame a very hostile continent. Now we all but need our hands held to cross the street. Wake up, people.


7 posted on 10/08/2012 10:48:18 AM PDT by all the best (`~!)
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To: Mr. K
ISN’T ANYONE IN THE GOVERNMENT CAPABLE OF DOING COST-BENEFIT ANALYSIS?

They all are.

The costs are measured in bottomless tax dollars.

The benefits are measured in priceless votes.

8 posted on 10/08/2012 10:48:44 AM PDT by null and void (Day 1357 of our ObamaVacation from reality - Obama, a queer and present danger)
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To: Kid Shelleen

Well, that may be true, but I have found that they make wheelchair cuts much less slippery. So maybe we’ve saved money on PI lawyers...


9 posted on 10/08/2012 10:48:58 AM PDT by livius
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To: wbill
Frankly I don't like the bumps ~ they are a trip hazard ~ something to worry about as you get older.

The new regulations were undoubtedly prepared by one of Obama's 'death panels' so they can cut down on the number of geezers sucking on the Obamakkkare tubes.

10 posted on 10/08/2012 10:49:08 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Kid Shelleen

This is a perfect example of government run amok. Put the things in at the cost of almost a billion dollars, then change the standards so they have to be revised at a cost of a couple hundred million more. For the number of people in wheelchairs who use them, they could have paid to have a limo pick the people up and take them to their destinations.


11 posted on 10/08/2012 10:50:54 AM PDT by Opinionated Blowhard ("When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.")
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To: Kid Shelleen

We have a couple near my home that are honest-to-God, located at corners with no other sidewalks leading to them. Just another example of PC gone haywire. What representative, at ANY level of government, would go up against the ADA?


12 posted on 10/08/2012 10:51:39 AM PDT by GreenAccord (Bacon Akbar)
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To: wbill

Broom the walks...period


13 posted on 10/08/2012 10:52:37 AM PDT by Sacajaweau (r)
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To: Kid Shelleen

Those bubbles are a textbook case of the government trying to do too much with OPM. It’s great when the economy is skyrocketing, but when it isn’t, well, this and things like it need to be axed.


14 posted on 10/08/2012 10:53:27 AM PDT by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: Mr. K

Unfortunately the only way for this crap to stop is for the entire system to collapse on itself. It won’t be pretty, and millions will suffer and die, but there is no other way to right this ship.


15 posted on 10/08/2012 10:54:42 AM PDT by GnL
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To: Kid Shelleen

So they don’t do a good job and the water doesn’t drain so it freezes on the sidewalk so that not only the visually impaired, but everyone, gets the chance to slip and hurt themselves. By golly, they could really help by putting spikes around those bubbles to really warn people. Maybe some land mines could help.


16 posted on 10/08/2012 10:56:50 AM PDT by blueunicorn6 ("A crack shot and a good dancer")
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To: Kid Shelleen
"Overwhelm the system" is the official motto of the United States feral government.
17 posted on 10/08/2012 10:57:49 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Government is the religion of the psychopath.)
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To: Kid Shelleen

Government doesn’t understand the concept of “Opportunity Costs”.


18 posted on 10/08/2012 10:58:07 AM PDT by blueunicorn6 ("A crack shot and a good dancer")
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To: GnL

I think you are right. We are borrowing a trillion dollars a year from China to put these bubbles in our streets. And no one man is going to be able to stop any of this because its all a bureaucracy that keeps churning out these projects day after day, week after week, month after month. And no one is going to eliminate that bureaucracy unless the system collapses.


19 posted on 10/08/2012 10:59:34 AM PDT by Opinionated Blowhard ("When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.")
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To: GnL
Here's another way you, or some other public spirited citizen can help ~ the federal regulation that came out mandating this particular feature was published in the federal register.

That notice is required to name the person most familiar with the rule.

Track her down ~ demand she fess up and tell you the truth ~ who did it, why they really did it, and where do they live ~ publish that information.

20 posted on 10/08/2012 11:00:52 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Mr. K

It cost about $400 per ramp to install these. There are two types, a plastic sheet that is pressed onto the concrete (whcih can delaminate and need replacing) or a hi-strength, 1-inch thick pre cast insert, both cost about $200 per insert. These are mandated by the American with Disabilities Act and there is no way around it.

Each community must prepare an ADA assessment plan so I would encourage you to check with your city or county public works departments to determine how many of areas exist that need to be brought up to the ADA standard.


21 posted on 10/08/2012 11:00:52 AM PDT by shotgun
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To: shotgun

....because wheelchairs roll so well on bumps ? LOL


22 posted on 10/08/2012 11:08:14 AM PDT by Revelation 911 ("The whole contrivance imploded last night ..in in one great rancid...public fart")
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To: shotgun
It cost about $400 per ramp to install these

But according to the article: The cost of installing the now-mandated ramps at each of the city's 22,000 intersections will be $858 million,

858 million / 22,000 = $39,000 per intersection. Let's say eight ramps per intersection = $4,875 per ramp. That's a lot more than $400. $4,875 will pay for a lot of people to lean on their shovels during installation.

23 posted on 10/08/2012 11:09:15 AM PDT by KarlInOhio (Big Bird is a brood parasite: laid in our nest 43 years ago and we are still feeding him.)
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To: Mr. K

I understand your rage. Problem is that government feels it is their right to take people money and use it how they see fit. It is criminal.


24 posted on 10/08/2012 11:17:20 AM PDT by vpintheak (Occupy your Brain!)
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To: Kid Shelleen

Now just a minute . . . Sidewalk Bubbles IS in the Constitution . . . somewhere . . . over by the 1-gallon per flush, abortion, penumbra, and privacy stuff . . . really . . . I seen it there . . . !


25 posted on 10/08/2012 11:27:09 AM PDT by laweeks
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To: Revelation 911

Just wait until the new wheelchair regs come out for “suspension modifications”, which’ll cost us all untold billions.


26 posted on 10/08/2012 11:27:49 AM PDT by carriage_hill (Libs, dems, unions, leftist scum & murderous muzzies - are like bacteria: attack, attack, attack!)
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To: Kid Shelleen
FTA: We have truncated domes. What will they dream up next?

Federally mandated electric wheelchair lifts for all public swimming pools.

The Obama administration had mandated them for all public swimming pools beginning March 15, 2012. After public swimming pools around the country announced that they would have to close because of the substantial cost of compliance, the mandate was postponed until January 31, 2013. It is purely a coincidence that the mandate will now kick in immediately after the election.

Just one more of the many economy killing regulations that we have to look forward to in a second term of the Obamanation.

27 posted on 10/08/2012 11:32:41 AM PDT by Bubba_Leroy (The Obamanation Continues)
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To: Kid Shelleen

Would someone tell me just how can the FEDERAL government can DICTATE to a CITY what kind of sidewalks they can and cannot have?.......................


28 posted on 10/08/2012 11:40:59 AM PDT by Red Badger (Is it just me, or is Hillary! starting to look like Benjamin Franklin?.................)
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To: wbill

We have those bumps in our new sidewalks, too............IN FLORIDA....................


29 posted on 10/08/2012 11:42:12 AM PDT by Red Badger (Is it just me, or is Hillary! starting to look like Benjamin Franklin?.................)
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To: KarlInOhio; shotgun

Which is it — $400, or $4,000 per ramp? Shotgun’s estimate seems more reasonable. But, what’s reason got to do with it?

Is this a case of government spending run amok, or is it simply another example of the rampant innumeracy in the media?


30 posted on 10/08/2012 11:45:56 AM PDT by USFRIENDINVICTORIA
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To: laweeks
over by the 1-gallon per flush,

Truth is new toilet design has improved the process such that no matter how much water you used in the older toilets, you won't get as reliable a result as you will with the newer toilets.

I changed all mine out about a year ago, and would not want to go back.

This is one case where government meddling has led to a better product.

31 posted on 10/08/2012 11:53:40 AM PDT by itsahoot (I'll write in Palin in 2012. That is 1 vote for Palin, 0 votes for Romney and Zer0 votes for Obama.)
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To: Red Badger
IN FLORIDA ....yeah, that goes back to the whole gov't sledgehammer thing I was talking about. :-)
32 posted on 10/08/2012 11:55:59 AM PDT by wbill
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To: Red Badger

Federal tax dollars for road construction. No money unless you do what they say.


33 posted on 10/08/2012 11:56:28 AM PDT by Ratman83
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To: Kid Shelleen

Bump


34 posted on 10/08/2012 12:00:18 PM PDT by lowbridge (Joe Biden: "Look, the Taliban per se is not our enemy.")
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To: wbill

Well, if our sidewalks EVER get coated in snow and ice, I’m glad that the grubbermint is looking out for my best interests...................


35 posted on 10/08/2012 12:01:20 PM PDT by Red Badger (Is it just me, or is Hillary! starting to look like Benjamin Franklin?.................)
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To: Red Badger

It’s for the visually impaired as well.

They are a hassle for me ‘cuz the GROCERY stores have had to put them in to denote where the street begins. This means my shopping card gets rattled REALLY hard going over the bumps. Have to be careful with your glass-bottled items.


36 posted on 10/08/2012 12:01:58 PM PDT by Blueflag (Res ipsa loquitur: non vehere est inermus)
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To: Red Badger

My experience with those as an avid city walker is that they are slicker in rain, sleet, snow and ice.


37 posted on 10/08/2012 12:03:25 PM PDT by hal ogen (First Amendment or Reeducation Camp?)
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To: hal ogen

The last time I walked in snow and ice I was in Germany. And as socialist as EU has become, they don’t have silly stuff on the sidewalks.........


38 posted on 10/08/2012 12:06:21 PM PDT by Red Badger (Is it just me, or is Hillary! starting to look like Benjamin Franklin?.................)
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To: neverdem; narses; SunkenCiv; cogitator; NicknamedBob; USFRIENDINVICTORIA
Which is it — $400, or $4,000 per ramp? Shotgun’s estimate seems more reasonable. But, what’s reason got to do with it?

400.00 per “ramp”for the single purchase on one bumpy plate ... Yah, know, we used to work realllll hard to make smooth sidewalks and REMOVE cobblestone streets ....

The 4,000.00 per ramp is to INSTALL (hire the bureaucrat(s) to run the program, hire the companies to install them, inspect the papers, inspect their EPA cert’s, inspect their paint and hazardous material documents, inspect their safety records, inspect their trash disposal, schedule the sidewalks and install their anti-mud barricades and pedestrian curbing/barricades, etc.), plus ripout the old concrete, lift it into trucks, ship it to a dump, get the new forms built, buy the new concrete, ship it in to the sidewalks, pour it, smooth it, graze it, install the bumps, paint it, remove the forms, clean up the debris, etc.

$4000.00 per ramp ain't bad when you consider how much it takes to “administrate” the programs that only buy a little bit of material.

39 posted on 10/08/2012 12:14:08 PM PDT by Robert A. Cook, PE (I can only donate monthly, but socialists' ABBCNNBCBS continue to lie every day!)
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To: Kid Shelleen

They might want to get some non-union labor.

At the price tag listed, its $7,500 a ramp. I do cost estimates on these all the time, and its around $900 per ramp. If they have to tear out the old on, its around $1,500. With design, put it at $2,000 a ramp. Who knew, stuff costs too much in Philadelphia.

Now if you read the fine print, you may notice that it uses up 65% of a $20 million budget, every year...but will ultimately cost $858 million...or a 66 year build out. The way it works is the city must have a ramp ‘program’ in place, and commit to replacing a certain number every year. In return they are eligible for federal matching funds (read their own money after its been filtered through Washington) on a variety of street projects. So they burn through their maintenance funds, and in return get more capital improvement funds...which is sadly a recipe for alot of poorly maintained streets.

Some cities get creative. Utility work, street widening, etc. takes out alot of ramps...and they require the new ones to go in with the domes. This costs less than just picking random ramps about town for replacement, but they still get ‘credit’ for the replacement.

Sadly, the ramp mandates were spawned from one act, signed into law by George Bush, in 1990. The mandates can’t be stopped or controlled now. The federal beast has been unleashed...something we should always think about when an ‘well intentioned’ legislation goes on the books.

Anyway, Philly has the pefect storm of corrucpt labor, federal regulation, and an inability to plan/think creatively to reduce costs. I’m not surprised.


40 posted on 10/08/2012 12:14:30 PM PDT by lacrew (Mr. Soetoro, we regret to inform you that your race card is over the credit limit.)
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To: Red Badger

They tie federal funding for capital improvement street projects to it. You want some of your community’s money back from Washington? Play by their rules.

Then there’s the fines and lawsuits...


41 posted on 10/08/2012 12:19:14 PM PDT by lacrew (Mr. Soetoro, we regret to inform you that your race card is over the credit limit.)
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To: Kid Shelleen

They have been installing these “bumps” in Louisville for the past 2-1/2 years. Not only are they a waste of money, but they tear out 50 feet of sidewalk to install a 2’ by 3’ ection of bumps.


42 posted on 10/08/2012 12:51:11 PM PDT by anoldafvet (One million people attended Obama's inauguration, 14 of them missed work)
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To: shotgun

” These are mandated by the American with Disabilities Act and there is no way around it.”

Just defund and/or repeal ADA.

I am sorry that some have disabilities, but do not destroy the economy because some few people have a disability.


43 posted on 10/08/2012 1:05:07 PM PDT by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon freedom, it is necessary to examine principles."...the public interest)
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To: itsahoot

“Truth is new toilet design has improved the process such that no matter how much water you used in the older toilets, you won’t get as reliable a result as you will with the newer toilets.”

Bullsh*t - uh, sorry, wrong species of feces.

However, most of the low flush toilets are not raving successes, as the thriving market for the old ones proves.

The ‘unseen hand of the market’ disagrees with you, it would appear.


44 posted on 10/08/2012 1:08:33 PM PDT by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon freedom, it is necessary to examine principles."...the public interest)
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To: Kid Shelleen

They’ve been obsessing putting those in here in Tucson too. And because the “recommended” slope tends to put them lower than the regular side walk and we don’t want anybody falling off those 2 inch lips they get guardrails too. They screw up traffic at an intersection for 2 weeks putting all this junk in and by the time they’re done it’s harder to walk through it because you have to dodge the stupid railing.


45 posted on 10/08/2012 1:14:45 PM PDT by discostu (Not a part of anyone's well oiled machine.)
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To: Mr. K

cost benefit analysis? They have only had time to do that on the elderly and medical needs.


46 posted on 10/08/2012 1:15:40 PM PDT by goosie
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To: USFRIENDINVICTORIA

It probably SHOULD cost $400 but you know how things are with government contractors. When I’ve seen them getting put in here step 1 is to not only tear out the old sidewalk and curb but also a couple of feet of road. So now you have to replace concrete and tar, and because there’s a hole in the road you have to direct traffic away from the lane, so you need a bunch of pylons... it’s really easy to add a zero to the cost when you do things the government way.


47 posted on 10/08/2012 1:19:57 PM PDT by discostu (Not a part of anyone's well oiled machine.)
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To: Kid Shelleen

48 posted on 10/08/2012 1:26:25 PM PDT by WVKayaker (I'm more than happy to be Obama's "enemy of the week" - Sarah Palin)
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To: Revelation 911
....because wheelchairs roll so well on bumps ? LOL

I'm hating over-regulating government more and more every year. In my community, they began cutting curbs at intersections supposedly for wheelchair access. However, they only cut about half of them, and stopped work almost two years ago. They neglected to cut them at the intersections adjacent to schools and parks, and busy intersections where they're most needed, especially for baby strollers.

On my block, some people park cars up on the sidewalk, forcing baby strollers and wheelchairs into the street. Complaints to City Hall go no where. I watched a neighbor in a wheelchair get a traffic ticket from a police officer, because he was driving his wheelchair in the street to get around a car. I went up and complained to the cop as he wrote the ticket, telling him to do something about the cars on the sidewalk. He gave me a look like he would arrest me, and said nothing and gave the ticket. I'm hating government and the cops; they just don't care about the public any more.

49 posted on 10/08/2012 1:37:22 PM PDT by roadcat
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To: shotgun
It cost about $400 per ramp to install these.

It cost's quite a bit more than that to install those. The entire corner of the sidewalk at the intersection has to be demolished and a new one installed. You couldn't even get the old concrete jackhammered out for that.

50 posted on 10/08/2012 1:55:16 PM PDT by Colorado Doug (Now I know how the Indians felt to be sold out for a few beads and trinkets)
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