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Obama, Romney, Other: Who Should Christians Vote for in the 2012 Election?
Providential Perspective - The Teaching Journal of The Providence Foundation ^ | September 2012 | Stephen McDowell

Posted on 10/10/2012 1:56:42 AM PDT by imardmd1

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To: MrDem

Good post.


51 posted on 10/10/2012 8:33:51 AM PDT by GlockThe Vote (The Obama Adminstration: 2nd wave of attacks on America after 9/11)
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To: GOPsterinMA
Think CA on a national level.

I don't think you want to frame the election that way. "Think CA on a national level" vs. "Think MA on a national level" would lead people to adopt my position of sitting this election out.

52 posted on 10/10/2012 8:39:18 AM PDT by CommerceComet (Obama vs. Romney - clear evidence that our nation has been judged by God and found wanting.)
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To: cripplecreek; xzins

Agree with both of you.
I am voting absentee this year, my California ballot has been sitting on the counter for days, every office and ballot initiative is marked except for president - I look at it every time I walk by - this year I realize I must leave it blank for the first time since I have been voting, there will be no presidential candidate marked.


53 posted on 10/10/2012 8:43:46 AM PDT by svcw (Why is one cell on another planet considered life, and in the womb it is not.)
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To: imardmd1

A couple of the most active pro-Obama trolls were up late last night on spreading hate and discontent on other threads and obviously haven’t seen this one yet. I expect some major new fireworks starting as the noise from their parents getting ready for work rouses them from their restful slumber.


54 posted on 10/10/2012 8:45:07 AM PDT by fireman15 (Check your facts before making ignorant statements.)
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To: Tau Food
I proudly support and will vote for Tom Hoefling, a pro-life conservative.

Obama thanks you for four things: (1) saving one of his votes; (2) not voting for his serious opponent; (3) allowing his train of destruction to rush on at 100 mph instead of slowing it to 20 mph with Romney; and (4) not allowing any conservative leaders the time to develop into serious opposition.

Can pride can fill your belly?

55 posted on 10/10/2012 8:51:16 AM PDT by imardmd1
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To: svcw

I haven’t made a firm decision about voting for Romney. My main concern is the behavior of the people calling themselves conservatives.

They talk a big game about getting rid of Obama then cheer Romney for saying he’s going to continue doing many of the same things. Obama arming Libyan rebels bad, Romney saying he would consider arming Syrian rebels good. Foreign aid under Obama bad, Foreign aid under Romney good. Defacto amnesty under Obama bad, Romney saying he wouldn’t overturn it good.

Just this morning I committed the blaspheme of suggesting that Joe Biden may not be a pushover in the debate like Obama was. I came under fire for simply pointing out that Joe Biden has 40 years of experience under his belt. I didn’t say that Ryan couldn’t defeat him, only that Ryan faced a tougher debate. Suggesting that Romney can’t fix the economy is another blasphemous statement that virtually all would have agreed with 6 months ago.

People both left and right are acting exactly alike and America will pay dearly for it. Cattle led to slaughter because they refuse to see.


56 posted on 10/10/2012 9:13:47 AM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: imardmd1

No true Christian would have to spend a nano second to consider this question.


57 posted on 10/10/2012 9:28:27 AM PDT by MayflowerMadam
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To: cripplecreek

Well, stated cripple.


58 posted on 10/10/2012 9:29:51 AM PDT by svcw (Why is one cell on another planet considered life, and in the womb it is not.)
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To: MayflowerMadam
true Christian?

hum?

59 posted on 10/10/2012 9:47:40 AM PDT by svcw (Why is one cell on another planet considered life, and in the womb it is not.)
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To: imardmd1

huh?


60 posted on 10/10/2012 9:48:46 AM PDT by svcw (Why is one cell on another planet considered life, and in the womb it is not.)
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To: imardmd1
Ok, you say you have to make up your mind

True, then you say voting for anyone but Romney helps obama win

Wouldn't it just be easy to say I'll tell you what to do, don't follow your convictions.

61 posted on 10/10/2012 9:53:03 AM PDT by svcw (Why is one cell on another planet considered life, and in the womb it is not.)
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To: MayflowerMadam
No true Christian would have to spend a nano second to consider this question.

No true Christian would spend less time than the author of this article did, in considering the alternatives very carefully.

And what is your urge? (of course not guided by thoughtful conference with the Holy Ghost)

62 posted on 10/10/2012 10:38:11 AM PDT by imardmd1
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To: xzins
I'll renew my attacks on Romney after the election. However, he will not receive my vote.

(1) The God is in charge.
(2) If Obama wins, God permitted that to happen, as He did in visiting Hitler as a judgment against Germany and their higher-criticism, corrupt-the-Scriptures theologians.
(3) If this is the case, then if you did not vote for Obama, you are flouting God's determined Will.
(4) If Romney wins, that is what God permitted, as He has for other of our Presidents who named the Name of Christ, but did not follow His teachings.
(5) If this is the case, and you did not vote for Romney, again, you have intended to flout God's determined Will.
(6) If you voted for a third candidate, a wholesome Christian opposing those two, and he does not win, that is also what The God permitted.
(7) In this case, both you and the third party nominee failed to discern The God's determinate Will, and are actively opposing Him also.

I, too, have been greatly exercised over this conundrum, and have tended toward voting for a third candidate.

But I also know that the author of this article has effectively summed up the differences between these major opponents, and considered both candidates unfit for a New Testament Christian occupation, yet pretty clearly shows us that The God has already willed through lawful processes, that one or the other of these candidates will obtain a majority electoral vote over the other; whereas a third party is extremely unlikely to effectively challenge. Even if both the two majors die, the successor of the winner will take his place; not any third candidate.

So, I do not believe the author is being a temporizer, but has hit the nail on the head both logically and spiritually.

I can elect to help "slow the train of destruction down" (knowing that Romney ids an engine of destruction in the points you mentioned), or I can assist the worst aggressor to steam full ahead by one of three methods: vote for Obama, vote for a third party, or abstain.

From this aspect, I do not believe that God's determined Will is that Obama be reelected to sink us. I believe that The God is giving us one last chance to start getting active in both evangelism and exhortation to bring the USA back under a better obedience to Him, and so I believe I must also permit Romney to have the helm briefly until we can confirm new leaders of our conservatism and constitutionality.

I have my 19 grandchildren in mind as to the outcome. What about you?

63 posted on 10/10/2012 11:34:07 AM PDT by imardmd1 (Let the redeemed of The LORD say so, whom He hath redeemed from the hand of the enemy. (Ps. 107:2))
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To: imardmd1
As s Pastor of a Southern Baptist Church, I vote for the person who holds views which I consider important. Let's see Jimmy Carter as a Southern Baptist, Bill Clinton was a Southern Baptist, now Obama,I have no clue, however he is for taking the life of the unborn (unscriptual, same sex marriage (unscriptual), redistribution of wealth, pro Islamic, etc. the list in continuous! Yes, I will vote for Mr Romney at least he appears to be moral in his beliefs (don't agree with Mormonism).
64 posted on 10/10/2012 11:34:21 AM PDT by DocJ69
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To: ShadowAce
Wow--read minds much?

No, all I had to to was read your post.

(It's not a vote against him either...no matter what you say.)...It is--pretty much by definition.

You can tell me that when your guy wins. Otherwise...math wins every single time.

65 posted on 10/10/2012 2:09:05 PM PDT by ROCKLOBSTER (Celebrate "Republicans Freed the Slaves" Month)
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To: imardmd1
A better question to ask is who should Americans vote for in the 2012 election?

(the answer being Romney, obviously)

66 posted on 10/10/2012 5:16:04 PM PDT by Joseph Harrolds
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To: imardmd1
Can pride can fill your belly?

I don't depend on government to fill my belly. I will not not depend on Mitt Romney to fill my belly.

I have arranged my affairs so as to limit the damage that any liberal (whether Obama or Romney) can do to interfere with my life. If you think you can depend on Mitt Romney or the government to fill your belly, you will likely be disappointed. I encourage you to reduce your dependency on government.

Tom Hoefling is a proven conservative who doesn't shift like a weathervane when liberal breezes blow.

When the day comes that I can no longer fill my own belly, I'll know that it's time for me to go.

67 posted on 10/10/2012 5:21:07 PM PDT by Tau Food (Tom Hoefling for President - 2012)
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To: imardmd1

As I said, I’d prefer to be bashing Obama as the greater enemy, so this is sans reference to Romney.

Read 2 Chronicles 17-20, the life of King Jehoshaphat.


68 posted on 10/10/2012 5:24:08 PM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: Joseph Harrolds
A better question to ask is who should Americans vote for in the 2012 election?
(the answer being Romney, obviously)

Well, taking that a bit further, in whom should citizens loving the values of our forefathers have voted for in the primaries, and that would be neither Obama nor Romney. But we are now faced with distasteful choices in the general election.

However, the title of the article is specifically limited to address the segment of the population who are, within the text, identified as regenerated believer-disciples of Christ -- not just persons who simply practice religious formalities prevalent in Christendom and thus call themselves "Christians." Thus for the constituents addressed, your question is another question, but not a "better" one.

With sincere regard --

69 posted on 10/10/2012 11:56:39 PM PDT by imardmd1 (Let the redeemed of The LORD say so, whom He hath redeemed from the hand of the enemy. (Ps. 107:2))
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To: xzins
As I said, I’d prefer to be bashing Obama as the greater enemy, so this is sans reference to Romney.

The time to bash is at the polls on November 6, and this is not without reference to Romney. AFIK We need to be paying the same attention to other portions of the slate with the same scrutiny as to whether they intend to uphold conservative, limited government or not.

70 posted on 10/11/2012 12:15:13 AM PDT by imardmd1 (Let the redeemed of The LORD say so, whom He hath redeemed from the hand of the enemy. (Ps. 107:2))
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To: Tau Food
I don't depend on government to fill my belly. I will not not depend on Mitt Romney to fill my belly.

No one is insisting on this, but it is expected that if Romney takes the office, he can better help improve the conditions under which you may operate to fill your own belly.

Getting Obama back will not improve these conditions. In that case, you can expect a more dramatic worsening under his championing of socialism that will likely make you tighten your belt. Not voting for Romney will improve Obama's chances measurably.

But if Romney is elected, we can not only expect some rather favorable improvements, but perhaps also we can begin to whittle at his shortcomings from a better vantage, perhaps bringing the engine of destruction to a standstill -- even moving toward a reversal. Eh?

Again, this topic is directed toward born-anew followers of Christ, not the general public, as to the facts in considering how to vote so as to agree with Scriptural morality and the Evangel. Your choice of a man of character may be one of approval, but voting for him as POTUS only helps the other side.

This is still a somewhat free country--do as you wish. But if Obama gets back in, I hope you are ready to shoulder your portion of the blame.

71 posted on 10/11/2012 12:43:23 AM PDT by imardmd1 (Let the redeemed of The LORD say so, whom He hath redeemed from the hand of the enemy. (Ps. 107:2))
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To: ROCKLOBSTER
You can tell me that when your guy wins.

Ahh--so the outcome of an election determines whether I voted for or against someone?

Do you listen to what you write, or you just throw down words at random?

72 posted on 10/11/2012 4:39:57 AM PDT by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: ShadowAce
the outcome of an election determines whether I voted for or against someone?

Yes, you and all the other Einsteins who voted for Mickey Mouse...or whatever.

Another Freeper put it quite nicely, essentially stating; he didn't like Romney, but he would vote for a rattlesnake if he knew it meant getting rid of Obama.

73 posted on 10/11/2012 5:21:44 AM PDT by ROCKLOBSTER (Celebrate "Republicans Freed the Slaves" Month)
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To: ROCKLOBSTER
Yes, you and all the other Einsteins who voted for Mickey Mouse...or whatever.

Hmm--show me where I posted in this thread for whom I an casting my vote. And before you jump all over it--Post #26 does not indicate who I am voting for or not voting for. I was making a comment on the statement--not defending anything I'm doing.

74 posted on 10/11/2012 5:36:54 AM PDT by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: ROCKLOBSTER
Another Freeper put it quite nicely, essentially stating; he didn't like Romney, but he would vote for a rattlesnake if he knew it meant getting rid of Obama.

I can understand that. Trust me--I despise Obama as much as the next FReeper (or more).

But we do not live in a democracy. We live in a republic. Because of the area I live in, it really does not matter who I vote for or against. The Electors who represent me are pretty much a given.

Given the above points, my vote is truly a personal decision.

75 posted on 10/11/2012 5:44:24 AM PDT by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: ShadowAce

Well assuming you “vote against” Obama down-ticket, we get both Houses, AND Romney does prevail...you (we) should then be able to beat Romney like a rented mule should he tick us off with his actions or posturing.


76 posted on 10/11/2012 5:51:11 AM PDT by ROCKLOBSTER (Celebrate "Republicans Freed the Slaves" Month)
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To: imardmd1

For me in Ohio, it’s fairly easy. Josh Mandel is conservative, and I’m from the very conservative 2d district, so any republican candidate is going to be conservative, and ours is.

So far as other candidates in lesser races in our local area, they wouldn’t survive if even hinted of liberalism.

Issues on the ballot are strange with me. Anything with over about a 100 words, no matter who’s supporting it, I generally reject, thinking that lawyers can make great hay out of extended verbosity. (See 2700 page ObamaCare law...won’t know what’s in it until it’s passed.)


77 posted on 10/11/2012 5:58:11 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: imardmd1
However, the title of the article is specifically limited to address the segment of the population who are, within the text, identified as regenerated believer-disciples of Christ -- not just persons who simply practice religious formalities prevalent in Christendom and thus call themselves "Christians." Thus for the constituents addressed, your question is another question, but not a "better" one.

I think it is a better one, and for this reason:  I don't like the idea of dividing up the vote based on people's religions.  If Christians should only vote a certain way, does that mean that atheists & agnostics should do the same?  While I recognize that most of my "fellow" unbelievers will vote for Democrats (about 70% of them, according to polls), I'm not about to go along with them, as I'm very conservative on economic and foreign policy issues.

Similarly, I would guess that Obama will win 90% (at least) of the Muslim vote.  It's fair to say that they're voting based on their religion far more than Christians do.  Is that a good thing?  Not in my book.

78 posted on 10/11/2012 10:19:09 AM PDT by Joseph Harrolds
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To: All

All God fearing Americans should realize it’s a duty to oust OBOZO. If course Romney is not exactly what we wanted, but Obama has got-to-go


79 posted on 10/12/2012 7:34:57 AM PDT by Milagros (Y)
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To: CommerceComet; GOPsterinMA

Kinda like sitting out WW2, but whatever.


80 posted on 10/12/2012 6:41:44 PM PDT by Impy (Don't call me red.)
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To: Mormon Cricket; ShadowAce; Colonel_Flagg; CommerceComet; cripplecreek; Tau Food; GOPsterinMA
Sins of Omission “aka God's blind spot”, are still sins. Lie to yourselves all you wish, you cannot lie to God.

Romney or Obama will be President. Not voting for Romney means you are voting for Obama by omission. Dress it up all you wish, you can answer to God for your sins.

Romney has stated he will rescind Barack Obama’s executive order authorizing US taxpayer fund to pay for overseas abortions.

But that single act alone a Romney Presidency will reduce the numbers of abortions.

There is NO other rational vote for any truly Christian voter. Your inaction empowers evil while your action would oppose it. Moral cowardice, not matter how carefully hidden in a fake gloss of morality, is till cowardice

81 posted on 10/12/2012 6:54:24 PM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: svcw

Sins of Omission “aka God’s blind spot”, are still sins. Lie to yourselves all you wish, you cannot lie to God.

Romney or Obama will be President. Not voting for Romney means you are voting for Obama by omission. Dress it up all you wish, you can answer to God for your sins.

Romney has stated he will rescind Barack Obama’s executive order authorizing US taxpayer fund to pay for overseas abortions.

But that single act alone a Romney Presidency will reduce the numbers of abortions.

There is NO other rational vote for any truly Christian voter. Your inaction empowers evil while your action would oppose it. Moral cowardice, not matter how carefully hidden in a fake gloss of morality, is till cowardice


82 posted on 10/12/2012 6:57:48 PM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: MNJohnnie
I believe that you should pick your favorite candidates, support them and vote for them on election day. If you do that, you will have done all that you can do as a human being. If Romney is your choice for president, go for it and stand proud.

We may disagree on this point, but I believe that God will play a role in these elections. We won't have to wait much longer for God to reveal His will.

Those of us who are willing to accept God's will and to defer to His judgment will do fine. Those who choose to resist God's will or to criticize God will be choosing a more difficult path.

Trust God. He does know what's best.

83 posted on 10/12/2012 7:02:51 PM PDT by Tau Food (Tom Hoefling for President - 2012)
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To: Tau Food

Sins of omissions are still sins. By your action evil may prosper. You can explain yourself to God one day, however you will no longer be able to claim you were unaware of what you were doing.


84 posted on 10/12/2012 7:08:18 PM PDT by MNJohnnie (Giving more money to DC to fix the Debt is like giving free drugs to addicts think it will cure them)
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To: Lucas McCain

I’m not a Christian, but my morals coincide with Christians. I do believe Romney will be a plus for Christian beliefs. I want a moral, earnest, grown-up man for president again.


85 posted on 10/12/2012 7:09:56 PM PDT by UltraV (I use the term Leftist not liberal, because a true liberal would not support government censorship.)
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To: Tau Food

Yup, I’ll choose my own path and God will punish me alone if he sees fit.

BTW my original comment about God’s “blind spot” had to do with those who were attacking Romney for his religion 6 months ago but now call others bigots for not liking Romney.

Its gotten to be awfully hard to tell the difference between FReepers and DUmmies when it comes to this stuff.


86 posted on 10/12/2012 7:32:44 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: MNJohnnie
I going to answer for all of us who are receiving your lecture.

Lie to yourselves all you wish, you cannot lie to God.

Fortunately for us, God can read our motives far better than you can.

Not voting for Romney means you are voting for Obama by omission. Dress it up all you wish, you can answer to God for your sins.

Fortunately for us, God is much better at logic than you are. Fortunately for us, God defines sin, you don't.

Romney has stated he will rescind Barack Obama’s executive order authorizing US taxpayer fund to pay for overseas abortions.

That would be outstanding provided he actually does it. Anyone who knows Mitt Romney's political history is rightfully skeptical of anything he says. He worked hard to earn his flip-flopping reputation.

Moral cowardice, not matter how carefully hidden in a fake gloss of morality, is till cowardice

You made this cowardice accusation before. I'm convinced that you don't understand the meaning of the word cowardice, just like you don't understand standing on principle.

87 posted on 10/12/2012 7:41:17 PM PDT by CommerceComet (Obama vs. Romney - clear evidence that our nation has been judged by God and found wanting.)
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To: MNJohnnie

Interesting if I do not support Romney your candidate, I am not a true Christian.
huh? Interesting that you can judge my heart.


88 posted on 10/12/2012 7:54:40 PM PDT by svcw (Why is one cell on another planet considered life, and in the womb it is not.)
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To: MNJohnnie

Do not judge my heart, you do not know my heart.
Stop mind reading.
To say that if I do not vote for Romney I am not a true Christian is not only stupid it is unBiblical.
You do not have the authority to judge my heart.
And not only did you ignore that I live in California you judged my heart.........be gone.
I really disl........OH, never mind.


89 posted on 10/12/2012 8:05:04 PM PDT by svcw (Why is one cell on another planet considered life, and in the womb it is not.)
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To: svcw

Romney has achieved the status of God that they say Mormons believe (I don’t know or care if they believe it or not)

Just today a FReeper announced that “The light of freedom shines from his eyes”. LOL


90 posted on 10/12/2012 8:07:30 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: cripplecreek

OMG Cripple, I’ll have to look for that.
I have said it before, my mormon family believes with every fiber of their bring that Romney is the answer to the lds prophesy.


91 posted on 10/12/2012 8:12:07 PM PDT by svcw (Why is one cell on another planet considered life, and in the womb it is not.)
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To: MNJohnnie

I’m really glad I don’t have to answer for my vote to the likes of you.

Don’t bother responding to me. Or pinging me, for that matter.


92 posted on 10/12/2012 8:14:50 PM PDT by Colonel_Flagg ("Don't be afraid to see what you see." -- Ronald Reagan)
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To: svcw

Its in this thread.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2943836/posts

I personally have never had any issues with mormons. When they start exploding on buses and cutting off heads I’ll worry but for now they’re just an odd sect.

I understand voting for Romney as a means of getting rid of Obama but these clowns are demanding that all build him up into the next coming of Reagan when we all know its a lie. That’s behaving exactly like democrats and will come to no good end.


93 posted on 10/12/2012 8:17:30 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: cripplecreek

IK


94 posted on 10/12/2012 8:21:55 PM PDT by svcw (Why is one cell on another planet considered life, and in the womb it is not.)
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To: MNJohnnie

Actually, I speak to God quite regularly. I prefer to believe that He hears me and that He knows what I will do before I know what I will do. I believe that if it is His will that I vote for Romney, He will make His will known to me.

I don’t think you or I should try to speak for God. Please be patient. God’s will shall be revealed soon enough.


95 posted on 10/12/2012 8:56:16 PM PDT by Tau Food (Tom Hoefling for President - 2012)
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To: MNJohnnie

Actually, I speak to God quite regularly. I prefer to believe that He hears me and that He knows what I will do before I know what I will do. I believe that if it is His will that I vote for Romney, He will make His will known to me.

I don’t think you or I should try to speak for God. Please be patient. God’s will shall be revealed soon enough.


96 posted on 10/12/2012 8:56:16 PM PDT by Tau Food (Tom Hoefling for President - 2012)
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To: Impy
Agreed. Nice analogy!
97 posted on 10/13/2012 7:16:48 AM PDT by GOPsterinMA (The Glove don't fit, but it's better than a burqa.)
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