Skip to comments.China Defends Its Bricks (Indian carrier delayed for year, possible counterfeit Chinese parts)
Posted on 10/10/2012 7:22:55 PM PDT by JerseyanExile
China and Russia are arguing over the quality of Chinese firebricks. That's because last month Russia told India that delivery of the refurbished Russian carrier Admiral Gorshkov (since renamed the INS Vikramaditya) would be delayed another ten months. The problem was that seven of eight steam boilers in the carrier power plant failed during recent high-speed trials. The Russians blame India for this, as the Indians refused to allow the Russians to use asbestos to insulate nearby engine components from the intense heat generated by the steam boilers. Instead the Russians had to use firebrick which, as some engineers suspected, was not adequate. Now extensive work has to be done on the engines to rectify the problem. The firebrick was bought from China and Russians now claim that the Chinese firm supplied defective firebrick. This dispute quickly escalated to the point where senior defense officials of both countries are hurling accusations and denials at each other via the media. Naturally this dispute invoked the "Chinese counterfeits" problem. China is the world leader in the production of counterfeit stuff. Not just luxury goods and high-end electronics but also aircraft and ship parts. Russian experts originally insisted that, even with good firebrick, the carrier engines really need asbestos. But some Russian shipyard officials blame poor workmanship, not substandard firebricks, for the engine failure.
The engine problem was discovered during the sea trials that have been under way for several months off the north coast (Barents Sea) of Russia. In all other respects the ship appears to be in working order. For example, two months ago the carrier experienced its first landing by a MiG-29. However, the sea trials had been delayed over a month by bad weather. India is not happy with yet another delay.
The Gorshkov served in the Russian Navy from 1987 to 1995, but was then withdrawn from service because the navy could not afford to keep the carrier operational. Gorshkov was put up for sale in 1996 and in 2005. India agreed to buy the Gorshkov if a few changes could be made. India paid over $2 billion to refurbish the Gorshkov and turn it into the Vikramaditya.
Some of the Indian crew has been working with the Vikramaditya for over a year, learning about all the ship's systems, and now most of the other 1,250 members of the crew are present. India was supposed to take possession of the Vikramaditya by late 2012, but that was recently delayed until early 2013, and is now delayed until late 2013. This project is now five years behind schedule and $1.5 billion over the original budget. It is a major cause of ill-will between Russia and India and has now worsened relations between China and Russia.
We should sell them space shuttle tile...
Chinese supplying bricks, Russian workers making a warship operable for India. What could go wrong?
Sometimes asbestos really is the appropriate material in an application.
The Indians should feel fortunate its only bricks.
The Chinese are selling us computer chips for our weapons systems.
Not that nuclear carriers don’t operate with steam, but I’m picturing someone shoveling coal. :)
“Sometimes asbestos really is the appropriate material in an application.”
You mean like the top half of the 110 floor towers in NY on 9/11 ? Late towers I mean.
In the Indian Navy, the boilers serve a dual purpose. They help run the ship and cook Ramen noodles.
On carriers your talking about enough heat that can either generate 600 or 1200 PSI steam pressure depending on which system they likely somewhat copied. USN used asbestos on all conventional powered carriers and likely Enterprise and Nimitz as well. I'm not sure what could replace it.
DFM aka Diesel Fuel Marine fueled most likely.
Yeah, that crap is nasty!! I believe it was the ‘Cafco’ and ‘Monokote’ products that were two of the ‘popular’ spray on, (sometimes troweled on in limited applications), fireproofing materials for the red iron and exposed pan decking that were used when I was building ‘Skrapers in years long past. I have no idea what is used now. I wonder how much of that garbage I breathed in daily working up there around that crap during those years. Never have smoked but some days now my lungs hurt even with living up here in the mountains with it’s damn good fresh air. Oh well...gotta go from something I guess.
You know that Communist Chinese products are crapola is when the Russians are complaining about them.
It’s interesting that the Russians would sell a ship named for one of their greatest naval heroes—Sergei Gorshkov, the admiral who built the Soviet navy into a formidable force during the Brezhnev-Chernenko-Andropov-Gorbachev era.
I was gonna say asbestos would likely have kept the WTC twin towers standing, but you basically beat me to the punch.
USN hasn’t used asbestos for decades...they just went to a very thick high temp lagging.
One of the toughest days I ever spent on the boat was after overhaul during the first steam plant startup. The all new lagging had to cure, and there was a rather thick atmosphere in the engine room that burned the eyes. Took a few days for that to go away. I still remember that smell though.
not all asbestos is friable, i would doubt it would be casing a engine boiler.
i was just thinking if they had a water cooling system around the boilers circulating all round the ship, they’d always have great hot water service. as well as a means to heat the ship through a temp control system.
It's still onboard the ships though. That's one of the reasons no one wanted to scrap any conventional CV's that and the PCB's make it cost prohibitive.
It's still used from a source I just checked History of Asbestos Usage in the Military but no where near too the extent it was back when I was in. In some places I don't see that they would have a choice especially on a riser.
Big E likely has less than it did due to SLEP and other overhauls but the conventionals were loaded with it.
I was on my ship when we came out for a shakedown in and out after the 80 overhaul. I was a one digit midget so I didn't go to the Mains. I usually didn't anyway I was A Gang AC&R. 1 & 2 Aux and the pump rooms was usually where I went to work.
A carrier at sea even in winter North Atlantic will run A/C units believe it or not. Lots of equipment to generate heat. In the spring & summer it can take about 1600-1800 Tons of cooling at times. No A/C means going back to port fast.