Skip to comments.Obama, Romney Get Feisty in Second Debate
Posted on 10/17/2012 3:59:46 AM PDT by Kaslin
HEMPSTEAD, NY - President Obama was noticeably sharper and more aggressive in tonight's debate, as both candidates exchanged barbs throughout the evening. Mitt Romney excelled by focusing on jobs, jobs, jobs, and repeatedly forcing voters to notice the canyon between Obama's rhetoric and his record. Romney's strongest answer came after Obama attempted to apply lipstick to his failed record in office. Romney unleashed a torrent of facts that pushed back forcefully against each and every one of those claims. It should be cut into an ad as soon as possible. Throughout the night, Romney was asked questions from the audience that could have caused significant trip-ups: Outsourcing, guns (a point on which moderator Candy Crowley followed up twice), and equal pay for women. Romney parried them skillfully. His biggest missed opportunity came, ironically, on Libya -- a subject on which he was unduly vague and allowed the president to offer an indignant response. There are facts that Romney could have raised, but he pulled punches. A mistake, in my view. We'll see if he does so again during the foreign policy debate. As expected, Obama rehearsed a series of attacks on Mitt Romney, many of which have been debunked. The false "$5 Trillion tax cut" line. The "Four Pinocchios" outsourcing claim. Etc, etc. All in all, this setting -- particularly considering the questions asked -- favored Obama, but Romney came prepared. Obama's energy and tone were much improved over Denver, but Romney stood his ground throughout. Grading on the curve established in Denver, Obama had a good night, but Romney had a pretty solid night, as well. We'll see flash polls and the like, but I can't imagine either campaign is particularly disappointed in their man's performance. Next Monday could be a barn-burner, as the two men will be sitting right next to each other at a desk for 90 minutes. I fear we'll hear even more interrupting, one of the most grating elements of both tonight's exchange and the Vice Presidential debate.
UPDATE - Both campaigns were spinning in the spin room at least ten minutes before the debate (which ran over time) had concluded. How does one spin answers one didn't hear?
UPDATE II - Based on early Twitter returns, partisans on both sides are pleased with their guy. Fox News' Brit Hume says he thinks Obama got the better of the evening as a whole. Numerous analysts suggesting the debate is unlikely to dramatically shake up the direction of the race. Krauthammer gives it to Obama "on points."
UPDATE III - CBS News' snap poll shows very split opinions on tonight's winner: Obama 37, Romney 30, Tie 33 -- with a four-point margin of error. Basically a wash. You know what's not a wash? These CBS respondents were asked who won on the economy. That result was Romney 65, Obama 34. Smiles for Team Mitt here.
UPDATE IV - Democratic strategist Joe Trippi: "I don't think it's going to change the dynamics of the race."
UPDATE V - Frank Luntz's focus group on undecided voters are giving Romney rave reviews. An older, whiter, more male crowd, but hey...guess who the undecideds are? Major movement to the GOP ticket among this group of uncommitteds.
UPDATE VI - Ari Fleischer notes that over the three debates thus far, Democrats have gotten roughly nine full minutes of additional talk time. "Needs to be fixed," he says.
UPDATE VII - Whoa, WaPo fact-checks Obama (and by extension, Crowley on this point) over Libya and terrorism: "He did not say “terrorism”—and it took the administration days to concede that that it an “act of terrorism” that appears unrelated to initial reports of anger at a video that defamed the prophet Muhammad." ABC News calls out Obama's incorrect energy claims.
UPDATE VIII - Independent voters in California say the debate was a 44-44 tie. CA partisans give it to Obama.
UPDATE IX - CNN's snap poll puts it at 46-39 for Obama. Largely in line with other numbers. Twenty-five percent said they're now more likely to vote for Romney, Obama's number was identical.
UPDATE X - On CNN, Crowley just conceded that Romney's point on Benghazi and terrorism was correct on substance. Politico's Mike Allen fact-checks that interaction on C-SPAN:
Politico's Mike Allen Fact Checks "Acts Of Terror" Comment
UPDATE XI - Here's the video of Crowley walking back her own 'fact-check' on Benghazi, saying that Romney was "right in the main:"
CNN's Candy Crowley: Romney Was Actually Right On Libya
Team Romney is blasting out copious evidence on this point as I write this. Expect the Libya 'terrorism' conversation to spill into tomorrow, for sure. Do Democrats want more discussion of Benghazi?
I thought I watched a boxing match last night after coming home from prayer group meeting.
I started to watch it, but after the first lies that came out of the arrogant pos’ mouth, I shut my TV off and went to sleep
UPDATE IX - CNN’s snap poll puts it at 46-39 for Obama. Largely in line with other numbers. Twenty-five percent said they’re now more likely to vote for Romney, Obama’s number was identical.
Disappointed this didn’t mention this same snapshot poll had Romney ahead on leadership, the economy, energy and foreign policy.
They both said things that could anger their bases, except that Romney’s base knows he means it, while Obama’s base knows that he doesn’t.
Romney also, always seems to forget that the economy was booming under W and the GOP, and that it crashed only after the Dems took control of congress. In attempting to distance himself from W, he also forgot to mention that we were attacked on 9-11-2001.
Whenever someone mentions that we had higher taxes under Clinton, and a balanced budget, as well as a booming economy. He needs to remind them that it started crashing in 2000 with the tech bust, and that we had much lower federal spending in those days.
He should say, “I’m willing to go back to Clinton era taxes, if you are willing to go back to Clinton era spending.”
That was my take too, after the first few lies I turned it off.
“...Romney’s strongest answer came after Obama attempted to apply lipstick to his failed record in office. Romney unleashed a torrent of facts that pushed back forcefully against each and every one of those claims. It should be cut into an ad as soon as possible...”
Romney was clear, articulate and in command of the unvarnished and unarguable facts. THAT in itself was a treat, coming from a career politician.
I don’t know how many people comprehend just how much of a leap that is for politics in America AND for Mitt Romney. How often do we get politicians who express themselves with that kind of unambiguous, focused and UNEMOTIONAL directness???
To emphasize what I mean: “O” continued as always with the monotonous and predictable Liberal laundry list of dated and groundless claims against Conservatism. “O’s” pathologically gratuitous and malicious ‘class baiting’ is NO substitute for a proper political platform. He makes himself an unworthy opponent. There is absolutely nothing new and original here.
Altogether apart from his offensive, summary expectation that THAT would be sufficient in light of our current situation, his smug and smarmy self-complacency and patently repellent satisfaction with himself Os doctrinaire, churchy and sing-song delivery is unendurable!!!
This sing-song delivery bothers me more than anything. It reminds me of grade school teachers who want to get/keep the attention of children or adults, who have learned English as a second language and are not comfortable expressing themselves except within the framework of this cadence.
BTW-he reminds me of our grade school fellow student who had a terrific stutter. She finally overcame the stutter with assistance and could speak without it. However, the training coached her to sing-song her speech to get past the stutter she always sounded like that!
On the contrary, I was fascinated by the steadfast manner in which the Current Occupant not only lied, but revisited the same ones again and again. He was still in a debate with the imaginary Romney that is living rent-free in his head, and not with the live, physical, and very different Mitt Romney only a few feet away. So of course, when comparing the imaginary Romney in his head and what he was saying, with what was being said live on stage, it seemed to be that in Obama’s mind, Romney was “lying”. Mitt was reciting some home truths that the pResident just did not want to hear.
About repeating that catchphrase about “five million jobs created in the private sector”, that was scarcely an offset to the millions that were swept away, to be replaced only in part, and the replacement jobs at a lower rate of pay when they were in fact “created”.
In January 2009, there were 11.1 million unemployed. In September 2012, there were reportedly 12.1 million unemployed. There, right out in the open, it looks like about a million MORE people are not now working, compared to the start of this regime.
Actually, the number is much higher, as long-term unemployed simply drop off the numbers, and go into some kind of relief program, either through disability or early retirement at reduced cash flow. Neither of the figures above include those who are “sort of” employed, at less than full-time, or in short-term temporary work, and an unknown number are engaged in some kind of entrepreneurial activity, of varying degrees of legality.
Overall, nobody’s mind was changed, not even among the “undecideds”, and the partisons for one side or the other did not have their personal faiths shaken one bit.
Debate was not a game-changer.
I tuned in late (intentionally) and, within three minutes, moderator Candy Crowley unilaterally shut down Romney on “Fast and Furious”. Hello, Game Three of the ALCS!
By the way, just before that, The One insinuated that he had performed a miracle ... that he (should that be capitalized???) prayed over a youngster who had been shot in that Colorado theater and that, now, the lad is “good as new”!
0bama carried himself like the chi-town street punk he is.
We foreced ourselves to watch about the first hour but got too angry so turned it off. Little Debbie was pimping for hussein and he was just a pile of steaming les.