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U.S. Set to Sponsor Health Insurance
The New York Times ^ | 10/27/12 | ROBERT PEAR

Posted on 10/27/2012 3:21:30 PM PDT by machman

WASHINGTON — The Obama administration will soon take on a new role as the sponsor of at least two nationwide health insurance plans to be operated under contract with the federal government and offered to consumers in every state.

.....Under the Affordable Care Act, at least one of the nationwide plans must be offered by a nonprofit entity. Insurance experts see an obvious candidate for that role: the Government Employees Health Association, a nonprofit group that covers more than 900,000 federal employees, retirees and dependents, making it the second-largest plan for federal workers, after the Blue Cross and Blue Shield program.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Business/Economy; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: healthcare; obamacare; singlepayer
Is this the next foot in the door for single payer?
1 posted on 10/27/2012 3:21:36 PM PDT by machman
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To: machman

Its more like the whole dang leg.


2 posted on 10/27/2012 3:31:56 PM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: machman

Not when they get voted out of office they’re not


3 posted on 10/27/2012 3:32:11 PM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: machman

Bye bye ‘health INSURANCE’. 0bamacare obliterates the entire concept of insurance.


4 posted on 10/27/2012 3:32:58 PM PDT by Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America
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To: machman

An October surprise? I loathe him.

I only sound his name when I need an expletive for excrement.


5 posted on 10/27/2012 3:33:49 PM PDT by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: machman

The Blue Cross (used to be for hospital claims) and Blue Shield plans have administered Medicare in all States since its inception.

They initiated most of the rules and regulations regarding coding for procedures and diagnoses.

Non-profit is a misnomer. Most Health Insurance companies began as “mutuals” - meaning the stakes (premiums and reserves) were held in trust for policyholders’ claims. Not sure that is true today.

The socialists want to get control over insurance reserves -those are some big bucks. Next - it will be the life insurance reserves.


6 posted on 10/27/2012 3:34:40 PM PDT by sodpoodle (Life is prickly - carry tweezers.)
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To: yldstrk

The scary part is obama has 2 months in which to jam all of this into place. Romney is going to need a big pair of scissors to unravel it all.....


7 posted on 10/27/2012 3:35:32 PM PDT by pollywog ("O Thou who changest not, abide with me.".......)
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To: driftdiver

Foot, leg, whole damn body....


8 posted on 10/27/2012 3:37:12 PM PDT by machman
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To: machman

This isn’t really about the push to single payer. The rest of the ACA is. It is about setting up a system which encourages the end of employer based benefits. Then people start getting accustomed to huge subsidies from the government to pay for their healthcare. The cost structure of the ACA collapses with the addition of those previously on employer based healthcare. Then we will be offered the option of paying much greater portions of the insurance premium or going on single payer. Not much of a choice. Once on single payer people will figure out what rationing means.


9 posted on 10/27/2012 3:38:36 PM PDT by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: pollywog
From Wikipedia:

"Takaful

Takaful (Arabic: التكافل) is an

Islamic insurance concept which is grounded in Islamic muamalat (Islamic banking), observing the rules and regulations of Islamic law. This concept has been practised in various forms since 622 CE.[1] Muslim jurists acknowledge that the basis of shared responsibility (in the system of aquila as practised between Muslims of Mecca and Medina) laid the foundation of mutual insurance.

Contents

1 Islamic references

2 Principles

3 Takaful companies

4 The Mudharabah model (profit-sharing)

5 References

Islamic references

These fundamentals are based on the sayings of the Islamic prophet Muhammad. Based on the hadith and Qur'anic verses mentioned below, Islamic scholars have decided that there should be a concerted effort to implement the concept of takaful as the best way to resolve these needs.[2] Some examples are:

Basis of Co-operation: Help one another in al-Birr and in al-Taqwa (virtue, righteousness and piety), but do not help one another in sin and transgression. (Surah Al-Maidah, Verse 2)[Quran 5:2]

God will always help his servant for as long as he helps others.[3]

Basis of Responsibility: The place of relationships and feelings of people with faith, between each other, is just like the body; when one of its parts is afflicted with pain, then the rest of the body will be affected.[4] One true Muslim (Mu’min) and another true Muslim are like a building, whereby every part in it strengthens the other part.[4]

Basis of Mutual Protection: By my life (which is in God’s power), nobody will enter Paradise if he does not protect his neighbour who is in distress.[5] The fundamentals underlying takaful are very similar to co-operative and mutual principles, to the extent that the co-operative and mutual model is one that is accepted under Islamic law. Some Muslims believe insurance is unnecessary, as society should help its victims. Others believe that Muslims should not ignore the fact that they live, trade and communicate with open global systems, and the need for banking and insurance. They believe in creating Muslim-friendly banking systems and a workable insurance framework by which Muslims can compete with non-Muslims in business and have coverage in daily life.

[edit] Principles

The principles of takaful are as follows:

Policyholders cooperate among themselves for their common good.

Every policyholder pays his subscription to help those who need assistance.

Losses are divided and liabilities spread according to the community pooling system.

Uncertainty is eliminated concerning subscription and compensation.

It does not derive advantage at the cost of others.

Theoretically, takaful is perceived as cooperative or mutual insurance, where members contribute a certain sum of money to a common pool. The purpose of this system is not profits, but to uphold the principle of "bear ye one another's burden". Commercial insurance is strictly disallowed for Muslims (as agreed upon by most contemporary scholars) because it contains the following elements:

Al-Gharar (uncertainty)

Al-Maisir (gambling)

Riba (usury)

There are three models (and several variations) of how takaful can be implemented:

Mudharabah model (profit-sharing)

Wakala model

A combination of both

[edit] Takaful companies

The growth in demand for Islamic insurance over recent years (particularly within the GCC countries and other areas of the Middle East), has seen a proliferation of new companies offering Islamic insurance products in these markets. The majority of these companies are full-fledged takaful operators, but conventional insurance companies have also entered the market with takaful "window" operations. As with the traditional forms of insurance, reinsurance of a takaful operation may be used, known as "retakaful".[6]

[edit] The Mudharabah model (profit-sharing)

According to this principle the al-Mudharib (takaful operator) accepts payment of the takaful installments or takaful contributions (premiums, known as ra's-ul-mal) from investors or providers of capital or funds (takaful participants), acting as sahib-ul-mal. The contract specifies how the profits (or surplus) from the operations of the takaful is to be shared in accordance with the principle of al-mudharabah – between the participants (as providers of capital) and the takaful operator. The sharing of such profit may be in a ratio of 50:50, 60:40, 70:30 and so forth, as mutually agreed between the contracting parties.

In order to eliminate the element of uncertainty in the takaful contract, the concept of tabarru ("to donate, contribute, or give away") is incorporated. Relating to this concept, a participant agrees to relinquish (as tabarru) a certain proportion of his takaful installments (or contributions) that he agrees or undertakes to pay, should any of his fellow participants suffer a defined loss. This agreement enables him to fulfill his obligation of mutual help and joint guarantee.

In essence, tabarru enables participants to perform their deeds in assisting fellow participants who might suffer a loss or damage due to a catastrophe or disaster. The sharing of profit (or surplus) that may emerge from the operations of a takaful is made only after the obligation of assisting the fellow participants has been fulfilled. It is imperative, therefore, for a takaful operator to maintain adequate assets of the defined funds under its care, whilst striving prudently to ensure the funds are sufficiently protected against over-exposure. Therefore, the provision of insurance coverage in conformity with Shariah is based on the Islamic principles of al-takaful and al-mudharabah.

Al-mudharabah is the commercial profit-sharing contract between the provider or providers of funds for a business venture and the entrepreneur who actually conducts the business. The operation of a takaful may thus be envisaged as the profit-sharing business venture between the takaful operator and the individual members of a group of participants who desire to reciprocally guarantee each other against a certain loss or damage that may be inflicted upon any one of them.

[edit] References

1.^ Origins of takaful Retrieved 2011-05-04. 2.^ Takaful Retrieved 2011-05-04.

3.^ Narratives by Imam Ahmad bin Hanbal and Imam Abu Daud.

4.^ a b Narratives by Imam al-Bukhari and Imam Muslim.

5.^ Narrative of Imam Ahmad bin Hanbal.

6.^ http://www.bnm.gov.my/guidelines/06_others/Concept%20Paper%20-%20Guidelines%20on%20Takaful%20Operational%20Framework.pdf

---------------------- So, are we all good Muslims now?

10 posted on 10/27/2012 3:41:05 PM PDT by combat_boots (The Lion of Judah cometh. Hallelujah. Gloria Patri, Filio et Spiritui Sancto.)
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To: USNBandit

I think you’re right, once those kinds of systems get installed they are impossible to unravel without a civil war.


11 posted on 10/27/2012 3:41:20 PM PDT by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: pollywog

Romney just needs to start exorcizing those Executive Orders like crazy!


12 posted on 10/27/2012 4:18:01 PM PDT by US_MilitaryRules (Unnngh! To many PDS people!)
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To: machman

It looks like the white boys in the federal government are going to own all of those “lady parts” after all. Adios “women’s health”. The government bean counters will be making all of your health decisions now.


13 posted on 10/27/2012 4:33:30 PM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (Osama bin Laden is dead, Chrysler moved to Italy and China.)
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To: driftdiver

I think its already to late to unwind. I don’t think one federal program has been undone.

Wishful thinking Romney will reverse Obamacare since he was for it before against it.


14 posted on 10/27/2012 5:00:34 PM PDT by Orange1998
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To: Orange1998

Sadly, I agree, I doubt that all of Obamacare will be repealed if Romney wins... More like they will try to change a few things around the margin, but the monstrosity has started down the road, it will hard to stop it because of sheer momentum...


15 posted on 10/27/2012 5:06:28 PM PDT by machman
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To: machman

Of course; single pay was always the aim and it still is.


16 posted on 10/27/2012 5:34:46 PM PDT by newzjunkey (Osama's dead... and so is our ambassador - Coulter.)
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To: Orange1998

I agree too. The problem is we have whole classes of people who are or want to be the “ruling class”, ie government stooges. They enjoy pushing paper and pushing people around and aren’t really capable of producing anything of worth. They are so hopelessly dependent on the system they will fight to protect it.


17 posted on 10/27/2012 5:41:07 PM PDT by Clock King
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Support Free Republic


Defeat ObamaCare
Defeat Obama

18 posted on 10/27/2012 5:50:16 PM PDT by RedMDer (https://support.woundedwarriorproject.org/default.aspx?tsid=om93destr)
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To: Orange1998

An old friend of mine sent an email a long time ago asking the question “Why are railroad tracks xx inches wide?”

After MANY paragraphs showing the history, various rules, regulations, etc. - the email traced it back to the width of Roman Chariots under Caesar. And the point of the story was exactly that - what rule, program, etc. do you think will be done away with once it is put into place?


19 posted on 10/27/2012 6:05:17 PM PDT by 21twelve (So I [God] gave them over to their stubborn hearts to follow their own devices. Psalm 81:12)
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To: 21twelve

Interesting, I enjoy this kinds of topics.


20 posted on 10/27/2012 6:35:07 PM PDT by Orange1998
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To: machman

“Insurance experts see an obvious candidate for that role: the Government Employees Health Association, a nonprofit group that covers more than 900,000 federal employees, retirees and dependents”

Oh, for @%$^s sake.


21 posted on 10/27/2012 6:40:38 PM PDT by Psycho_Bunny (Thought Puzzle: Describe Islam without using the phrase "mental disorder" more than four times.)
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To: pollywog

“The scary part is obama has 2 months in which to jam all of this into place.”

Every outgoing president normally “rams” every one of their policies via executive order. Odumbo will do it as he is a vindictive piece of trash, garbage and sh*t.


22 posted on 10/27/2012 8:51:22 PM PDT by max americana (Make the world a better place by punching a liberal in the face)
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To: 21twelve
Excellent post/ response! Also an excellent responee to”you didn't build that” bullshit! And yes that term is now acceptable because or elected President deemed it so by using it! I have driven on roads that were actually cow paths, and because of growth became roads. I am really getting disgusted with the general public. I'm self employed, and have been most of my life. I grew up in a home where my father was self employed. I own every thing i have. I just don't understand our country anymore. I wonder if I am really poor and I am just an IDIOT and don't know it.
23 posted on 10/27/2012 8:52:51 PM PDT by goodtomato (I'm really, really blessed!)
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To: Orange1998

Ditto!


24 posted on 10/27/2012 8:54:28 PM PDT by goodtomato (I'm really, really blessed!)
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To: goodtomato

responne= response, sorry for the fat fingers


25 posted on 10/27/2012 8:59:14 PM PDT by goodtomato (I'm really, really blessed!)
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To: goodtomato

“Poor” is a state of mind.


26 posted on 10/27/2012 9:01:01 PM PDT by babyfreep
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To: babyfreep
Well said my FRiend, everything seems to be colasping around me and I keep plugging along. I'm not saving what I use to, but my pantry is full with long term goods, along with my stock of “precious metals”
27 posted on 10/27/2012 9:33:19 PM PDT by goodtomato (I'm really, really blessed!)
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To: 21twelve
"what rule, program, etc. do you think will be done away with once it is put into place?"

I believe it will end up just like Medicare. Everyone eventually have no choice but the standard government care. You can purchase or company sponsored perk, supplemental insurance to fill the gap. Sadly Medicare is rifled with fraud and so will Obamacare. Most certainly additional taxes will be collected to "fix" the problem.... just like QE1, QE2, QE3 ect ect.

P.s. Doctors will have no bedside manners and will not be smiling during the care. Think quantity over quality like a Factory all in the name of reduce cost.

28 posted on 10/27/2012 9:52:19 PM PDT by Orange1998
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To: machman

Anyone surprised?

and right before the election it needs a big push right?


29 posted on 10/28/2012 2:20:20 AM PDT by GeronL (http://asspos.blogspot.com)
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