Skip to comments.If Nate Silver cannot be wrong, how can he be right?
Posted on 10/30/2012 3:43:16 AM PDT by Perdogg
have no implicit pro- or anti-Nate Silver bias.
He was a journolist and in 2008 got some secret help with his predictions from the Obama campaign, but since joining The NY Times I think he has raised his game.
I find the whole focus on Silver and his presidential election model to be particularly annoying, in part because there seems to be a lack of transparency. Is the methodology and how it is used to come up with specific percentages fully disclosed?
Whatever, Silver-mania (both pro and con) seems to have invaded way too many bodies.
I was in an SUV last Wednesday night in Austin with a group of people at a conference heading to dinner. A woman in the car got a beep on her phone, and she exclaimed words to the effect: I just got an alert, Nate Silver has Obamas chances of winning at 72.3 percent. (I may be off slightly on the percentage, but thats pretty close.)
At that moment, if I did not know it before, I understood that this Nate Silver thing had gone way too far.
Im not a numbers guy, never claimed to be. My primary strength when it comes to numbers has been to reduce complicated damages calculations to an explanation so simple that even someone as statistically illiterate as me can understand it. If I can understand the numbers, anyone can.
But theres something that doesnt require you be a numbers guy or gal which bothers me about Silver-mania.
Silver cannot be wrong because his model, whatever it is, merely puts a likelihood of success on the election. Silvers model could predict a 75% chance of an Obama win, but if Romney wins the model was not wrong because his model allowed for a 25% chance of a Romney win.
If Silver cannot be wrong, how can he be right? Heads he wins, tails you lose. Calling all philosophy majors!
Ill leave you with this. My first experience with Silver-mania was in his pre-NY Times days, when he was covering the Coakley-Brown race. According to Wikipedia, Silvers 538 model was pure genius:
FiveThirtyEight writers Schaller, Gelman, and Silver also gave extensive coverage to the January 19, 2010 Massachusetts special election to the U.S. Senate. The 538 model once again aggregated the disparate polls to correctly predict that the Republican Scott Brown would win.
The source in the footnote was Silvers January 18, 2010 blog entry, 538 Model Posits Brown as 3:1 Favorite posted at 5:26 p.m. the day before the election.
Well, yeah, duh, about 14 hours before the polls opened Silver joined the rest of the world in predicting a Brown win, but he was consistently predicting doom for Brown and was the last person to jump on board.
Heres the pertinent chronology from my post in February 2010, Beware Statisticians Bearing Advice:
Nate Silver, January 5, 2010, Wicked Awesome Thoughts on Massachusetts Special Election:
Rasmussen is supposed to have a poll out tomorrow (Tuesday) on the Massachusetts Senate Special Election, which will take place on the 19th. Theres been some speculation, mostly from Republican blogs but also from some Democratic analysts, that the Republican candidate, Scott Brown, might have a chance, which would potentially wreck the Democrats chances to pass health care reform.
Ill be curious to see what Rasmussen and the other pollsters (PPP? Suffolk?) have to say, and bears remembering that special elections are highly unpredictable affairs. But Id be somewhat surprised if the election turns out to be especially competitive.
Nate Silver, January 14, 2010, OK, Its a Toss-Up:
Earlier today I tweeted about how there wasnt enough evidence to describe the Massachusetts special election as a toss-up, as some other forecasters have done, based on the information available to us at that time.
Well, now theres some new evidence. And it isnt good for Martha Coakley.In particular, the evidence is a Suffolk University poll that shows the Republican, Scott Brown, ahead by 4 points, 50-46.
Nate Silver, January 17, 2010, 538 Still Rates Massachusetts as Toss-up:
Please dont be too enthralled with/scared by the specific numbers below. Theyre based a number of assumptions which may not be valid. However, I agree with the characterization that the model comes to, which is that the Massachusetts special election should continue to be regarded as a toss-up.
Nate Silver, January 19, 2010, Defying Odds, Republican Brown Becomes Next Senator from Massachusetts: In an outcome that would have been unthinkable just weeks ago, Republican Scott Brown has become the Senator-elect from Massachusetts.
Silver was as wrong as anyone could be in the Brown-Coakley race, yet came out a hero because his model predicted at 75% chance Brown would win late in the day before the election.
I neither a Nate Silver lover nor hater be.
But when someone has a model which cannot be proven right or wrong, Im not buying whatever it is hes selling.
Silver is the Octomom of the 2012 election...can’t explain his popularity but he’s been screwed up since the beginning.
Silver is one of these guys who claims that he was some big-time “professional” poker player several years ago, yet he has no noteworthy results anywhere on the record to his name. I meet clowns like this about every other week.
Silver is a fag. Hence his erotic love for obama.
Over at DU, they are hanging on to Silver like a god (why not - other than Obama, they don’t seem to have any other!).
If he is wrong, I don’t think they’ll be forgiving.
nate silver is not fit to lick the stains from Michael Barrone’s toilet bowl and Barone... the absolute undisputed master of elections... state by state... county by county... and he predicts MITT WILL KICK THE KENYAN’S ARSE!
nate silver is not fit to lick the stains from Michael Barone’s toilet bowl and Barone... the absolute undisputed master of elections... state by state... county by county... and he predicts MITT WILL KICK THE KENYAN’S ARSE!
Silver was a very successful MSNL grinder on partypoker before the UIGEA was passed, he quit playing rather than play on sites that kept allowing deposits in violation of the new law.
Some people don’t seem to understand his forecasting, he isn’t saying that Obama’s hand is 50% better than Romney’s, he’s saying that Obama’s hand will win 75% of the time even though it might only be slightly better (AKs over AQo).
Romney has a very good hand, but Obama has him out kicked (electorally) and he is suited (incumbent) with only one street (week) remaining.
Maybe... but Obama is underwater on the economy, the deficit, taxes and his approval rating. I don’t think he can turn it around in the time that is left.
And with some Blue States turning purple, O’s situation is precarious. All he can do now is hope Romney will snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
A key ingredient is luck.
The former Daily Koz employee is a sick joke but a dangerous Axelrod stooge !
Silver is as credible as David Brooks.
And, like Brooks, Silver is a legend in his own mind.
I don’t buy that he was as good as he claims. If he was, he would have continued playing brick and mortar games (which usually tend to be easier than online), and he would have at least one or two noteworthy tournament results, and he has none at all.
Nate is in the early stages of AIDS Dementia.
Live poker, especially tournament poker, is a completely game than online poker.
Online before the UIGEA Americans could legally play 24 tables at a time, which made playing poker like asset management or investing in the stock market; live poker is more akin to gambling - not that there isn’t (math) skill involved, but when your entire portfolio can ride on the result of a one hand at a time the results become as unstable as selling insurance to one client at a time.