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Senate bill rewrite lets feds read your e-mail without warrants
CNET ^ | |November 20, 2012 | Declan McCullagh

Posted on 11/20/2012 7:34:40 AM PST by Cheerio

Proposed law scheduled for a vote next week originally increased Americans' e-mail privacy. Then law enforcement complained. Now it increases government access to e-mail and other digital files.

(Excerpt) Read more at news.cnet.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Front Page News; Government
KEYWORDS: bigbrother; bighollywood; copyrightlaw; cultureofcorruption; democratscandals; donutwatch; doublestandard; fascism; hollywoodvalues; homelandsecurity; hr2471; leakyleahy; mediacomplex; nationalistsecurity; patrickleahy; policestate; reid; senate; snailmailrules; snooping; traitor; waronamericans; waronconstitution; wiretapping
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Where is the outrage similar to the leftiest waged against the Patriot Act during the GWB regime?
1 posted on 11/20/2012 7:34:45 AM PST by Cheerio
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To: Cheerio

“F” that!


2 posted on 11/20/2012 7:37:31 AM PST by WellyP (question!)
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To: Cheerio

“F” that!


3 posted on 11/20/2012 7:37:39 AM PST by WellyP (question!)
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To: Cheerio

That was my first thought.


4 posted on 11/20/2012 7:39:27 AM PST by arichtaxpayer
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To: Cheerio
Dear Government snoop:

If you are reading this E-Mail, you eat s... and bark at the moon.

5 posted on 11/20/2012 7:39:44 AM PST by Enterprise ("Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." Voltaire)
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To: Cheerio
"Big Brother" is watching each and every one of us.

Never thought it would happen in America, but ... it has.

6 posted on 11/20/2012 7:42:41 AM PST by OldNavyVet
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To: Cheerio

Everyone talked about how this could/would happen when the Patriot Act was introduced..


7 posted on 11/20/2012 7:47:20 AM PST by stuartcr ("When silence speaks, it speaks only to those that have already decided what they want to hear.")
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To: arichtaxpayer

can this be used to find out what the EPA is up to ?


8 posted on 11/20/2012 7:48:08 AM PST by molson209
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To: Cheerio
Is looking more and more like we will be going radio silent and underground. May need to come up with a new form of this:


9 posted on 11/20/2012 7:49:37 AM PST by Eagle of Liberty (Be the Enemy Within the Enemy Within...)
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To: Cheerio

“Proposed law scheduled for a vote next week originally increased Americans’ e-mail privacy. Then law enforcement complained. Now it increases government access to e-mail and other digital files.”

Surprise. Surprise. Government employees are more interested in making their jobs “easier” than in “protecting and serving” as their vehicles claim.


10 posted on 11/20/2012 7:50:30 AM PST by Altariel ("Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!")
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To: Eagle of Liberty
s looking more and more like we will be going radio silent and underground. May need to come up with a new form of this:

I think your absolutely right. Everything this regime is doing is going to send the public underground. It will be a black market black ops world.

11 posted on 11/20/2012 7:54:35 AM PST by jetson
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To: Cheerio
The Government already captures & stores all of our emails, texts, phone calls & electronic purchases with plans to increase their capabilities --

The NSA Is Building the Country’s Biggest Spy Center (Watch What You Say)

Most conservatives gave Bush a free pass on this. Now, most liberals are doing the same.

12 posted on 11/20/2012 7:55:33 AM PST by gdani
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To: Cheerio

“Where is the outrage similar to the leftiest waged against the Patriot Act during the GWB regime?”

The same place ours was during the time the foundations were poured for this with the Patriot Act and Department of Homeland Security. All wrapped up in the warm, soft diapers of credulous party loyalty and complacency.


13 posted on 11/20/2012 8:01:56 AM PST by Psalm 144 (For Chicken Little the sky is always falling.)
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To: Eagle of Liberty

I like your tagline and the mindset behind it.


14 posted on 11/20/2012 8:02:44 AM PST by Psalm 144 (For Chicken Little the sky is always falling.)
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To: Nachum

Ping.


15 posted on 11/20/2012 8:10:26 AM PST by Army Air Corps (Four Fried Chickens and a Coke)
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To: Cheerio
Then law enforcement complained

Traitors!
16 posted on 11/20/2012 8:16:36 AM PST by microgood
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To: arichtaxpayer

When they came for my neighbor, I said nothing.


17 posted on 11/20/2012 8:17:29 AM PST by woodenickel
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To: Jet Jaguar; NorwegianViking; ExTexasRedhead; HollyB; FromLori; EricTheRed_VocalMinority; ...

The list, Ping

Let me know if you would like to be on or off the ping list

http://www.nachumlist.com/


18 posted on 11/20/2012 8:20:08 AM PST by Nachum (The List was hacked- www.nachumlist.com)
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To: Cheerio

The House has to approve this, correct? Can they stop it? Will they even try?


19 posted on 11/20/2012 8:22:13 AM PST by madison10
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To: Cheerio
Who is CNET? Also I read through the whole article and didn't find what this bill is called. Such as Senate Bill SB1234 etc.

A person should be able to go read the actual bill.

20 posted on 11/20/2012 8:32:31 AM PST by Spunky (We lost so now I am thinking of joining them and getting an Obamaphone.)
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To: madison10
The House has to approve this, correct? Can they stop it? Will they even try?

Looking at both parties' shredding of the Constitution in the name of "national security" since 9/11, of course they will not try.

And here we are at FR, wailing & moaning over & over about Obamacare (which, for the record, does suck). But, we're mostly silent on far worse dangers to the Bill of Rights and society in general.

21 posted on 11/20/2012 8:34:53 AM PST by gdani
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To: Cheerio

If Bush were president the hypocritical outrage would never stop. But there’s a marxist in the white house. Not a word from the left because they approve of this.


22 posted on 11/20/2012 8:37:11 AM PST by I want the USA back
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To: Spunky

For the technologically impaired, cnet is probably THE leading internet site for popularized computer and internet technology.

And yes, they are leftist MSM, leaving out many important facts.


23 posted on 11/20/2012 8:39:06 AM PST by jjotto ("Ya could look it up!")
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To: Cheerio

My very thoughts exactly.


24 posted on 11/20/2012 8:40:59 AM PST by MagnoliaB
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To: gdani
The Government already captures & stores all of our emails, texts, phone calls & electronic purchases with plans to increase their capabilities --

Exactly. This bill will only legalize what they are already doing. The only time that privacy is a right is when it comes to abortion.

25 posted on 11/20/2012 8:47:11 AM PST by Hoodat ("As for God, His way is perfect" - Psalm 18:30)
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To: Cheerio

So when does that “protect and defend the Constitution of the United States” part of their oath supposed to kick in?


26 posted on 11/20/2012 8:47:11 AM PST by WKUHilltopper (And yet...we continue to tolerate this crap...)
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To: Cheerio

Anyone that would send anything by email and expect the government NOT to already be reading it is naive.


27 posted on 11/20/2012 8:48:51 AM PST by Portcall24
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To: Cheerio

To be used by the DNC to eliminate conservative candidates in the primaries...

FULeakyLeahy


28 posted on 11/20/2012 8:50:06 AM PST by a fool in paradise (America 2013 - STUCK ON STUPID)
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To: Cheerio
Hah! The Gov’t has been able to read your emails since at least 1986 as long as they are over 6 months old and a subpoena is issued from a prosecutor!

No warrant required!

29 posted on 11/20/2012 8:50:18 AM PST by Theoria (Romney is a Pyrrhic victory.)
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To: Theoria

>>....has been able to read your emails...<<

....and I thought it was the *drafts* that both senders were accessing for their communications... about the launch codes to his missile. Heh.


30 posted on 11/20/2012 8:56:08 AM PST by Daffynition (Self-respect: the secure feeling that no one, as yet, is suspicious. ~ HLM)
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To: Daffynition

ROFL. Good one...


31 posted on 11/20/2012 9:00:04 AM PST by Theoria (Romney is a Pyrrhic victory.)
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To: Spunky
Also I read through the whole article and didn't find what this bill is called. Such as Senate Bill SB1234 etc.

It looks like it may be related to the bill listed under consideration for this day:

Senate Judiciary Committee

Which refers to this bill:

H.R. 2471

But don't worry, the bill is innocuously titled:

clarify that a video tape service provider ... ...may obtain a consumer’s informed, written consent on an ongoing basis and that consent may be obtained through the Internet.

IOW, it sounds like every time you agree to terms and conditions you'll be granting those 22 agencies the right to examine your stuff.
32 posted on 11/20/2012 9:00:32 AM PST by andyk (I have sworn...eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.)
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To: stuartcr

Hillary Clinton held 900 FBI files without a damn patriot act or criminal prosecution.

Evil people are going to do evil things, the law be dammed.


33 posted on 11/20/2012 9:01:51 AM PST by a fool in paradise (America 2013 - STUCK ON STUPID)
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To: Spunky
Dang, nailed by the copy-paste anti-pattern. Here's the bill:

H.R. 2471

It's hard to tell whether that includes Reid's latest revisions. The dates seem too old for that.
34 posted on 11/20/2012 9:03:32 AM PST by andyk (I have sworn...eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.)
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To: gdani

Good reminder.


35 posted on 11/20/2012 9:03:49 AM PST by Altariel ("Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!")
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To: microgood

Some in law enforcement claim that everyone is guilty of something and that the first words out of any “perp’s” mouth are a lie.


36 posted on 11/20/2012 9:05:36 AM PST by a fool in paradise (America 2013 - STUCK ON STUPID)
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To: Spunky
A person should be able to go read the actual bill.

Pelosi: we have to pass the health care bill so that you can find out what is in it
37 posted on 11/20/2012 9:09:22 AM PST by Cheerio (Barry Hussein Soetoro-0bama=The Complete Destruction of American Capitalism)
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To: Cheerio
So, for all out there, delete FB accounts, no more webmail (use Thunderbird or Outlook), no more "Cloud," etc. Keep away from all social sites.

Of course I'm sure they'll be coming after FR if this bill passes. Dark, dark, clouds on the horizon.....

38 posted on 11/20/2012 9:09:38 AM PST by ducttape45
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To: Cheerio

3n(ryp7 3v3ry7hn6, 3v3n |337 15 u53fu|.


39 posted on 11/20/2012 9:14:17 AM PST by DBrow
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To: molson209

No, govt emails are private and only the approved party in power can have access to those. Never mind the private emails violate numerous laws.


40 posted on 11/20/2012 9:17:28 AM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: Spunky
It's S.3414, apparently. ***** It's backk!! Controversial proposal regarding public/private sharing via the DHS gets

In recent years the U.S. has struggled under the weight of constant cyberattacks from China.  But in recent months, a new threat has emerged -- Iran -- a nation the U.S. long wrote off a cyber-weakling.

I. Reviving S.3414

In the midst of this two-sided battle, the Obama administration is making a second pitch to members of Congress to revive and pass a slightly modified version of the Cybersecurity Act of 2012 (S. 3414).

The administration's argument is basically, "Hey, we'll take out the parts of the cybersecurity bill that you don't necessarily want to be seen supporting, and replace them with executive orders."

Most on both sides of the aisle agree that in the perfect world there would be some sort of exchange of threat information between the government and the private sector; the question is how to do that, without imposing onerous red tape on the private sector.

There is some base controversy about the fact that the administration's plan flows data through the U.S. Department of Homeland Security (DHS).  Rep. Ron Paul (R-TX) has attacked the bill, which he calls a "big brother writ at large", and also called out the DHS as an "inefficient and redundant entity, commenting, "It’s the inefficiency of the bureaucracy that is the problem. So, increasing this with the Department of Homeland Security and spending more money doesn't absolve us of the problem."

Digital data
Businesses are mistrustful of the government's ability to secure their risk analyses.
[Image Source: Stream 20]

But many Republicans are supportive of having the DHS handle terrorist threats -- including in cyberspace; after all it was a Republican who created the DHS in the post-9/11 aftermath.

The part that bothers the majority of Republicans is opposition from major businesses which fear Sec. 102 "Sector-by-sector cyber risk assessments".  The concern from the private sector lies not so much in the cost -- businesses will generally be forced to perform such risk analyses anyhow.  Rather, there's fear that the government could lose this data as it has lost masses of data in the past (Wikileaks, anyone?) exposing potentially embarrassing and damaging vulnerabilities.

So the Obama administration may snip the Sec. 102 language, while keeping the basic concept of the government sharing information on threats with private sector firms like banks and defense contractors.  Senator Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-NV) is reportedly preparing to introduce the slightly revised bill, according to Reuters.

Comments Jeffrey Ratner, senior adviser for cybersecurity on the Senate Homeland Security Committee, on the removal of the Sec. 102 language, "[Bill coauthor Joe Lieberman] wants legislation [on risk analysis], but he's willing to focus on the rest of this bill, because there are important things there that he believes need to be implemented."

II. Watered Down or Bipartisan Compromise?

Sen. Joe Lieberman (I-NH) is one of the bill's coauthors, who is working with Sen. Reid, a former party colleague on the draft.

DHS Secretary Janet Napolitano says the bill will not create new bureaucracy, merely improve and codify efforts that are already underway.  She comments, "We know there are … vulnerabilities. We are working with [private industry] on that."

The revised bill is likely to move closer to a bipartisan bill proposed by House of Representatives by Chairman of the House Intelligence Committee Rep. Mike Rogers (R-MI) and the top Democrat on that panel, Rep. C.A. Ruppersberger (D-MD).  That bill is known as the The Cyber Intelligence Sharing and Protection Act (H.R. 3523)

The plan is to pass the pared down bill, which some critics call a "watered down" version of S. 3414.  President Obama will then try to implement some of the removed features via executive orders, placing the blame or credit for them on his own administration, not Congress.
 
Obama, tired
President Obama's cabinet is looking to implement the missing features of S.3414 with executive orders. [Image Source: Associated Press]

But even if that plan may be palatable to Congress, not everyone thinks it will help safeguard the U.S.  Dmitri Alperovitch, chief technology officer of CrowdStrike, argued to Reuters that the real problem is that U.S. lacks the backbone to initiate digital counterstrikes or offline trade repercussions against those who attack it.

"We're having the wrong debate," he says, "What's the benefit of information-sharing if you're not going to act on the information?"
http://www.dailytech.com/Amid+Recent+Cyberattacks+Senate+Poised+to+Revive+Cybersecurity+Bill/article29086.htm
41 posted on 11/20/2012 9:19:09 AM PST by Altariel ("Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal!")
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To: DBrow

Rapelcg rireglguvat jvgu ebg13. Vg’f gur bayl jnl gb or fher gung gurl pna’g ernq lbhe znvy.
Lrf, guvf vf fnepnfz. Qbjaybnq CTC, yrnea gb hfr vg. HFR vg!


42 posted on 11/20/2012 9:25:25 AM PST by zeugma (Those of us who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.)
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To: zeugma

I totally agree with you. Also if you change your ID to a Muslim name, you’ll probably be OK.


43 posted on 11/20/2012 9:30:32 AM PST by sanjuanbob
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To: zeugma

they have backdoors into any commercial encryption software plus the computing power to break most others.


44 posted on 11/20/2012 9:39:03 AM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: zeugma

Exactly.


45 posted on 11/20/2012 9:42:22 AM PST by madison10
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To: a fool in paradise
Some in law enforcement claim that everyone is guilty of something and that the first words out of any “perp’s” mouth are a lie.

Well, given that you can commit a 'felony' by putting prescription drugs in one of those boxes designed for daily meds, yeah, just about every american is guilty of something.

46 posted on 11/20/2012 9:47:40 AM PST by zeugma (Those of us who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.)
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To: zeugma
"Well, given that you can commit a 'felony' by putting prescription drugs in one of those boxes designed for daily meds, yeah, just about every american is guilty of something."

Did you really think we want those laws observed? said Dr. Ferris. We want them to be broken. You'd better get it straight that it's not a bunch of boy scouts you're up against... We're after power and we mean it... There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws. Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens? What's there in that for anyone? But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced or objectively interpreted and you create a nation of law-breakers and then you cash in on guilt. Now that's the system, Mr. Reardon, that's the game, and once you understand it, you'll be much easier to deal with.

Ayn Rand,
Atlas Shrugged 1957

47 posted on 11/20/2012 9:53:14 AM PST by meowmeow (In Loving Memory of Our Dear Viking Kitty (1987-2006))
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To: Psalm 144
I like your tagline and the mindset behind it.

THANK YOU!
48 posted on 11/20/2012 10:15:04 AM PST by Eagle of Liberty (Be the Enemy Within the Enemy Within...)
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To: zeugma

Gurer vf n serrjner TAH CTC irefvba gung vf fhccbfrq gb or tbbq, gbb. CTC vf abg gur bayl fbhepr. Naq nf V fhfcrpg lbh xabj Sversbk unf n YRRGXRL cyhtva jvgu frireny bcgbaf.

Thanks!


49 posted on 11/20/2012 10:37:30 AM PST by DBrow
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To: WellyP

E-mail is not private, in effect. But passing a law allowing it to accessed and read would allow it to be used as evidence against you.

For example, hypothetically, you receive investment advice spam through e-mail as part of a personal effort to learn more about economics. Intruder, looking for a case and maybe some extra revenues/debt, reads it and assumes that you have extra money to invest, even though you’re poor and haven’t hidden any income from anyone. Heh...there you are. Trouble.

Imagine uses of exaggerations and false assumptions from such information used against you in the current, hysterical political atmosphere. As for snail mail, I saw a case where police illegally received and opened letters from a postal employee during the ‘70s with no punishment for doing so.

We’re morally bankrupt as a nation. We’ve become un-American in regards to what our country once was. Look closely at the demographics of politicians and other leaders of the past for a clue.


50 posted on 11/20/2012 10:38:43 AM PST by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of rotten politics smelled around the planet.)
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