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If The Right Gets Its Way, The 'Fiscal Cliff' Will Kill Social Security And Medicare
TBI- A Taxing Matter ^ | 11-22-2012 | Linda McKissack Beale

Posted on 11/22/2012 10:00:35 AM PST by blam

If The Right Gets Its Way, The 'Fiscal Cliff' Will Kill Social Security And Medicare

Linda McKissack Beale
A Taxing Matter
Nov. 22, 2012, 9:52 AM

In several posts recently I have discussed the harmful demands the right is engaging in related to the so-called "fiscal cliff" created by the original Bush tax cuts (set to sunset en masse), the artificial debt ceiling (used by the GOP to exact promises of spending cuts during a recession along with extension of unneeded tax cuts for the rich), and the ill-conceived notion that the U.S. military should continue to be funded at dangerously high levels that (i) ensure that the military-industrial complex will find a war or quasi-war in which to engage their newest toys while (ii) sucking resources from public infrastructure projects and education that are vitally needed to sustain our economy.

See, e.g., The GOP's extortion demands: cut Social Security or we'll shoot; If the Dems got backbone; Is it a fiscal cliff or merely a bump in the road; We face an 'austerity crisis' not a 'fiscal cliff.

A. The Explanation.

At least the national media and a slew of bloggers are beginning to provide some background information to ordinary Americans on just what is driving the national discussion of "fiscal cliffs" and "austerity" demands.

See, e.g., Richard Rubin & Heidi Przybyla, Tax Pledges Confound Math as Obama Seeks Deal with Republicans, Bloomberg.com (Nov. 16, 2012) (noting that "The $607 billion fiscal cliff is the combination of tax increases and spending cuts that will take effect in January if Congress doesn’t act" and characterizing the positions of the parties as follows: "Republicans want to extend expiring tax cuts for all income levels

(snip)

(Excerpt) Read more at businessinsider.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: fiscalcliff; medicare; republicans; socialsecurity; ss

1 posted on 11/22/2012 10:00:45 AM PST by blam
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To: blam

It’s going to happen no matter what. Blaming the “right” is stupid. The “right” has absolutly NO POWER whatsoever.


2 posted on 11/22/2012 10:04:11 AM PST by GeronL (http://asspos.blogspot.com)
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To: blam
There is no more money. If the "fiscal cliff" is passed, there is that "fiscal abyss" right behind it.
3 posted on 11/22/2012 10:06:05 AM PST by Sooth2222 ("Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of congress. But I repeat myself." M.Twain)
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To: blam

It’s NOT a “fiscal cliff”....it’s a SPENDING CLIFF!!!!


4 posted on 11/22/2012 10:11:18 AM PST by goodnesswins (R.I.P. Doherty, Smith, Stevens, Woods.)
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To: GeronL

“The “right” has absolutly NO POWER whatsoever”

And certainly no desire to lead.


5 posted on 11/22/2012 10:12:44 AM PST by freeangel ( (free speech is only good until someone else doesn't like it)
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To: freeangel

yep


6 posted on 11/22/2012 10:15:07 AM PST by GeronL (http://asspos.blogspot.com)
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To: blam

Something is going to kill Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid and a lot of other stuff. The sooner these things die the sooner the economy can rationalize itself. I am not a young kid contemplating being taxed most of my earnings to support a bunch of old folks. I am an old folk. A third of my income is Social Security. I am stuck on Medicare. Kill the ravening beast now. I would rather the deprivation now than watch the impoverishment of my children and grandchildren in order to support an army of high living bureaucrats and, as the raison d’être for the good livings of those bureaucrats, my SS check, while also being progressively impoverished as that SS check declines rapidly in value even as the number on it stays the same. AND that Medicare isn’t going to be worth more than aspirin and hospice after another year or so anyway.


7 posted on 11/22/2012 10:16:29 AM PST by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson ONLINE www.fee.org/library/books/economics-in-one-lesson)
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To: blam

Soc Security and Medicare should have been killed LONG ago...they are merely in the last throes of end stage cancer, having eaten their host....the “host” that thinks it can live on something someone else pays for.


8 posted on 11/22/2012 10:18:05 AM PST by goodnesswins (R.I.P. Doherty, Smith, Stevens, Woods.)
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To: arthurus

I tried reading your Economic lesson...can’t access it...any tricks?


9 posted on 11/22/2012 10:21:30 AM PST by goodnesswins (R.I.P. Doherty, Smith, Stevens, Woods.)
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To: goodnesswins
Sounds good. Just give me back the $100K or so that I am my employers paid into it and I'll go my own way.

The truth. If all of us did this, it would definitely go bust. Sort of like a ponzi scheme.

10 posted on 11/22/2012 10:24:59 AM PST by dhs12345
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To: blam

Republicans should not make any effort to block Obama’s agenda.

Let’s see where he takes us.

Then we cam tell the world: “Obama did this.”


11 posted on 11/22/2012 10:31:13 AM PST by ClearCase_guy (Global Warming is a religion, and I don't want to be taxed to pay for a faith that is not mine.)
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To: blam

Social Security and Medicare are about the only things that the fiscal cliff will not impact.


12 posted on 11/22/2012 10:35:23 AM PST by Mike Darancette (I don't understand why the Boomers are so passive.)
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To: blam

If The Left Gets Its Way, Debt And Recession Will Kill Social Security And Medicare


13 posted on 11/22/2012 10:35:34 AM PST by mrsmith (Dumb sluts: Lifeblood of the Media, Backbone of the Democrat Party!)
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To: mrsmith; All

In the world view of the left, everything bad is the fault of conservatives, republicans, “the rich” or anyone else but the left.

Everything good is the result of the efforts of the left.

It does not matter what the facts are, the left will find a way to rationalize their actions and blame any bad consequences on the right.


14 posted on 11/22/2012 10:39:42 AM PST by marktwain
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To: blam

They are being killed by the fact that it is impossible to spend more than you take in forever. Defy the natural laws of economics and mathematics at your peril....


15 posted on 11/22/2012 10:41:47 AM PST by GenXteacher (You have chosen dishonor to avoid war; you shall have war also.)
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To: blam
I’m sorry, but wasn’t Obama actually present and voted for extending the tax cuts, voted for the massive overspending, and signed the other legislation as president?

Oh, right, forgot, he’s a black man and mentioning this is racist. It’s all the fault of evil Republicans.

16 posted on 11/22/2012 10:53:35 AM PST by kingu (Everything starts with slashing the size and scope of the federal government.)
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To: blam

More lies


17 posted on 11/22/2012 11:07:42 AM PST by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote; then find me a real conservative to vote for)
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To: blam

Oh goody. Another “Let’s scare old people” story.

Is ANYTHING ever new under the Democrat sun??


18 posted on 11/22/2012 11:08:35 AM PST by DustyMoment (Congress - another name for white collar criminals!!)
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To: goodnesswins
Here are several options:

http://www.amazon.com/Economics-One-Lesson-Shortest-Understand/dp/0517548232 ->Kindle

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=economics+inone+lwsson ->book

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=economics+inone+lwsson ->on-line PDF

http://steshaw.org/economics-in-one-lesson/preface_new_ed.html ->just on-line

http://www.audible.com/pd?asin=B002V0KK0C&mkwid=s3SEtwpsL&pcrid=17956079889&pmt=b&pkw=_inurl:asin%3D&source_code=GO1DG9019WS113010&gclid=CIe1oaai47MCFQ45nAodqBgAmw -> order audio book

19 posted on 11/22/2012 11:12:25 AM PST by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson ONLINE www.fee.org/library/books/economics-in-one-lesson)
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To: dhs12345
“Sort of like a ponzi scheme.”

Exactly what it is, I think maybe I got in and will croak before it collapses

20 posted on 11/22/2012 11:25:30 AM PST by dalereed
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To: blam

What right?,,, Theres a right?.... Where?....


21 posted on 11/22/2012 11:40:52 AM PST by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole..)
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To: dalereed

If one looks at the SS act of 1935 and who was covered at that time, you realize it was intended to be a benefit for the poor, the disabled, for widows and orphens. It gradually morphed into a retirement plan for the middle class.


22 posted on 11/22/2012 11:46:45 AM PST by RobbyS (Christus rex.)
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To: blam

They need to look back over the last four years to see what drove us over the cliff.

It astounds me how the left successfully blames the right for every disaster time after time. They had the whole works four years ago yet, instead of even acknowledging our budget problems they went on the largest spending spree in history.

How can we get the word out to the old people sitting at their tvs with no other input.


23 posted on 11/22/2012 12:16:48 PM PST by Kenny (<p)
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To: blam
"If The Right Gets Its Way, The 'Fiscal Cliff' Will Kill Social Security And Medicare"

.... LOL .... this is such a great example of how the left is so successful in getting their point of view out to the public. They get way way .... waaaaaay out in front of an issue and begin sowing and planting their talking points all throughout their adoring media. Then at the same time the leftwardly prone politicians do the same. Suddenly when the event actually happens all they need to do is go on a "See I told you so" tour solidifying the belief in the mind of the public psyche. Thus far they have had a successful 12 years of demonizing Bush for all of his policies ... The constant repetition of a statement aka talking point when repeated often enough is the best way to drill a hole into the mind and make the thought permanent.

Strangely enough .... the left uses this technique 99% of the time in a very predictable way. So much so that we can actually predict their statements! And for some reason .... even though the right is quite aware of their techniques .... they are almost always caught by surprise with next to no response on hand to counteract the brain washing technique of the left. And even then ... the only responses will come from the conservative talking heads and talk show hosts .... without hardly a peep coming out of the mouths of our illustrious elected leaders.

Perhaps in the future there may actually come a time when the right can co-ordinate their responses in a tactical way using both the communication machinery, which mostly preaches to the choir while at the same time having the elected officials verbalizing the ideas on the house and senate floors which will then be relayed to the ears of the public.

24 posted on 11/22/2012 12:59:56 PM PST by R_Kangel ( "A Nation of Sheep ..... Will Beget ..... a Nation Ruled by Wolves.")
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To: GeronL

“It’s going to happen no matter what. Blaming the “right” is stupid. The “right” has absolutly NO POWER whatsoever.”

No, actually, politically, it’s brilliantly diabolical.

If something is inevitable and unpopular, blame your opponent early and often. With a complicit media, the message will get through.

This strategy will give them the excuse to do just about anything to conservatives, including rounding the up and shooting them for “killing grandma”


25 posted on 11/22/2012 1:07:17 PM PST by RFEngineer
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To: blam

Obama owns the fiscal cliff. We need to tell every lefty Obama owns it and don’t forget it.

They voted for this disaster.


26 posted on 11/22/2012 2:04:58 PM PST by FreeAtlanta (bahits.com)
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To: R_Kangel; All
same time having the elected officials verbalizing the ideas on the house and senate floors which will then be relayed to the ears of the public.

This is where your plan fails. Elected officials often verbalize the ideas on the House and Senate floors, but the MSM *will not* relay those speeches to the public.

This was first driven home to me after the 1994 elections. The MSM was blaming the government shutdown on the Republicans, when it was clear that it was President Clinton that was making that decision. I saw Newt Gingrich make a brilliant speech on C-Span that, if seen by the public, would have swayed a great number to our side. It was never seen anywhere but C-Span, the networks simply refused to show it.

The MSM must die so that the Republic may live. The question is, will it die fast enough to save the Republic?

27 posted on 11/22/2012 2:08:36 PM PST by marktwain
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To: blam

One possible solution is starting a review process for young adults. Those who were classified as learning disabled as minors generated SSI for parents - and often automatically get disability as young adults. But the first diagnosis was for schools that wanted extra money for special education, parents who wanted SSI and easier academics for their kids.


28 posted on 11/22/2012 2:08:47 PM PST by tbw2
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To: blam

So why did you post this @@!#$!#$@#$??? I stopped reading after she blamed the GOP/right for the whole mess.


29 posted on 11/22/2012 2:11:25 PM PST by Tolerance Sucks Rocks (Obama should change his campaign slogan to "Yes, we am!" Sounds as stupid as his administration is.)
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To: GeronL

Technically, the “right” does control the House. Unfortunately, that control is led by John Boehner, the Great, Spineless Weeper.


30 posted on 11/22/2012 2:13:00 PM PST by Tolerance Sucks Rocks (Obama should change his campaign slogan to "Yes, we am!" Sounds as stupid as his administration is.)
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To: blam

We are so divided now I looked at the authors name and said Oh woman - socialist. I get it.


31 posted on 11/22/2012 2:13:00 PM PST by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: arthurus

You make some good points. We’re on So-So Security and Medicare, too; but still able to do a bit of work along with it to make it not so nippity-tuck. I agree.


32 posted on 11/22/2012 2:23:16 PM PST by Twinkie (Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.)
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To: dhs12345

All of it is already spent, and the national debt is 16 trillion dollars. You’ll get back pennies on the dollar at most. Just be grateful if they drop FICA along with SS.


33 posted on 11/22/2012 2:28:29 PM PST by Tolerance Sucks Rocks (Obama should change his campaign slogan to "Yes, we am!" Sounds as stupid as his administration is.)
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To: arthurus

You sound like my Dad. He’s drawing SS, but he’s willing to give it up.


34 posted on 11/22/2012 2:29:47 PM PST by Tolerance Sucks Rocks (Obama should change his campaign slogan to "Yes, we am!" Sounds as stupid as his administration is.)
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To: blam
The left creates a problem. When things crash and burn they blame the right. The only answer (they say) is more left wing nonsense. Rinse and repeat.
35 posted on 11/22/2012 5:53:32 PM PST by jdsteel (Give me freedom, not more government.)
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To: Tolerance Sucks Rocks

You mean the government politicians lied to me?????

But they are promising the same thing with Obamacare. Gee, should I trust them?

/sarc


36 posted on 11/26/2012 6:19:56 AM PST by dhs12345
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To: dhs12345

If there ever was any money squirreled away in the alleged trust fund, it’s all spent now. Money for current retirees is paid with taxes from future retirees. It’s basically a Ponzi Scheme in which almost all Americans are forced to participate.

If Social Security collapses, simply insist that the government eliminate FICA, because that’s as far as we’re gonna get, if we’re lucky.


37 posted on 11/26/2012 9:22:04 AM PST by Tolerance Sucks Rocks (Obama should change his campaign slogan to "Yes, we am!" Sounds as stupid as his administration is.)
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To: blam
Professor Linda M. Beale received a B.S. degree in chemistry magna cum laude from Duke University, an M.A .and Ph.D. in linguistics from Cornell, where she was a Herbert Lehman Fellow, a J.D. summa cum laude from Cornell Law School, and an LL.M. in taxation from New York University. Prior to her entry in law teaching, Professor Beale clerked with Judge Dorothy Nelson on the Ninth Circuit and worked at Cleary, Gottlieb, Steen and Hamilton in New York (with one year in Washington, D.C.) as a tax associate. Her work with Cleary’s many financial institution and multinational corporate clients included a wide range of tax issues such as securitizations, partnerships, and cross-border corporate mergers and acquisitions. She has also served as a congressional staffer, a Peace Corps volunteer in Colombia, and a university administrator at Binghamton University.

And is married to Rachel Maddow no doubt.

38 posted on 11/26/2012 9:33:50 AM PST by McGruff (No New RINOs!)
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