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They Are Going To Make It Nearly Impossible To Pass On A Farm Or A Business To Your Children
Economic Collapse ^ | 20 November 2012 | Michael

Posted on 11/24/2012 6:59:49 AM PST by Lorianne

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1 posted on 11/24/2012 6:59:51 AM PST by Lorianne
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To: Lorianne

If you have a farm or a small business, would you like to pass it on to your children when you die? Well, unless Congress does something, it is going to become much, much harder to do that starting next year. Right now, there is a 5 million dollar estate tax exemption and anything above that is taxed at 35 percent. But on January 1st, the exemption will go down to 1 million dollars and the tax rate will go up to 55 percent. A lot of liberals are very excited about this, because they believe that the government will be soaking wealthy people like Warren Buffett and Bill Gates.

But the truth is that a lot of farms, ranches and small businesses will be absolutely devastated by this change in the tax law. There are many farmers and ranchers out there today that do not make much money but are sitting on tracts of land that are worth millions of dollars. According to the American Farm Bureau, approximately 97 percent of all farms and ranches in the United States would be subject to the estate tax if the exemption was reduced to just a million dollars. That means that the children of these farmers and ranchers would be faced with a very cruel choice when it is time to inherit these farms and ranches.

Either they come up with enough money to pay the government about half of what the farm or ranch is worth, or they sell the farm or ranch that may have been in their family for generations. Needless to say, most farm and ranch families do not have that kind of cash lying around. Most of them are just barely making it from year to year. So this change in the tax law is going to greatly accelerate the death of the family farm in America. This is also going to devastate many family-owned small businesses. Many small businesses don’t make much money, but they have buildings or land or assets worth millions of dollars. Children that may have wanted to continue the family legacy will be forced to sell because of the massive tax bill that they get from Uncle Sam. This is an insidious cruelty, and it shows just how broken our system has become.

The desire to leave the wealth that you have worked so hard to accumulate all your life to your children is something that is common to virtually all human societies. We want to know that future generations will be taken care of.


2 posted on 11/24/2012 7:01:03 AM PST by Lorianne (fedgov, taxporkmoney)
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To: Lorianne

Are we not slaves?


3 posted on 11/24/2012 7:01:44 AM PST by baddog 219
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To: Lorianne

In the Communist Manifesto, Marx saidn that the dictatorship of the proletariat should wrest control of the means of production and distribution by outlawing inheritance, ie a 100% inheritance tax.


4 posted on 11/24/2012 7:04:22 AM PST by Daveinyork (."Trusting government with power and money is like trusting teenaged boys with whiskey and car keys,)
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To: Lorianne

Previous thread:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2961891/posts


5 posted on 11/24/2012 7:05:38 AM PST by humblegunner
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To: baddog 219

Yes, we are slaves. We are slaves to the collective. The question is what are we going to do about it?


6 posted on 11/24/2012 7:06:08 AM PST by lookout88 (.combat officer's dad)
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To: Lorianne

That’s the intention! They are communists! They want ALL property in the hands of the collectivity! They think the American public won’t resist the big grab. (Half of the public has its head up its a$$ and won’t care - just don’t take away their 2 1/2 Men!)

Under communism, all the means of production and all property is in the hands of the collectivity! Every day and every way the democrats are moving closer to their goal! That’s the goal. If you think otherwise you are stupid.


7 posted on 11/24/2012 7:06:11 AM PST by I want the USA back (Don't doubt me.)
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To: Lorianne
The inheritance tax is the only reason that scumbag, Warren Buffet is rich.
8 posted on 11/24/2012 7:07:14 AM PST by mindburglar (It must be noon, because I'm drunk somewhere.)
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To: Lorianne

By calling it an inheritance “tax” many people are fooled. (head up the a$$)
It’s not a tax. It’s confiscation.


9 posted on 11/24/2012 7:07:34 AM PST by I want the USA back (Don't doubt me.)
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To: lookout88
The answer is....Photobucket
10 posted on 11/24/2012 7:10:33 AM PST by baddog 219
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To: baddog 219

“Are we not slaves?”

Yes because you want to be or you would do something about it instead of whining.


11 posted on 11/24/2012 7:12:34 AM PST by Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
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To: Lorianne

Does anyone really think that the politicians in Washington give a damn?

Watch this go through.

It’s a sure thing.

And people like Soros and rich politicians will suck up this land like a Vacuum.

For every farmer that gets screwed there is someone that is doing the screwing.Politicians make their fortunes sucking up to people who get richer and richer by buying politicians and getting them to pull sh*t like this.

You don’t thin Nancy Pelosi is in the Congress because she loves America do you. None of them are they are in ti to get rich and the paltry salary they make is nothing.


12 posted on 11/24/2012 7:13:10 AM PST by Venturer
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To: Venturer

Sorry I was so pissed when I wrote that , that I messed up

The last sentence should say they are all in it to get rich, and their salary is nothing to what they make selling their vote.


13 posted on 11/24/2012 7:15:28 AM PST by Venturer
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To: baddog 219

“Are we not slaves?

Won’t be long now. The foundation has been laid, the votes have been counted and the edifice is about to be built.

Those who voted for it will think the chains are only for the evil “rich guy”.

They don’t know that the chains will fit anyone their masters may wish to muzzle. (With no due process)

IMHO


14 posted on 11/24/2012 7:16:40 AM PST by ripley
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To: Lorianne

Ya thought “you didn’t build that” didn’t have consequences?


15 posted on 11/24/2012 7:17:46 AM PST by DManA ( you)
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To: Lorianne

I see dead people.


16 posted on 11/24/2012 7:19:35 AM PST by Noumenon (As long as you have a rifle, you STILL have a vote.)
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To: Lorianne

Therein lies the value of planning ahead. Most farms are privately owned but could be converted to corporations with the heirs in control. When the parents are gone the corporation lives on.


17 posted on 11/24/2012 7:22:04 AM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: ripley
Free will is the enemy of the state. The great design of the new world order is to enslave all, by the ruling few.
I can't believe how our children are being programed to summit to the will of their masters. I mean,Hell it's in the schools, on the TV,and now being preached in Churches.
Piece by piece our rights are being canceled in the name of security by our government.... And we stand there and let them.
Th answer isPhotobucket
18 posted on 11/24/2012 7:25:33 AM PST by baddog 219
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To: Lorianne
WHAT THE FOLKS ARE SAYING!!!!! They’re saying a whole lot, but few, if any, listen–and even so, can any Real Americans left really do anything about things. Some say yes; some say no. Fact is, this is a helluvva time to think about doing anything about things….one would think “the folks”–I think that’s 0′pinhead’s codeword for sheeple–should have at least smelled a rat, suspected something after the lincoln fiasco. And so, here we be! Like Hopalong Cassidy used to say, Looks Like They Got The Drop On Us! Semper Watching! *****
19 posted on 11/24/2012 7:28:45 AM PST by gunnyg ("A Constitution changed from Freedom, can never be restored; Liberty, once lost, is lost forever...)
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To: I want the USA back

I try not to pretend the Republicans (Graham, McCain the insane and the rest of the GOP Senate) are not working with them to destroy

Anything that destroys the family, like this legislation, is involved.


20 posted on 11/24/2012 7:30:28 AM PST by stanne
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To: count-your-change

And corporate stock is subject to the gift tax and death tax. Pay up sucka, the people need their Obamaphones.


21 posted on 11/24/2012 7:34:43 AM PST by ccmay (Too much Law; not enough Order.)
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To: Lorianne

The laws were like this years ago and that is why the ranch my husband’s family owned had to be sold when his father died, no way there was enough money to pay the taxes without selling the ranch. That issue was fixed when it was realized that was the number one reason family farms and ranches were going under. Now looks like it will be a problem again. Add to it that many of the land valuations are unrealistic, many ranches and farms cannot actually be sold for what they are valued at.


22 posted on 11/24/2012 7:35:03 AM PST by Tammy8 (~Secure the border and deport all illegals- do it now! ~ Support our Troops!~)
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To: count-your-change

True, but then you lose other benefits that are in place for individual/family owned farms. One major drawback is the question of whether minors in the family are allowed to legally work on a “corporate owned” business...if they can’t work on the family ranch/farm growing up they don’t learn the necessary skills/work ethic to be able to take over the business.


23 posted on 11/24/2012 7:39:33 AM PST by Tammy8 (~Secure the border and deport all illegals- do it now! ~ Support our Troops!~)
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To: lookout88

“collective” . . . . . a word I suspect that is going to be used more and more by Dhimmicrat leaders; just to get us accustomed to the idea.


24 posted on 11/24/2012 7:39:56 AM PST by Twinkie (ABORTION is GENOCIDE of Blacks & Hispanics!)
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To: count-your-change

Therein lies the value of planning ahead. Most farms are privately owned but could be converted to corporations with the heirs in control. When the parents are gone the corporation lives on.


But, what would the writers of this article have to complain about? There is value in understanding the system. Only emotional ties get in the way. The only down side is that some lawyer will get a fee to cut the paper.


25 posted on 11/24/2012 7:42:39 AM PST by Steamburg (The contents of your wallet is the only language Politicians understand.)
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To: mindburglar
The inheritance tax is the only reason that scumbag, Warren Buffet is rich.

Yup, most of his fortune was made up of insurance companies, which the rich use to pay off the death tax. That's the reason he's such a big proponent of the death tax or 0bamacare, he makes out on it. Buffet never supports anything that will hurt his bottom line, but try to get progressives who see him as some benevolent billionaire to believe that.

The thing is, people like him, Gates , the Kennedy's can afford to set up complex shelters to avoid a good part of this government ripoff. In other words they aren't really affected. It's the farmer or small business who's net worth is tied up in land buildings or equipment, without a lot of cash reserves who gets whacked by this. That's why the family farm is largely a thing of the past. Of course , this is all by design.

26 posted on 11/24/2012 7:45:10 AM PST by YankeeReb
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To: Daveinyork
In the Communist Manifesto, Marx saidn that the dictatorship of the proletariat should wrest control of the means of production and distribution by outlawing inheritance, ie a 100% inheritance tax.

Correct! This should be posted on billboards every time congress starts debating the death tax.

27 posted on 11/24/2012 7:47:44 AM PST by YankeeReb
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To: ccmay

Whether stock is issued depends upon type of corp. formed. Ownership would be to the corporation not the children.

But for certain trying to plan at the funeral is a little too late.


28 posted on 11/24/2012 7:47:44 AM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: Lorianne

if you have a farm or business... form a trust and sell the business to the trust and you and your kids into it.

the trick is... a trust is a legal entity... and cannot die

if the current head of the trust dies, another would take their place... ie: your kids

death taxes never come into the picture.

you could also have the trust hold all your property as well... again keeping the greedy fedgov from touching it

(if they move to change the laws regarding a trust... the just make a corporation with shareholders and a CEO... same result)


29 posted on 11/24/2012 7:48:55 AM PST by sten (fighting tyranny never goes out of style)
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To: Steamburg

The only down side is that some lawyer will get a fee to cut the paper.

******

There are lots of cheap ways, including free...

I’ve used these guys twice!
http://www.bizfilings.com/incorporation-search-landing.aspx?vendorid=B737&KWD=set%20up%20corporation

******

How to Set up a Corporation Without a Lawyer

(By an eHow Contributor)

Setting up a corporation sounds impressive and complex, but the truth is that to create a business, you simply have to list a few of the company’s facts and essentials and file an application with the Secretary of State. It’s running a new company and facing the many challenges of building a business that will really require professional assistance.

Read more: How to Set up a Corporation Without a Lawyer | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/how_2040117_corporation-without-lawyer.html#ixzz2D9gIsjIO


30 posted on 11/24/2012 7:49:05 AM PST by WVKayaker ("Mitt Romney couldn't keep up with lies and spin of Barack Obama" - Sarah Palin 10/24)
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To: Lorianne

Couldn’t you get around this through setting up a trust, or incorporation?


31 posted on 11/24/2012 7:56:15 AM PST by WackySam (Obama got Osama just like Nixon landed on the moon.)
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To: Tammy8
Add to it that many of the land valuations are unrealistic, many ranches and farms cannot actually be sold for what they are valued at.

Depends on what the valuation is based on. Some locales like to set property values high enough to add tax money without having to raise the tax rate.

There is a solution for that: the valuation of the land sets the bar price for the land if it has to be sold. Can't sell it for the taxable value? The tax assessor has to revalue the land for the sale price, and refund excess taxes paid by the previous owners for the past 25 years.

And if the government wants to buy the land, the bid price is the value set by the government for tax purposes. Those two measure would stop the inflation of values.

32 posted on 11/24/2012 7:58:52 AM PST by asinclair (Better than the government having to buy the land at the tax value)
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To: Lorianne

Create a corporation. Place all privately held stocks of that corporation into a blind trust. Hire family as employees of said corporation. Stocks never change hands, so a dead employee changes nothing, no taxes paid. No?


33 posted on 11/24/2012 8:01:01 AM PST by CodeToad (Liberals are bloodsucking ticks. We need to light the matchstick to burn them off.)
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Ideally, we need every member and regular user to contribute to keep Free Republic up and running strong.

34 posted on 11/24/2012 8:01:10 AM PST by RedMDer (May we always be happy and may our enemies always know it. - Sarah Palin, 10-18-2010)
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To: Steamburg

Ranting about a tax will never save a penny, planning on how to avoid a tax will.

One business that I am familiar with was actually a group of corporations. One owned the the buildings, another the equipment, another the land, and so on. All were incorporated in Delaware and all had the same directors, members of one family.

In effect the business leased eveything from its self. There are ways to keep a business out of the tax man’s hands.


35 posted on 11/24/2012 8:05:02 AM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: Lorianne

Exactly.

the ‘government’ wants the land and what it produces...or prohibits.

America will be a 3D museum.


36 posted on 11/24/2012 8:05:39 AM PST by combat_boots (The Lion of Judah cometh. Hallelujah. Gloria Patri, Filio et Spiritui Sancto!)
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To: count-your-change

I like the creative thinking on this thread - but I don’t give a rat’s a$$ about the death tax - this is what the dufus farmers in Iowa voted - I hope choke on it.


37 posted on 11/24/2012 8:12:07 AM PST by wewereright
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To: Steamburg
But, what would the writers of this article have to complain about? There is value in understanding the system. Only emotional ties get in the way. The only down side is that some lawyer will get a fee to cut the paper.

You don't think that there is anything to complain about on this subject?

Only emotional ties get in the way? All one needs to do is understand the system?

You think that somebody having to convert their family farm into corporation and all of the down side aspects of that is a good thing. And how long do you think it will be before the government starts screwing around with your beloved convert-it-to-a-corporation "system"? And what about people who have assets over a million who don't have a farm of business?

Unbelievable.

38 posted on 11/24/2012 8:14:15 AM PST by FreeReign
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To: Tammy8

That seems a small problem to overcome in view of not having the family farm to work on at all.


39 posted on 11/24/2012 8:14:42 AM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: I want the USA back
Under communism, all the means of production and all property is in the hands of the collectivity! Every day and every way the democrats are moving closer to their goal!

I am convinced that was part of the reason for the BLM and Forest Service. When you look at some of our Western states being over 90% owned by the Federal Government it's hard to think otherwise

I am really developing an intense dislike for Teddy Roosevelt

40 posted on 11/24/2012 8:20:44 AM PST by Cowman (How can the IRS seize property without a warrant if the 4th amendment still stands?)
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To: wewereright

Trouble is the tax is on the non-dufus farmers too. You know, those folks that put food on your table too.


41 posted on 11/24/2012 8:23:42 AM PST by count-your-change (You don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: count-your-change

“Therein lies the value of planning ahead. Most farms are privately owned but could be converted to corporations with the heirs in control. When the parents are gone the corporation lives on.”


The estate tax is a tax on EVERYTHING you own and/or control at the time of death, including owned life insurance policies, with the tax being due and payable in nine months from date of death of the owner of the taxable property. So, if you convert your ownership from the land to shares of stock, you will still be paying an estate tax on the value of the stock in the corporation.

Owned farm land worth $10 million, owned corporate stock worth $10 million, the tax is the same. Should the owner of the land, converted to stock, gift the stock to kids, then a GIFT tax on the value of the gift of the stock, comparable to the estate tax will be assessed by the government.

Hopefully, you are not wandering around rendering estate tax advice, since you do not know squat.


42 posted on 11/24/2012 8:32:26 AM PST by LaMudBug
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To: wewereright
I like the creative thinking on this thread - but I don’t give a rat’s a$$ about the death tax - this is what the dufus farmers in Iowa voted - I hope choke on it.

You don't give a rat's ass about the death tax?

Because Iowa went for Obama?

Really?

Many farmer in Iowa didn't vote for Obama.

Many farmers elsewhere didn't vote for Obama.

Many people all across the country who wish to leave their private property to their children didn't vote for Obama.

43 posted on 11/24/2012 8:37:33 AM PST by FreeReign
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To: baddog 219
Are we not slaves?

We've been slaves for a long time. The chains are just getting shorter.

44 posted on 11/24/2012 8:42:04 AM PST by unixfox (Abolish Slavery, Repeal The 16th Amendment!)
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To: asinclair
There is a solution for that: the valuation of the land sets the bar price for the land if it has to be sold. Can't sell it for the taxable value? The tax assessor has to revalue the land for the sale price, and refund excess taxes paid by the previous owners for the past 25 years.
**********
Where is the world would that be? That's certainly not how the system is set up in the United States.
45 posted on 11/24/2012 8:44:51 AM PST by wildandcrazyrussian
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To: Lorianne

Sell the farm to the kids for $1.00 before you die,save on taxes.


46 posted on 11/24/2012 8:44:51 AM PST by Vaduz
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To: Lorianne

Deed the land over to your children years before you die.


47 posted on 11/24/2012 8:46:02 AM PST by Bryan24 (When in doubt, move to the right..........)
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To: count-your-change
There are ways to keep a business out of the tax man’s hands.

For now. Tyranny never sleeps.

48 posted on 11/24/2012 8:49:29 AM PST by unixfox (Abolish Slavery, Repeal The 16th Amendment!)
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To: wewereright

Big farmers (as opposed to ‘hobby farmers’) in Iowa long ago became corporations, coincidentally owned by people related to each other. Other small businesses are much more hurt by this than full-time farmers.


49 posted on 11/24/2012 8:53:36 AM PST by jjotto ("Ya could look it up!")
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To: gunnyg

This doesn’t matter to the zombies who voted for zero. They don’t own property anyway, so why should they care? They don’t - they only care about their bennies the gubmit can give them. And, they will continue to not care until the trough runs dry. Then they’ll riot in the streets.


50 posted on 11/24/2012 8:53:51 AM PST by Catsrus
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