Skip to comments.City Hall wants diesel drivers to swap for electric vehicles
Posted on 11/27/2012 8:04:45 PM PST by smokingfrog
Chicago Mayor Rahm Emanuel wants to make a deal with diesel truck owners in the Chicagoland area: give up your truck, and the city will give you a voucher that covers around 60 percent of the cost of a new electric one.
Officials say the project could help with air quality and even quieter streets across the city. By next spring, fleets in Cook, DuPage, Kane, Lake, McHenry and Will counties will be able to apply for the program.
The city is encouraging companies to invest in electric vehicles in order to incrementally improve Chicagos air quality while helping to advance these emerging transportation technologies, Chicago Department of Transportation Commissioner Gabe Klein said in a statement. By offering a voucher at the point of sale, rather than as a post-sale rebate, we hope that more companies will be encouraged to participate in the program.
But not all drivers are jumping at the chance to trade in their truck. Phil LaPalermo, co-owner of All Ways Paving and Plowing, says he's not sure there's an electrical vehicle out there that can compare to the power of a diesel truck. LaPalermo said he likes the idea of using alternative energy sources, but the diesel engine is what keeps his fleet plowing and paving streets all over the city and suburbs.
(Excerpt) Read more at wbez.org ...
I knew that, just never understood it, not being an electrician or an engineer or physicist. I always thought that when you convert energy from one form to another that there is a net loss and therefore it would make more sense to run them directly with diesel engines. Is it just not practical for some reason?
I'm dead serious and would appreciate any explanation offered.
Yes. Those would be diesel electrics. They use the same type system on some ferry boats. Probably not all that practical for a dump truck though.
A very silly man.
Yes, but it shows he "cares" and "feels" and isn't that the very definition of a democrat?
There's going to be a whole lot of unintended consequences for the Left coming very soon.
Rahm must think you can buy an electric powered 18 wheeler.
I think they have a gas engine. A diesel would be better though.
I think there is some energy savings in not having all the drive shafts, etc that would be necessary to drive the multiple wheels on a train locomotive. Also high torque at low speed is helpful on a train. And I assume there is no need for a transmission. But, I would never characterize the engine as ‘electric’. Its power comes from a massive internal combustion engine.
I am sure you are correct.
I was just being snarky, and quite honestly big twin diesels rock on water.
And just how many electric alternatives are there that can equal the towing capacity and torque of a diesel truck?
they have electric trains ;) much easier to electrify the wire over the tracks and use the track as the ground/neutral when the train can’t go anywhere the track doesn’t.
Even diesel locomotives use electric motors.
electric motors produce a hell of a lot of torque. They make this torque at all speeds and do not need to shift.
Diesel trucks have 10-18 speeds for a reason. You need to keep the engine in the power band to keep things moving.
Read the wiki article if you want more in depth info.
I'm saving up for a Emax Super Marine 45
Hrm. What I’m wondering is, how well would an all-electric vehicle compare to a diesel when it comes to heavy work tasks - i.e. plows, heavy load hauling, etc.?
Electric motors certainly can provide torque, but I question whether they could perform the same task continuously for as long as a comparable diesel. It seems to me an electric’s batteries are likely to be used up well before a diesel tank runs dry.
I also have to wonder about durability and maintenance costs. We’ve gotten pretty good with diesels these days. They start in the wintertime and the better engines are just about bulletproof with normal maintenance. I don’t know how good these electrics are, but I think it’s fair to ask how well an electric design will endure a Chicago winter compared to a diesel. I also think it’s fair to ask how much more $$$ a business owner will have to spend on maintaining said vehicle.
Diesels, more than gas engines, have an optimum speed and >load< for best economy and perhaps a different speed for max power. But even gas engines have an innate speed at which they operate best. Also, using electric motors for train propulsion offers both incredible torque for starting, because they can handle brief overloads and also have the ability to use the electric motors as dynamic brakes...turning them into generators, the generators power giant resistors, generating heat, and serious braking power results. This means that the locos don’t have to have such giant brake shoes...useful to help stop the whole train. Plus the traction motors can be reversed pretty easily without having to have a geared transmission on the diesel which of course would be massive given the torque and power involved. Furthermore, it is relatively easy to synchronize multiple motors to rotate at the same speed allowing multiple engines to be used in tandem, which makes it easier to match the no of locos to the particular load and the type and amount of uphill pulling the loco must perform. And finally, the ability to control everything electrically meant that fewer people were required to run the train, esp with multiple engines. This was all developed during the early-through-middle part of the last century to a fairly fine art, and it was universally determined by all mfrs and freight/PAX lines that the diesel-electric combo was the best, cheapest, and most flexible. So while you are correct that changing one kind of energy to another involves some losses, these things have been studied and tested to exhaustion and the diesel-electric came to be the chosen mode. Motors, at this point (and even 50 years ago) got to be pretty darn efficient in converting electrical energy into axle torque. Of course, some electric trains have overhead or third rail electrical supply and those don’t need the diesel combustion engine.
Yes!!!...and when the Unicorns $hit...the kids will have an endless supply of M+Ms.....
They do make hybrid electric transit buses, but they’re expensive and the advantages are minimal or dubious.
You could buy a lot of diesel fuel for the cost of the electric vehicles. When it comes time for new batteries, there will be real buyer’s remorse.
Those will be some big ass M&M’s.
They could rename them Mochelle & Moochelles...