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The GOP Fiscal Cliff Counter Offer Is Brilliant—And It's Actually A Really Good Sign
Business Insider ^ | 12/03/2012 | Grace Wyler

Posted on 12/03/2012 4:39:42 PM PST by SeekAndFind

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1 posted on 12/03/2012 4:39:53 PM PST by SeekAndFind
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To: SeekAndFind

There will not be any spending cuts. There never are. The only way real cuts will happen is when the credit markets say so.


2 posted on 12/03/2012 4:44:10 PM PST by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: SeekAndFind
Brilliant? A Good sign?

Someone is either putting the bravest political spin ever on what Boner is doing. Or they have hit the pipe too hard today.

Or both.

Look at this. If Boner is indeed agreeing to even 60 percent....

1. I wouldn't be surprised.

2. It's just a matter of time before Thelma and Louise (Repubs and Dems) sail hand in hand together over the fiscal cliff.

 

3 posted on 12/03/2012 4:46:39 PM PST by Responsibility2nd (NO LIBS. This Means Liberals and (L)libertarians! Same Thing. NO LIBS!!)
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To: SeekAndFind

GOP - The spelunking party. We love caves.


4 posted on 12/03/2012 4:47:55 PM PST by Tenacious 1 (The Click-&-Paste Media exists & works in Utopia, riding unicorns & sniffing pixy dust.)
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To: Responsibility2nd
Brilliant? A Good sign?

Well, it's Business Insider, the liberal alternative to IBD.
5 posted on 12/03/2012 4:48:48 PM PST by andyk (I have sworn...eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.)
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To: SeekAndFind

Sorry, but this sounds like another idiot move by Boner and Co.

Cutting deductions for the upper middle class is insanity. Likewise, this rollover cuts no federal programs, eliminates no federal employees, and leaves Obamacare as-is, where-is.

The fact that Boner just cleaned out another conservative from a committee chair speaks volumes about the GOP’s commitment to snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.


6 posted on 12/03/2012 4:48:58 PM PST by snowrip (Liberal? You are a socialist idiot with no rational argument.)
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Comment #7 Removed by Moderator

To: SeekAndFind
first counter-proposal

Geez, you don't ask for what you want in your first counter-offer. Haven't they been watching Pawn Stars?
8 posted on 12/03/2012 4:49:47 PM PST by andyk (I have sworn...eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.)
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To: Responsibility2nd

Spending cuts first, tax increases later.


9 posted on 12/03/2012 4:51:04 PM PST by Paladin2
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To: SeekAndFind

Maybe she’s British. Brits think Cheez-Wiz is “Brilliant”.


10 posted on 12/03/2012 4:51:56 PM PST by King Moonracer (Bad lighting and cheap fabric, that's how you sell clothing.....)
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To: Lurker
True, but the crash is going to be epic when magical thinking runs into hard reality.


11 posted on 12/03/2012 4:53:48 PM PST by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: andyk

Cut 20% across the board. Bush tax cuts are made permanent and all loopholes with the exception of mortgage interest closed.

Go from there.


12 posted on 12/03/2012 4:54:01 PM PST by EQAndyBuzz (George W. Bush is the Emmanuel Goldstein of the modern era.)
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To: Paladin2

Agree. And begin tax increases from the bottom up. Begin on low-life moochers who currently pay no taxes.


13 posted on 12/03/2012 4:54:43 PM PST by Responsibility2nd (NO LIBS. This Means Liberals and (L)libertarians! Same Thing. NO LIBS!!)
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To: SeekAndFind
The letter is actually a savvy tactical maneuver by Boehner, and underscores just how angered Republican leaders were by the White House's initial offer on the fiscal cliff.

Feh. Typical Business Insider leftist crap. The proper maneuver would have been to tell Obama to shove his insulting opening posture up his Obama and come back with a decent one. No counter-offer until there is a serious offer on the table to begin with. Gotta be a Ferengi Rule of Business there somewhere....

Counter-offering foolishness only guarantees more foolishness. A counter-offer is what you do when you and the other guy are in the same neighborhood. Obama's not even on the same planet.

14 posted on 12/03/2012 4:55:01 PM PST by Cyber Liberty (Obama considers the Third World morally superior to the United States.)
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To: SeekAndFind

Brilliant? That’s what we heard about the Roberts’ decision on commie care. Good grief!


15 posted on 12/03/2012 4:56:02 PM PST by paint_your_wagon
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To: andyk

I think they watch “Pawn Stars” too much....


16 posted on 12/03/2012 4:56:09 PM PST by Cyber Liberty (Obama considers the Third World morally superior to the United States.)
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To: SeekAndFind

“Brilliant”?

Boehner actually trying to do the BASICS of his job as the leader of the “Opposition Party” ...in the MAJORITY in the House...BRILLIANT?

give me an effin’ break!!!


17 posted on 12/03/2012 4:56:18 PM PST by mo (If you understand, no explanation is needed. If you don't understand, no explanation is possible.)
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To: SeekAndFind

The Current Regime in the White Hut has not been negotiating. They have been dictating, and are somewhat affronted that the obedient Congresscritters did not just meekly go do their assigned duty, which is to simply rubberstamp the proposals.

If one side or the other is going to “negotiate”, the only effective course is to take hostages and/or find enough dirt on the other side to insure that there is mutual assured destruction, starting with shooting one hostage each day, or maybe upping it to one hostage every hour, or conversely, outing one respected member of the opposition on a similar time schedule.

The Democrats have shown they will dig up the dirt willingly enough, but they are squeemish about actually SHOOTING someone. What they should be conderned about is that the Second Amendment has not yet been overturned in the courts.

As for the threat of blackmailing the opposition, the best and most effective course is to acknowledge and even EMBRACE the dark side, and hold it aloft as a virtue, a part of heritage that has its own formative and energized thrust, that can be used as a weapon. Make the perpetrators of this agency of infamy sorry they ever opened that Pandora’s Box.

Saul Alinsky tactics turned against them.


18 posted on 12/03/2012 4:57:11 PM PST by alloysteel (Bronco Bama - the cowboy who whooped up and widened the stampede.)
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To: SeekAndFind

What are the details of the offer that this “counter” offer is actually counter to?


19 posted on 12/03/2012 4:59:38 PM PST by chris37 (Heartless.)
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To: Tzar
Why not propose an extra tax on the income of federal workers? Any government bureaucrat making over $100,000 should pay his fair share.

Yeah. No need to means test it. Tax all of them an extra 10% for being allowed to keep a government job and not being unemployed. Their salaries are being paid with borrowed money after all.

20 posted on 12/03/2012 5:01:26 PM PST by plain talk
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To: Travis McGee

Let it happen. We are about as ready as we can be. If we live through it, fine. If we don’t we will go down with the bolts locked back.


21 posted on 12/03/2012 5:02:33 PM PST by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: Tzar
The question is why not ~ and the answer is ~ 'because it's very dangerous to PO people who can be responsible for spending millions of dollars.

The salaries of all the federal workforce aren't a drop in the bucket compared to grants ~ go for the soft targets ~ the people who get grants from the government.

They are in no position to spend more.

22 posted on 12/03/2012 5:03:42 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: SeekAndFind

Deficit spending is escalating and will soon approach 1.5 trillion per year. The “spending cuts” here are a joke.
Instead of 1.5 trillion deficits we will have 1.3 trillion deficits as far as the eye can see. Forget it, it’s over.


23 posted on 12/03/2012 5:04:58 PM PST by jwalsh07
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To: EQAndyBuzz

Cutting 20% would leave us with an $800 Billion annual deficit.


24 posted on 12/03/2012 5:05:07 PM PST by csmusaret (I will give Obama credit for one thing- he is living proof that familiarity breeds contempt.)
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To: Lurker

Yep. Hot brass, etc.


25 posted on 12/03/2012 5:05:37 PM PST by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: csmusaret

“Cutting 20% would leave us with an $800 Billion annual deficit.”

Ok, good start. Now get rid of Obamacare in it’s entirety. Where are we at?


26 posted on 12/03/2012 5:07:35 PM PST by EQAndyBuzz (George W. Bush is the Emmanuel Goldstein of the modern era.)
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To: EQAndyBuzz

$660 Billion


27 posted on 12/03/2012 5:10:49 PM PST by csmusaret (I will give Obama credit for one thing- he is living proof that familiarity breeds contempt.)
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To: SeekAndFind

800 billion in new taxes...The GOP are so brave!

/s


28 posted on 12/03/2012 5:16:51 PM PST by icwhatudo (Low taxes and less spending in Sodom and Gomorrah is not my idea of a conservative victory)
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To: andyk
but Zero has been watching Hardcore Pawn, where they come in there wid their trash, "youse gonna gib me da money, I wants da cash". But sir "it ain't real".

Obama "gib me da monies". "I wants da money, or else".

29 posted on 12/03/2012 5:18:13 PM PST by annieokie
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Comment #30 Removed by Moderator

To: SeekAndFind

I sort of see what Boehner was trying to do but he needs to watch Pawn Stars and learn how to negotiate. Maybe take Simpson/Bowles, increase spending, reduce taxes and use that as a starting place if he wants to play that game.

whatever they do they need to shift the focus away from taxes towards spending. Obama and Dem Senate WILL win on taxes. The best the pubs can get is to extend the Bush cuts for the 98%. That’s the best case. The dems are using this as a distraction to split the pubs and avoid talking about their problem - their out of control spending.

The pubs need to start with a significant reduction in spending - not this namby/pamby stuff being thrown out now. Obama said he would balance the budget in 4 years. Let’s give him 8 years (that’s twice as long as Obama promised & no way he could say that is not reasonable).

$10T in add’l debt over 10 years (at current rate using rough numbers). allow 4 years of ramp-down to get to balanced budget. This means we have to cut at least $6T to get to balance. There will be $1T or so in increased taxes on the 2%. However we should not count any of it because it will not be achieved because the 2% will adapt, hide, make changes and the increased taxes will reduce economic growth and reduce overall revenues anyway. so we make the case that NONE of the increased taxes can be counted towards the deficit.

So Pubs need to propose $6T in spending cuts. But since I watch Pawn Stars - perhaps start with $8T and negotiate down to $6T.


31 posted on 12/03/2012 5:24:05 PM PST by plain talk
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Comment #32 Removed by Moderator

To: EQAndyBuzz

So you want to get rid of the charitable donation deduction?


33 posted on 12/03/2012 5:30:27 PM PST by Crusher138 ("Then conquer we must, for our cause it is just")
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To: Tzar

IOUs. THAT is even better!


34 posted on 12/03/2012 5:31:53 PM PST by plain talk
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To: Lurker

This is nuts

How is any of this a good sign?


35 posted on 12/03/2012 5:33:20 PM PST by GeronL (http://asspos.blogspot.com)
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To: Responsibility2nd

I know it’s not a winning arguement. But someone needs to make it. If the rich are not paying their “fair share” how in gods great earth is someone who is paying zero paying their “fair share”??

I heard CA only has 37% of it’s population paying state income taxes.

No wonder they have the problems they do.


36 posted on 12/03/2012 5:50:02 PM PST by cableguymn (The founding fathers would be shooting by now..)
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To: mo

Someone needs to remind Bonehead that Obama can huff and puff but spending and taxation bills start in the HOUSE. Something, while he might not realize it, Bonehead controls.


37 posted on 12/03/2012 5:53:42 PM PST by cableguymn (The founding fathers would be shooting by now..)
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To: plain talk

watch more Pawn Stars...

They have told people the real value of something and paid more than asking. (being honest but still)

They have also bought junk.

I would not send them in to work out a deal for me.


38 posted on 12/03/2012 5:55:20 PM PST by cableguymn (The founding fathers would be shooting by now..)
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To: SeekAndFind
If it truly is a good and strategic counter offer the DNCMedia will make sure as few low-information voters as posible ever hear about it.

Those that they do allow to hear about it will hear how cruel it is and how it only helps the rich.
39 posted on 12/03/2012 5:55:27 PM PST by John 3_19-21 (Are we in the bubble?)
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To: SeekAndFind

bkmk


40 posted on 12/03/2012 5:57:00 PM PST by Sergio (An object at rest cannot be stopped! - The Evil Midnight Bomber What Bombs at Midnight)
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To: plain talk

One idea might be to give them what they want - we will go back to Clinton era tax rates. The Dems have to go back to Clinton era expenditures.

I could live with that.


41 posted on 12/03/2012 6:00:30 PM PST by BruceS
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To: Sergio

Obama sent a ridiculous, stupid, liberal wet-dream proposal. OBoehner should respond in kind.

SHUT DOWN depts entirely, Education, Energy, EPA, (etc. keep naming more departments for every day there is no budget), in fact, shut down the IRS, too. Stop all funding to foreign countries, Eliminate baseline budgeting trickery, explain it on the airwaves, cut all taxes to no higher than 10%, Eliminate permanently all death taxes, cut off all funding for vacations for the Executive Office, and cut all salaries of elected officials to $1/year. Any attempt to pass Executive Orders will be with even more cuts in the Executive branch’s funding.

Obama wants to play stupid dictator, play stupid right back at him. Threaten to shut down the government unless your budget is passed ASAP. They want to play with nukes, throw them back at ‘em harder. Make EVERY DAY with out a balanced budget ever more painful. Every day.


42 posted on 12/03/2012 6:13:39 PM PST by Big Giant Head
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To: Lurker

Yep...decreases in future increses.


43 posted on 12/03/2012 6:17:44 PM PST by Fledermaus (The Republic is Dead: Collapse the system. Let the Dems destroy the economy!)
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To: cableguymn

Any argument that calls for expanding the base subject to federal income taxes is not a winning argument. The current Conservative position is that the federal income tax is just another failed government program to be abolished.


44 posted on 12/03/2012 6:29:14 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah

That works to. I’d MUCH rather have a consumption tax.


45 posted on 12/03/2012 6:36:04 PM PST by cableguymn (The founding fathers would be shooting by now..)
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To: SeekAndFind

Unregistered guns, ammo, power, metals, food. And quickly.


46 posted on 12/03/2012 6:37:45 PM PST by gotribe
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To: SeekAndFind
We don't need taxes at this point. No tax economy, and print money and lend it to the federal reserve. Take a hit for inflation. If we are a tax free state, then we would be a 25 trillion GDP instead of a 15 Trillion GDP economy.

Now, we are taking a double hit, money printing inflation hit, and taxes on top, this is killing our economy and we are needlessly importing oil.

If we allow oil drilling on federal land, we can become an oil exporting country.

47 posted on 12/03/2012 6:39:47 PM PST by agincourt1415 (Tired of the current State, and Federal Tax System go here: APTTAX.com)
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To: SeekAndFind

Since Obama moved into the White house, he has done nothing but sabotage the country. When will Congress stand up for our Constitution and represent the people? Taxes need not be raised for anyone! Opening the pipe line from Canada, cutting damaging regulations on business, drilling oil here now, and cutting out obsolete departments and spending in general is the only way to get the economy going and revenues will automatically increase grandly!


48 posted on 12/03/2012 6:44:03 PM PST by Paperdoll
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To: SeekAndFind

I also have been thinking of all the better ways the House could play this. But its been 4 weeks since 0bama won “the most important election of our lifetime”. It was called that over & over for a reason. Boener and his offer (and maybe a little in a counter-counter offer) are all we get.

...If we continue to look towards DC for any answers.


49 posted on 12/03/2012 7:01:13 PM PST by ReaganGeneration2
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To: SeekAndFind

RINO File.


50 posted on 12/03/2012 7:12:04 PM PST by Graewoulf ((Traitor John Roberts' Obama"care" violates Sherman Anti-Trust Law, AND the U.S. Constitution.))
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