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Obama Barreling Toward Real Fiscal Cliff
Townhall.com ^ | December 4, 2012 | David Limbaugh

Posted on 12/04/2012 4:53:44 AM PST by Kaslin

Some commentators wonder why President Obama always engages in brinksmanship. Why can't he meet Republicans halfway, like Clinton did, they ask. Let me try to respond.

One blogger suggests that Obama prefers to play chicken, taking the nation right to the edge of a fiscal disaster because it will increase the likelihood that the GOP will cave. Perhaps, but there's more to it.

Many of us warned that Obama is not, by nature or ideology, a conciliator. He is not a centrist, and he's not someone who is interested in the other side's ideas. He knows what he wants to do, and he is hell-bent on doing it. He is not just playing hardball as a matter of strategy; he has no interest in compromise and is angling to get his way entirely. And he wants to further damage the Republican brand in the process.

The way Obama probably looks at it is that Republicans will cave and he will either get most of what he wants, or the Republicans will hold fast and he can effectively blame them for taking us over the fiscal cliff. You'll note that in none of these explanations is there a hint that Obama is motivated to do what is best for the country. He intends to act in his own best interests and those of his party, and decidedly against the interests of the GOP and, ultimately, the nation.

To better understand what we're dealing with and what the stakes are in these negotiations, let's take a look at what people mean when they say we're headed toward a fiscal cliff in January -- as distinguished from the much bigger cliff we're heading for if we don't get our deficits and debt under control very soon.

The immediate fiscal cliff includes the largest tax increase in a single year in our nation's history ($494 billion), dangerous defense cuts via sequestration, a Medicare reimbursement fiasco and an expiration of federal funding for extended unemployment benefits.

Despite these looming concerns, Obama hasn't approached these budget talks in good faith, but in a way that even former defenders recognize is designed to result in an impasse. Indeed, Obama's proposal is so manifestly unreasonable that even his own party - Democratic senators and congressmen -- has consistently rejected less extreme versions of it in its unanimous votes against his budgets.

Consider: He chose Timothy Geithner to be his lead negotiator. Geithner has repeatedly shown he is not serious about entitlement reform. He and the president have failed even to put a proposal on the table. Also, they've proposed no real short-term spending cuts, twice the level of tax increases Obama campaigned on, more stimulus spending, an intransigent demand for an economy-smothering tax rate increase on the "wealthy" as opposed to decreases in deductions, and the topper: a demand that Congress surrender to this reckless spender of a president its constitutional prerogative over spending limits.

The upshot is that Obama is demanding Republicans agree to policies that will further damage the economy and ensure the nation's financial demise even sooner than is now inevitable. Adding insult to injury, Geithner is arrogantly boasting that Republicans will cave.

Republicans are agreeing to let Obama increase taxes (by reducing deductions for upper income earners) even with the anemic economy, but are demanding from him, on behalf of the nation, serious discretionary spending cuts and major structural entitlement reform. If Republicans cave in exchange for Obama's vague, illusory, insincere promises to cut spending and reform entitlement down the road, they will be complicit in accelerating the nation's fiscal destruction.

Some painfully superficial analysts argue that Obama is right to offer an extreme position as his first volley, because that's the way negotiations work. But Obama's hardball offer is not merely a different approach to the shared goal of restoring the nation's fiscal health. It unequivocally guarantees national bankruptcy while the Republicans' proposal is designed to avert that disaster.

Obama is playing chicken, all right, but he's not driving his own car; he's driving the United States of America. People can quibble endlessly over whether he is intentionally trying to harm America. The better way to frame it is that Obama is, by his own admission, trying to fundamentally transform America.

His transforming vision means continuing to expand the welfare state, major tax hikes, increased spending and obstructing reform of our already insolvent entitlement programs, the major debt drivers that are leading us toward the real "fiscal cliff."

Obama's policies in furtherance of his vision -- as clearly laid out during the campaign and even more so during these "fiscal cliff" negotiations -- left unchecked will complete the fiscal destruction of the nation.

So if you insist, don't call it intentional destruction. Call it, euphemistically, "the intentional fundamental transformation of America that will necessarily destroy her."


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Editorial
KEYWORDS: barackobama; fiscalcliff; obamataxhike; taxes
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1 posted on 12/04/2012 4:53:52 AM PST by Kaslin
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To: Kaslin

Agreed.


2 posted on 12/04/2012 4:58:49 AM PST by John W (Viva Cristo Rey!)
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To: Kaslin
It's as if an insane skipper had somehow come aboard a ship, and is bouncing it from reef to reef, steering into hurricanes, opening up the sea cocks, seemingly doing all he can to wreck her...

Until finally, the crew realizes, that is exactly what the crazy new skipper intends.

This may be a bogus internet quote or whatnot, but Lenin is said to have had a "The worse, the better," philosophy for during the Russian revolution and civil war. Totally reduce a country to ruins, and rebuild it on the totalitarian Communist model.

And many Americans still naively believe that Obama is trying to "fix" the economy.

If there is one subject that Obama studied all his life, it's Marxism-Leninism. On that, he is an expert.

3 posted on 12/04/2012 5:00:39 AM PST by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: Kaslin

The Limbaugh’s at times can be among the clearest thinkers out there.....


4 posted on 12/04/2012 5:02:27 AM PST by Arlis (.)
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To: Kaslin

article is a long-winded way of saying Obama is an a-hole !


5 posted on 12/04/2012 5:03:28 AM PST by xtinct (The will of God will never take you where the Grace of God will not protect you..Be Strong Patriots!)
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To: Kaslin

Something I found today in the comments section of IBD:

From Dean Hilgeman · Top Commenter

you better not work.
you better not try.
you better not earn.
I’m telling you why.
Obama Claus is coming to town.

He sees you when you’re building.
he wants what you all make.
he’ll tell the 47 per cent.
that being rich is a mistake.

oh you better not work.
you better not try.
you better not earn.
I’m telling you why.

Obama Claus is coming to town.

he’ll tell you to be thankful.
to bow down and give thanks.
or he’ll send you to a FEMA camp.
to get your thinking “straight”.

oh you better not work.
you better not try.
you better not earn.
I’m telling you why.
Obama Claus is coming to town.

he’ll give you a free cell phone.
say Obamacare is great.
he’ll tell you being a success.
is something you should hate.

oh you better not work.
you better not try.
you better not earn.
I’m telling you why.
Obama Claus is coooming tooo tooown!


6 posted on 12/04/2012 5:06:41 AM PST by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter admits whom he's working for)
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To: Kaslin

Imagine... just imagine if the Repubs grew a pair and called this POS out for what he is... a socialist bent on the nation`s destruction. As for the Republican brand, it`s irreparably damaged anyway.. the “media” will never allow the sheep to hold it in high regard. So.. how about the GOP do the right thing for once, pass ONE bill, stand pat, tell Obama to take it or leave it, go on vacation, and let the political chips fall where they may.

American voters wanted four more years of Obama. Don`t protect them from him anymore. Pass a bill, step aside, grab some popcorn and watch the show.


7 posted on 12/04/2012 5:10:30 AM PST by ScottinVA (I've never been more disgusted with American voters.)
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To: Kaslin
This nation re-elected this clown. We are all going to own it.

The republicans need one thing right now: Courage. Unfortunately, they would rather indulge their fears and go quietly than stand and fight.

They need to play just as hard as Obama is. Let the "fiscal cliff" wash over. Let it come. The nation voted for higher taxes and a worse economy, let them have it.

In January, refuse to raise the spending limits. Enough is enough. They will be excoriated and blamed no matter what. Might as well do the right thing.

8 posted on 12/04/2012 5:11:38 AM PST by hopespringseternal
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To: Kaslin

S T O P

I T

“O” doesn’t care and never DID!

I wish the biased and idiotic MSM would just finally admit the OBVIOUS!

The welfare and security of the American people is NOT on his agenda!!!

STOP pretending that it IS ... and STOP assessing this administration and this President with the same yardstick as OTHER PRESIDENTS and OTHER ADMINISTRATIONS in the history of America-as if there is any equivalency in capabilities and commitment to this country!!!!!!!!


9 posted on 12/04/2012 5:12:26 AM PST by SMARTY ("The man who has no inner-life is a slave to his surroundings. "Henri Frederic Amiel)
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To: Kaslin

Obama acts like he has a surgically implanted explosive device in his skull and has his marching orders....or else.


10 posted on 12/04/2012 5:19:10 AM PST by Eye of Unk (A Civil Cold War in America is here, its already been declared.)
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To: SMARTY

I think the point of the article is that Obama is intentionally taking actions that will destroy the country. It’s stated here far more clearly than usual.


11 posted on 12/04/2012 5:24:48 AM PST by ClearCase_guy (Global Warming is a religion, and I don't want to be taxed to pay for a faith that is not mine.)
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To: Kaslin

I’ve often thought that a major reason that the MSM supports Obama and his policies is that they KNOW it will cause a bad economy and all of the ills that go along with that. Bad news SELLS newspapers and TV Time to Advertisers. And when you get right down to it that is what motivates these people.


12 posted on 12/04/2012 5:32:19 AM PST by The Working Man
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To: MrB

That’s funny... in a scary kind of way.


13 posted on 12/04/2012 5:36:43 AM PST by Flick Lives (We're going to be just like the old Soviet Union, but with free cell phones!)
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To: ClearCase_guy

I think the more important point is the GOP is set-up as things currently stand, to take the blame.

That is the more important point.

The GOP has lined up with those who would export US jobs, and so is going to take the blame.

BRING BACK US JOBS.


14 posted on 12/04/2012 5:41:12 AM PST by Cringing Negativism Network
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To: ScottinVA

I love your idea. Send it to Boehner.


15 posted on 12/04/2012 5:41:43 AM PST by jersey117
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To: Kaslin

He’s a Chicago hood...and a jerk...and he doesn’t give a damn about anyone.


16 posted on 12/04/2012 5:46:59 AM PST by Sacajaweau
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To: ScottinVA

Might be nice to denounce Obama’s racist politics as well. “Class warfare” is a polite way of saying the left is fueling a revolt by minorities with outright racist appeals.


17 posted on 12/04/2012 5:48:47 AM PST by Andrei Bulba (No Obama, no way!)
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

The economy exports jobs because it’s a socialist nightmare you idiot.


18 posted on 12/04/2012 5:50:21 AM PST by Andrei Bulba (No Obama, no way!)
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To: Kaslin

“The upshot is that Obama is demanding Republicans agree to policies that will further damage the economy and ensure the nation’s financial demise even sooner than is now inevitable.”

Kinda’ sad, really...


19 posted on 12/04/2012 5:51:28 AM PST by TalBlack (Evil doesn't have a day job.)
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To: Andrei Bulba

Enough excuses.

Bring back US jobs.


20 posted on 12/04/2012 5:52:27 AM PST by Cringing Negativism Network
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To: Kaslin

Limbaugh’s thesis: either the Republicans cave or, if they stand firm, Zero gets to blame them for obstructionism, is correct.

But the key premise to that is that he gets away with blaming them. And that only works because of the compliant media which won’t critically analyze the dynamics of the standoff.

So the fundamental problem is that not enough Americans can stand back, analyze, and see through Obama’s tactics.

And that’s partly because he has the media on his side and partly because Americans have been dumbed down.

And that’s the real problem. Obama and his masters are smart enough to realize the critical mass has been reached and they can get away with this stuff, which they’d never have gotten away with a few decades ago.


21 posted on 12/04/2012 6:01:43 AM PST by Houghton M.
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

No,the GOP is set up to take the blame even if they stand firm because of the media spin.

I make no brief for the eRepubs. THey disgust me.

But we have to honestly assess the situation. Obama is in a win-win situation because not enough people get their news through filters that will critically evaluate who’s doing what in this “negotiating.”


22 posted on 12/04/2012 6:04:06 AM PST by Houghton M.
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To: The Working Man

No, I think the media operatives are mostly just stupider than stupid.

But Obama and Valerie and Alexcrap know what they are doing. They are laughing at the stupidity of the MSM even as their whole strategy depends on the MSM covering (unwittingly) for them.

With some exceptions, of course. Some of the MSM operatives are outright Marxist/Socialist “transform America” ideologues.

But most are just plain stupid.


23 posted on 12/04/2012 6:06:41 AM PST by Houghton M.
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To: Houghton M.

I disagree.

We have become the party of foreign stuff.

If the GOP simply stood up and constantly advocated American goods, we would become the party of American stuff.

That would win. Big.


24 posted on 12/04/2012 6:09:00 AM PST by Cringing Negativism Network
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

We can disagree.

“If the GOP simply stood up”

It’s no longer simple, if it ever has been. We are fighting the Lie. Orwell. Once enough, once a majority or near majority are so taken in by the Lie that they haven’t the faintest idea they are living a lie it becomes very hard, not simple, to break through to them with the Truth.

We are stupid if we understimate the enemy. Conservatives can be stuck on stupid too.


25 posted on 12/04/2012 6:14:03 AM PST by Houghton M.
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To: Houghton M.

Well I will in no way minimize the problem we face, but among them prominently this time, was the Mormon religion.

That was stupid.

Why we allowed a Mormon to buy his way to the GOP nomination, was nearly impossible to understand.

We will not have a Mormon next time. That will bring things back toward normal. But we MUST stop advocating imports.

Imports only help two Americans:

The shipper, and the checkout clerk at the store.

Otherwise it is all going overseas.


26 posted on 12/04/2012 6:19:12 AM PST by Cringing Negativism Network
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

We have reached or are near the point of no return because the real power today rests with the bureaucracy. Already George W. crippled himself by not totally cleaning house in Justice and State.

Any Republican, even the most true blue conservative Republican, who might get elected in 2016 will be saddled with a Judiciary absolutely stuffed with ultra liberal judges, with a Justice department stuffed with civil-service-protected flaming liberal lawyers, a State Department stuffed with hate-American diplomats, an EPA stuffed with destroy-the-economy “experts,”
and
so
on
and
so
forth.

They can destroy any president just by quietly doing this or that that guarantees the failure of whatever reform initiatives he implements.

Even if he has a Congress that is, in theory, on his side, with a compliant media, the meme that “President So-and-So’s” entitlement reform or EPA reform or State-department reform efforts have abysmally failed. He hates the poor, he . . . . [fill in the blank].”

Perhaps if enough states band together to nullify the Feds, we have some hope. But the Feds will come after them and will not shrink from using force. It might be possible to win the media battle if it came to blows. But that’s how serious the situation is.

No White Knight presidential candidate can turn things around.

Can’t.

Won’t happen.

Not possible.


27 posted on 12/04/2012 6:27:36 AM PST by Houghton M.
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To: Houghton M.

Well that is where we disagree.

I think we can turn this around big.

But we must start now, and we must support US workers. And most of all, let’s avoid any further religious adventures.

I admit I (also) fell into the Mitt bandwagon after Sarah Palin stood down.

That mistake must not be repeated.


28 posted on 12/04/2012 6:31:13 AM PST by Cringing Negativism Network
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To: Kaslin

I sure wish I could not care enough to ignore this Kabuki dance. Boehner is going to end up crying in his soup, while the rest of us get screwed. All he needs to do is vote no on tax increases. Everything else is Obama’s problem.


29 posted on 12/04/2012 6:32:24 AM PST by Behind the Blue Wall
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

Who in their right mind, and with capital to invest, wants to build anything here? You don’t “bring jobs” nor do you “send jobsb”. Jobs are byproducts of building, buying, selling, investing, inventing, and more than anything the ability to make and keep earnings.

I will add that laws that require “jobs here”and only dicourageous the above. But its great for those with a union thigh mindset.


30 posted on 12/04/2012 6:38:37 AM PST by FreedomNotSafety
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

Why don’t you bring the jobs back, since you view economic reality as an “excuse”. Oh, you mean it’s not so easy?

The jobs are being done by 30 million illegal aliens. Excuse? The jobs are being done in countries with lower tax rates and non union labor. Excuse? The jobs are being killed by Obamacare. Excuse? The jobs are about to be killed more by raising taxes on job creators. Excuse? The jobs are being killed by raising capital gains taxes. Excuse? Keystone pipeline blocked. Excuse?:


31 posted on 12/04/2012 6:39:39 AM PST by Andrei Bulba (No Obama, no way!)
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To: MrB

Perfect. I just send it on to my e-pal list


32 posted on 12/04/2012 6:45:35 AM PST by Kaslin ( One Big Ass Mistake America (Make that Two))
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To: MrB

Thanks! Will use it at our Christmas party!


33 posted on 12/04/2012 6:48:31 AM PST by Rennes Templar (Be positive: America is greater than Obama.)
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To: SMARTY

you said it all with the biased idiotic MSM, but I like to change it to LSM as in LameStream Media, or SRM (State Run Media, OM (Obama Media)


34 posted on 12/04/2012 6:49:27 AM PST by Kaslin ( One Big Ass Mistake America (Make that Two))
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To: Cringing Negativism Network
Remember the primaries with the Mormon. The conservatives choose everybody but him, he was the last man standing when everyone had chosen a player. He knocked them out with negative campaigning one after another until we were stuck with him. And then we expected half the nation to rally around our last choice, our "severely conservative" candidate? He didn't even believe that statement.

I figured he would give Obama a run in his negative campaigning but he backed off on the only one who ever deserved criticism. Instead he blew his negative wad on the fellow R's and then went soft on the real opponent.

35 posted on 12/04/2012 6:55:57 AM PST by thirst4truth (www.Believer.com)
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To: FreedomNotSafety

Well we’ve exported enough jobs now that Democrats won the last election.

Handily.

If you’re actually truly rich, I can see advocating shipping jobs offshore. I suppose. Though I still cannot see why you would not want Americans to do well.

If you are not actually rich, there is no reason not to support American workers.

Sure almost all people who are unemployed are Democrats.

The thing we have lost sight of recently is, not such a huge portion of WORKING people are Democrats.

The GOP used to win a significant portion of these votes.

Now a lot of those people are unemployed. Replaced by millions of factory workers in Shanghai, or Bombay.

Unemployed.

But still here. Now increasingly ... voting for Dems.


36 posted on 12/04/2012 6:57:17 AM PST by Cringing Negativism Network
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To: Kaslin
Limbaugh has it pegged. There will be no compromise because Obama doesn't want one and it's time for Republicans to change the rhetoric and warn the American people as to what is going to happen and why.

Obama has everything to gain and nothing to lose by taking the country down. Obama and Democrats know Republicans will get the blame so why not do it? These maniacs do not care about what happens to the American people--they will be just fine and to hell with everyone else. This way they think they can also destroy Republican majorities, even in the House. This is politics on the part of Dims.

37 posted on 12/04/2012 7:00:13 AM PST by Conservativegreatgrandma
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To: thirst4truth

Thank you.

That is the explanation. Indeed.

Romney was much tougher on the right, than on the left.

AFTER HE WON HE LOST HIS FOCUS. Until that time, he seemed right.

I appreciate that. Thanks.

:)


38 posted on 12/04/2012 7:01:30 AM PST by Cringing Negativism Network
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To: Kaslin
I agree with the author completely, but he is preaching to the choir of entrepreneurs when he talks about the economy. He & the Pubs need to be talking about the effects the fiscal cliff will have on the poor & lower wage earners. These are the people who voted for Obama & support his proposals.

The fiscal cliff will fall heaviest on the poor. Higher taxes on job creators will mean fewer jobs created & more jobs lost. Geithner’s money printing is driving up prices of food, utilities, & transportation - 3 primary expenses of poor & low income people. As the economy continues to decline, & entitlement costs continue to soar as a result, soon the entitlement checks will either stop coming, or be inadequate to pay the inflated bills. With more people out of work, crime will increase, which always falls disproportionally on the poor.

This is the message the Pubs need to be sending. “The economy” is not something people worry about - higher food costs are. And people who don't pay taxes don't care about tax rates when theirs will remain zero.

39 posted on 12/04/2012 7:05:59 AM PST by Mister Da (The mark of a wise man is not what he knows, but what he knows he doesn't know!)
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To: Travis McGee
So Obama is in a win, win, win situation. We go over the cliff - he wins. The GOP conciliates with him - he wins. The country crashes - he wins. There seems to be no way out short of anarchy and Obama wants that too so he can rebuild his way on the wreckage. The only hope would be that conservatives would survive better through the chaos, but even that is just a hope and external forces would undoubtedly move against us. How depressing.
40 posted on 12/04/2012 7:14:00 AM PST by Truth29
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To: Truth29

How about the GOP simply goes to bat aggressively, for American workers and (American) companies.

What is so complicated about that?

Keep unions out of the discussion. In fact root against unions, if asked.

But why in the world, are we not fighting for America?


41 posted on 12/04/2012 7:20:25 AM PST by Cringing Negativism Network
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To: ScottinVA
" Pass a bill, step aside, grab some popcorn and watch the show."

Why not bring a bill to the floor immediately that authorizes EVERYTHING the The Bozo wants. See if the Rats pass it and see if the Senate passes it.

42 posted on 12/04/2012 7:21:32 AM PST by I am Richard Brandon
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To: Kaslin
Obama is negotiating like the Marxist he is...

Remember the negotiations with the North Koreans over the Pueblo ship,

The Chinese with the aircraft at the start of Bush 2 presidency

and the legendary delays etc with the N. Vietnamese in winding up the Vietnam war.

History repeating.

43 posted on 12/04/2012 7:27:59 AM PST by spokeshave (The only people better off today than 4 years ago are the Prisoners at Guantanamo.)
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To: Cringing Negativism Network

“If you are truly rich”. I may be rich or just have little bit but either way it is mine. How are “WE” supposed to bring jobs here? If I have wealth then I can bring it here and which may create jobs. If you do not have wealth to invest, please drop the we. We is a collective pronoun typically used by those who know best how to invest and spend someoneles’es wealth.

Investor do not buy and sell jobs. You should learn how and whythe jobs are created and destroyed.

I would be interested in hearing what jobs you want here.


44 posted on 12/04/2012 8:00:39 AM PST by FreedomNotSafety
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To: spokeshave

I don’t think that arrogant pos of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave knows what negotiating means


45 posted on 12/04/2012 8:23:01 AM PST by Kaslin ( One Big Ass Mistake America (Make that Two))
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To: Truth29

At this point, I think the best reasonable hope is for a regional breakup of the former USA, like the former USSR.

This will happen when the economy implodes, bond rates explode, the dollar crashes, and Uncle Sam can’t pay anybody anything but worthless digital dollars that won’t buy a can of soup.

At that point, some of the military might stick around to keep in good standing for pensions, but the military overall will not be able to mount expeditions to corral the states. Like the USSR 90-92 could not stop the Baltic states and the Stans from departing.

That’s my best-case scenario. THe others are much worse.


46 posted on 12/04/2012 9:05:25 AM PST by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: Eye of Unk

Why do you think he refused to give-up his BlackBerry?


47 posted on 12/04/2012 11:15:39 AM PST by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: jersey117
I love your idea. Send it to Boehner.

Thanks. It won't matter, but I did anyway.

48 posted on 12/04/2012 11:51:57 AM PST by ScottinVA (I've never been more disgusted with American voters.)
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To: MrB

you better not work.
you better not try.
you better not earn.
Im telling you why.
The Federal Partys’ are coming to town.

They sees you when youre building.
They wants what you all make.

that being rich is a mistake.

oh you better not work.
you better not try.
you better not earn.
Im telling you why.

Every Party Bureucrat is coming to town.

They’ll tell you to be thankful.
to bow down and give thanks.
or send you to a Arbeitsziehungslager camp.
to get your thinking straight.

oh you better not work.
you better not try.
you better not earn.
telling you why.
Both Federal Work Camp Partys’ are coming to town.

oh you better not work.
you better not try.
you better not earn.
Im telling you why.
The Federal Government coooming tooo tooown in every way!


49 posted on 12/04/2012 3:19:28 PM PST by Varsity Flight (Extortion-Care is the Government Work-Camp: Arbeitsziehungslager)
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To: Truth29

How does Obama win if we go over the cliff? He’s supposed to be the leader so why doesn’t he lead? Of we go over the cliff it’s his fault for not extending the bush tax cuts for the middle class and negotiating tax on the rich later. His all or nothing approach is his fault.


50 posted on 12/04/2012 3:29:04 PM PST by jersey117
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