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Feds to landowner: don't touch that trash [Obama admin grabs private property in NM]
WND ^ | Dec 12 2012 | Bob Unruh

Posted on 12/12/2012 10:16:51 PM PST by WilliamIII

A New Mexico couple has been warned by the federal government not to touch trash – tin cans, broken glass and the like – that has accumulated over the years on the 20 acres of desert land they bought for their retirement home near Santa Fe because it could hurt the Rio Grande River, 25 miles away.

Huh?

The dispute over the Obama administration’s claim to jurisdiction over desert land belonging to Peter and Francoise Smith is heading to court now. Their lawsuit alleges Washington is over-reaching in its claim that their land, which does not contain any “relatively permanent, standing or continuously body of water,” can be regulated by the Clean Water Act.

Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2012/12/feds-to-landowner-dont-touch-that-trash/#RrGLA4EXmvBBS0RK.99

(Excerpt) Read more at wnd.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Front Page News; US: New Mexico
KEYWORDS: agenda21; dearleader; landgrab; obama; privateproperty; tyranny; tyrant

1 posted on 12/12/2012 10:16:59 PM PST by WilliamIII
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To: Nachum

Ping


2 posted on 12/12/2012 10:21:34 PM PST by Jet Jaguar
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To: WilliamIII

The Rio Grande is mud for the most part.


3 posted on 12/12/2012 10:23:37 PM PST by TigersEye (Who is John Galt?)
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To: CedarDave

ping


4 posted on 12/12/2012 10:24:38 PM PST by TigersEye (Who is John Galt?)
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To: Jet Jaguar; NorwegianViking; ExTexasRedhead; HollyB; FromLori; EricTheRed_VocalMinority; ...

Thanks Jet Jaguar

Obama and Agenda 21

The list, Ping

Let me know if you would like to be on or off the ping list

http://www.nachumlist.com/agenda21.htm


5 posted on 12/12/2012 10:29:40 PM PST by Nachum (The List is off the Google blacklist- www.nachumlist.com)
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To: hattend; tubebender; SierraWasp; steelie; Ernest_at_the_Beach; editor-surveyor; Carry_Okie; ...

ping


6 posted on 12/12/2012 10:43:46 PM PST by WilliamIII
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To: WilliamIII

Jurisdictional battles over what constitutes “waters of the United States” have been going on for over 100 years.


7 posted on 12/12/2012 10:53:42 PM PST by Carry_Okie (The Slave Party: advancing indenture since 1787.)
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To: Carry_Okie

Jurisdictional battles over what constitutes “waters of the United States” have been going on for over 100 years.

It’s only been in the last 30 years or so that the federal government has tried to take over private property on such a broad scale, with flimsy claims that there’s some kind of “water” connection to dry land. The water from my bathtub runs into the Colorado River, eventually. Does that give Obama control over my property? It sounds crazy, but we’re headed closer to, not farther from, total federal control.


8 posted on 12/12/2012 11:00:58 PM PST by WilliamIII
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To: WilliamIII
Under Justice Antonin Scalia’s plurality opinion, which PLF argues is controlling, there must be a “relatively permanent” water flow to a navigable body of water, such as a river, lake or ocean.

Even there, Scalia is enlarging Federal reach. The standard was once commercially NAVIGABLE waters only, once determined as sufficient to accommodate a vessel of 12 DWT (dead weight tons).

9 posted on 12/12/2012 11:19:54 PM PST by Carry_Okie (The Slave Party: advancing indenture since 1787.)
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To: WilliamIII

Maybe 0bama’s afraid the couple might find some Qurans laying around? Or this is a trial balloon for more intrusive plans by 0bama to just all-out confiscate private property.


10 posted on 12/12/2012 11:41:34 PM PST by Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America (IMPEACH OBAMA)
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To: WilliamIII
It’s only been in the last 30 years or so that the federal government has tried to take over private property on such a broad scale, with flimsy claims that there’s some kind of “water” connection to dry land.

Try forty. The spate of laws under Nixon was pursuant to the collapse of the Bretton Woods Agreement in 1971. Everything from the CWA to NEPA to the ESA soon followed.

The water from my bathtub runs into the Colorado River, eventually. Does that give Obama control over my property?

As far as the EPA is concerned, yes.

It sounds crazy, but we’re headed closer to, not farther from, total federal control.

I covered the threat to property rights of instituting non-point TMDLs for silt in my first book published twelve years ago. If you go back to about 1999, you will find NRDC lawsuits instituting enforcement of 303(d) standards for nonpoint sources in all fifty States. At that time I warned about this very issue of considering silt in ephemeral streams as nonpoint sources of pollution. Even an attorney at Pacific Legal had read it:

It is fairly obvious that the NRDC lawsuit was not the first that the EPA had heard about enforcing 303(d) TMDL on nonpoint sources. Both litigants are members of the same multilateral organization, the International Union for the Conservation of Nature and Natural Resources (IUCN). In this case, both litigants have a confidential, offshore venue at which to conclude the settlement in advance, and get a free vacation in the deal. The litigants can walk into the Federal Court and tell the judge that they’ll settle. The judge looks at the backlog and down comes the gavel. It’s a done deal: The litigants can enter into a consent decree with a time limit for implementation upon which they alone agree. They can even have the press releases written in advance.

It’s called a sweetheart suit.

There are dozens of Federal Courts in the Western United States. No one could possibly monitor all of these lawsuits sufficiently to find out about the suit, notify the affected property owners, gather data capable of refuting the claims, and organize a response quickly enough to block the consent decree. No one is there with the preparation and aura of credibility to refute the legitimacy of the claims or contest their jurisdictional authority to institute and enforce the nonpoint TMDL.

Now, what was the point of all this? Why should the NRDC and the EPA think the nonpoint nitrate TMDL in the San Lorenzo River Watershed is such a big deal? It’s gonna take a little while for this one to sink in.

Mud.

Wherever there is dirt and water, there is mud. Whenever you mix mud and water, you get suspended silt. Mud is a nonpoint source of silt. Silt is found everywhere there is dirt, which is everywhere. If you want to control the use of dirt, just call it a pollutant! It isn’t clean water any more, it’s dirty. People don’t want dirty water. They want clean water. Just ask them.

I hardly need dire warnings about this from you.
11 posted on 12/12/2012 11:45:13 PM PST by Carry_Okie (The Slave Party: advancing indenture since 1787.)
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To: WilliamIII

The fed gov is just thinking Forward. Increasing control over the wilderness will help keep people in the corrals of cities and towns. Makes secession and self-reliant compounds less viable, too. Increases that interdependence thing that is the dark heart of socialism. You can be in a desert, but you’re messing with somebody’s river. If the gov has to redefine water, so be it, but let’s all be interconnected so the gov can decide who has rights, when, and where.


12 posted on 12/13/2012 4:40:07 AM PST by HomeAtLast
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To: WilliamIII

Build a mosque on it and see what happens.

But make sure the grout of the mortar has pig urine in it first, otherwise you may have some wandering Moslems on their knees when your back is turned.


13 posted on 12/13/2012 4:42:47 AM PST by Eye of Unk (A Civil Cold War in America is here, its already been declared.)
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To: WilliamIII

It’s obvious. Obama doesn’t want to dictate the control of ALL the land in the US. He only wants dominion over the land upon which it rains.


14 posted on 12/13/2012 5:23:36 AM PST by norwaypinesavage (Galileo: In science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of one individual)
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To: WilliamIII
UN Agenda 21.

Again.

15 posted on 12/13/2012 5:34:08 AM PST by E. Pluribus Unum ("The more numerous the laws, the more corrupt the state." - Cornelius Tacitus, Roman Senator)
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To: WilliamIII
What I'd do ('maybe') is clean it up in the dead of night. When the EPA Nazis come back just act SHOCKED!.. and say ...
'Well, the Illegals crossings OUR LAND must have cleaned it up. That, or the Space Aliens we saw land last week took it all with them when they left.'
:-)
16 posted on 12/13/2012 6:01:06 AM PST by Condor51 (Si vis pacem, para bellum.)
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To: Nachum

Knew it. Just talked about it yesterday. He will do whatever he pleases and he knows this is the beginning of his reign over oil.


17 posted on 12/13/2012 6:42:57 AM PST by sarasota
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To: Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America

See #17.


18 posted on 12/13/2012 6:49:01 AM PST by sarasota
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To: WilliamIII
Facism is man playing god.
19 posted on 12/13/2012 7:10:06 AM PST by American in Israel (A wise man's heart directs him to the right, but the foolish mans heart directs him toward the left.)
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To: Carry_Okie

I hardly need dire warnings about this from you.

I hear you. Didn’t realize how much you were into this issue.


20 posted on 12/13/2012 8:54:08 AM PST by WilliamIII
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To: HomeAtLast

#12-—brilliant and succinct assessment.


21 posted on 12/13/2012 9:50:10 AM PST by supremedoctrine
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To: norwaypinesavage

He also wants control over all lands where people are getting prepared.

I still can only come up with one explanation as to why this “man” has all this power. It must be Biblical.


22 posted on 12/13/2012 10:31:26 AM PST by Terry Mross (I don't watch the "news". Someone ping me if something big happens.)
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To: TigersEye

Up near Santa Fe, and the Rio Grand is far to the west of Santa fe near Los Alamos. There is water in the Rio Grand, with you and most people I agree this claim by our lawless master is preposterous. But I’m also surprised it got this far, Santa Fe is after all the most leftist city in the South west.

This couple must have some money aside for not only is Santa Fe very expensive, but a lawsuit against Washington is correspondingly expensive. I guess you could call it an exersize freedom tax, that few are able to pay.


23 posted on 12/13/2012 11:00:46 AM PST by Monorprise
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To: WilliamIII

It sounds crazy, but we’re headed closer to, not farther from, total federal control.


It’s not crazy... If one knows anything about western water rights, and is a living, breathing entity who is paying any sort of attention, it is beyond that the feds have significantly broadened their “rights” over western waters in the past 30 years.


24 posted on 12/13/2012 12:36:48 PM PST by Red Boots
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To: Monorprise
There is water in the Rio Grande in Albuquerque, TorC and even El Paso. I just meant that it's muddy brown water. Even up by Taos it's muddy although perhaps not always.

Los Alamos brings up a good point here though. After the big fire there (not to mention several other fires in the Jemez in recent years) there is going to be lots of muddy runoff. Far more than from cleaning up some trash on one small property.

Maybe they should hold an 'environmental cleanup day' and get all the Greenies to come out and pick up all the trash by hand!?! After only 3 or 4 of them show up they can say 'the Greenies of Fanta Se didn't care so we're going ahead with our plan.'

25 posted on 12/13/2012 1:22:40 PM PST by TigersEye (Who is John Galt?)
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