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US-Iranian nuclear talks fail. Iran has plutonium for 24 Nagasaki-type bombs
Debka ^ | December 15, 2012

Posted on 12/15/2012 8:56:12 AM PST by Dave346

The secret, one-on-one nuclear negotiations President Barack Obama launched with Iran have run into a blank wall. A senior Iranian team member, Mostafa Dolatyar, said Friday, Dec. 14 in New Delhi that the diplomatic process for solving the nuclear issue with Iran was in effect going nowhere, because the demand that Tehran halt its 20-percent enrichment of uranium “doesn’t make sense.”

He went on to say: “They [the world powers] have made certain connections with purely technical issues and something purely political. In so far as this is the mentality and this is the approach from 5 + 1 (the Six World Powers) - or whatever else you call it - definitely there is no end for this game.”

debkafile: The phrase “or whatever else you call it” may be taken as Iran’s first veiled reference to the direct talks with Washington that were launched Dec. 1 in the Swiss town of Lausanne.

Mostafa Dolatyar is not just a faceless official. He is head of the Iranian foreign ministry’s think tank, the Institute for Political and International Studies, as well as a senior member of the Iranian team facing US negotiators in Lausanne. His remarks were undoubtedly authorized by the office of Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei who, through him, posted a message to Washington: If the enrichment suspension demand stands, the game’s over.

After more than 15 years of on-and-off, largely aimless, nuclear diplomacy with world powers and evasive tactics with the UN nuclear agency, Tehran is for the first time showing signs of impatience and not just is usual disdain. This is because two things have changed:

(Excerpt) Read more at debka.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Foreign Affairs; Israel; Russia
KEYWORDS: bushehr; elbaradeisbomb; iaeabomb; iran; nuclear; plutonium
Looks like those of us warning that Bushehr had to be stopped in 2010 were right all along.
1 posted on 12/15/2012 8:56:24 AM PST by Dave346
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To: Dave346

Obama hasn’t given up on getting an American city nuked yet.


2 posted on 12/15/2012 9:07:05 AM PST by Hardraade (http://junipersec.wordpress.com (Vendetta))
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To: Hardraade
He did say, at one time, we could survive it OK if it happened...no biggie I guess, just as long as it wasn't DC, probably.
3 posted on 12/15/2012 9:11:15 AM PST by hinckley buzzard
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To: hinckley buzzard

Well. It appears that the harshly worded letters from the UN and the secretary of state, clintoon, didn’t work after all. Boom, you’re dead.


4 posted on 12/15/2012 9:23:44 AM PST by hal ogen (First Amendment or Reeducation Camp?)
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To: Dave346

Add in the missile technology provided by the clintoons and not-so-bright and zer0’s and democRATS’ plans to abort millions of Americans are within the grasp of the terrorists. Yep, too late to be worried. When people die, at least it will be known who helped the terrorists succeed. Even though I do not consider the source reliable; the implications are profound.


5 posted on 12/15/2012 9:33:26 AM PST by no-to-illegals (Please God, Protect and Bless Our Men and Women in Uniform with Victory. Amen.)
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To: Dave346

——the Swiss town of Lausanne.———

Lots of fantastically good eats there. I can’t think of a better place to loll around and meet a few hours per day, between fantastic meals.


6 posted on 12/15/2012 9:37:00 AM PST by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 .....The fairest Deduction to be reduced is the Standard Deduction)
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To: hinckley buzzard

New York City would be easy to nuke. Imagine that now you see it, now you don’t scenario. What kind of economic impact would that be? Worse case, several seaport cities could be obliterated simultaneously.


7 posted on 12/15/2012 9:39:29 AM PST by meatloaf (Support Senate S 1863 & House Bill 1380 to eliminate oil slavery.)
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To: Dave346

Iran’s nuke fabrication facility needs to have a nuclear “accident”, ASAP.


8 posted on 12/15/2012 9:53:53 AM PST by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed &water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: Dave346

If Iran has a working reactor, they have plutonium. The article says that they doubt that Iran has the technical ability to extract the plutonium from the rods, which is actually not true. While the separation has to be done robotically, it is a simple chemical process. Separating the U235 isotope from U238 to make a uranium bomb is actually much more difficult.

And, 24 Nagasaki-type bombs is not what the Iranians want. I’m sure they’d rather just use the plutonium as an initiator for a lithium-deuteride reaction. More bang for the buck.


9 posted on 12/15/2012 10:03:49 AM PST by henkster ("The people who count the votes decide everything." -Joseph Stalin)
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To: Dave346

Prescription: Radiation Therapy.

Iran needs a thorough stream of radiation to root out and contain the problem before it gets much larger. It should have been caught earlier.

This will spread to New York, Washington, LA, Dallas etc etc wherever Obama wants to direct it to.


10 posted on 12/15/2012 10:05:08 AM PST by himno hero (hadnuff)
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To: no-to-illegals

“When people die, at least it will be known who helped the terrorists succeed.”
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

Oh, yes, the left will know instantly to blame the NRA, Tea Party, Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachman, George W. Bush, Dick Cheney, George H.W. Bush, Ronald Reagan, maybe even Richard Nixon.


11 posted on 12/15/2012 10:16:33 AM PST by RipSawyer (I was born on Earth, what planet is this?)
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To: Dave346

so what, they can’t deliver it.


12 posted on 12/15/2012 10:29:24 AM PST by longfellow (Bill Maher, the 21st hijacker.)
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To: Dave346

Failure thy nmae is Obama.


13 posted on 12/15/2012 11:03:18 AM PST by hattend (Firearms and ammunition...the only growing industries under the Obama regime.)
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To: longfellow

The Norks just orbited a satellite, have an ICBM if you will, and Iran buys missiles from the Norks.

It won’t take much to get a delivery vehicle.


14 posted on 12/15/2012 11:06:22 AM PST by hattend (Firearms and ammunition...the only growing industries under the Obama regime.)
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To: hattend
Failure thy nmae is Obama.

It's also your name!

15 posted on 12/15/2012 11:07:14 AM PST by hattend (Firearms and ammunition...the only growing industries under the Obama regime.)
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To: hattend; longfellow
so what, they can’t deliver it.

It doesn't take a B-52 or an ICBM to deliver a nuclear weapon.

They can also be "delivered" in the hold of a merchant ship entering New York Harbor. Or in the back of a one-ton truck fording the Rio Grande below El Paso. Or in the cargo hold of an airfreighter letting down into Dulles.

It's absurd to contend that, just because the Iranians don't have jet bombers or long-range ballistic missiles, that we're immune from a nuclear attack.

16 posted on 12/15/2012 11:35:39 AM PST by okie01 (THE MAINSTREAM MEDIA; Ignorance on parade.)
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To: hattend

Nuke strikes in large urban cities will be the Rats death knell.

Its where all their voters live.


17 posted on 12/15/2012 11:37:35 AM PST by Gasshog
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To: Dave346

Naturally they went nowhere. Having enough plutonium, they no longer need to play for time.


18 posted on 12/15/2012 11:41:21 AM PST by Eleutheria5 (End the occupation. Annex today.)
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To: Dave346
US-Iranian nuclear talks fail. Iran has plutonium for 24 Nagasaki-type bombs

Not to worry, didn't Idiot Joe Biden say during the debates that Iran didn't have anything to put the plutonium in? /sarc

19 posted on 12/15/2012 11:46:39 AM PST by The Sons of Liberty (America 2012 - What Would Our Forefathers Do?)
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To: longfellow

“so what, they can’t deliver it.”

The world’s best physical distribution system can. And, smugglers are not encountering any resistance from us, ‘remember?


20 posted on 12/15/2012 11:48:07 AM PST by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon freedom, it is necessary to examine principles."..)
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To: Dave346

looks like 0bama is succeeding in his goal to get nukes under the caliphate’s control


21 posted on 12/15/2012 11:52:13 AM PST by sten (fighting tyranny never goes out of style)
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To: henkster
You're right about procurement of the respective metals, but Plutonium is so hot that Plutonium weapons are a lot harder to design, and extensive testing is needed to perfect the conventional charge configuration so the fissile material doesn't just blow itself out; this can't really happen with even very simple Uranium bombs.

We know the North Koreans had several ~1 K-ton (or smaller) detonations trying to perfect the technique. There is as yet no evidence in the public domain of such tests by Iran. Even if US intelligence tried to suppress them, the Israelis surely would not.

Boosted and multi-stage thermonuclear devices are even more difficult. It's not clear that India and Pakistan even have these devices -- though they brag that they do. I seriously doubt the Iranians are at this level of sophistication. It's bad enough that they're on the brink of having 1945-level technology weapons.

22 posted on 12/15/2012 12:51:15 PM PST by FredZarguna (One kilogram of anti-matter is EIGHT megatons, BYOTCHES.)
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To: The Sons of Liberty

Yes, but unfortunately, Ryan didn’t completely crush that remark. He should have. The Iranians don’t need missiles to deliver their nukes, and their bombs don’t have to be terribly sophisticated to achieve their ambitions.


23 posted on 12/15/2012 12:55:09 PM PST by FredZarguna (One gram of antimatter gets eight kilotons.)
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To: FredZarguna
You wrote -

It's not clear that India and Pakistan even have these devices -- though they brag that they do.


For reference - India was subject to US-led sanctions on its nuclear program after its first atomic test in 1974. These were hardened in 1998 when New Delhi declared itself a nuclear weapons state after conducting five test nuclear explosions. http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/749827.shtml

http://www.thenews.com.pk/Todays-News-6-143722-Pakistani-&-Indian-scientists-speak-out-on-nuclear-race-issue

I seem to recall there were actual successful nuclear tests by India.

24 posted on 12/15/2012 1:58:51 PM PST by mbj
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Comment #25 Removed by Moderator

To: mbj
They undeniably have nuclear weapons.

You were inattentive. I was speaking specifically of fusion boosted and multi-stage thermonuclear weapons (incorrectly called "H-Bombs" in the popular vernacular.)

Here, among many places, you will find some claims that India does not, in fact, possess thermonuclear weapons : http://lewis.armscontrolwonk.com/archive/2445/indias-h-bomb-revisited. The discussions and controversy are extensive. Dig in.

26 posted on 12/15/2012 2:46:17 PM PST by FredZarguna (Existence of Spellchecker.)
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To: Dave346

So there you have it: guns in the hands of US citizens is a crime and needs to be punished.

Nuclear bombs in the hands of rogue terror states is their God given right.

It’s another day in Obamaland. :D


27 posted on 12/15/2012 2:55:50 PM PST by Tzimisce (What do you do when every every branch of the government is corrupt and aligned against you?)
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*


28 posted on 12/15/2012 5:13:33 PM PST by PMAS (All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing)
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To: Dave346
14 lbs of Pu-239 from the reactor would be plenty sufficient. And you can mix U-235 with Pu-239 to get enough for the weapon. The U-238 from the refining process gets used as well in the bomb. The Swedish design is easy enough for even a country like Iran. They probably already detonated the objective design in Korea to make sure it worked. The key is the weight limit on the Shahab-3, 1,500 lbs. Plenty enough for the nuclear weapon. I believe they already have 3 warheads and enough material for 3 more. Once they reach 8 warheads, all bets are off. They may get greedy and go for a greater number to keep in reserve to threaten Europe as well as the U.S. in the region and the Saudi oil fields. Israel is running out of time. The Obama second term may have almost guaranteed a nuclear war. If Israel is smart, it will be a pre-emptive nuclear war. The Muslim brotherhood will soon have the military of Syria to go along with the militaries of Lybia and Egypt. All part of their plan for a Jewish genocide.
29 posted on 12/15/2012 5:28:54 PM PST by Revolutionary ("Praise the Lord and Pass the Ammunition!")
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Comment #30 Removed by Moderator

To: Dave346

You know, this problem wouldn’t exist if we just nuked Iran. Problem solved, plus a few million fewer freedom-hating islamofascists in the world. What’s the downside?


31 posted on 12/15/2012 8:22:26 PM PST by meyer (Proud member of the 53%.)
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To: RipSawyer

As is a favorite saying Rip ... You can’t fix stupid.


32 posted on 12/16/2012 1:01:11 AM PST by no-to-illegals (Please God, Protect and Bless Our Men and Women in Uniform with Victory. Amen.)
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To: hattend

Remember, Obama said we didn’t have to worry about those “small” Countries. Is it time for American Idol yet?


33 posted on 12/16/2012 1:06:54 AM PST by Kickass Conservative (They Live, and we're the only ones wearing the Sunglasses...)
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To: Dave346

from the article “Iran could extract 220 pounds (just under 100 kilos) of plutonium, enough to produce as many as “24 Nagasaki-type bombs””

A google search indicates that the critical mass of plutonium is about 10 KG, which means Iran has 10 bombs at the most.

Now a bomb needs to exceed critical mass to go boom or else it is a reactor, not a bomb.

Furthermore, if you have a crude design instead of a state of the art one, you have to be tempted to use close to 1.7 or 1.8 times critical mass to make sure the bomb goes boom instead of a brown fizzle.

So, the Iranians might have 6-7 bombs.

I will say it is really bad if the Iranians have plutonium instead of Uranium because it is a lot easier to make plutonium go boom than Uranium.


34 posted on 12/16/2012 7:44:34 AM PST by staytrue
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To: hinckley buzzard

You mean....just as long as it wasn’t DC while Obama is IN DC, don’t you? Obie wouldn’t care as long as he is safely out of the blast and fallout area.

“He did say, at one time, we could survive it OK if it happened...no biggie I guess, just as long as it wasn’t DC, probably.


35 posted on 12/16/2012 9:14:35 AM PST by XenaLee (The only good commie is a dead commie.)
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To: hattend

This was Joe Biden’s dumb ass response during the debates.


36 posted on 12/16/2012 9:18:06 AM PST by longfellow (Bill Maher, the 21st hijacker.)
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To: GladesGuru

This was Joe Biden’s dumb ass response during the debates.


37 posted on 12/16/2012 9:19:51 AM PST by longfellow (Bill Maher, the 21st hijacker.)
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To: GladesGuru

This was Joe Biden’s dumb ass response during the debates.


38 posted on 12/16/2012 9:20:58 AM PST by longfellow (Bill Maher, the 21st hijacker.)
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To: longfellow
The Norks just orbited a satellite, have an ICBM if you will, and Iran buys missiles from the Norks.

It won’t take much to get a delivery vehicle.

This was Joe Biden’s dumb ass response during the debates.

It was? Why is it "dumb ass"? It's true.

39 posted on 12/16/2012 11:45:45 AM PST by hattend (Firearms and ammunition...the only growing industries under the Obama regime.)
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To: hattend

NO, No, No, Dumb ass biden said “so what if they get a nuke they can’t deliver it”.


40 posted on 12/16/2012 8:14:18 PM PST by longfellow (Bill Maher, the 21st hijacker.)
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To: longfellow

I suspect an order has already been sent to North Korea for a few of their now successfully launched ICBMs.


41 posted on 12/17/2012 7:24:44 AM PST by littleharbour
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To: longfellow

I suspect an order has already been sent to North Korea for a few of their now successfully launched ICBMs.


42 posted on 12/17/2012 7:26:01 AM PST by littleharbour
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To: littleharbour
"...I suspect an order has already been sent to North Korea for a few of their now successfully launched ICBMs...."

They can just trade, "mine for yours"!!!!!

can you say, "destabilization"??

43 posted on 12/17/2012 11:16:07 AM PST by kimtom (USA on the Brink, Now Falling over the edge)
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To: himno hero
Prescription: Radiation Therapy. Iran needs a thorough stream of radiation to root out and contain the problem before it gets much larger.

Better if the radiation could be of the Neutron variety. If we still had that device (no thanks to the Peanut farmer for dismantling them) we could eliminate the entire population and all the animals then waltz in and claim the oil four days later when the radiation subsided to nearly nothing.

IIRC the Nagasaki device was a nominal yield of about 20KT. A firecracker by modern ICBM standards. That size can be fired from a cannon on a battlefield these days. Still, it would do a spectacular job of urban renewal in Detroit or Chicago or South Central L.A., who would then scream for funds to rebuild and do it right this time...

44 posted on 12/20/2012 12:46:14 PM PST by ExSoldier (Stand up and be counted... OR LINE UP AND BE NUMBERED...)
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