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Kos: Ban Guns with Magazines; Shooter's Mother Was Paranoid Freak Who Sealed Her Own 'Doom'
NewsBusters ^

Posted on 12/18/2012 6:22:02 PM PST by chessplayer

The hard-left gun abolitionists are feeling their oats lately. Buoyed by the president's reelection and his hinting strongly that he will pursue gun control legislation in the wake of the Newtown mass murder, Daily Kos founder Markos Moulitsas offered yesterday "Some thoughts on the coming gun debate" which essentially boiled down to a call to make illegal a broad array of guns that are right now perfectly legal and used daily by law-abiding Americans to protect their homes: rifles and handguns that are semiautomatics with detachable magazines.

"[I]f I were the benevolent dictator of this country, I'd simply outlaw guns with magazines. That would leave plenty of guns for people to hunt with and defend their homes," Moulitsas insisted. Of course, banning all guns with magazines would instantly make Granny's 9 mm semiautomatic pistol illegal. Sure, she may opt for a revolver, but generally speaking that means she's going to have less rounds to work with in a home defense scenario, not to mention stronger kickback. But really, in Moulitsas's mind, if you are a gun owner, like the shooter's mom was, you were probably a paranoid freak who deserves to be shot:

[H]is idiot "survivalist" mother (how'd that work out for her?) had to purchase her small arsenal, to protect herself against phantom threats on her "freedoms"—urged on by Fox News and Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck and the gun manufacturers. And instead, she ensured her own untimely doom and that of too many innocents.


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: banglist; guncontrol; secondamendment

1 posted on 12/18/2012 6:22:06 PM PST by chessplayer
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To: chessplayer

The scumbag Moulitsas is trying to introduce the “We only ask that you to sit in the back of the plane if you want to smoke” Phase of the communists’ Camel’s Nose agenda. Take your crap somewhere else commie! Why no “outrage” over the million Americans who were murdered in abortion clinic last year, sh*tbird?


2 posted on 12/18/2012 6:27:26 PM PST by FlingWingFlyer (Gun control is not about laws. It's about confiscation.)
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To: chessplayer

Just saw Pierce Morgan attempting to go after the president of GOA.

What an officious ass and a POS Limey.

FU PM and there are no guests you will ever have on your show that will compel me to watch your goofy, pretentious and predatory haranging which merely mimicks an ape.


3 posted on 12/18/2012 6:31:45 PM PST by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

Another raging leftist douche-bag opines.


4 posted on 12/18/2012 6:32:56 PM PST by paulcissa (The first requirement of Liberalism is to stand on your head and tell the world they're upside down)
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To: chessplayer

I don’t even like discussing this as the thought of those beautiful little children murdered upsets me.

The fact is tho that he could have done the same thing or maybe even worse with a Lupo with auto ejectors and pockets full of shells. After he had taken care of the adults those little children could do nothing.

I still don’t know exactly what kind of guns the guy used as I have heard different versions but it really doesn’t matter. He could have used about anything from a hatchet to a double bladed axe to a bucket of gas and a match.

I hate to think of any method to use on those innocents but the number of ways not even involving guns is massive.


5 posted on 12/18/2012 6:39:01 PM PST by yarddog (One shot one miss.)
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To: yarddog

This one used dynamite.

1927 — US: Bath, Michigan School Disaster. Andrew Kehoe, seeking revenge against the community for taxes imposed on his farm to pay for a new school, set off a TNT bomb in the school, killing 43 people, including 39 grade-school children. After the explosion, Kehoe killed his wife, then drove his truck back, loaded with dynamite & nails, to the school, & set it off, killing himself & the school superintendent.


6 posted on 12/18/2012 6:42:36 PM PST by HerrBlucher (Praise to the Lord the Almighty the King of Creation)
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To: chessplayer

I’d simply outlaw guns with magazines. That would leave plenty of guns for people to hunt with and defend their homes,”

I remember when the most fearful thing in a Lib’s hum drum life was a manufactured fear of the 5 shot bolt action army surplus rifle and the low cost revolver.


7 posted on 12/18/2012 6:52:12 PM PST by Ruy Dias de Bivar (Reopen the mental institutions! Damn the ACLU!)
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To: chessplayer
Shooter's Mother Was Paranoid Freak Who Sealed Her Own 'Doom'

You can always count on class,compassion and basic Christian decency from the Daily Chaos.

8 posted on 12/18/2012 6:57:14 PM PST by Gay State Conservative (When Robbing Peter To Pay Paul,One Can Always Count On Paul's Cooperation)
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To: chessplayer; viking kitty; Slings and Arrows; All
Shalom!

Hey...Chessplayer...

YOU ARE IN NEED OF: MISS. VIKING KITTY...TO GIVE YOU A RIGHT AND PROPER *** ZOT! ***

BUT I'LL GET YOU, YOU SLIMY TWO LEGGED LIBERAL, SOCIALIST, COMMUNIST DEMON-RAT SNAKE...

BAST*RD!!!

TAKE THIS ** ZOT ** AND SHOVE IT!

Simcha7...A PROUD GUN TOTING AMERICAN!

9 posted on 12/18/2012 7:02:29 PM PST by Simcha7 ((The Plumb - Line has been Drawn, T'shuvah/Return for The Kingdom of HaShem is at hand!))
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To: chessplayer

Still wondering why didn’t the Media want to ban “Rusty Butter-knives” after Daniel Pearl?

TT

(I know Ko’s isn’t the “Media” ... but they sleep together)


10 posted on 12/18/2012 7:09:12 PM PST by TexasTransplant (Radical islam is islam. Moderate islam is the Trojan Horse.)
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To: yarddog

I know really, we should be looking for ways tonreach ot to these families and offer whatever condolences or help if we can.


11 posted on 12/18/2012 7:10:35 PM PST by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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To: Simcha7

Shalom but, WTF ?


12 posted on 12/18/2012 7:13:36 PM PST by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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To: Simcha7; chessplayer; viking kitty; Slings and Arrows
CHESSPLAYER...

DON'T GO GETTING YOUR GIRLIE PANTIES IN A BIG WAD.

JUST WANT TO MAKE IT REAL CLEAR HERE...

I AM GETTING YOU WITH A FREE REPUBLIC...

MISS. VIKING KITTY....** ZOT **

HAVE TO BE CAREFUL THESE DAYS...ESPECIALLY WHEN TRYING TO TALK TO A LIBERAL IDIOT!

13 posted on 12/18/2012 7:16:17 PM PST by Simcha7 ((The Plumb - Line has been Drawn, T'shuvah/Return for The Kingdom of HaShem is at hand!))
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To: Vendome; All
Vendome and All,

I am an OLD TIME FREEPER FROM 1999.

When Ever A LIBERAL/SOCIALIST/COMMUNIST DEMON-RAT SPEWED THEIR GARBAGE HERE ON FREE REPUBLIC...

Another Long Time FREEPER By The Name Of: Miss. VIKING KITTY...

Went On THE SUSPICIOUS THREAD AND...GAVE THE DEMON-RAT A...

** ZOT! **

THIS IS PART OF: FREEPER LORE....Long Before Your Time HERE!

IF YOU DON'T BELIEVE ME...GO AND ASK FR's OWNER: JimRob, He Knows Me For A Very LONG TIME!

AND I'D LIKE TO REMIND YOU ABOUT NOT USING NASTY LANGUAGE!

Like Dropping The: "F" BOMB...THAT'S NOT NICE For A FREEPER TO DO!

14 posted on 12/18/2012 7:39:33 PM PST by Simcha7 ((The Plumb - Line has been Drawn, T'shuvah/Return for The Kingdom of HaShem is at hand!))
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
I’d simply outlaw guns with magazines.

Why punish the innocent for the crime of another?
99.9999999.....% of people who own a gun like that haven't hurt anyone. They've committed no crime. Why would you want to steal their property from them for no reason at all?

15 posted on 12/18/2012 7:48:29 PM PST by concerned about politics ("Get thee behind me, Liberal")
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To: chessplayer

These anti-gun idiots don’t know what they’re talking about.


16 posted on 12/18/2012 8:01:30 PM PST by popdonnelly
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To: chessplayer

“[I]f I were the benevolent dictator of this country,

Quick, list the names of the last 10 benevolent dictators that you know!


17 posted on 12/18/2012 8:03:59 PM PST by RetiredTexasVet (The law of unintended consequences is an unforgiving and vindictive b!tch!)
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To: chessplayer
It's no wonder that socialists are fans of gun control.


18 posted on 12/18/2012 8:04:31 PM PST by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: popdonnelly
These anti-gun idiots don’t know what they’re talking about.

Black Gun Buying Frenzy [Vanity]

19 posted on 12/18/2012 8:06:31 PM PST by concerned about politics ("Get thee behind me, Liberal")
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To: chessplayer

20 posted on 12/18/2012 8:22:40 PM PST by tumblindice (America's founding fathers: All armed conservatives. "A long train of abuses and usurpations.")
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To: Vendome

Long ago I christened him “The Slimey Limey”. Fits. Send him back to England.


21 posted on 12/18/2012 8:54:55 PM PST by pankot
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To: Simcha7

Did I misunderstand you calling for chessplayer to be zotted?

Or were you referencing another thread?


22 posted on 12/18/2012 8:55:44 PM PST by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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To: chessplayer

SAMUEL ADAMS:

“Among the natural rights of the Colonists are these: First, a right to life; Secondly, to liberty; Thirdly, to property; together with the right to support and defend them in the best manner they can. … it is the greatest absurdity to suppose it in the power of one, or any number of men, at entering into society, to renounce their essential natural rights, or the means of preserving those rights; when the grand end of civil government, from the very nature of its institution, is for the support, protection, and defense of those very rights; the principal of which, as is before observed, are Life, Liberty, and Property. If men, through fear, fraud, or mistake, should in terms renounce or give up any essential natural right, the eternal law of reason and the grand end of society would absolutely vacate such renunciation. The right to freedom being the gift of God Almighty, it is not in the power of man to alienate this gift and voluntarily become a slave.” – The Rights of the Colonists (November 20, 1772)

“The said Constitution [shall] be never construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the press, or the rights of conscience; or to prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms; or to raise standing armies, unless necessary for the defense of the United States, or of some one or more of them.” – Debates & Proceedings in the Convention of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts (February 6, 1788)

“The Militia is composed of free citizens. There is therefore no danger of their making use of their power to the destruction of their own Rights, or suffering others to invade them.”

“... whereas, to preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms, and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them...” – Constitutional Debates of the Massachusetts Convention of 1788 (also attributed to A Federal Farmer, the anti-federalist)

GEORGE WASHINGTON:

“To be prepared for war is one of the most effectual means of preserving peace. A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined; to which end a uniform and well-digested plan is requisite; and their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories as tend to render them independent of others for essential, particularly military, supplies.” – First Annual Message to Congress; Federal Hall, New York City (January 8, 1790)

THOMAS JEFFERSON:

“The laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Can it be supposed that those who have the courage to violate the most sacred laws of humanity...will respect the less important and arbitrary ones... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants, they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.” – quoted from Enlightenment philosopher Cesare Beccaria’s On Crimes and Punishment, 1764; translated by Jefferson and copied into his Commonplace Book of great quotations.

“No freeman shall be debarred the use of arms [within his own lands or tenements].” – Draft Constitution for Virginia; June 13, 1776 (brackets in Jefferson’s original)

“Every able bodied freeman, between the ages of 16 and 50, is enrolled in the militia. … The law requires every militia-man to provide himself with the arms usual in the regular service.” – Notes on the State of Virginia, written by Jefferson, published in 1781, updated in 1782

“A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun therefore be the constant companion of your walks.” – letter to nephew Peter Carr (August 19, 1785)

“What country before, every existed a century and a half without a rebellion? And what country can preserve its liberties, if its rulers are not warned from time to time, that his people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. … What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure.” – letter to Colonel William S. Smith, Paris (November 13, 1787)

“I enclose you a list of the killed, wounded, and captives of the enemy from the commencement of hostilities at Lexington in April, 1775, until November, 1777, since which there has been no event of any consequence... I think that upon the whole it has been about one half the number lost by them, in some instances more, but in others less. This difference is ascribed to our superiority in taking aim when we fire; every soldier in our army having been intimate with his gun from his infancy.” – letter to Giovanni Fabbroni (June 8, 1788)

“…the governor [is] constitutionally the commander of the militia of the State, that is to say, of every man in it able to bear arms…”. – letter to Destutt de Tracy (January 26, 1811)

“On every question of construction [of the Constitution] let us carry ourselves back to the time when the Constitution was adopted, recollect the spirit manifested in the debates, and instead of trying what meaning may be squeezed out of the text, or invent against it, conform to the probable one in which it was passed.” – letter to William Johnson (June 12, 1823)

“The constitutions of most of our States assert, that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves, in all cases to which they think themselves competent, (as in electing their functionaries executive and legislative, and deciding by a jury of themselves, in all judiciary cases in which any fact is involved) or they may act by representatives, freely and equally chosen; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed; that they are entitled to freedom of person, freedom of religion, freedom of property, and freedom of the press.” – letter to Major John Cartwright (June 5, 1824)

THOMAS PAINE:

“The supposed quietude of a good man allures the ruffian; while on the other hand, arms like laws discourage and keep the invader and the plunderer in awe, and preserve order in the world as well as property. The same balance would be preserved were all the world destitute of arms, for all would be alike; but since some will not, others dare not lay them aside … Horrid mischief would ensue were one half the world deprived of the use of them …”. – Thoughts On Defensive War, 1775

“...in this country, every man is a militia-man...”. – The American Crisis series, # 9, dated June 9, 1780

PATRICK HENRY:

“...who are the militia, if they be not the people of this country...? I ask, who are the militia? They consist now of the whole people, except a few public officers.”

“No free government was ever founded or ever preserved its liberty, without uniting the characters of the citizen and soldier in those destined for the defense of the state.... Such are a well regulated militia, composed of the freeholders, citizen and husbandman, who take up arms to preserve their property, as individuals, and their rights as freemen.”

“The great object is that every man be armed. Everyone who is able may have a gun.” – from debates during the Constitutional convention (later quoted with approval by George Washington), as quoted in Elliot’s Debates, 1836

“That the people have a Right to mass and to bear arms; that a well regulated militia composed of the Body of the people, trained to arms, is the proper natural and safe defense of a free state...”

“Have we no means of resisting disciplined armies, when our only defense, the militia, is put in the hands of Congress? Of what service would the militia be to you when, most probably, you will not have a single musket in the state? For, as arms are to be provided by Congress, they may or may not provide them.”

“They tell us, Sir, that we are weak...but when shall we be stronger? Will it be when we are totally disarmed?

Three millions of People, armed in the holy cause of liberty, and in such a country as that which we possess, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us.” – The War Inevitable; speech to the Virginia assembly, March, 1775

“...a well regulated militia, composed of gentlemen and yeomen, is the natural strength and only security of a free government.”

“Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined.” (in the Virginia ratifying convention)

JOHN ADAMS:

“To suppose arms in the hands of citizens, to be used at individual discretion, except in private self-defense...is a dissolution of the government.” – A Defense of the Constitutions of the Government of the United States of America, 1788, questioning the utility of private arms for the defense of the State but accepting the private right of self defense.

“Arms in the hands of citizens [may] be used at individual discretion… in private self-defense …” – A Defense of the Constitutions of the Government of the United States of America (1788)

“Here, every private person is authorized to arm himself, and on the strength of this authority, I do not deny the inhabitants had a right to arm themselves at that time, for their defense, not for offense...”. – opening statement as defense counsel for British soldiers on trial for the Boston Massacre in 1770; from the Legal Papers of John Adams, Butterfield and Zobel; 1965

JAMES MADISON:

“Let a regular army, fully equal to the resources of the country, be formed; and let it be entirely at the devotion of the federal government; still it would not be going too far to say, that the State governments, with the people on their side, would be able to repel the danger. The highest number to which, according to the best computation, a standing army can be carried in any country, does not exceed one hundredth part of the whole number of souls; or one twenty-fifth part of the number able to bear arms. This proportion would not yield, in the United States, an army of more than twenty-five or thirty thousand men. To these would be opposed a militia amounting to near half a million of citizens with arms in their hands, officered by men chosen from among themselves, fighting for their common liberties, and united and conducted by governments possessing their affections and confidence. It may well be doubted, whether a militia thus circumstanced could ever be conquered by such a proportion of regular troops. Those who are best acquainted with the last successful resistance of this country against the British arms, will be most inclined to deny the possibility of it. Besides the advantage of being armed, which the Americans possess over the people of almost every other nation, the existence of subordinate governments, to which the people are attached, and by which the militia officers are appointed, forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition, more insurmountable than any which a simple government of any form can admit of. Notwithstanding the military establishments in the several kingdoms of Europe, which are carried as far as the public resources will bear, the governments are afraid to trust the people with arms. And it is not certain, that with this aid alone they would not be able to shake off their yokes. But were the people to possess the additional advantages of local governments chosen by themselves, who could collect the national will and direct the national force, and of officers appointed out of the militia, by these governments, and attached both to them and to the militia, it may be affirmed with the greatest assurance, that the throne of every tyranny in Europe would be speedily overturned in spite of the legions which surround it. Let us not insult the free and gallant citizens of America with the suspicion, that they would be less able to defend the rights of which they would be in actual possession, than the debased subjects of arbitrary power would be to rescue theirs from the hands of their oppressors.” – Federalist # 46

“[A] government resting on a minority is an aristocracy, not a Republic, and could not be safe with a numerical and physical force against it, without a standing army, an enslaved press, and a disarmed populace.”

JAMES MONROE:

“...the loyalists in the beginning of the late war, who objected to associating, arming and fighting, in defense of our liberties, because these measures were not constitutional. A free people should always be left... with every possible power to promote their own happiness.”

ALEXANDER HAMILTON:

“If the representatives of the people betray their constituents, there is then no recourse left but in the exertion of that original right of self defense which is paramount to all positive forms of government.” – Federalist # 28

“Little more can reasonably be aimed at with respect to the people at large than to have them properly armed and equipped...” – Federalist # 29

Further in Federalist #29, Hamilton discusses militias and standing armies in detail. He argues against a formal standing army recommending “...an excellent body of well trained militia ready to take the field whenever the defense of the State shall require it. This will not only lessen the call for military establishments, but if circumstances should at any time oblige the government to form an army of any magnitude, that army can never be formidable to the liberties of the people while there is a large body of citizens, little if at all inferior to them in discipline and the use of arms who stand ready to defend their own rights and those of their fellow citizens.” If Hamilton expected the militia to be able to stand up to and oppose the regular army, if necessary, with what would they be expected to fight, if not their own arms? That entire exposition, assuming that people would always possess their own weapons with which they could defend the People’s liberties against any formal “military establishment” of the State which might turn tyrannical, clearly shows that the idea of disarming the people was so foreign to their thinking, that they didn’t even consider it as a real possibility.

BENJAMIN FRANKLIN:

“Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.”

GEORGE MASON:

(Virginia delegate to the Constitutional Convention of 1787, Delegate to the Virginia Constitutional Ratification Convention of 1788, helped Thomas Jefferson draft the Virginia Declaration of Rights which served as the basis for the U.S. Bill of Rights)

“[W]hen the resolution of enslaving America was formed in Great Britain, the British Parliament was advised by an artful man, who was governor of Pennsylvania, to disarm the people; that it was the best and most effectual way to enslave them; but that they should not do it openly, but weaken them, and let them sink gradually, by totally disusing and neglecting the militia.” – from debates during the Virginia state ratifying convention (June 14, 1788), quoted in Elliot’s Debates

“I ask, who are the militia? They consist now of the whole people, except a few public officers. But I cannot say who will be the militia of the future day. If that paper on the table gets no alteration, the militia of the future day may not consist of all classes, high and low, and rich and poor; but they may be confined to the lower and middle classes of the people, granting exclusion to the higher classes of the people. If we should ever see that day, the most ignominious punishments and heavy fines may be expected. Under the present government, all ranks of people are subject to militia duty. Under such a full and equal representation as ours, there can be no ignominious punishment inflicted. But under this national, or rather consolidated government, the case will be different. The representation being so small and inadequate, they will have no fellow-feeling for the people.” – from debates during the Virginia state ratifying convention (June 16, 1788), quoted in Elliot’s Debates

“That a well-regulated militia, composed of the body of the people trained to arms, is the proper, natural and safe defense of a free state...” – Virginia Declaration of Rights (drafted by Thomas Jefferson and George Mason, with others)

“Are we at last brought to such an humiliating and debasing degradation that we cannot be trusted with arms for our own defense? Where is the difference between having our arms under our own possession and under our own direction, and having them under the management of Congress? If our defense be the real object of having those arms, in whose hands can they be trusted with more propriety, or equal safety to us, as in our own hands?”

“Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect every one who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined.... O sir, we should have fine times, indeed, if to punish tyrants, it were only sufficient to assemble the people!”

NOAH WEBSTER:

“The militia, who are in fact the effective part of the people at large, will render many troops quite unnecessary. They will form a powerful check upon the regular troops, and will generally be sufficient to over-awe them.” – An Examination of the Leading Principles of the Federal Constitution (October 17, 1787)

“Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed, as they are in almost every kingdom in Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword, because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops that can be, on any pretense, raised in the United States. A military force, at the command of Congress, can execute no laws, but such as the people perceive to be just and constitutional; for they will possess the power, and jealousy will instantly inspire the inclination, to resist the execution of a law which appears to the unjust and oppressive.” – An Examination of the Leading Principles of the Federal Constitution (October 17, 1787)

RICHARD HENRY LEE:

(Fought under George Washington, introduced the motion leading to the Declaration of Independence, signer of the Declaration of Independence; an antifederalist, elected as Virginia delegate to the Constitutional convention and refused to serve, believing the convention was an improper body to consider the new Constitution; opposed the Constitution as not sufficiently protective of individual and State’s rights; U.S. Senator from Virginia and helped secure ratification of U.S. Bill of Rights)

“A militia when properly formed are in fact the people themselves...and include all men capable of bearing arms. The Constitution ought to secure a genuine militia and guard against a select militia, by providing that the militia shall always be kept well organized, armed, and disciplined, and include...all men capable of bearing arms. The mind that aims at a select militia, must be influenced by a truly anti-republican principle.” – Additional Letters From The Federal Farmer (1788)

“To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of the people always possess arms and be taught alike, especially when young, how to use them.” – Letters From The Federal Farmer, # 18 (January 25, 1788)

“... of the liberty of conscience in matters of religious faith, of speech and of the press; of the trial by jury of the vicinage in civil and criminal cases; of the benefit of the writ of habeas corpus; of the right to keep and bear arms.... If these rights are well defined, and secured against encroachment, it is impossible that government should ever degenerate into tyranny.” – Letters from the Federal Farmer, # 53 (1788)

“That the people have a right to keep and bear arms; that a well-regulated militia, composed of the body of the people trained to arms, is the proper, natural and safe defense of a free state; that standing armies, in time of peace, are dangerous to liberty, and therefore ought to be avoided, as far as the circumstances and protection of the community will admit.” – proposed by the Virginia delegation to the Constitutional Convention (defining the phrase “well-regulated militia” which was used exactly in the final draft of the Second Amendment); and suggested in their state ratification debates, June 1788, to clarify the right.

ELBRIDGE GERRY:

(Massachusetts delegate to the Constitutional Convention of 1787; delegate to the Massachusetts Ratification Convention of 1788 [refused to agree to the Constitution]; Vice President during President James Madison’s second term, 1813 until his death in 1814)

“What, sir, is the use of militia? It is to prevent the establishment of a standing army, the bane of liberty. . . Whenever Government means to invade the rights and liberties of the people, they always attempt to destroy the militia, in order to raise a standing army upon its ruins.” – debate in the U.S. House of Representatives (August 17, 1789)

FISHER AMES:

(Delegate to the Massachusetts Constitutional Ratification Convention of 1788, and was later elected to the U.S. House of Representatives in 1789)

“The rights of conscience, of bearing arms, of changing the government, are declared to be inherent in the people.” – letter to F.R. Minoe (June 12, 1789)

SAMUEL BRYAN:

(Pennsylvania anti-federalist, wrote under the pseudonym “Centinel”)

“That the people have a right to bear arms for the defense of themselves and their own state, or the United States, or for the purpose of killing game; and no law shall be passed for disarming the people or any of them, unless for crimes committed, or real danger of public injury from individuals...”. – during debates on ratification of the Constitution in the Pennsylvania assembly

TENCH COXE:

(Prominent Federalist from Pennsylvania, published commentary under the pseudonym “An American Citizen”)

“The militia, who are in fact the effective part of the people at large, will render many troops quite unnecessary. They will form a powerful check upon the regular troops, and will generally be sufficient to over-awe them.” – An American Citizen (October 21,1787)

“Who are the militia? Are they not ourselves? Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birthright of an American . . . . The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.” – The Pennsylvania Gazette (February 20, 1788)

“As civil rulers, not having their duty to the people before them, may attempt to tyrannize, and as the military forces which must occasionally be raised to defend our country, might pervert their power to the injury of their fellow citizens, the people are confirmed by the next article (of amendment) in their right to keep and bear their private arms.” – Remarks on the First Part of the Amendments to the Federal Constitution; Federal Gazette, (June 18, 1789). Coxe sent a copy of his essay to James Madison along with a letter of the same date. Madison wrote back as follows, supporting the interpretation of the Second Amendment as an individual right: “Accept my acknowledgments for your favor of the 18th. instant. The printed remarks inclosed in it are already I find in the Gazettes here [New York] ... The amendments ... will however be greatly favored by explanatory strictures of a healing tendency, and is therefore already indebted to the co-operation of your pen.”

“The power of the sword is in the hands of Congress? My friends and countrymen, it is not so; for the powers of the sword are in the hands of the yeomanry of America from sixteen to sixty. The Militia of these free commonwealths, entitled and accustomed to their arms, when compared with any possible army, must be tremendous and irresistible. Who are the Militia? They are not ourselves as politicians and lawmakers. They are those who have elected us into our positions and entrusted us with the power of preserving and carrying out their wishes. Congress has no power to disarm the Militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American. The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the Federal or State governments, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.” – letter to James Madison during adoption of the Bill of Rights in the United States Congress (1789)


23 posted on 12/18/2012 8:57:26 PM PST by EternalVigilance (Socialism: Where your health care is free, but you are not.)
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To: Simcha7

Something is wrong with your caps lock button...


24 posted on 12/18/2012 8:59:10 PM PST by EEGator
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To: chessplayer

Hey Marcos!

You pick any semi-auto handgun you like and we’ll see if you can squeeze off 7 rounds faster than I can with my S&W 686.

The simple fact is, you don’t know what you’re talking about.

What you really hate is the idea that individuals are self-reliant and not easily controlled by the state.


25 posted on 12/18/2012 9:04:05 PM PST by G Larry (Which of Obama's policies do you think I'd support if he were white?)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

OK, on a total tangent i was on an airplane last week and saw the onboard ashtray near the lavatory. I stole the one from the front and back of the plane, just for posterity. You havent been able to smoke a cigarette on an airplane in 30 years. They are brand new and virgin.


26 posted on 12/18/2012 9:04:11 PM PST by When do we get liberated? (A socialist is a communist who realizes he must suck at the tit of Capitalism.)
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To: Ruy Dias de Bivar
I’d simply outlaw guns with magazines. That would leave plenty of guns for people to hunt with and defend their homes,”

I remember when the most fearful thing in a Lib’s hum drum life was a manufactured fear of the 5 shot bolt action army surplus rifle and the low cost revolver.

A "5 shot bolt action army surplus rifle" has a magazine.

27 posted on 12/18/2012 9:14:15 PM PST by Oztrich Boy (By doubting we come to inquiry, and through inquiry we perceive truth. -; Peter Abelard)
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To: Simcha7

Take your meds now.


28 posted on 12/18/2012 9:47:28 PM PST by TigersEye (Who is John Galt?)
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To: TigersEye
Take your meds now.

Someone's posting while drunk - He/she shouldn't mix meds and booze.

29 posted on 12/18/2012 10:05:05 PM PST by Graybeard58 ("Civil rights” leader and MSNB-Hee Haw host Al Sharpton - Larry Elder)
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To: Graybeard58

At least fix the cap locks button. lol


30 posted on 12/18/2012 10:10:39 PM PST by TigersEye (Who is John Galt?)
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To: Simcha7

Uhhhhh, you’re old time something or other.

Looks that plate in head is getting rusty.


31 posted on 12/18/2012 10:13:10 PM PST by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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To: Vendome; chessplayer; All
Vendome and chessplayer, ALL...

Yes...I DID.

I didn't even Realize that Anyone on FR Still Knows What A "ZOT" IS Anymore.

Well, He Tried to Get Me Banned...and It Did Not Work.

I May Have Misunderstood his Posts...If SO, I do Apologize for that.

But, He Does NOT KNOW WITH WHOM He Has TRIED TO MESS... Around With.

And for His Ignorance, I Will Forgive His Dalliance...

This Time.

32 posted on 12/18/2012 11:07:52 PM PST by Simcha7 ((The Plumb - Line has been Drawn, T'shuvah/Return for The Kingdom of HaShem is at hand!))
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To: Vendome; chessplayer; All
Vendome, chessplayer and TO ALL WHOM THIS POST APPLIES:

I AM NOT DRUNK, I DO NOT DRINK ALCOHOL, NEVER HAVE AND NEVER WILL.

I DO NOT TAKE ANY KIND OF MEDICATION/DRUGS: PRESCRITPION, OVER THE COUNTER OR ILLEGAL....AND NOR DO I HAVE TO.

I DO NOT SMOKE ANYTHING, NEVER HAVE AND NEVER WILL.

My Head Is Just Fine and It Is Screwed On RIGHT!

ALL Of My MARBLES ARE INTACT...ARE YOURS?

YOU...NEWBIES ARE NASTY...SHAME ON YOU!

33 posted on 12/18/2012 11:29:59 PM PST by Simcha7 ((The Plumb - Line has been Drawn, T'shuvah/Return for The Kingdom of HaShem is at hand!))
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To: Simcha7

>> Shalom, you dirty rat bastard...

Ha?


34 posted on 12/18/2012 11:40:43 PM PST by Gene Eric (Demoralization is a weapon of the enemy. Don't get it, don't spread it!)
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To: Simcha7; Vendome; chessplayer; All
All....

Correction of my Spelling Error In Previous Post:

Should Have Been...PRESCRIPTION.

35 posted on 12/18/2012 11:40:50 PM PST by Simcha7 ((The Plumb - Line has been Drawn, T'shuvah/Return for The Kingdom of HaShem is at hand!))
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To: Simcha7; Vendome; chessplayer

If you are fine then why are you messing with chessplayer?

I don’t recall him posting anything, in terms of his opinion, that we would disagree with.

What gives?

Oh, and I’m drinking Oban right now cuz tis the season....

I’m guessing this is just a misunderstanding or I don’t know the background. In any case, I like chessplayer and hope to meet him one day and see if he does like chess if only to see how he would deal with the Roy Lopez or Italian openings.

Basic stuff but fun for those who get the outcome...

Merry Christmas.


36 posted on 12/19/2012 1:05:55 AM PST by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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To: chessplayer
[H]is idiot "survivalist" mother (how'd that work out for her?) had to purchase her small arsenal, to protect herself against phantom threats on her "freedoms"—urged on by Fox News and Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck and the gun manufacturers. And instead, she ensured her own untimely doom and that of too many innocents.

She was a teacher, and an idiot, should we assume she was a democrat who voted for Obama?

37 posted on 12/19/2012 1:58:08 AM PST by Razz Barry (Round'em up, send'em home.)
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To: chessplayer

Allow only single shot rifles that shoot .22 shorts. That should protect the citizenry against the tyrannical government.


38 posted on 12/19/2012 6:20:50 AM PST by crosshairs (It's all about good vs evil. In the end, evil is destroyed.)
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