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The Music Is Timeless, but About the Rockers ...
nytimes ^

Posted on 12/21/2012 8:34:37 AM PST by chessplayer

THERE was Roger Daltrey, 68, with his open shirt revealing a Palm Beach perma-tan, and abs so snare-tight that they immediately raised suspicion. (“Implants!” charged a few skeptical members of the Twittersphere.)

Last week’s star-studded “12-12-12” concert — a showcase of retirement-age rock icons like the Rolling Stones, the Who and Eric Clapton — not only raised millions to benefit victims of Hurricane Sandy, but as the “the largest collection of old English musicians ever assembled in Madison Square Garden,” as Mick Jagger joked onstage, it also inspired viewer debate about whether is it possible to look cool and rebellious after 50 without looking foolish?

“I will donate $1,000 to #121212Concert if Roger Daltry buttons his shirt,” tweeted Alan Zweibel, 62, a comedy writer.

The quickest route to ridicule, it seems, is for aging rockers to proceed as if nothing has changed.

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


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Great article. Have to hand it to Mick Jagger, though. At 69, he's in great shape. He can still bounce around at a performance for two and a half hours. If the vast majority of 69 year olds tried that they would fall on the stage floor and be writhing in pain from pulled, cramped, and torn muscles and ligaments.
1 posted on 12/21/2012 8:34:39 AM PST by chessplayer
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To: chessplayer

I thought jagger was going to break in half. The who showed more restraint I am a fan of both. I thought the stones were a little too out there.

In an interview a day or two befor the concert Pete Townsend came out as a “neo-con” and had hoped that Romney would have won.


2 posted on 12/21/2012 8:41:30 AM PST by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: chessplayer

I certainly don’t have a problem with any musician continuing to perform.I am musician myself. IMO, it should be done with dignity.. The preening and posturing by singers such as Jagger looks ridiculous for a 69 year old man. Doesn’t he see they that .. is he frigg’n blind ?

A portion of the moves many of these singers utilized, even when they were young, were learned at “ The School of Rock Posturing”..and the moves were always just shy of being silly, even then. And often, as in the case of the floor writhing by Billy Squier in the now famous video, they were career ending.

These old rockers should all take a page from the jazz book and look at how Louis Armstrong, was able to perform, well into old age, with dignity.


3 posted on 12/21/2012 8:43:00 AM PST by Chuzzlewit
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To: chessplayer

I couldn’t bear to tune in. Did McCartney sing “Mary had a little Lamb” or “We’re so Sorry Uncle Barack”?


4 posted on 12/21/2012 8:45:32 AM PST by Baynative
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To: Chuzzlewit

Jagger wants to show that he’s still “got the moves like Jagger”.


5 posted on 12/21/2012 8:46:21 AM PST by sarasota
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To: chessplayer
Old glorious farts desperately fighting ossification.

Pathetic has-beens sadly living beyond the lifespan of their talents.

Hendrix, Joplin and Morrison laugh at these old fools from the grave.

Live fast, die young and leave a pretty corpse OR fade away and don't embarrass your legacy is the true spirit of Rock and Roll.

6 posted on 12/21/2012 8:53:48 AM PST by Happy Rain ("Gun free zones are baited fields.")
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To: Chuzzlewit
One guy that endures and does not go through all of that, is Van Morrison.

He is not a 'showman', nothing fancy, just solid music, great musicians (Brian Kennedy, Georgie Fame, Candy Dulfer) combined with many changes over the years from blues (tributes to John Lee) to rock (Jackie Wilson Said) to introspection (Poetic Champions) to R&B tinges (Goin Down Geneva), to religious themes (Hymms to the Silence) to Country (Down the Road (not his best effort IMHO)).

I saw him at the Shrine in '72 (Herbie Hancock opened) and at the Masonic in SF three times, once with the late Sam Butera.

But he keeps rolling along on his 401K tours.

7 posted on 12/21/2012 8:54:06 AM PST by Michael.SF. (Obama lied, Stevens died.)
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To: chessplayer

In the old days this wasn’t a problem, since back then, music was meant to be heard, not seen.


8 posted on 12/21/2012 8:55:45 AM PST by Mr Ramsbotham (Laws against sodomy are honored in the breech.)
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To: Michael.SF.

One word. Eagles


9 posted on 12/21/2012 8:59:18 AM PST by showme_the_Glory (ILLEGAL: prohibited by law. ALIEN: Owing political allegiance to another country or government)
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To: chessplayer
The quickest route to ridicule, it seems, is for aging rockers to proceed as if nothing has changed.

aint that the truth ! I haven't the heart to tell my dead-head friends that Jerry Garcia is dead.
10 posted on 12/21/2012 9:00:10 AM PST by stylin19a (obama -> Fredo smart)
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To: chessplayer

Years ago when Robert Plant had his first solo album out, he was asked, (paraphrase) Do you look back on how you used to perform with your shirt open and feel foolish?

He responded that he still performed that way now.

Roger Daltry, I’ll never forget seeing Tommy at the midnight movies. When he first appears as the adult Tommy, all the girls in audience went wild. It was pretty awesome.

I’ve seen The Who several times but never with Moon. They were great with I think it was John Bohnam’s son on drums???

Never been a fan of the Stones but they’ve been performing forever and people who do like the Stones say they’ve seen them recently and they still rocked. Pretty impressive that Mick can move better than I can and I’m a lot younger.

All the bands I grew up with are retirement age or have lost major members like the loss of The Who’s Thunderfingers, John Entiwstle in the last ten years or so.

I just listened to the entire Tommy and Quadrophenia albums recently and they are timeless; same thing with Queen’s A Night at the Opera. Nice to hear actual musicianship.


11 posted on 12/21/2012 9:00:57 AM PST by Lx (Do you like it, do you like it. Scott? I call it Mr. and Mrs. Tennerman chili.)
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To: chessplayer

12 posted on 12/21/2012 9:04:26 AM PST by JoeProBono (A closed mouth gathers no feet - Mater tua caligas exercitus gerit ;-{)
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To: chessplayer
Rock is to be played by those in their teens,twenties and thirties.Those older than that look...and sound...foolish.
13 posted on 12/21/2012 9:15:58 AM PST by Gay State Conservative (When Robbing Peter To Pay Paul,One Can Always Count On Paul's Cooperation)
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To: Happy Rain
Old glorious farts desperately fighting ossification.

Hendrix, Joplin and Morrison laugh at these old fools from the grave.

While Daltrey, Townshend, and Jagger's bodies may be fighting ossification, they are certainly in better shape than Hendrix, Joplin, and Morrison who by now are probably completely rotted down to the bones.

I saw my mom watching some stupid red carpet thing for that show "X-Factor" with plenty of young musicians and a bunch of crap they call entertainment. I'd rather watch Jagger on-stage naked that most of the young talent today.
14 posted on 12/21/2012 9:16:31 AM PST by mmichaels1970
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To: chessplayer

Some years ago Letterman had a good Top Ten List about the Stones’ upcoming tour which gave possible names for the tour.My favorite was “Hey,You,Get Off Of My Barcolounger”.


15 posted on 12/21/2012 9:19:42 AM PST by Gay State Conservative (When Robbing Peter To Pay Paul,One Can Always Count On Paul's Cooperation)
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To: Chuzzlewit

The preening and posturing by singers such as Jagger looks ridiculous for a 69 year old man.


Perhaps, but that wasn’t the point I was trying to make. The fact that he can do it at all, for a two and a half hour performance, at almost 70 years old is amazing. Seems he’s a strong believer in the adage “use it or lose it,” exercise wise.


16 posted on 12/21/2012 9:19:52 AM PST by chessplayer
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To: showme_the_Glory
One word. Eagles

The Eagles rocked!


17 posted on 12/21/2012 9:20:14 AM PST by Fiji Hill (i)
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To: showme_the_Glory

2 words:

Eagles suck.

just messing with you !!!! not a fan, however.


18 posted on 12/21/2012 9:23:42 AM PST by Chuzzlewit
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To: chessplayer

Why is it the “12-12-12” concert? Am I missing something?


19 posted on 12/21/2012 9:23:43 AM PST by Larry Lucido
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To: Larry Lucido

Um.... because it took place on December 12, 2012? Just a guess...


20 posted on 12/21/2012 9:25:33 AM PST by ZirconEncrustedTweezers (Some cultures are destined to remain stupid and we need to quit trying to uplift them.)
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To: Gay State Conservative
No more true words have ever been spoken.

When I listen to Pete Townsend, Eric Clapton, Joe Walsh and the rest I am again a young man rediscovering the cosmic awareness inducing shock of true rock...

Mick Jagger is a pathetic relic who sullies the legacy of the Rolling Stones with his halfhearted rheumatoid faggot dancing...

...he should give it a rest and maybe the other legends of rock will be inspired to go out as the heroes they deserve to be.

21 posted on 12/21/2012 9:31:59 AM PST by Happy Rain ("Gun free zones are baited fields.")
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To: Chuzzlewit
The Eagles did suck—pure top forty sellouts.

The only song that they produced that wasn't mediocre was the cool “Get Over It!” and that was near the end of their careers.

The Eagles had the very best PR and sold way beyond their talent but their sucker fans will never admit it.

To me, Joe Walsh was the only Eagle worth a damn and he had the sense to stay away from the overrated dumasses as much as he could.

22 posted on 12/21/2012 9:41:43 AM PST by Happy Rain ("Gun free zones are baited fields.")
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To: chessplayer

I hate these articles on Rock and Rollers...How they look and move onstage, their hair and skin, their pants and shoes, etc. What a load of crap. Just tell me how the music sounded and maybe I’ll remember to look for an album next time I go to the mall.


23 posted on 12/21/2012 9:45:57 AM PST by equaviator
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To: Happy Rain
As in Houseman's poem, since The Beatles broke up in 1970 and never played again, they are assured in memory of being the greatest rock band in history.

To an Athlete Dying Young

by A. E. Housman (1859-1936)

We chaired you through the market-place;
Man and boy stood cheering by,
And home we brought you shoulder-high.

To-day, the road all runners come,
Shoulder-high we bring you home,
And set you at your threshold down,
Townsman of a stiller town.

Smart lad, to slip betimes away
From fields were glory does not stay
And early though the laurel grows
It withers quicker than the rose.

Eyes the shady night has shut
Cannot see the record cut,
And silence sounds no worse than cheers
After earth has stopped the ears:

Now you will not swell the rout
Of lads that wore their honours out,
Runners whom renown outran
And the name died before the man.

So set, before its echoes fade,
The fleet foot on the sill of shade,
And hold to the low lintel up
The still-defended challenge-cup.

And round that early-laurelled head
Will flock to gaze the strengthless dead,
And find unwithered on its curls
The garland briefer than a girl's.


24 posted on 12/21/2012 9:56:58 AM PST by eddie willers
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To: chessplayer

When I hear “Old English musicians” I think of Henry Purcell and William Byrd.


25 posted on 12/21/2012 9:58:35 AM PST by Erasmus (Zwischen des Teufels und des tiefen, blauen Meers)
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To: mmichaels1970

If your opinion is a consensus then Rock is indeed dead...is there no young person today willing to collect the collections of analog rock, take from the recordings the inspirations and present their own interpretations sans the digital cheating and sterile computerized reproductions of mechanical musical talent...? Joe Walsh is an old fart trying to save analog rock and I would endorse buying his new recordings... ...but it is too little too late and a thousand years from now when cool dudes want to get mellow with a doobie and a song their play-lists will resemble any pothead’s from 1968 to 1972.


26 posted on 12/21/2012 10:00:00 AM PST by Happy Rain ("Gun free zones are baited fields.")
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To: Erasmus
I think Jethro Tull and Procol Harum.
27 posted on 12/21/2012 10:05:50 AM PST by Happy Rain ("Gun free zones are baited fields.")
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To: chessplayer
Oh, I dunno. Keith Richards looks as good as he ever did.


28 posted on 12/21/2012 10:12:42 AM PST by Billthedrill
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To: Happy Rain
If your opinion is a consensus then Rock is indeed dead

It's close....I'd call it semi-dormant. I think it does that from time to time and then some band comes around that puts it back on the map.

Of course it's all subjective. Rock to me probably differs with rock to you.

I remember considering rock "dormant" and then Guns-N-Roses came out with Appetite for Destruction and, to me, there was a resurgance.

Then the hair and glam went over the top and rock sort of stalled out again. Then Nirvana released "Nevermind" and popularized a relatively new genre.

I'm probably just getting old and not rolling with the changes as much as I used to. I'm having difficulty thinking of the last band that I thought really blasted rock back onto the map.

Maybe a band like Muse or a few others like it will make their mark and become timeless.
29 posted on 12/21/2012 10:15:05 AM PST by mmichaels1970
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To: Billthedrill
Oh, I dunno. Keith Richards looks as good as he ever did.

lol...he's probably the only one who's in worse shape than Morrison, Joplin, or Hendrix at this point.
30 posted on 12/21/2012 10:21:15 AM PST by mmichaels1970
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To: mmichaels1970

I believe Keef actually did die about the same time but nobody’s had the heart to tell him.


31 posted on 12/21/2012 10:23:17 AM PST by Billthedrill
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To: Gay State Conservative

Same goes for the listeners.


32 posted on 12/21/2012 10:34:38 AM PST by sphinx
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To: chessplayer
For some reason rather than tolerating the fact that rock and roll was basically blues with an uptempo and/or pop beat, the rock press decided that rock and roll was a rebellious music that was to be used to bring down the system. By the mid-sixties all rock and rollers were expected to follow the leftist program of protesting everything that made them rich and famous. There were to be no exceptions. Issues of rock magazines like Rollingstone and others frequently paired articles about rockers with leftist propaganda. I never like Grand Funk Railroad, but I felt a little anger when they were condemned by the rock press for having investments in oil companies.

For these miserable wretches, i.e. the rock press, rock and roll could never be innocent fun (which it was for most teens), it had to be "angry" and full of rebellion. The fact is most teens were not angry and rebellious. They just wanted music they could dance to or sing and play. I doubt most rockers were down for the struggle either. Most of the early rockers might have been libs, but I think they were probably more into drugs and sex than they were politics.

33 posted on 12/21/2012 10:40:50 AM PST by driftless2
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To: Chuzzlewit
"posturing"

Although I liked the Stones, I was highly amused the first time I saw Jagger on Ed Sullivan gyrating like a spastic yo-yo. The Stones had the conceit that they were some sort of blues band with a rock tempo. They always sounded like white rock and rollers to me.

34 posted on 12/21/2012 10:45:04 AM PST by driftless2
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To: sphinx
Same goes for the listeners.

Nope,wrong! I have a music collection that consists of about 3,000 songs...most of them having been obtained through the miracle of public libraries and the CD-R.I have Rock,Pop,Folk,some Jazz,some C&W and even a little Classical.At least ninety percent of those songs are from the 50's and 60's.Even today I can listen to The Who (early stuff),the Stones (ditto),Dylan (ditto) and many many other groups/individual performers from that era and my heart sings! Music,more than any of the other "arts",hits me right where I live.That is...music of the 50's and 60's.Other stuff (with a few exceptions) no thanks!

35 posted on 12/21/2012 10:49:00 AM PST by Gay State Conservative (When Robbing Peter To Pay Paul,One Can Always Count On Paul's Cooperation)
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To: Gay State Conservative
"those older"

Then should people forty and older not be allowed to listen to or like rock and roll music? I'm 63...should I throw out the Beatles and other rock and roll sheet music that I play on my guitar?

36 posted on 12/21/2012 10:50:22 AM PST by driftless2
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To: Happy Rain

Of course rock is dead. The thing about zombies, of course, is that they don’t know they’re dead. They just keep jaggering around the stage.


37 posted on 12/21/2012 10:53:32 AM PST by sphinx
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To: driftless2

See Post #35


38 posted on 12/21/2012 11:02:26 AM PST by Gay State Conservative (When Robbing Peter To Pay Paul,One Can Always Count On Paul's Cooperation)
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To: Lx
I’ve seen The Who several times but never with Moon. They were great with I think it was John Bohnam’s son on drums???

Ringo's son, actually. Zak Starkey. It was Moon who gave Zak his first drum kit, and his work on Quadrophenia in concert would make Keith proud.
39 posted on 12/21/2012 11:03:30 AM PST by drjimmy
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To: Gay State Conservative
Good for you, but I still want to know why that for some reason many people believe rock and roll is only music for teenagers. If that's the case, then why do so many people/old farts like you and me still love that "teenage" music? Why does music made supposedly just for teens still strike responsive chords (no pun intended) in people decades later? If the music was made for teens, then how could old people possibly like the music? The obvious answer is: rock and roll is not just for teens, it's for any age group that likes rock and roll.

If that sounds simplistic, it might be because many people put too much emphasis on rock and roll being a music of anger and rebellion. But most of the teens who liked rock and roll weren't angry or rebellious. They didn't want to destroy western civilization, they wanted to have a good time.

I get upset when I read articles by rock "critics" like one I read in a Minneapolis newspaper many years ago (1990?) who said he got mad when he saw young people at a concert given by rockers from the sixties. This idiot said young people should only be listening to rock music from their contemporaries. That would be like forbidding you or me from listening to music from the forties or further back. (I love to listen to Bach and play classical guitar music from the 1600s and 1700s. I don't think Bach or Gaspar Sanz were in my age group). It's nobodys business the music from whatever era somebody likes to listen to or play.

And as a side note in nthe last two years the wife and I have gone to concerts by a number of big name musicians whose concerts we had no money or means to attend when we were young. That includes Paul Simon, Neil Diamond, Elton John, Rod Stewart, and Stevie Nicks. And they all sounded great. So I'm glad you still love the music you loved as a teen. And don't put down rockers in their declining years who still want to give concerts. If people like to listen to the old geezers, that's the only thing that counts.

40 posted on 12/21/2012 11:40:19 AM PST by driftless2
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To: chessplayer

One point - argue with me if you wish - but Chuck Berry basically created the music that all the rest of them rushed in to get on board with. And Chuck continues to play and live on his own terms (as he always has) and never looks ridiculous doing it.


41 posted on 12/21/2012 11:44:41 AM PST by 2 Kool 2 Be 4-Gotten
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To: Vaquero
In an interview a day or two befor the concert Pete Townsend came out as a “neo-con” and had hoped that Romney would have won.

I just read his autobiography, and in it he claims he's a socialist.

42 posted on 12/21/2012 11:45:05 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: showme_the_Glory
One word. Eagles

To quote Mojo Nixon, "Don Henley Must Die, Don't Let Him Get Back Together With Glenn Frey."

43 posted on 12/21/2012 11:46:58 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: Lx
I’ve seen The Who several times but never with Moon.

Then you didn't see The Who. The late 60's/early 70's Who was the greatest band, ever. Still amazing to watch their Isle of Wight 1970 performance.

44 posted on 12/21/2012 11:48:35 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: drjimmy

You’re correct and with a name like DrJimmy, probably a big fan.

I saw them with their first replacement and it was OK but with Starky, it was much better.


45 posted on 12/21/2012 12:06:28 PM PST by Lx (Do you like it, do you like it. Scott? I call it Mr. and Mrs. Tennerman chili.)
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To: driftless2
..but I still want to know why that for some reason many people believe rock and roll is only music for teenagers.

It may be true that some people might think that R&R is only for teenagers.But,as I said in my first post in this thread,"rock is to be played by those in their teens,twenties and thirties.Those older than that look...and sound...foolish".I went on to say in a subsequent post that I,a guy old enough to have had a draft card,still *loves* the music of the 50's and 60's.So I,unlike some it would seem,don't belong to the group that you've described.

46 posted on 12/21/2012 12:08:48 PM PST by Gay State Conservative (When Robbing Peter To Pay Paul,One Can Always Count On Paul's Cooperation)
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To: dfwgator
Then you didn't see The Who. The late 60's/early 70's Who was the greatest band, ever. Still amazing to watch their Isle of Wight 1970 performance.

There was the small matter of Moon's death, what was I supposed to do?

Isn't the Isle of Wight performance the one where Entwistle wore that skeleton outfit? I've seen it but I think they butchered it up; I'd like to see the original.

47 posted on 12/21/2012 12:09:42 PM PST by Lx (Do you like it, do you like it. Scott? I call it Mr. and Mrs. Tennerman chili.)
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To: Lx

That’s the one...even as butchered up as it was, it was still amazing to watch and here them......”Young Man Blues” makes me want to break stuff when I hear it. ;)


48 posted on 12/21/2012 12:18:03 PM PST by dfwgator
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To: Michael.SF.; Happy Rain; driftless2; BluesDuke

I went and heard the Moody Blues in concert here in St. Louis earlier this month. They sounded great! Justin Hayward (lead vocals, lead guitar) is 66, John Lodge (vocals, bass guitar) is 67, and Graeme Edge (drums) is 71. They also have four younger side musicians that play with them. Some of the Moody Blues’ music is dated, but a lot of it holds up well.


49 posted on 12/21/2012 12:32:53 PM PST by Charles Henrickson (St. Louis)
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To: Chuzzlewit

Well, at least they didn’t have Iggy Pop stripping naked on the show. ;-)


50 posted on 12/21/2012 12:33:15 PM PST by RatSlayer
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