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Still the BEST EVER explanation of the 2nd Amendment
Future of Freedom Foundation ^ | May 1, 2008 | Rick Lynch

Posted on 12/21/2012 9:32:50 AM PST by Doctor 2Brains

We now come back to those words so loved by the gun grabbers, “well regulated militia.” Knocking down this silly little argument is vitally important because the gun grabbers’ notion that says the Second Amendment reads, in essence, “militias are acceptable” is simply and undeniably the only arrow in their quiver. Take that from them, and they are finished. Liberals do not maintain that the Second Amendment says “We can take your guns.” They believe (or pretend to believe) that the Second Amendment reads, “Militias are acceptable.” Being wholly ignorant of the doctrine of enumerated powers, liberals think this is enough to deny us our gun rights; for if the federal government, unrestrained by an enumeration, was empowered to legislate on all matters not put off limits by the Bill of Rights, and if the Second Amendment actually did read “militias are acceptable,” then the federal government would indeed have the authority to regulate our ownership of firearms. "...But readers of this magazine know better. A constitutional amendment that reads “militias are acceptable,” no more gives the federal government the authority to legislate against guns than it does the authority to tell me what color I may dye my hair, or what size carburetor I may put under my hood. If I had a right to buy guns before the “militias are acceptable” amendment was enacted, then I have a right to buy guns afterward."


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism
KEYWORDS: banglist; guncontrol; secondamendment
Takes my breath away.
1 posted on 12/21/2012 9:32:58 AM PST by Doctor 2Brains
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To: Doctor 2Brains

IMO, the “Well-regulated militia” argument by gun grabbers trying to take the INDIVIDUAL’s right to arm himself is just a diversion tactic.

To me the “well-regulated militia” statement merely says that “yes, we need militias” “AND, militias are made up of free individuals who MUST have an unfettered right to arms.”

For this to be true, before a militia can be stood up, free individuals have to have free rights to guns, uninfringed by government.


2 posted on 12/21/2012 9:43:59 AM PST by Gaffer
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To: Doctor 2Brains
Far simpler to explain that the Supreme Court recently ruled in the Heller decision that the 2nd Amendment guarantees individuals the right to keep and bear arms. The 2nd Amendment does not address deer hunting or sports shooting. It was written so that the citizens have the means to protect themselves and the country from both external and internal enemies - with the same kind weapons that potential enemies possesses.
3 posted on 12/21/2012 9:45:44 AM PST by Buffalo Head (Illigitimi non carborundum)
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To: Gaffer

“To me the “well-regulated militia” statement merely says that “yes, we need militias” “AND, militias are made up of free individuals who MUST have an unfettered right to arms.”

Until the Civil War every militia member was expected to supply his own weapons, uniform and food. So, what the amendment says is; “Civilians are expected to supply their own gun so they can be a member of a militia.”


4 posted on 12/21/2012 9:58:16 AM PST by Gen.Blather
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To: Gaffer

Setup a militia in the United States with a chapter in every State consisting of registered gun owners.


5 posted on 12/21/2012 10:00:32 AM PST by frogjerk (Obama Claus is coming to town!)
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To: Doctor 2Brains

!


6 posted on 12/21/2012 10:03:38 AM PST by skinkinthegrass (Who'll take tomorrow,spend it all today; who can take your income & tax it all away..0Bama man can :)
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To: Buffalo Head

I agree. Besides you’ll never persuade the gun-grabbers and their useful-idiot abettors anyway!


7 posted on 12/21/2012 10:11:02 AM PST by old school
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To: frogjerk
Setup a militia in the United States with a chapter in every State consisting of registered gun owners

My state does not register gun owners. Why should they?

8 posted on 12/21/2012 10:13:53 AM PST by Starstruck (Washinton is presently building a diving board on the fiscal cliff)
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To: Gaffer

The whole basic premise of the militia is simply that the government recognizes (and encourages) citizenry to be able to when necessary, arm itself and defend itself. From anything, foreign or domestic.

The individual right to self-defense was never surrendered just because government was given certain powers (from the people) in terms of keeping the peace or being able to declare war.

We know this for certain because courts have ruled government is not liable for anyone’s injury or death when their police officers and other leos and army folks don’t stop criminals from injuring or murdering citizens.


9 posted on 12/21/2012 10:16:15 AM PST by Secret Agent Man (I can neither confirm or deny that; even if I could, I couldn't - it's classified.)
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To: frogjerk
“...consisting of registered gun owners.”

Gun owners don’t want to be targeted by being ‘registered’.

That didn’t work out too well for those required to ‘be registered’ in ‘30’s Germany.

10 posted on 12/21/2012 10:17:54 AM PST by Beagle8U (Free Republic -- One stop shopping ....... It's the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
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To: Secret Agent Man

I agree. My point was that the militia argument they use is BS.


11 posted on 12/21/2012 10:18:45 AM PST by Gaffer
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To: frogjerk
Step 1: Setup a militia in the United States with a chapter in every State consisting of registered gun owners.

Step 2: Require everyone to register and join the "militia."

Step 3: Ban guns.

Step 4: We know who you are and where you are. We're coming to get them now.

Step 5:


12 posted on 12/21/2012 10:25:04 AM PST by tpmintx (Gun free zones are hunting preserves for unarmed people.)
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To: Doctor 2Brains

Hmmmmmm!
Change the name of the National Rifle Association to the National Rifle Militia and we might actually have it.


13 posted on 12/21/2012 10:25:37 AM PST by BuffaloJack (Children, pets, and slaves get taken care of. Free Men take care of themselves.)
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To: Gaffer

yup.


14 posted on 12/21/2012 10:26:08 AM PST by Secret Agent Man (I can neither confirm or deny that; even if I could, I couldn't - it's classified.)
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To: Doctor 2Brains

The authors fall into a common trap. “Well regulated” does not have anything to do with “regulating” a militia. The militia is the people. Well-regulated means that the people are well-trained and well-equipped period. The people keep their arms at home and bear them when needed.


15 posted on 12/21/2012 10:29:46 AM PST by palmer (Obama = Carter + affirmative action)
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To: frogjerk
Setup a militia in the United States with a chapter in every State consisting of registered gun owners.

It's already set up. The militia is the people. Read the amendment.

16 posted on 12/21/2012 10:32:16 AM PST by palmer (Obama = Carter + affirmative action)
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To: Doctor 2Brains
I've always read it that because a well regulated militia (armed Army, National Guard, police forces) is necessary, the right of the people to keep and bear arms to attempt to keep them at bay is necessary too.
17 posted on 12/21/2012 10:33:20 AM PST by onedoug
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To: Doctor 2Brains
Amendment 9 - Construction of Constitution. Ratified 12/15/1791.

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

Amendment 10 - Powers of the States and People. Ratified 12/15/1791.

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

Taken together, the Ninth and Tenth Amendments simply codify the objections of the Federalists to the Antifederalist demand for a bill of rights - that any such bill would inevitably fail to articulate all of the rights which, not being restricted by the Constitution, were intended to be retained by the people. Which means that the rights articulated in the Bill of Rights are intended as a floor under, rather than a ceiling above, the rights of the people.

Two other constitutional citations are IMHO germane to this topic:

Article 1 Section 8.

The Congress shall have power . . . To promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries . . .

and
Article V - Amendment

The Congress, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose Amendments to this Constitution, or, on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States, shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments, which, in either Case, shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes, as part of this Constitution, when ratified by the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States, or by Conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other Mode of Ratification may be proposed by the Congress; Provided that no Amendment which may be made prior to the Year One thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any Manner affect the first and fourth Clauses in the Ninth Section of the first Article; and that no State, without its Consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate.

Article 1 Section 8 codifies the belief in, and expectation of, progress. Progress, one of

"the Blessings of Liberty [expected to be secured by the Constitution] to ourselves and our Posterity”

is the default assumption of the Constitution. So in principle, if not in detail, the repeating rifle and the machine gun were anticipated by the framers of the constitution - and, if experience revealed the necessity, the framers provided for adjustments to be made to adapt to the ramifications of freedom and progress.


18 posted on 12/21/2012 10:35:02 AM PST by conservatism_IS_compassion (The idea around which “liberalism" coheres is that NOTHING actually matters except PR.)
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To: frogjerk

The Swiss model: Every able-bodied male citizen from late adolescence to the age of retirement is by law a member of the Swiss army, and MUST keep a firearm in working order and ample ammunition in the home.

A similar statute exists in Israel, a country that has been besieged since its founding, where the citizenry is essentially the militia, and every citizen receives training in the care and feeding of firearms. Again, possession of firearms in the home is strongly encouraged, with the police and members on active duty with the IDF authorized to carry at all times.


19 posted on 12/21/2012 10:39:09 AM PST by alloysteel (Bronco Bama - the cowboy who whooped up and widened the stampede.)
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To: Doctor 2Brains
Under the National Defense Act of 1916,1674 the militia, which hitherto had been an almost purely state institution, was brought under the control of the National Government. The term “militia of the United States” was defined to comprehend “all able-bodied male citizens of the United States and all other able-bodied males who have . . . declared their intention to become citizens of the United States,” between the ages of eighteen and forty-five.

(http://law.onecle.com/constitution/article-1/47-militia.html)

(The age 45 limit is obviously outdated, as life expectancy is much higher now.)

20 posted on 12/21/2012 10:44:50 AM PST by polymuser ("We have a right to debate and disagree with any administration!" (HRC))
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To: Doctor 2Brains
Image and video hosting by TinyPic
21 posted on 12/21/2012 11:01:21 AM PST by MtnMan101
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To: alloysteel
The expression "right to keep and bear arms" is ancient ~ they didn't invent it just for our Constitution.

This is what made a noble different from a commoner ~ a nobleman had a "right to keep and bear arms". A town, in fact, might be granted part of the right ~ so many swords, so many cannon, warhorses, etc.

This right also carries with it the news that someone so honored can go to the public courts and bring suit against someone else and ask that the armed might of the government be brought into a dispute!

This was a real problem for commoners and Jews throughout Europe for centuries ~ unless they could settle a dispute privately, they had no access to the courts.

On the other hand, the courts had access to them!

I think one of the Justices limited his construction of the 'bear arms' part of the expression to just carrying around a weapon. Actually, he really missed the boat on that one ~ and with him a judge, and before that a lawyer, it tells me of the sad state of teaching history in our nation's universities!

22 posted on 12/21/2012 11:12:22 AM PST by muawiyah
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To: Doctor 2Brains

Reference ping


23 posted on 12/21/2012 11:41:37 AM PST by BreezyDog (Illegitimi non carborundum)
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To: Doctor 2Brains

Well we could fall into their failed logic trap and argue all day long what a Militia or Well Regulated Militia means and it would not change a thing. The way the sentence is structured, in English, means we have a right to keep and bear arms”

What these self proclaimed enlightened ignoramuses never dare expose is that the first part of the statement never contradicts the second part. In fact the 2nd part could stand alone and the meaning would be exactly the same.

Even if the 2nd Amendment read: “Guns are very dangerous to any government, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed” would still mean the US Constitution is simply restating our rights as citizens to be armed.

There is nothing which contradicts or limits, “shall not be infringed” yet we have allowed the most dishonest people on the planet, lawyers and politicians, to infringe on those rights and IMO we have allowed them to invalidate the vast majority of the Constitution.

Anyone but me think all the 5-4 decisions from the less than Supreme Court are simply political crap with no grounding in the Constitution? Tell me how 9 brilliant Constitutional scholars could possibly spew forth constant 5-4 decisions unless they are traitors to the Constitution hiding behind black robes.


24 posted on 12/21/2012 11:46:02 AM PST by Wurlitzer (Nothing says "ignorance" like Islam!)
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To: tpmintx
Step 4: We know who you are and where you are. We're coming to get them now.

Meet my weapons friend.

25 posted on 12/21/2012 11:46:14 AM PST by SandRat (Duty - Honor - Country! What else needs said?)
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To: tpmintx
Step 4: We know who you are and where you are. We're coming to get them now.

Meet my weapons friend.

26 posted on 12/21/2012 11:48:47 AM PST by SandRat (Duty - Honor - Country! What else needs said?)
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To: Doctor 2Brains

The wording of the Second isn’t the issue right now. (It is for us, but we’re on the defensive and mapping out our trenches!)

Progressives are HOWLING for a complete disarmament of the people. That will never happen, of course, but it doesn’t stop them from howling. Obummer loves to hear their howls, which does not work to our advantage.

It’s going to be a rough couple of months. We all know they’re going to try and pass some stupid and ineffective new gun laws, which we of course will fight tooth and nail.

Just hang tough, folks. They might jam through another pointless ban on “assault weapons” but it won’t change a thing. Just be ready to howl even louder if they try for the whole enchilada, which Obummer just might.

We know what the Second means. They need to know too.


27 posted on 12/21/2012 12:23:33 PM PST by DNME (Without the Constitution, there is no legitimate U.S. government. No exceptions.)
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To: DNME

the MEME of the MSM is is “GUN BANS WORK”, it is just not far enough or detailed emough.

They start with the assumption that the last would have worked BUT FOR....

The low information voters will not see this deception. (how often do you beat your wife? compound trick)

The left is just going by the “we need magic words.”


28 posted on 12/21/2012 12:59:04 PM PST by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: SandRat

Certainly this high-tech weapons system could not have been envisioned by the framers. There is no way they meant for normal citizens to have such a destructive weapon in their possession. </sarc>


29 posted on 12/21/2012 1:34:10 PM PST by tpmintx (Gun free zones are hunting preserves for unarmed people.)
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To: Doctor 2Brains

The Supreme Court has already ruled that the 2nd amendment applies to individuals. Any discussion of militias is redundant.


30 posted on 12/21/2012 1:38:20 PM PST by csmusaret (I will give Obama credit for one thing- he is living proof that familiarity breeds contempt.)
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To: tpmintx
That bolt, from that bow, was the first Armor piercing weapon, and still will go through a police vest.
31 posted on 12/21/2012 3:09:43 PM PST by SandRat (Duty - Honor - Country! What else needs said?)
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To: tpmintx
That's what they used in the middle ages, dates mid 1500's.
32 posted on 12/21/2012 3:22:21 PM PST by SandRat (Duty - Honor - Country! What else needs said?)
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To: tpmintx
Back in the 1400s Joan of Arc figured out that the best way to combat cannon was to fire cannon at cannon. They were using them then to knock holes in city walls during sieges ~ which made city walls totally obsolete!

That was pretty basic high tech, but the Founders knew about just how powerful the earliest firearms technology had been ~ and they thought it was perfectly acceptable for private individuals to own the very best!

33 posted on 12/21/2012 6:43:17 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: SandRat; muawiyah
That's what they used in the middle ages, dates mid 1500's.

You all missed my tag.

MOLON LABE!

34 posted on 12/21/2012 9:18:04 PM PST by tpmintx (Gun free zones are hunting preserves for unarmed people.)
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To: SandRat; muawiyah
That's what they used in the middle ages, dates mid 1500's.

You all missed my </sarc> tag.

MOLON LABE!

35 posted on 12/21/2012 9:18:44 PM PST by tpmintx (Gun free zones are hunting preserves for unarmed people.)
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