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Belleville chief bans officers from Denny’s; detectives were asked to leave for displaying gun
Belleville News-Democrat ^ | Jan. 2, 2013 | Jamie Forsythe

Posted on 01/03/2013 4:41:47 AM PST by Lawgvr1955

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To: JimSp

This Dennys is two blocks down the street from the police station. I’m sure that all the police officers and detectives and the brass knew full well what Dennys policy on open carry was — posted or not.


51 posted on 01/03/2013 6:24:13 AM PST by Uncle Chip
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To: eyeamok

I agree completely.


52 posted on 01/03/2013 6:25:48 AM PST by Doctor 2Brains
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To: eyeamok
I actually think this is great and wish more people and restaurants would do this, especially in States where Citizens are prevented from owning or using firearms.

I agree. Since the State thinks citizens should be disarmed, then so should the State. Time to force our overlords to live by the same rules as the "little people".

53 posted on 01/03/2013 6:26:02 AM PST by Flick Lives (We're going to be just like the old Soviet Union, but with free cell phones!)
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To: battlecry

Ah, that’s right! As I recall, the CA State Patrol sent in a gun for service that he could not legally send back to them under CA law. So he kept it and sent them a letter explaining why. They sued and lost. Good on Barrett.


54 posted on 01/03/2013 6:28:34 AM PST by jboot (This isn't your father's America. Stay safe and keep your powder dry.)
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To: popdonnelly; eyeamok
Fairly ignorant?

That's putting it fairly mildly.

55 posted on 01/03/2013 6:28:34 AM PST by Mr. Lucky
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To: servo1969

Yeah, I’m kind of torn on this one also. Very stupid on the part of the restaurant assistant manager, and I’m glad the police chief is sticking it to the local hoplophobe at Denny’s.

But on the other hand, Illinois law would have required that these officers arrest me if I were to be caught carrying my TN-legal concealed carry pistol in IL. So they already received better treatment than this law-abiding citizen would...


56 posted on 01/03/2013 6:28:51 AM PST by Fletcher J
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To: Lawgvr1955

Illinois may be the first state to erect a virtual “Berlin Wall” in America. Millions will be leaving the state as well as businesses.


57 posted on 01/03/2013 6:43:19 AM PST by Eye of Unk (A Civil Cold War in America is here, its already been declared.)
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To: eyeamok
I actually think this is great and wish more people and restaurants would do this, especially in States where Citizens are prevented from owning or using firearms. Do these “officers” enforce tyrannical laws in direct defiance of what the Constitution says?? YES THEY DO. Then tell the Jack Booted Gang Bangers to go somewhere else.

Absolutely agree.  Off duty cops should be treated no differently than any other citizen. Personally, I'm not really all that enthusiastic about on-duty cops getting special priviledges the rest of us don't have.

Maybe I will start eating at Denny’s again.

Yeah, well, I wouldn't go that far. They are anti-gun after all.

58 posted on 01/03/2013 7:28:38 AM PST by zeugma (Those of us who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.)
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To: ScottinVA

FYI, in case you didn’t hit the link. That’s not just one video. That’s a whole playlist of Denny’s incidents.

The video you saw is probably in there.


59 posted on 01/03/2013 7:30:51 AM PST by FreedomPoster (Islam delenda est)
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To: FreedomPoster

Oh yes... saw a whole group of them. Almost every one of those incidents has a particular and very noticeable commonality.


60 posted on 01/03/2013 7:35:59 AM PST by ScottinVA (More dizzying than a Tilt-a-Whirl is an around-a-circle argument with a liberal about gun control.)
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To: Melinda in TN
Police should never have to hide their weapons in uniform or out. Neither should any legal individual permit holder. citizen. Or legal resident alien, for that matter. The right to self defense is a fundamental human right, protected (not granted) absolutely by the Constitution.
61 posted on 01/03/2013 7:36:49 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: Lawgvr1955

This has been a very interesting thread to read the responses to. Thanks for posting.


62 posted on 01/03/2013 7:41:02 AM PST by zeugma (Those of us who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.)
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To: ScottinVA

Let’s just say it - it’s thuggish urban black people acting up in public.

It’s also the culture/demographic we need to be talking about if we really want to go to the root of much of the violent crime in the U.S.


63 posted on 01/03/2013 8:00:17 AM PST by FreedomPoster (Islam delenda est)
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To: servo1969

“On the other hand, so police are just better than everyone else? They can have a firearm but everyone else can’t be trusted with such power?”

The serious question to ask is “Why do the police need any firearms?”

The answer to that question is the same as why every citizen legally able to own a firearm should be allowed to do so.


64 posted on 01/03/2013 8:08:34 AM PST by RFEngineer
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To: zeugma

I might have went too far with the line about eating at Denny’s, But none of my other opinions have changed. We sure do seem to attract more Boot Lickers here than usual lately. Seems that once you confront them with HARD FACTS about their “Buddies” they crawl back under the rock from which they came.


65 posted on 01/03/2013 8:09:20 AM PST by eyeamok
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To: ArrogantBustard

I agree completely but I’m not holding my breath for that anytime soon. Right now we need to try to hang on our right to carry anyway we can and proceed from there.


66 posted on 01/03/2013 8:17:53 AM PST by Melinda in TN
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To: eyeamok
I find threads like this to be useful in identifying those who react with a knee-jerk response, sometimes on both sides. I've found over the many years that I've been on FR that those who blindly support the government in its various forms has been steadily decreasing. Ten years ago, you'd have seen a much stronger response in support of the powers that be. I see it as a good sign. There will always be some who don't fully think through the implications.

Personally, as far as I'm concerned, in situations like this, where you have a victim disarmament zone, I don't think the police (on or off duty) should be armed any more than your average citizen unless they are acting directly in their official capacity.

67 posted on 01/03/2013 8:20:28 AM PST by zeugma (Those of us who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.)
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To: Melinda in TN
I believe this is current (2012):

We're making progress in the several States.

68 posted on 01/03/2013 8:29:57 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: zeugma

We are in agreement!!


69 posted on 01/03/2013 8:35:12 AM PST by eyeamok
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To: zeugma
Personally, as far as I'm concerned, in situations like this, where you have a victim disarmament zone, I don't think the police (on or off duty) should be armed any more than your average citizen unless they are acting directly in their official capacity.

In addition, from a liability perspective, the entity that has declared the area a victim disarmament zone should have a strict liability for the protection of those within the VDZ. If a patron is harmed, and has had his ability to defend himself usurped, the entity should be held completely responsible for his safety.

This is especially true in those places where you have no choice to be, like airports, and government facilities. I recently had to enter a courthouse for jury duty and couldn't have so much as a swiss army knife on my person. So, I was compelled under force of law to be there, and also compelled that I disarm complately. This is immoral, especially as the state disclaims liability for my person.

70 posted on 01/03/2013 8:37:56 AM PST by zeugma (Those of us who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.)
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To: Lawgvr1955

When I was a kid there was a busy restaurant that did not take checks or credit cards, only cash. The table nearest the cash register had a sign on it: “Reserved for on duty uniformed San Antonio Police Department Officers.”


71 posted on 01/03/2013 8:45:23 AM PST by Pilsner
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To: momtothree

I was in a Chinese restaurant once -typical buffet place. Huge place with dozens of tables. This one guy was leaving and tried to walk out without paying. They tried to stop him and he started screaming at them about the shrimp on the buffet being bad (they weren’t). They told him they would call the police, and he screamed “Call the f-ing police. I don’t care.”

Immediately, about 8 plainclothed police officers stood up. Within 3 minutes, a uniformed cop had arrived and the guy wass taken away in cuffs.


72 posted on 01/03/2013 9:24:27 AM PST by RightFighter (It was all for nothing.)
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To: zeugma
I've found over the many years that I've been on FR that those who blindly support the government in its various forms has been steadily decreasing. Ten years ago, you'd have seen a much stronger response in support of the powers that be. I see it as a good sign. There will always be some who don't fully think through the implications.

 

Good observations. 10 years ago we were still overcoming 9/11. We as a nation were activley engaged in Iraq, finding WMD, and - as a rule - we supported law and order.

Now? Now we see LEO's, the local, state and federal governments, Capital Hill, and even our military have seriously hurt and disappointed the conservative cause. In just 10 years. Naturally a lot of blame is laid at the feet of the Kenyan. But it is a sad thing to see teachers, cops, even soldiers and other once highly esteemed citizens slammed and denigrated here at FR.

Law and Order? (hoccc ptui) Libertarians rule this place.

73 posted on 01/03/2013 9:27:50 AM PST by Responsibility2nd (NO LIBS. This Means Liberals and (L)libertarians! Same Thing. NO LIBS!!)
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To: PapaBear3625

Of course a restaurant has the right (or should have) to ask a customer to leave if that customer makes other people feel uncomfortable. In this case an anti-gun person would ask the armed person to leave and a gun supporter would ask the anti-gun person to leave. Which would you ask to leave?


74 posted on 01/03/2013 10:13:36 AM PST by JimSp
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To: eyeamok

“...Jack Booted Gang Bangers...” ???

You and your post are misguided and irrelevant. What are you, some kind of cop-hating ... never mind, we know who you are...


75 posted on 01/03/2013 10:45:05 AM PST by GGpaX4DumpedTea (I am a Tea Party descendant...steeped in the Constitutional Republic given to us by the Founders.)
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To: JimSp
Of course a restaurant has the right (or should have) to ask a customer to leave if that customer makes other people feel uncomfortable. In this case an anti-gun person would ask the armed person to leave and a gun supporter would ask the anti-gun person to leave. Which would you ask to leave?

I would explain to the uncomfortable person that these were just police detectives having lunch, and if she didn't want to eat in my place as a result, i would understand.

Then I would then explain to the detectives that if they wanted to eat in my place they would need to keep their stuff concealed.

76 posted on 01/03/2013 10:52:30 AM PST by PapaBear3625 (You don't notice it's a police state until the police come for you.)
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To: Responsibility2nd
Now? Now we see LEO's, the local, state and federal governments, Capital Hill, and even our military have seriously hurt and disappointed the conservative cause. In just 10 years.

Absolutely agreed, though it goes back a lot further than that. It's just that now it's getting so obvious that it's hard to ignore.

But it is a sad thing to see teachers, cops, even soldiers and other once highly esteemed citizens slammed and denigrated here at FR.

Respect and support is earned, and can't just be taken for granted. Once lost, it is all the more harder to regain.

Law and Order? (hoccc ptui) Libertarians rule this place.

Some of us expect the rule of law to apply to everyone, not just the unwashed masses. The law actually has to make some sense as well. When the law becomes arbitrary and capricious, you'll find lots less respect for it. When an American citizen can be imprisioned for years because a piece of steel is one inch shorter than the government proclaims it should be, you have a serious problem. When the law is extended to the point where the government thinks it has the power to dictate how many ounces your soft drink should  be, you have a serious problem. When the government confiscates half the income of a hardworking American, you have a serious problem. Some of us are sick and tired of the relentless advance of the police state. You'll find lots of order in a police state. You won't find much freedom there though.

 

77 posted on 01/03/2013 10:59:37 AM PST by zeugma (Those of us who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.)
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To: servo1969

Think you need a correction. Felons should still be in jail if they cannot have their Rights restored.

Pretty soon, under dumbo’s reign, we may all be ‘felons’


78 posted on 01/03/2013 11:04:53 AM PST by i_robot73
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To: PapaBear3625
Then I would then explain to the detectives that if they wanted to eat in my place they would need to keep their stuff concealed.

Bingo --

If the detective had followed police policy and kept her weapon concealed this entire incident would never have occurred.

At the same time general police policy is that officers, even when they are off duty, are supposed to have their weapons handy where they can be easily accessed.

79 posted on 01/03/2013 11:12:43 AM PST by Uncle Chip
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To: Lawgvr1955

I’ll bet he’d appreciate the police having guns on them if somebody came in to shoot up the place.


80 posted on 01/03/2013 11:41:09 AM PST by Marathoner 244
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To: GGpaX4DumpedTea

Sorry pal, but I don’t”hate” anyone, I just see them for who they really are.


81 posted on 01/03/2013 5:25:54 PM PST by eyeamok
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