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Obama would be limited in executive order on gun control
Examiner ^ | January 9, 2013 | Ryan Witt

Posted on 01/09/2013 4:49:23 PM PST by QT3.14

Today Vice President Joe Biden met with gun victims and safety groups as part of a continuing effort by his task force to come up with solutions to gun violence in the aftermath of the Newtown, Connecticut shootings. The highlight of the meeting came when Biden announced that the White House is prepared to act through executive action to implement gun control measures. Biden stated...

(Excerpt) Read more at examiner.com ...


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: 2a; banglist; eo; executiveorder; guncontrol; obama; secondamendment
"…Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed; as they are in almost every kingdom in Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed...."

- Noah Webster, An Examination of the Leading Principles of the Federal Constitution, 1787

1 posted on 01/09/2013 4:49:30 PM PST by QT3.14
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To: QT3.14

The ATF is about to get stupid on gun store owners.


2 posted on 01/09/2013 4:50:23 PM PST by Noamie
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To: QT3.14

Mark


3 posted on 01/09/2013 4:52:35 PM PST by wolf24
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To: QT3.14

Oh? Who exactly is going to limit him?


4 posted on 01/09/2013 4:55:05 PM PST by null and void (Avg # victims per incident, if shooter stopped by armed civilian: 3, if stopped by a policeman: 14)
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To: QT3.14

“”The president is going to act. Executive order, executive action that can be taken, we haven’t decided what that is yet.”

We have to sign it so we can know what’s in it.


5 posted on 01/09/2013 5:03:23 PM PST by Hugin ("Most times a man'll tell you his bad intentions, if you listen and let yourself hear."---Open Range)
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To: QT3.14
Let's be honest, there is a lot that can be done by Executive Order. A lot of it can be challenged in the courts for due process, but if the due process happens, a lot can be done.

EPA has been toying with banning lead bullets for a long time.

Product liability laws were used by the left as a method of scaring firearm manufacturers.

Many on the left have wanted the CDC to take up firearms and gun violence as a medical issue to be regulated as such.

You could see federal regulations declaring all kinds of federal facilities or things purchased with federal money to be declared gun free zones, like parks, interstate highways, and a host of things. Post Offices, federal buildings are still gun free zones, even if National Parks now allow concealed carry permit holders to concealed carry (outside of federal park buildings).

In short there is probably going to be a long of things that the big Zero is going to be implementing that will make those who believe in the 2nd Amendment mad.

Still the Constitution has a set of Checks and Balances and it has a Bill of Rights. I lived through the first Assault Weapons Ban and 8 years of Bill Clinton, I can live through the Big Zero who is going to make Jimmy Carter look like a successful president.

6 posted on 01/09/2013 5:04:45 PM PST by Robert357 (D.Rather "Hoist with his own petard!" www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1223916/posts)
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To: QT3.14

WHAT! Joe “spread ‘em, you’re gonna be frisked” biteme mis-spoke? No way!!!!

Stop radical left wing extremists.


7 posted on 01/09/2013 5:07:01 PM PST by rktman
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To: Noamie
The ATF is about to get stupid on gun store owners.

The ATF is about to get stupid on gun store owners.

There, fixed that for you.

If Obomba and the ATF want to dance they better understand that the American people can dance better than anyone else.

8 posted on 01/09/2013 5:07:13 PM PST by Just another Joe (Warning: FReeping can be addictive and helpful to your mental health)
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To: Robert357
Let's be honest, there is a lot that can be done by Executive Order.

I remember when Clinton signed an order on his way out to require every water treatment center to raise their arsenic standards. It would have cost local governments billions.

9 posted on 01/09/2013 5:08:28 PM PST by aimhigh ( Guns do not kill people. Planned Parenthood kills people.)
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To: null and void
Oh? Who exactly is going to limit him?

Our good friends, Smith & Wesson.

Seriously though, I think that doofus dumb-ass Joe Bite-Me Biden just "shot" himself in the proverbial foot with his outburst. He just opened his mouth and absolutely confirmed the greatest fears of conservatives & gun owners (likely including some liberal gun owners as well) that 0dumb0 & the socialist demoRATs have every intention of ruling by dictatorial & tyrannical fiat. This will probably galvanize conservative/Christian/patriotic Americans if they ever try to implement such a gun grab like this. This may be the tipping point that is needed to make a strong stand for our freedoms & rights & liberties against 0dumb0Sh_t and the RATs.

10 posted on 01/09/2013 5:13:02 PM PST by rcrngroup
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To: QT3.14

executive orders only apply to the executive branch employees.


11 posted on 01/09/2013 5:14:24 PM PST by Secret Agent Man (I can neither confirm or deny that; even if I could, I couldn't - it's classified.)
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To: aimhigh
Exactly, a lot can by done by executive order and much of what can be done is not good.
12 posted on 01/09/2013 5:22:42 PM PST by Robert357 (D.Rather "Hoist with his own petard!" www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1223916/posts)
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To: Secret Agent Man
That won't matter. The Constitution not only gives the federal government no authority to regulate arms, it expressly forbids it from doing so. That hasn't stopped anti-gun laws from being passed and forced for decades, and it certainly won't stop the current occupier of the White House from doing whatever he wants.

The only thing that will stop him is the will of the defenders of the Constitution, and that will has been severely lacking for many years now.
13 posted on 01/09/2013 5:25:29 PM PST by DangerZone (If the left had their way, all of America would be as safe as Sandy Hook Elementary.)
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To: QT3.14

How is Obama limited? The Constitution does no apply to him and he controls the Justice Department?


14 posted on 01/09/2013 5:26:30 PM PST by doug from upland (Obama and the leftists - destroying our country one day at a time)
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To: QT3.14

First get every gun away from street hoods. Then maybe we’ll talk. It’s easier to get guns from law abiding citizens because they obey the laws re: guns. Street hoods do not.


15 posted on 01/09/2013 5:39:00 PM PST by SkyDancer (Live your life in such a way that the Westboro church will want to picket your funeral.)
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To: SkyDancer

Uh, no. Our rights to defend ourselves are not negotiable. The Second Amendment is not about defending ourselves from common criminals or nutters who go on mass shooting sprees.


16 posted on 01/09/2013 5:46:20 PM PST by DangerZone (If the left had their way, all of America would be as safe as Sandy Hook Elementary.)
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To: QT3.14

Limits have never stopped Obama before.


17 posted on 01/09/2013 5:50:21 PM PST by Tzimisce (The American Revolution began when the British attempted to disarm the Colonists.)
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To: DangerZone

It was a tongue in cheek thing. I know that no street hood would turn in their gun. It’s easier for politicians to go after registered guns or guns from law abiding citizens. It’s also the reason our family doesn’t belong to the NRA or any gun organisation because the feds can use the subscription lists to find out who owns guns. Unfortunately all ours were lost in a tragic mishap when our boat was swamped.


18 posted on 01/09/2013 5:56:42 PM PST by SkyDancer (Live your life in such a way that the Westboro church will want to picket your funeral.)
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To: Noamie

Yeah,

Makes one wonder where the people who make up the ATF come from; KGB residuals perhaps. They were the prime movers behind Ruby Ridge and the Branch Dividian Massacre - says all you need to know about these people. They’ll quite willingly do whatever Obama and Holder wants them to.


19 posted on 01/09/2013 5:58:10 PM PST by snoringbear (E.oGovernment is the Pimp,)
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To: QT3.14
FIRST will come registration and that will be justified in order to track and trace all weapons transferred between private parties - e.g. sales among friends, transfers from heir to heir, and that scary gun show “loop hole” that Senator Juan McLame loves to talk about frequently. ONCE registration is established all bets are off.
20 posted on 01/09/2013 5:59:51 PM PST by Cheerio (Barry Hussein Soetoro-0bama=The Complete Destruction of American Capitalism)
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To: QT3.14
Here's the clip of Biden saying Obama will use Executive Orders.
21 posted on 01/09/2013 6:04:15 PM PST by usconservative (When The Ballot Box No Longer Counts, The Ammunition Box Does. (What's In Your Ammo Box?))
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To: QT3.14

Limited my a**. He can’t pass any EXO that restricts or infringes on the rights of citizens to keep and bear arms. Only and amendment to the constitution can do that. If the house doesn’t call him on any EXO he tries to shove down our throats they need to be kicked pronto. Can’t depend on Roberts to uphold the constitution if it comes to that.


22 posted on 01/09/2013 6:06:34 PM PST by calex59
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To: DangerZone
You stated: “That hasn't stopped anti-gun laws from being passed and forced for decades,. . . “

That is because the left used “felon's in possession” as the reason de jure for gun control and almost every American supported it since the left was leaving them alone.

Now the left gun grabbers are knocking on the door of every American; convicted felon or not, now it is a problem and the new laws need to be beaten back.

I tried to get people to fight against all gun control efforts but was unsuccessful. the excuse was “we don't want convicted felons in possession of firearms!” or “we need some reasonable gun control laws!” Well, if everyone would understand, the socialist gun control is NOT about crime prevention, or gun safety, but, instead to disarm the American people period, maybe now everyone will unite to fight these dirty socialist on EVERY legislative gun control effort!

23 posted on 01/09/2013 6:13:45 PM PST by paratrooper82 (82nd ABN Div. 1/508th BN "Fiery From the Sky")
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To: SkyDancer
Unfortunately all ours were lost in a tragic mishap when our boat was swamped.

What a coinki dink.....I too lost all my firearms in a tragic canoe capsizing, on a lake in Manitoba (I think, it was such a traumatic experience the my mind is jello,jello...

24 posted on 01/09/2013 6:14:45 PM PST by Robe (Rome did not create a great empire by talking, they did it by killing all those who opposed them)
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To: QT3.14

This dictator recognizes no limits. The argument is moot.


25 posted on 01/09/2013 6:15:56 PM PST by Cyber Liberty (Obama considers the Third World morally superior to the United States.)
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To: Cyber Liberty

Storm the Bastille?

One of those cell phone flash things?

Desperate times, desperate measures.

Besides, the Attorney General did that very thing in college.


26 posted on 01/09/2013 6:34:23 PM PST by tsomer
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To: QT3.14

The kenyan must know that whatever action he’s planning would have no chance getting through even the weak kneed congress, so like any DICTATOR would, he plans to issue an edict! I don’t know about anyone else, but 0bama IS NOT MY MASTER!


27 posted on 01/09/2013 6:35:56 PM PST by 21st Century Crusader (August 26, 1191)
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To: QT3.14

Twelve Americans are murdered every day by illegal aliens, according to statistics released by Rep. Steve King, R-Iowa. If those numbers are correct, it translates to 4,380 Americans murdered annually by illegal aliens.
Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2006/11/39031/#LEASzzXP0jXjETVw.99

So every two days illegals create a Newtown. When does the deportation begin?


28 posted on 01/09/2013 6:55:09 PM PST by doug from upland (Obama and the leftists - destroying our country one day at a time)
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To: Robe

One day I’m going to go trawling the lakes and streams of this country. The sheer volume of gold and guns I will find there will make me a multimillionaire.


29 posted on 01/09/2013 6:58:02 PM PST by garbanzo (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine)
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To: null and void
"Oh? Who exactly is going to limit him?"

The answer to that is in case law, and the citation and quote are behind the link to the article.


30 posted on 01/09/2013 7:12:08 PM PST by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of rotten politics smelled around the planet.)
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To: null and void

It’s not “who” but rather, what.


31 posted on 01/09/2013 7:12:58 PM PST by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of rotten politics smelled around the planet.)
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To: familyop

“The law? What do I care about law? Ain’t I got the power?” - Cornelius Vanderbilt.


32 posted on 01/09/2013 7:28:55 PM PST by null and void (Avg # victims per incident, if shooter stopped by armed civilian: 3, if stopped by a policeman: 14)
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To: Tzimisce

Omammy shall not “abridge the right to keep and bear arms”. That means he has no power at all on our guns. We are not registering and he can go to burning Hades.The reason for this freedom which was a high priority in out CONSTITUTION. was to be able to combat TYRANNY from our government!!!


33 posted on 01/09/2013 7:44:43 PM PST by willardwx
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To: Robert357

You are correct in that Obastard will be limited in what he can do. Whatever it is, it will still have to be within the law and the Constitution or the EO will be rapidly overturned. As much as Obastard hates to admit it, he can’t simply create a law declaring the AR-15 to be a Class 3 weapon and force everyone to register them as such.


34 posted on 01/09/2013 7:54:53 PM PST by Blood of Tyrants (The one thing that Hollywood gets right about guns is that crminals will always get them.)
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To: DangerZone

well it will have to come down to the wire if they attempt to take peoples’ guns. they’ll have no choice but to decide what they will do.


35 posted on 01/09/2013 9:14:38 PM PST by Secret Agent Man (I can neither confirm or deny that; even if I could, I couldn't - it's classified.)
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To: QT3.14

He can order whatever he wants. He’s the Executive.
If anyone objects, he can tie it up in court for years regardless of inevitable outcome.


36 posted on 01/09/2013 9:16:43 PM PST by ctdonath2 (End of debate. Your move.)
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To: null and void
Oh? Who exactly is going to limit him?

Sure can't get a clue from the two sentence excerpt...

37 posted on 01/09/2013 9:20:28 PM PST by MileHi ( "It's coming down to patriots vs the politicians." - ovrtaxt)
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To: ctdonath2
Very true.

Article 1 of the Constitution establishes that "the Privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion the public Safety may require it" -- but does not specify which authority has the jurisdiction to decide on the exceptional suspension.

Another passage of Article 1 declares that the power to declare war and to raise and support the army and navy rests with Congress, BUT Article 2 states that "the President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States."

Let's just look at a few precedents:

During the Civil War (1861–1865), Lincoln acted counter to the text of Article 1 (on April 15, 1861) by proclaiming that an army of seventy-five thousand men was to be raised and convened a special session of Congress for July 4. In the ten weeks that passed between April 15 and July 4, Lincoln acted de facto as a total dictator. On April 27, Lincoln authorized the General in Chief of the Army to suspend the writ of Habeas Corpus whenever he deemed it necessary along the military line between Washington and Philadelphia. Furthermore, on February 1862, Lincoln imposed censorship of the mail and authorized the arrest and detention in military prisons of persons suspected of "disloyal and treasonable practices".

Image 1648

In the speech he delivered to Congress July 4 1861, President Lincoln justified his actions as the holder of a supreme power to violate the Constitution in a situation of necessity:

"Whether strictly legal or not, [the measures he had adopted had been taken] under what appeared to be a popular demand and a public necessity" in the certainty that Congress would ratify them. Those exceptional measures were based on the conviction that even fundamental, natural law could be violated IF the very existence of the union and the juridical order were at stake:

"Are all the laws but one to go unexecuted, and the Government itself go to pieces lest that one be violated?"

--Lincoln

Although Congress was aware that the constitutional jurisdictions had been transgressed, it could do nothing but ratify the actions of the President, as it did on August 6, 1861. Strengthened by this approval, Lincoln proclaimed on September the emancipation of the slaves on his authority alone and later generalized the state of emergency throughout the entire territory of the United States, authorizing the arrest and trial before courts martial of "all Rebels and Insurgents, their aiders and abettors within the United States, and all persons discouraging volunteer enlistments, resisting militia drafts, or guilty of any disloyal practice, affording aid and comfort to Rebels against the authority of the United States."

***

During World War One President Wilson assumed broader powers than those Lincoln had claimed. However, instead of ignoring Congress, as Lincoln had done, Wilson had those extraordinary powers delegated to him by Congress. Instead of declaring a state of emergency, he had exceptional laws issued. From 1917 to 1918, Congress approved a series of acts (from the Espionage Act of 1917 to the Departmental Reorganization Act of 1918) that granted the President COMPLETE CONTROL over the administration of the United States and not only prohibited disloyal activities (such as collaboration with the enemy and the diffusion of false reports), but even made it a crime to "willfully utter, print, write, or publish any disloyal, profane, scurrilous, or abusive language about the form of government of the United States" (from the Sedition Act of 1918).

***

Since the power of the President is grounded in the emergency linked to a state of war, the metaphor of war became a part of the presidential vocabulary whenever decisions considered to be of vital importance are being imposed.

In 1933, Franklin D. Roosevelt was able to assume extraordinary powers by presenting his actions as those of a Commander in Chief during a military campaign:

"I assume unhesitatingly the leadership of this great army of our people dedicated to a disciplined attack upon our common problems.…I am prepared under my constitutional duty to recommend the measures that a stricken Nation in the midst of a stricken world may require.…But in the event that the Congress shall fail to take [the necessary measures] and in the event that the national emergency is still critical, I shall not evade the clear course of duty that will then confront me. I shall ask the Congress for the one remaining instrument to meet the crisis—broad Executive power to wage war against the emergency, as great as the power that would be given to me if we were in fact invaded by a foreign foe."

--Franklin D. Roosevelt, First Inaugural Address, March 4, 1933

From the constitutional point of view, the New Deal was realized by delegating to the President (through a series of statutes culminating in the National Recovery Act of June 1933) an UNLIMITED POWER to CONTROL every aspect of the economic life.

The outbreak of World War Two extended these powers with the creation of a "Office of Emergency Management" [the ancestor of today's FEMA]. On September 7, 1942, FDR renewed his claim to TOTAL CONTROL during the emergency:

"In the event that the Congress should fail to act, and act adequately, I shall accept the responsibility, and I will act.…The American people can…be sure that I shall not hesitate to use every power vested in me to accomplish the defeat of our enemies in any part of the world where our own safety demands such defeat."

On February 19, 1942, the FDR administration proceeded with the internment of seventy thousand American citizens of Japanese descent who resided on the West Coast (along with forty thousand Japanese citizens who lived and worked there).

38 posted on 01/09/2013 9:40:55 PM PST by Katechon
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To: QT3.14
I interpret just the mention of "executive order" as an admission by the Obama administration that there is no way on this earth that any gun control law will pass Congress.

Congressmen on the fence about this issue are now relieved of having to commit themselves. They need only state that they are awaiting the results of Obama's executive orders. If such orders prove effective, then there would be no need for new legislation.

39 posted on 01/09/2013 10:06:14 PM PST by William Tell
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To: Robe

Ours disappeared in our last move. We didn’t notice until months later — too late to file a claim. Very sad!


40 posted on 01/10/2013 6:58:34 AM PST by Roses0508
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To: Robert357

What good is the constitution if there is no one to defend it? Look what Roberts did with the supreme court decisions.. And the republicans in congress are nothing but wimps. They can’t even stand up to Obama over a simple budget. There may be a few hold out judges across the country but Obama has the key people in control that will side with him. And those that do not follow his command, he uses the media or activist groups to destroy them.


41 posted on 01/10/2013 7:27:07 AM PST by dragonblustar (Allah Ain't So Akbar!)
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To: snoringbear

I’ve known some field ATF agents and the one thing they had in common was this real desire to “go get law breakers.”

I came to the realization that they don’t really think too much about what the law is, or if it is a just law.... or even Constitutional.

They’ll just go pack-o-dogs on you and not think twice if they’re pointed in your direction.


42 posted on 01/10/2013 7:51:59 AM PST by Noamie
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To: null and void

I got your point: We cannot be certain that a significant number of Republicans in Congress and justices on the Supreme Court wouldn’t give obama most anything he demands — they’ve done so thus far many times (although they threaten a lot!)


43 posted on 01/10/2013 7:57:47 AM PST by glennaro
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To: QT3.14

Nothing is limited when it comes to a committed communist like obama


44 posted on 01/10/2013 8:01:12 AM PST by GlockThe Vote (The Obama Adminstration: 2nd wave of attacks on America after 9/11)
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To: QT3.14

Refuse. Resist.


45 posted on 01/10/2013 8:05:05 AM PST by PLMerite (Shut the Beyotch Down! Burn, baby, burn!)
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To: glennaro

Yeah, and not one single citizen/subject/serf will have “standing” to take it to court.


46 posted on 01/10/2013 9:06:40 AM PST by null and void (Soap box. Ballot box. Jury box. We're two more boxes away from freedom...)
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To: Secret Agent Man
executive orders only apply to the executive branch employees.

Like the ATF, FBI, EPA. Remember Clinton's farewell Exec order, which would have required all local water plants to filter for arsenic?

47 posted on 01/10/2013 9:49:43 AM PST by aimhigh ( Guns do not kill people. Planned Parenthood kills people.)
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