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The Debt Ceiling has TEETH (What would happen if Obama violates it)
American Thinker ^ | January 17, 2013 | Jonathon Moseley

Posted on 01/17/2013 3:31:13 AM PST by Moseley

President Obama should violate the debt ceiling, Nancy Pelosi and other Democrats are urging. Force Republicans to sue in court. Democrats are already violating legal requirements to pass a national budget each year. Republicans would lose even more influence if Democrats broke more laws.

So does the national debt ceiling have 'teeth?' What would happen if Barack Obama simply shattered the debt ceiling, to avoid negotiating with Congressional Republicans?

Democrats argue it would take a long time for appeals courts to wrangle through the dispute. Obama could go on spending for years while unpredictable judges sort it all out. In the interim, Obama could get his way.

Democrats are beating the drum that Congress voted for the spending, so Obama faces legal uncertainty. In truth, Congress has not voted for a budget since Obama took office. A temporary Continuing Resolution expires on March 27, 2013. Democrats are fretting about paying debts. But of course new spending is not a debt. Republicans are just gearing up with the revelation that Senator Obama voted against a debt ceiling increase in 2006:

Increasing America's debt weakens us domestically and internationally. . . . Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better. I therefore intend to oppose the effort to increase America's debt limit.

-- Senator Barack Obama, Congressional Record, March 16, 2006.

First, investors would just stop loaning money. Who will buy government bonds that are worthless, null and void? Any Treasury bonds sold in excess of the debt ceiling will be legally invalid. If there is legal uncertainty, investors might be buying worthless pieces of paper.

(Excerpt) Read more at americanthinker.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: attackwithin; budget; debt; debtceiling; deficit; demagogicparty; fed; illegalpres; nwo; obama; partisanmediashills; sequester
American Thinker, like many publications, requires that Free Republic post only an excerpt and link to the full artcle, for copyright reasons. The full article can be rad at:

Full article here

1 posted on 01/17/2013 3:31:29 AM PST by Moseley
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To: Moseley

http://www.americanthinker.com/2013/01/the_debt_ceiling_has_teeth.html


2 posted on 01/17/2013 3:32:18 AM PST by Moseley (http://www.curesocialism.com)
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To: Moseley

Republican leaders are useless, welcome to tyranny everyone, Obama will not leave office.


3 posted on 01/17/2013 3:45:08 AM PST by stockpirate (Sen. John Kerry belonged to the terrorist group VVAW.)
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To: Moseley
What would happen if Obama violates it

Violates it? With Boehner negotiating for the working citizens? Please! That thought even has obama, Reid and Pelosi chuckling.

Once you get past the joke premise, it's a pretty interesting article.

4 posted on 01/17/2013 3:50:52 AM PST by stevem
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To: Moseley
The Debt Ceiling has TEETH.

Yea, but do the republicans? There aren't enough conservatives to do the job.

Republican

Conservative

5 posted on 01/17/2013 3:55:20 AM PST by mark3681
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To: Moseley
What would happen if Obama violates it

Violates it? With Boehner negotiating for the working citizens? Please! That thought even has obama, Reid and Pelosi chuckling.

Once you get past the joke premise, it's a pretty interesting article.

6 posted on 01/17/2013 3:57:11 AM PST by stevem
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To: Moseley

The article mentions government hiring freezes. It has already started for the defense department because of the sequestration. I doubt any other department is making plans but they should.
http://www.govexec.com/defense/2013/01/panetta-orders-civilian-hiring-freeze-contract-delays-amid-budget-uncertainty/60607/

The Pentagon will begin to take “prudent measures” in the coming weeks to prepare for a possible perfect storm of budget cuts, Defense Secretary Leon Panetta said during a press briefing Thursday.

Those precautions include a civilian hiring freeze, delaying some contract awards and trimming non-essential facilities maintenance, he said. In addition, Defense Department components must start more detailed planning for the across-the-board budget cuts that are now scheduled to hit March 1 if Congress does not reach a deal on spending reductions.

The more specific sequestration strategies should include plans to implement unpaid furloughs of civilian workers, Panetta added. “I want to be clear: It’s precautionary,” he said. “But I have an obligation to – to let Congress know that we may have to do that, and I very much hope that we will not have to furlough anyone.”


7 posted on 01/17/2013 4:44:56 AM PST by RadiationRomeo (Step into my mind and glimpse the madness that is me)
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To: Moseley

Why would O do that?
He can just force Rs to increase the debt limit which is what he will do.

The GOP will do its symbolic vote thing, speak some tough words on TV, then they will give O what he wants and then again form the circular firing squad :’That Bohner sold us out again’, lots of wailing and drama again.

This record is played over and over, why the science fiction?

I guess these conspiracy theories entertain, how about that coin?


8 posted on 01/17/2013 4:45:19 AM PST by sickoflibs (Losing to O is NO principle!)
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To: Moseley

Emperor Obama will not violate it. He will simply issue an executive order moving it to a higher level.
Obama is the kind of ruler that we fought to get rid of during our war of independence from England.


9 posted on 01/17/2013 4:49:03 AM PST by BuffaloJack (Children, pets, and slaves get taken care of. Free Men take care of themselves.)
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To: Moseley

The real bite from the debt ceiling would come if it forces interest rates up. Interest rates have been kept artificially low by the Federal Reserve on purpose. Almost nobody talks about this, and if they do its in a negative light, but rising interest rates would actually have several POSITIVE effects:

1. Rising income for savers. People who actually save their income have been getting the short end of the stick due to low rates on their CDs.
2. Higher Government borrowing costs. This would serve to bring the spending problem to a head and is the #1 thing that can force entitlement reform. Artificially low interest rates are enable Government spending, period.

Right now we live in a dysfunctional environment where the more Government borrows, the lower interest rates get. That’s really the opposite of what SHOULD happen and is an indicator of how distorted our Economy really is.


10 posted on 01/17/2013 4:51:57 AM PST by rbg81
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To: Moseley

Informative. Thanks for the post.


11 posted on 01/17/2013 4:56:49 AM PST by rockinqsranch (Dems, Libs, Socialists, call 'em what you will, they ALL have fairies livin' in their trees.)
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To: mark3681

Newt must have had all of his teeth fall out, too. From the way he is talking, we should all just bend over BOHICA style and accept whatever number Mr. Soetoro wants to put down as the next phony debt limit. Cave on taxes, cave on spending increaes, cave on a half-sequester (cut defense, but keep domestic spending), and cave on blowing a hole in the debt limit. Boehner has established a new career in spelunking.


12 posted on 01/17/2013 4:57:55 AM PST by SERKIT ("Blazing Saddles" explains it all.......)
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To: Moseley
Why isn't Ben Bernake in prison

FED unreported bailouts

13 posted on 01/17/2013 5:36:18 AM PST by opentalk
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To: Moseley
First, investors would just stop loaning money. Who will buy government bonds that are worthless, null and void?

Benbernank and the Federal Reserve.

14 posted on 01/17/2013 5:38:16 AM PST by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: Moseley
If Democrats cry "boo" Republicans won't stop running until they're hiding deep in the tall grass.

I think it is much worse than that. The Republicans understand that the Revolution is in progress and are trying to show they are really on the side of the new Rulers and shouldn't be shot when the cleaning out process commences. Or, failing that, "Please eat me last. (whimper)."

15 posted on 01/17/2013 5:47:53 AM PST by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson ONLINE www.fee.org/library/books/economics-in-one-lesson)
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To: Moseley
Apparently, there are no LEGAL consequences for our leaders who violate the Constitution & laws.

Reid has failed to pass a budget in 4 years. You would think there would be a price to pay. Nope. None. Nada.

Obama has violated the Constitution several times, with illegal recess appointments, unvetted czars, & executive orders contrary to written law. He can continue violating the Constitution with impunity because the Constitution fails to penalize the President for such crimes.

The only way to prosecute the President is through Impeachment, a thoroughly POLITICAL process that, given our partisan divide & 2/3 majority requirement, has little chance of conviction. The only way to depose an irresponsible Senate Majority Leader is for the Majority party to vote him out as leader.

Since it is more likely to snow in Miami, both men are essentially above the law & Constitution.

16 posted on 01/17/2013 5:50:49 AM PST by Mister Da (The mark of a wise man is not what he knows, but what he knows he doesn't know!)
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To: Moseley

There is no “debt ceiling”.

Congress cannot limit the powers of Congress by statute, only by constitutional amendment.

Congress has unrestricted power to borrow money, unless Article I has been amended. This whole controversy is a fraud.


17 posted on 01/17/2013 5:54:45 AM PST by Jim Noble (When strong, avoid them. Attack their weaknesses. Emerge to their surprise.)
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To: mark3681

Our “conservatites,” Tea Party and other, show just much agility in the leftward kowtow as do the Boenerites. Without their votes we would not have got unlimited detention-without-warant-or-trial and we wouldn’t have got Boener again and a lot of etc.


18 posted on 01/17/2013 5:54:58 AM PST by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson ONLINE www.fee.org/library/books/economics-in-one-lesson)
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To: Moseley

Remember something.

ALL the banks in America are PRIVATE BANKS!!

They are part of the Federal Reserve System.

They can, any time they want, AFAIK, simply tell grandma when she comes in with her SS check “Sorry... that account is overdrawn...”

I think it’s already happened a few times that the government was told this might happen.

Hence the bank bailouts. They KNEW they were gonna lose their rears in the real estate blow-up.


19 posted on 01/17/2013 5:55:05 AM PST by djf (Conservative values help the poor. Liberal values help them STAY poor!!!)
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To: Jim Noble
There is no “debt ceiling”. Congress cannot limit the powers of Congress by statute, only by constitutional amendment. Congress has unrestricted power to borrow money, unless Article I has been amended. This whole controversy is a fraud.

But Congress has empowered the US Treasury to borrow money only up to a certain limit.

Only Congress has the power to borrow money. The US Treasury does not.

So the US Treasury has no power to borrow money except to the extent that the Congress had delegated the US Treasury that power -- up to a certain limit.

So until Congress raises the limit, the US Treasury has no authority to borrow any more money. Only Congress has the power to borrow money under Article 1, Section 8 of the US Constitution


20 posted on 01/17/2013 6:00:06 AM PST by Moseley (http://www.curesocialism.com)
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To: Moseley
TEXT OF Senator Barack Obama Senate Floor Speech on Public Debt March 16, 2006

Congressional Record Volume 152, Number 34 (Thursday, March 16, 2006)] [Senate] [Pages S2236-S2241]

From the Congressional Record Online through the Government Printing Office

Mr. OBAMA. Mr. President, I rise today to talk about America's debt problem.

The fact that we are here today to debate raising America's debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can't pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government's reckless fiscal policies.

Over the past 5 years, our federal debt has increased by $3.5 trillion to $8.6 trillion. That is ``trillion'' with a ``T.'' That is money that we have borrowed from the Social Security trust fund, borrowed from China and Japan, borrowed from American taxpayers. And over the next 5 years, between now and 2011, the President's budget will increase the debt by almost another $3.5 trillion.

Numbers that large are sometimes hard to understand. Some people may wonder why they matter. Here is why: This year, the Federal Government will spend $220 billion on interest. That is more money to pay interest on our national debt than we'll spend on Medicaid and the State Children's Health Insurance Program. That is more money to pay interest on our debt this year than we will spend on education, homeland security, transportation, and veterans benefits combined. It is more money in one year than we are likely to spend to rebuild the devastated gulf coast in a way that honors the best of America.

And the cost of our debt is one of the fastest growing expenses in the Federal budget. This rising debt is a hidden domestic enemy, robbing our cities and States of critical investments in infrastructure like bridges, ports, and levees; robbing our families and our children of critical investments in education and health care reform; robbing our seniors of the retirement and health security they have counted on.

Every dollar we pay in interest is a dollar that is not going to investment in America's priorities. Instead, interest payments are a significant tax on all Americans--a debt tax that Washington doesn't want to talk about. If Washington were serious about honest tax relief in this country, we would see an effort to reduce our national debt by returning to responsible fiscal policies.

But we are not doing that. Despite repeated efforts by Senators Conrad and Feingold, the Senate continues to reject a return to the commonsense Pay-go rules that used to apply. Previously, Pay-go rules applied both to increases in mandatory spending and to tax cuts. The Senate had to abide by the commonsense budgeting principle of balancing expenses and revenues. Unfortunately, the principle was abandoned, and now the demands of budget discipline apply only to spending.

As a result, tax breaks have not been paid for by reductions in Federal spending, and thus the only way to pay for them has been to increase our deficit to historically high levels and borrow more and more money. Now we have to pay for those tax breaks plus the cost of borrowing for them. Instead of reducing the deficit, as some people claimed, the fiscal policies of this administration and its allies in Congress will add more than $600 million in debt for each of the next 5 years. That is why I will once again cosponsor the Pay-go amendment and continue to hope that my colleagues will return to a smart rule that has worked in the past and can work again.

Our debt also matters internationally. My friend, the ranking member of the Senate Budget Committee, likes to remind us that it took 42 Presidents 224 years to run up only $1 trillion of foreign-held debt.

This administration did more than that in just 5 years. Now, there is nothing wrong with borrowing from foreign countries. But we must remember that the more we depend on foreign nations to lend us money, the more our economic security is tied to the whims of foreign leaders whose interests might not be aligned with ours.

Increasing America's debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that ``the buck stops here.'' Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem [[Page S2238]] and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better.

I therefore intend to oppose the effort to increase America's debt limit.

Senator Barack Obama Senate Floor Speech on Public Debt March 16, 2006 http://the-heff-report.blogspot.com/p/text-of-senator-barack-obama-senate.html

21 posted on 01/17/2013 6:08:49 AM PST by KeyLargo
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To: rbg81

Saving money is what builds a real stable economy. This economy has been built on spending and negative saving. That string is hitting the wall even now, thus the crisis after crisis.


22 posted on 01/17/2013 6:24:03 AM PST by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson ONLINE www.fee.org/library/books/economics-in-one-lesson)
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To: KeyLargo

Bump.


23 posted on 01/17/2013 6:27:13 AM PST by Cringing Negativism Network
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To: Moseley
Something that needs to be shouted from the rooftops (since the "Ministry of Propaganda" will never report it) is that EVERY TIME a leftist says we have to increase the debt ceiling because we need to pay the bills that congress has run up, PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW that the leftists are wanting to borrow more money to pay back what was borrowed!

They're wanting to make a payment on their VISA card bill using a cash advance from their Mastercard!

Mark

24 posted on 01/17/2013 8:57:16 AM PST by MarkL (Do I really look like a guy with a plan?)
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To: arthurus

Saving money is what builds a real stable economy.


A good savings rate helps, but its not the whole story. Look at Japan. I realize a lot of Americans may still think the Japanese economy is great, but in many ways they’re in bigger trouble than us—including debt.


25 posted on 01/17/2013 10:12:15 AM PST by rbg81
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To: rbg81

Look at Japan. They have a tremendous nominal savings rate but the government spends that savings faster than it accumulates. Almost all personal savings is through the Post Office which, in Japan, is a government bureau. The government replaces the monetary savings of the people with IOUs, kind of like the American forced “savings” plan that we call Social Security. It ain’t there and it does not build capital for future enterprise. The Japanese economy is very like that of the USA. They just have different names for things and hit the bog a bit earlier than the USA did.


26 posted on 01/17/2013 10:24:04 AM PST by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's Economics In One Lesson ONLINE www.fee.org/library/books/economics-in-one-lesson)
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