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Kroger Gun Stunt Sparks 2nd Amendment Debate
NBC28 ^ | 1/28/2013 | Amy Vu

Posted on 01/29/2013 11:46:30 AM PST by 1912comeback

Charlottesville police say the man who showed up at a Kroger grocery store with a loaded gun wanted to make a point. On Sunday, an unidentified 22-year-old man carried a loaded AR-15 into the Kroger store on Emmet Street and Hydraulic Road, sparking not only a scare for customers and employees but also a 2nd Amendment debate.

(Excerpt) Read more at nbc29.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; News/Current Events; US: North Carolina
KEYWORDS: banglist; guncontrol; guns; nra; secondamendment
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1 posted on 01/29/2013 11:46:39 AM PST by 1912comeback
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To: 1912comeback

Saw “NBC” and left.


2 posted on 01/29/2013 11:48:58 AM PST by Da Coyote
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To: 1912comeback

“Charlottesville police drew their guns on the man after witnesses reported he brought a gun into the store. They restrained the man to ask him questions, but released him after they confirmed he is not a convicted felon, owned the gun legally and it was not concealed. “

In other words, much ado about nothing... as usual,.


3 posted on 01/29/2013 11:53:23 AM PST by Bigh4u2 (Denial is the first requirement to be a liberal)
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To: 1912comeback

All he did was demonstrate what a bunch of pussies society has become.


4 posted on 01/29/2013 11:55:03 AM PST by ImJustAnotherOkie (zerogottago)
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To: 1912comeback

He is very lucky and very foolish. If someone in my presence walked into a store with an uncased rifle, I personally would have the safety off and be ready to draw and fire the second he gave indications of even thinking about shouldering the weapon. I would err on the side of saving myself and other patrons in making the decision.


5 posted on 01/29/2013 11:55:42 AM PST by Trod Upon (Civilian disarmament is the precursor to democide.)
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To: 1912comeback

He had a note in his pocket in case he was shot?
He was prepared to make a statement with a note if the police shot him?
Was he trying to provoke people?
Did he explain to anyone his reasoning or just walk around the store in a creepy way?
I’m completely pro-gun but I wouldn’t walk into Target or Walmart with a shotgun slung over my shoulder.
Now, carry concealed? Heh, no comment.


6 posted on 01/29/2013 11:57:22 AM PST by servo1969
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To: 1912comeback
I am so tired of the Left's outright abrogation of gun rights and dissemination of fear for guns. The hoplophobes in this country are in the minority, and this young man was fully within his rights as a member of American society to do this. Call it a stunt if you wish, this should be the NORM not the exception!

Homosexuals across the nation have PARADES in which they make out and march to celebrate how they HAVE SEX! What normal, God-fearing society accepts this as normal? Yet, they push it as "normal and natural," while it's anything but.

I've said this a dozen times now, WE NEED TO NORMALIZE OPEN CARRY! It needs to be out in the open, in-you-face, and out there for every American, be they a gun owner or not, to see and to understand. NOT EVERYONE WITH A GUN IS GOING TO COMMIT A MASSACRE!

From the article:

"If you go and carry concealed, carry concealed and don't let nobody know it. If you go and carry open, respect the rights of others," he said.

If you carry openly, how the Hell are you supposed to "respect the rights of others?" And what rights are they supposed to respect? What RIGHT, what God-given, fully-affirmed RIGHT did this young man violate for which he was not arrested? He was allowed to go on his way after it was determined he was legally allowed to carry the weapon, it was his weapon, he wasn't a felon, and it wasn't concealed. Yet, he freaked out a bunch of hoplophobic idiots in a Kroger.

Support Open Carry and Carry Open if your state allows it. Florida is one of the few that expressly forbids it, but you can bet your bottom dollar that I'll be carrying an AK over my shoulder when it does become legal.

7 posted on 01/29/2013 11:57:32 AM PST by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: Trod Upon
I would err on the side of saving myself and other patrons in making the decision.

Sounds to me like you shouldn't be carrying a gun.
8 posted on 01/29/2013 11:58:42 AM PST by ZX12R
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To: 1912comeback

So what do people think, that when someone walks into a store like that, that are instincts would be that “oh he’s cool”?

Hell no! He is lucky a thinking gun owner didn’t blow his head off.


9 posted on 01/29/2013 11:59:06 AM PST by VanDeKoik
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To: 1912comeback

Saw a hot chick on a bicycle stopped at a light in downtown Medford, OR, with a pink-stocked AR-15 slung over her shoulder.

:-)


10 posted on 01/29/2013 11:59:47 AM PST by Uncle Miltie (Of the government, by the government, and for the government.)
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To: 1912comeback
Pikers...

Israeli's do it right.

11 posted on 01/29/2013 12:00:44 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: VanDeKoik
Hell no! He is lucky a thinking gun owner didn’t blow his head off.

That would be a non-thinking gun owner.
12 posted on 01/29/2013 12:01:14 PM PST by ZX12R
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To: Trod Upon

Damn straight. Raised rural I was taught that a gun came out only when you either transporting it or planning to do business with it. You do not brandish it around in a store to ‘prove a point’. You may end up proving a different point than you intended.


13 posted on 01/29/2013 12:02:08 PM PST by Free Vulcan (Vote Republican! [You can vote Democrat when you're dead]...)
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To: 1912comeback

This would not be so unusual around here (rural southern Arizona). My reaction would be to ask him what variety of weapon he had and how he liked it. Heck, might even invite him out to our place (on working cattle ranch) for some shooting followed by some homebrew. Too many folks are unused to seeing armed civilians it seems.


14 posted on 01/29/2013 12:05:36 PM PST by ammomajor (If 'helicopter Ben' says gold isn't money, I want more of it.)
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To: Trod Upon

Trigger happy ninnies like you will probably do more harm to our RKBA than the OC guys will.


15 posted on 01/29/2013 12:06:44 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: 1912comeback

This would not be so unusual around here (rural southern Arizona). My reaction would be to ask him what variety of weapon he had and how he liked it. Heck, might even invite him out to our place (on working cattle ranch) for some shooting followed by some homebrew. Too many folks are unused to seeing armed civilians it seems.


16 posted on 01/29/2013 12:07:05 PM PST by ammomajor (If 'helicopter Ben' says gold isn't money, I want more of it.)
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To: 1912comeback

A “debate”? Brandishing a weapon in a public place for no apparent reason is a “Second Amendment debate”?

What. Evah.


17 posted on 01/29/2013 12:09:20 PM PST by SoFloFreeper
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To: Free Vulcan

We used to walk around with them strapped to our hips and hanging from saddle scabbards.

Scared sheep from a slung rifle are idiots.


18 posted on 01/29/2013 12:11:01 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: 1912comeback

We don’t have open carry in Texas. If that guy came in my Kroger with a loaded AR 15, someone would shoot him dead with their concealed gun.

If we ever have open carry, that AR 15 should be in carry position with shoulder strap. I don’t know if this guy in that Kroger had it in carry position.


19 posted on 01/29/2013 12:12:28 PM PST by Marcella (Prepping can save your life today. Going Galt is freedom.)
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To: ZX12R; Trod Upon; SpinnerWebb
Sounds to me like you shouldn't be carrying a gun.

I'm with Trod Upon on this one. My hand would be on my carry and if bozo the "statement maker" shouldered that AR, I'd be forced to make a statement of my own. If he doesn't shoulder it, I'm fine with just keeping my eye on him ... if he does, he's won a Darwin Award®

20 posted on 01/29/2013 12:32:57 PM PST by tx_eggman (Liberalism is only possible in that moment when a man chooses Barabas over Christ.)
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To: Marcella
From texasgunlaws.org:

Q: Can I carry a firearm on my person? A: Yes, with proper licensing (Concealed Handgun License) you may carry a pistol or revolver on your person so long as it remains concealed. Long guns (rifles / shotguns) do not have to be concealed, but must be carried in a manner not calculated to cause alarm, and do not require a license.

21 posted on 01/29/2013 12:39:49 PM PST by Texican72
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To: tx_eggman; Marcella

Like Marcella says just above you, we don’t have open carry in Texas.... yet.

So your attention would be warranted.

I personally wish we just had open carry, no permit, no registration. The fools will take a few good ones with them, but would soon weed themselves out.


22 posted on 01/29/2013 12:40:24 PM PST by SpinnerWebb (In 2012 you will awaken from your HOPEnosis and have no recollection of this... "Constitution")
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To: tx_eggman

and sorry for the late response... it took a while to get past post #11


23 posted on 01/29/2013 12:41:24 PM PST by SpinnerWebb (In 2012 you will awaken from your HOPEnosis and have no recollection of this... "Constitution")
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To: tx_eggman
I'm with Trod Upon on this one.

To each his own, but maybe you two are just too nervous or paranoid to carry a firearm. You could end up in prison for the rest of your life, for jumping to a conclusion prematurely.
24 posted on 01/29/2013 12:41:49 PM PST by ZX12R
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To: VanDeKoik
Hell no! He is lucky a thinking gun owner didn’t blow his head off.

What actions did he take or threat did he pose that would cause a "thinking gun owner" to decide that he needed to have his head blown off?

25 posted on 01/29/2013 12:42:55 PM PST by Bob
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To: SoFloFreeper
A “debate”? Brandishing a weapon in a public place for no apparent reason is a “Second Amendment debate”?

To keep and BEAR arms.
26 posted on 01/29/2013 12:43:12 PM PST by ZX12R
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To: Texican72; Marcella; tx_eggman

well, then again, we could be incorrect.


27 posted on 01/29/2013 12:43:45 PM PST by SpinnerWebb (In 2012 you will awaken from your HOPEnosis and have no recollection of this... "Constitution")
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To: SpinnerWebb

You are welcome... ;-)


28 posted on 01/29/2013 12:46:36 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: ZX12R

Yes, so let us look at what that meant to the founders.

My recollection is that bearing arms meant, to the founders, carrying them when and if there is a reason to bring them out into a public place. The founders didn’t foolishly carry arms into a place where they weren’t normally needed...unless they were expecting trouble from the redcoats.

Am I off base in that recollection?


29 posted on 01/29/2013 12:47:45 PM PST by SoFloFreeper
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To: Dead Corpse

Pic of the day.


30 posted on 01/29/2013 12:48:48 PM PST by SoFloFreeper
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To: SoFloFreeper

Yes. You are wrong.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1933938/posts

Unless they’ve changed the meaning of “to be at all times armed” along with “shall not be infringed”.


31 posted on 01/29/2013 12:50:09 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: SoFloFreeper
Yeah... There are more out there too...

God bless Israel. In more than one way, hopefully.

As for open carry, I'm ok with it as long as you are behaving yourself. Expect folks to keep an eye on you, but situational awareness demands you keep aware of ANY potential threat. Not OMGWTFBBQ/DefCon1... But aware.

Open, concealed, long gun, pistol, machine gun, rocket launcher... I don't care. Educate the sheep by being nice, but BE ARMED.

32 posted on 01/29/2013 12:54:57 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: Dead Corpse
Hhhmmm... Screwed up my img code somehow...

Ok... Better.

33 posted on 01/29/2013 12:57:33 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: SoFloFreeper
Am I off base in that recollection?

I don't know, I wasn't there, but I'd guess it meant that in order for any federal militia to be well regulated and kept in their place, that citizens should display their weapons when ever they liked, so as to remind them that we are not their subjects, if we are not criminals, made so by constitutional laws.
34 posted on 01/29/2013 12:57:33 PM PST by ZX12R
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To: rarestia

Great post on how the “normalization” thing works. And of course some of the foundations of this nation are being made to be “abnormal” (public prayer, chastity, guns, etc.)

On a personal note - seeing someone in public with a visible, holstered pistol draws my eye - but no other reaction except to assess the person. (Always an older gray-haired white guy that isn’t at the top of my threat matrix.) A rifle over a twenty-something guy’s shoulder would. And while I think it would be prudent to assess the situation - no difference legally between the two in my state. BUT - it seems that the media and elites views have even filtered into my brain. (As a kid it was common to wander the neighborhood with our .22’s and nobody gave us a second glance).


35 posted on 01/29/2013 1:00:20 PM PST by 21twelve ("We've got the guns, and we got the numbers" adapted and revised from Jim M.)
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To: Dead Corpse

Never saw that letter; thanks for the source.

I wonder if one can extrapolate the meaning of an amendment from the excerpt of one letter—the same kind of exercise was done by SCOTUS regarding “wall of separation between church and state” using, ironically, one single phrase from a letter by Jefferson.

Seems to me the founders didn’t think that “bear” arms meant carrying them everywhere or brandishing them without purpose.

Of course, if the “open carry” law is in the jurisdiction, then there should be no problem.


36 posted on 01/29/2013 1:00:43 PM PST by SoFloFreeper
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To: SoFloFreeper

A strong body makes the mind strong. As to the species of exercises, I advise the gun. While this gives moderate exercise to the body, it gives boldness, enterprise and independence to the mind. Games played with the ball, and others of that nature, are too violent for the body and stamp no character on the mind. Let your gun therefore be your constant companion of your walks.
-— Thomas Jefferson to Peter Carr, 1785. The Writings of Thomas Jefferson, (Memorial Edition) Lipscomb and Bergh, editors.


37 posted on 01/29/2013 1:08:00 PM PST by Politicalmom (Liberalism. Ideas so great they have to be mandatory.-FReeper Osage Orange)
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To: SoFloFreeper

More than one source.

http://constitution.org/dhbr.htm

Lots to read.


38 posted on 01/29/2013 1:18:42 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: Free Vulcan
You do not brandish it around in a store to ‘prove a point’. You may end up proving a different point than you intended.

Where in the story do you see where he brandished the rifle?

39 posted on 01/29/2013 1:22:36 PM PST by LoneRangerMassachusetts (The meek shall not inherit the Earth)
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To: LoneRangerMassachusetts

No where. Some folks have “the Fear” when it comes to expressing their Rights.


40 posted on 01/29/2013 1:25:09 PM PST by Dead Corpse (I will not comply.)
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To: Politicalmom

Thanks for this post. Quite relevant, I’d say.


41 posted on 01/29/2013 1:28:01 PM PST by FourtySeven (47)
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To: Trod Upon

Not to be a smart a$$, but... duh! I had this happen to me once. Made me nervous as all get out, but the guy did not display any intent. Weapon was slung and he was walking casually with a girlfriend.


42 posted on 01/29/2013 1:31:30 PM PST by Mathews (Ecclesiastes 10:2 (NIV))
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To: VanDeKoik
A thinking gun owner would assess the situation, consider the options and act. If there was no display of intent, meaning he came in with the weapon at sling arms and kept it at sling arms, a thinking gun owner would would remain cautious and alert... but to draw on a guy for carrying a slung rifle...? I don't know about that.
43 posted on 01/29/2013 1:36:18 PM PST by Mathews (Ecclesiastes 10:2 (NIV))
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To: SoFloFreeper

Define brandishing. If it was slung on his back, that is NOT brandishing.


44 posted on 01/29/2013 1:37:56 PM PST by Mathews (Ecclesiastes 10:2 (NIV))
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To: Dead Corpse

Yes they do!


45 posted on 01/29/2013 1:41:30 PM PST by MadelineZapeezda (“By failing to prepare, you are preparing to fail.”....Ben Franklin)
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To: SoFloFreeper

yeah you are way off base
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpK84illOPA

right to bear arms included right to cross state lines with them, unlike today in some instances..


46 posted on 01/29/2013 1:49:58 PM PST by rolling_stone
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To: Mathews

“Charlottesville police say the man who showed up at a Kroger grocery store with a loaded gun wanted to make a point”

Now if this guy told the officers that was his goal, then he was playing with fire. He should have asked the store first if it was ok to walk in with his rifle, unless there is some law in that state where it is perfectly legal to go into private establishments openly packing.

People at that store (private property) didn’t know him, and aren’t obliged to play along regardless of what right he wants to express. No different then if we walked in to make a political speech against the government.


47 posted on 01/29/2013 1:50:30 PM PST by VanDeKoik
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To: 1912comeback

Sounds like the guy was trolling.

You wanna “spark a debate”? Make people uneasy? Get the cops out there so you can “make a point”? Carry an AR-15.

You wanna accustom your fellow citizens to seeing firearms in public without panicking? Try a break-open bird-gun instead.

I read not long ago that some police - in areas where police aren’t generally liked or trusted - have swapped out their semi-auto, military-style rifles for lever-actions. Why? Because people view the two differently. To them, one says “military overlord” while the other says “decent lawman”.

So many posts lately reminisce about the days when we were kids walking down the street carrying our 22s. Well an AR-15 ain’t no 22. One reason it’s popular is because of its looks - and looks are what scare the sheeple.

This is very much a PR war for the minds - or feelings, perhaps - of the sheeple. We need to be shrewd, not provocative.


48 posted on 01/29/2013 2:15:01 PM PST by LearsFool ("Thou shouldst not have been old, till thou hadst been wise.")
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To: 21twelve

But meanwhile, we have openly gay, flamboyant displays of homosexual activity and we’re told to just “look away.” My response to that would be, “Then you go ahead and leave the area if you think I’m a danger to your or your family. If YOU had a firearm on your person, you would be more adept at assessing the situation before you reflexively call 9-11.”

When Virginia made open carry legal a few years back, there were stories of middle-aged men being hassled in diners for openly carrying pistols. There’s very little appreciable difference between that and this young man carrying his rifle. The biggest delta between the situations is the firearm, but at no point did anyone attempt to assess the mindset of the individual carrying the weapon.

We are a lawful people on the whole. There’s no reason any of us should suspect someone OPENLY CARRYING A FIREARM of any ill intent. They’ve pretty much telegraphed it if they do. Remember, in the “old days,” it was considered criminal to carry concealed. “Cloak and dagger” held the meaning that someone concealing a weapon was intent on doing someone harm. It’s only in recent times that concealment was considered acceptable, and it’s mostly due to political correctness run amok.

I carry concealed all the time, but I absolutely would not have an issue carrying open; and I would be carrying at least a rifle or shotgun AND a pistol. It’s not for “attention” or to be noticed. It’s my RIGHT to protect myself and my family.


49 posted on 01/29/2013 3:46:45 PM PST by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: ZX12R
Because it's only reasonable to draw after you've taken the first bullet, right?
50 posted on 01/29/2013 5:46:39 PM PST by Trod Upon (Civilian disarmament is the precursor to democide.)
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