Skip to comments.Amish Men Accused of Animal Cruelty Defend Their Actions ("In the Amish itís acceptable")
Posted on 02/01/2013 6:15:09 AM PST by Behind Liberal Lines
Clyde, N.Y. - Two Amish men from Wayne County are accused of killing a litter of healthy puppies and their mother.
This is simply a case of animal cruelty, says Wayne County District Attorney Rick Healy who intends to charge the pair.
The nine dead dogs were discovered in a compost pile and reported to police January 17th.
Merlin Schumacher who owns the dogs says he was trying to breed Australian Red Heelers, but when he couldnt sell the dogs and they became too big he asked an employee to shoot them.
Jonathan Eicher agreed to put the dogs down.
In the Amish its acceptable to put dogs down. I thought as long as you did it out back it was okay, Eicher told police. Eicher referred to what he called the three Ss: shoot, shovel, and shut up.
That is where Amish custom and New York law clash. New York A.G. and Market Laws prevent the killing of otherwise healthy animals for no reason.
They need to understand that it is illegal, says DA Healy. They cant treat the animals the way they want to treat the animals they must treat the animals humanely.
Schumacher, who owns the dogs, told police he had raised the dogs and couldnt put them down myself so I asked Jonathan to do it.
Both men now face nine counts of unjustifiably killing an animal which is a misdemeanor.
Schumacher was charged Wednesday, Eicher expected to be charged Wednesday evening.
Should have just called the cops and let them shoot them...
Which would be more effective:
“Danger: Snakes on Premises”
Many shelters now have such high standards for adoption that people are discouraged from adopting pets.
They want to do home visits, get proof of financial ability, past history of adopting or surrendering pets, history of residency...and more.
If you’re not deemed acceptable — and sometimes your current pets too must pass inspection and compatibility tests — the prospective adoptee stays put. Until of course they euthanize him.
By the way, there isn't any vets within 400 miles of my home and the road is closed for the winter. Last winter I had to shoot an old friend of 14 years; hated doing it, but wasn't going to let him die in pain and agony. I heard some of you claim that I could be arrested for animal cruelty. Well, it's how it's done with dogs where we call home; no matter what any of you all think about it.
Dogs would also be released in islands in the river and left there to fend for themselves all summer, they'd learn to catch salmon swimming upriver. Also when they'd stake dogs along river, dogs had water and learned pretty quick to catch fish in the river. Indians didn't have to take care of dogs all summer.
We had a preacher that also trapped. He took a dogteam and killed them one by one, used dead dog as bait set for wolves, no joke; that even bothered me some.
Another local started eating his dogs one by one a few winters back; ran low on food, couldn't find any moose; true story.
I wanna kiss the animals wouldn't make it here in Alaska.
What the difference between shooting them and giving them a needle or gas.
Years ago when a dog was suffering it was put down that way. They never heard of the song “Old Shep”?
Cats were drowned in bags and dogs were shot, it was no more animal cruelty than what is practised in every dog pound in the country when animals are euthanised.
Funny the story says:New York A.G. and Market Laws prevent the killing of otherwise healthy animals for no reason.
And yet the State of New York allows the killing of human babies in the womb for no reason.
oh bullshit I probably pay more taxes than anything else
The dog pound can kill animals
The abortion doctor can kill babies,
But a private citizen cannot save himself a $40 dollar fee for putting down his sick animal by using a 15 cent shot shell.
I don’t think it’s right than an animal shelter can kill the dogs but a private citizen can’t.
I do understand laws against torture. But a clean shot to the head is not torture.
” but dogs will fight to the death to protect their owners.”
Not necessarily. Some dogs will kill their owners.
Lots of them won’t do either (kill them or protect them).
“.. See how it could be? That’s how I want it. . .”
Me, too. Someday soon, the earth shall be full of His knowledge and glory as the waters that cover the sea . . There’s a little more to endure before that happens; but not much more.
Take care of things without involving the government, and you are defined as inhumane.
I am unclear as to what you think the guys in this story “took care of”.
Not really getting your comparison to kill shelters, which actively try to place the animals in homes, but failing that have few other options other than to euthanize. I know a lot of rescue operations get their dogs from kill shelters.
Since the dogs would have meant money in their pockets if sold, seems they fulfilled other needs with these dogs.
Waiting for the - the dogs were their private property and they can do as they wish - post that is found in every dead dog thread.
Why are we equating the putting down of old, sick dogs with a healthy mom and her healthy puppies.
What you describe is exactly right. When it’s your old friend’s time, you gotta do it. And there is no state in the union that would arrest you for animal cruelty under those circumstances.
What happened in this case sounds like sport killing. And I wasn’t there so I’m speculating.
Too many dogs and cats in this country any ways. Kittens are great until they grow up, get loose, go feral, have tons of kittens, and wipe out every bird, rabbit, etc in the area. I hate them.
Dogs are the same way. Except that the dogs pack up and then - they.come.after.you.
Where do you live?
I have lived in the country for nearly 40 years. We have feral cats. We also have tons and tons of all sorts of birds, rabbits and assorted other critters, some of them plain vermin. No matter how many baby bunnies the dogs eat, somehow, my driveway is still full of them every summer evening and my garden is raided, as well. Probably, we feed the dogs too well. Only the beagle would always chase any rabbit he saw.
We have a large Amish population, too. Some breed dogs. The animal control people and the vets think there are more looses, abandoned dogs from the *English* breeders than from the Amish.
I have had more visits from the neighbors’ cows than from a feral dog pack. However, the very few dog packs are really domesticated dogs that run away and then join up in a pack. Some are home at night and running wild during the day. They are far less dangerous and less of a nuisance than the coyotes. Usually, just yelling and telling them to “Go home” works well. The sight of a gun and a shot over their heads will do it, too. Most dogs hate the smell of gunpowder and the shots hurt their ears.
Even though everyone hunts, I have nearly been run down by romping pairs of yearling deer while berry picking. A neighbor no longer goes berry picking, because her last time included a bear encounter. These can be more dangerous to humans than any other animal, including the coyote packs.
As for feral kittens, most don’t survive. The hawks and owls are always looking for a snack and if they don’t get them, coyotes do. Some “feral” cats have homes, but go out bumming when they can. The cats do a good job of keeping mice and vole populations down, as do some breeds of dog.
I wonder if the lead dog in your story sensed your intentions and that is why he challenged you?
Just off the top of my head...
The animal shelter uses a drug that is supposed to kill the dog peacefully.
The animal shelter isn't going to potentially miss or just wound the pet the first time.
The animal shelter isn't killing the dogs in front of family members.
The animal shelter is authorized by law to it, after presumably getting proper training.
With all due respect, your comment is foolish. You might as well say "I don't think it's right that a doctor can perform surgery, but a private citizen can't" or "I don't think it's right that President Bush can invade Iraq but a private citizen can't."
Try and develop a little perspective in your life.
I really don’t think your analogies pertain to this situation. I SAID I don’t think torture should be allowed.
The animal shelter uses a drug that is supposed to kill the dog peacefully. - well, a bullet to the head is quick and painless
The animal shelter isn’t going to potentially miss or just wound the pet the first time. - I think the odds of a shelter doing euthanasia wrong are about the same. It is hard to miss when you have a gun right up to a head. Sure, it could misfire, but at the shelter a needle could break or a machine could malfunction.
The animal shelter isn’t killing the dogs in front of family members. - I don’t think the Amish did that, either, nor do they advocate it.
The animal shelter is authorized by law to it, after presumably getting proper training. - I think this is bogus, you don’t need to be trained how to shoot a dog in the head.
I have a perfectly good perspective on life. Dogs are not people.
Correct and you will note that these defendants were not charged with murder or any other homicide offense.
Your lack of perspective is in ignoring the law already draws distinctions to make clear that this is not the same as killing a person.
The issue here was did the defendants engage in unjustified acts. The facts seem to indicate they did. The dogs weren't sick. They weren't being harvested for food or clothing. They could have been given away. The could have been peacefully euthanized. None of that was considered. Instead, the defendants just cavalierly shot a group of dogs because "their culture" said it was better to just "shoot shovel and shut up" (their words). That is essentially an admission on their part that this was done for convenience and to cover up what they did.
We are on our 2nd Akita. They are death on moles. Leave the yard looking like a minefield, but the moles at least migrate out to the fallow pasture.
You did have an unusual dog pack experience, IMO. Big dogs, like our Akitas, are usually confident enough that when facing down a larger dog or being territorial, one deep *WUFF* is all they do. I only get scared when a dog is on alert, has his lips skinned back, his ears up, back hair bristled and is slavering while barking/growling. Lips, hair and muzzle are the key cues, IMO. All my dogs seem to have an instinctive fear of a broom, though.
That Rottie obviously had been a pet, if it knew about cars. Sometimes I think people just can’t handle the large working breeds and tend to make them outside dogs and so, the dogs escape jail and go out on their own. Our 1st Akita was a showup and I think that was his story. Our vet was pretty sure he came from a breeder who had many different breeds and the dogs just didn’t get socialized to a human pack.
The worst thing about feral cats, for me, is that they beat up on my 15-year-old cat, although she is savvy about hiding. The late Akita was *his* cat’s protector, but would chase off any strange one. Don’t know yet about the puppy...he’s too young to have any real discernment. He is death on voles, though! We’ll see what he’s made of after he’s neutered and if he calms down enough to be allowed off leash or out of his pen. We’re planning on moving in a year, so we’ll have to re-acclimate him to a new territory, then. Once he’s 3 or so, he should be more trustworthy. Right now, he’s just lunch, so he stays inside, on leash when out or in his large pen for playtime.
Right on about the beavers. We let the local trappers set traps, not that it does much good and then we have to worry about them ourselves. Destructive beasts.
When our old guy died, the coyotes had a wake. They sang all night. Now, they know the pup is here and they are staying out of sight and are quieter. We see tracks and scat, of course, but they are warier. He’s only 5 months old, but already over 60 pounds. One day, he’ll be formidable. That’s at least a year away, though.
As a landowner, we can kill beaver and coyote if need be. Coon and possum usually don’t stick around an adult Akita, though. If they do, they quickly become chew toys.
“In the Amish its acceptable”
If so, how long before Sharia Law becomes acceptable?
Now this is really stupid.
Every animal shelter in the country puts dogs down.
your tax dollars at work or those of a local charity.
Im only pointing out that there exists an alternative to killing a mama dog and her puppies.
Yeah that’s ostensibly the point of this article.
But the Amish do everything on their own—like healthcare. Without government support.
Yours and my reaction would be to shovel the problem off to the local animal shelter—where they would either find a home for mama dog and her puppies or put them down. Either way, the responsibility for the animal is off our hands.
Whenever you read an Amish story—map it over onto Lubivitchers to see how the story fits into the liberal narrative. Both groups keep old ways and both groups are self reliant—both of which characteristics are anethma to liberals
“The could have been peacefully euthanized. “
They were peacefully euthanized. Unless I am mistaken no charges of torture are being proposed.
The local shelter isn’t the only place where an animal can be put down peacefully. One might argue it’s more traumatic for many animals to be taken there for euthanization. I think it is normally kinder to do it at home when the animal is sleeping. Rather than in a strange place with lots of other dogs, territorial stuff, waits in unfamiliar kennels, unfamiliar food, all that.
No, humans are not animals, by my standard and the basic assumptions of my worldview.
I suggest that if my worldview assumptions bother you, that it’s your problem, not mine.
Meanwhile, a many of the problems caused by the death culture of the left have the same assumptions that you’ve just espoused - a pig is a dog is a rat is a boy. Famous quote.
That's different you know....The "Humane" Society..has the "okay" to do it.
Do you have your "Exhalation Permit"?
We are concerned about your Carbon Footprint in light of
Global Warming... Climate Change...whatever.
While we would NEVER think of restricting your right to inhale life-giving air, we must think of the Environment, of The Children!
Therefore, you may freely inhale, but you must have an Exhalation Permit before you let it out, due to the great increase to the Carbon Content ("boooooo, hissss, boooo") you have just made to that breath.
Exhalation Permit Request forms are available at your local EPA Office, open from 10:00 to 10:15 on Tuesdays and alternate Thursdays. Three copies are required at $37.50 each.
The quota of permits for this Fiscal Year has already been issued.
Have a Nice Day! "Obama cares!"
["Enough of this Red State nonsense! I'll make sure EVERYONE turns BLUE!" - Yes, Mr. President.]
See, the blindspot that atheists have is that they try to tell themselves that they either have no assumptions, or their assumptions are based on “reason”, which in itself is a circular argument where your feet are grounded firmly in midair.
Raised from puppyhood w/kids and they are good to excellent. Used as babysitters in Japan, historically.
Our guy comes from a breeder in Mindoro, WI. She also runs a private email group for her owners & owners-to-be and there are a lot of families w/kids, plus this genetic line seems really tractable and good-tempered. Her website:
You can see her dogs over 2 generations. She has one stud and 3 females and does 3 litters a year. You need a reservation. Males, right now, are in short supply, with more reservations for them than puppies available.
I would say visit various breeders and study up on the breed. They are very independent-minded and take a firm hand and time to train. Not for everyone. You really have to stay one step ahead. I advocate a puppy just because then, you aren’t dealing with someone’s mistakes or trying to replace a bonded leader. This is like having a baby, though and means broken sleep for at least 2-3 months.
You want to see some of the dogs at the middle & ends of their lives, too. Some lines have hip & knee problems, some have skin probs and auto immune issues.
They have an innate high prey drive, so it is important they be socialized with the family, kids, other pets from weaning onward. They must recognize everyone in the family as alpha to them. On the whole, though, they are very loving dogs and want to please. Bright, too.
I want babies protected
I also want animals protected
We can choose to protect both.
I dont want animals or babies to suffer.
But a clean shot to the head is not torture.
I am not to be included in your WE........speak for yourself. What I choose to so is my business...don’t speak for anyone else.
PETA kills all the animals that are left in their care.
you are ridiculous
” I think it is normally kinder to do it at home when the animal is sleeping.”
He shot nine dogs. You really expect us to believe the animals slept through all the gunshots?
“He shot nine dogs. You really expect us to believe the animals slept through all the gunshots?”
I don’t know what he has stated.
Were I on a jury, I would not vote to convict unless evidence was presented that he tortured them in some way, not that he just killed them.
“But its one d__n tough shot to make.”
On a dog? I don’t think so.
Yup. Don’t forget about the “gay” dog.
Total hypocrisy by the state of NY. There are kill shelters all over the place. Is the objection to the way they were killed or to the killing itself?
You have to keep in mind that for the Amish, the breeding and selling dogs is no different to them than breeding cows and growing crops.
If a farmer, Amish or otherwise has a dairy cow that doesnt produce any milk, the farmer would most likely put her down they are not going to incur the expense of keeping an animal alive that provides no economic value. Likewise, if a farmer, Amish or otherwise had a bad crop of corn that doesnt start growing, theyd plow it under and start again with another crop.
While I personally find it rather sad and I think the Amish here in PA are a big part of the puppy mill industry; something I abhor for many reasons, I can, from purely a business perspective understand why they do this.
FWIW, my mothers cousin was a breeder of pure bred AKC registered Boxers. He even had one dog go all the way to Westminster. While he loved his dogs, breeding and selling top quality dogs was his business. As a kid I was shocked to learn that if one of his Boxers had a litter of white or albino Boxer puppies, he would immediately and humanly euthanize them as they were unsellable and of no value to him. While they might have, despite not being able to be AKC registered back then, still might have made a great pet for someone; he however wasnt in the business of selling pet quality dogs but in the business of breeding and selling top quality, show quality dogs. For him to feed and care for puppies that had very little sale value or even had to be given away, just didnt make sense to him from a business perspective not to mention that he felt that the proliferation of poor quality dogs diluted the breeds gene pool overall.
On a dog? I dont think so.
Too bad they don't extend that same protection to otherwise healthy unborn children.