Skip to comments.Army: 78% Of Combat Brigades Will Skip Training Due To Sequester, CR
Posted on 02/10/2013 3:40:59 AM PST by SkyPilot
WASHINGTON: Rarely have such pretty slides told such an ugly story. While Army Chief of Staff Ray Odierno tries to talk up "The Force of Tomorrow," Army briefing documents obtained today by AOL Defense lay out the near-term impact of sequestration, the Continuing Resolution, and unresolved overseas contingency operations needs: an enormous $18 billion shortfall for the service that will be borne almost entirely by federal workers and military readiness.
You can see the slides by clicking "download this document" (up and to the left) and read the detailed talking points here, but the highlights are harrowing enough:
Training: The Army will have money to fully train only a fraction of its total force: The 82nd Airborne's Global Response Force paratrooper brigade, units in Korea, and troops headed for Afghanistan. Everyone else will cancel everything more elaborate than "squad-level training."
That means the largest Army formations that practice together as a team will be eight-man squads. For comparison, even a football team gets to put 11 players on the field at a time and as hard as you have to practice to win the Super Bowl, the Baltimore Ravens didn't have to rehearse how to coordinate the actions of thousands of players working as a unit while somebody was trying to kill them.
(Excerpt) Read more at defense.aol.com ...
we’re so screwed
People here on FR think this is a good thing.
I have found that out.
Many, many Freepers are in "Shoot! Fire! Aim!" mode on this. It is both disappointing and amazing at the same time.
We all want the deficit reduced. But breaking faith with our military this way is obscene. They also do not understand that the military is already dealing with almost half a Trillion dollars in cuts over ten years (cuts that began 2 years ago), on top of Sequestration.
The military is hemorrhaging.
I can tell you that America is going to get an education this week. The Joint Chiefs are going to Congress to testify.
I am told that at least one of them is close to putting his stars on the table. The level of frustration and desperation is reaching fever pitch, and Congress and the American people simply do not (yet) care.
Good. Best way to have a government fall is to lose the military. The faster this puss-filled, corrupt dictatorship falls, the better.
I can tell you from personal experience that the Army needs to stand down for 6 months or so every couple of years for “people Maintenance”.
The "Burn it All Down Then!" approach is immoral and is nothing less than a treasonous betrayal of the very best of what is left of America.
Since 911, no facet of American society has given more, suffered greater loneliness and hardship, and worked harder than our military.
Obama is a curse. At least half of the voting population is a secular, rotten mess. But that does not justify breaking faith with our military like this. Nothing does.
A lot of that going on, unfortunately.
OK. How much more in taxes are you willing to pay to keep this from happening? We either gut the military, gut Medicare, or gut Social Security, increase the deficit, or raise taxes. Those are the options. pick one.
Defund Michelle’s staff. Defund Congress’ staff and get rid of Congress members’ pensions; they’re not doing anything anyway. Defund the DOJ; they’re all in bed with the crooks anyway. Limit Obama’s travel to essentials. Ditch Obamacare and all its extra IRS agents...
They should start with the elements that have won the least trust from the public and go from there...
(Note: I haven’t thought this through. This is just a quick suggestion. The Constitution authorizes certain things for the feds to be doing, and the one thing it MANDATES the feds to do is provide security from invasion. That’s the military. The military should be the one thing left standing after all the other cuts have happened. If we followed this, maybe we would end up in compliance with the 10th Amendment, after all...)
You left one option out. Defense spending is about 19% of discretionary spending but is taking 50% of the hit. Making the cut proportional to spending would help too.
“But breaking faith with our military this way is obscene.”
Sorry, but a $650+ billion military budget that we current have isn’t even remotely necessary for the defense of this nation. They are crying over losing roughly $50 billion of that, still leaving $600 billion for the military.
I wonder how much of that is related to Obama’s regime putting out brochures(?) for wounded military telling them they should ask themselves if it would be better to just die, and spare their families the pain of dealing with long-term disability?
I can’t even say how disgusted I am with what the slimeballs in this regime (and the idiots who put this regime into power the 2nd time; 1st time was deception/coup, the 2nd time was stolen but it couldn’t have happened without enough idiots supporting Obama) have done to our military. It seems like it’s the most selfish bastards in the world taking out the most selfless people in the world, while we all watch. Some of us because we don’t know what else we can do.
We coulda had a country.......
Instead, we have ObamaCommieland and his welfare state.
SOON, WE WILL HAVE NEITHER.
So where else would you make the cuts that would actually save any substantial money? We are not cutting non-discretionary spending like entitlement spending. There is basically nothing left in non-defense discretionary spending to cut that is actually meaningful. It’s the budgetary equivalent of pocket change.
Yep - they paint all government employees with the same broad brush and don't have the brain power to make any distinctions. they espouse conservatism and then suggest liberal "solutions". I can feel for some of them because I have no doubt they are having to deal with unemployment/underemployment and other job issues, but hardship isn't an excuse for dumb.
“People here on FR think this is a good thing.”
Some people wonder why, with a guaranteed $500B budget, the present Defense Department leadership cannot seem to accomplish things that contribute to our defense, such as training soldiers, and deploying aircraft carriers.
DoD budgets are facing a cut of less than 10% per year.
What our DoD leaders are doing is simply lying in hopes of preserving their bureaucracies. They are lying about where our Defense Budget priorities should be, they are cutting high-visibility things so they can pretend that the cuts are worse than they are, and they are exaggerating the real impact of a mere....yes “mere” 10% budget cut.
Since they are bureaucrats first, Americans second, they should be replaced by people who can take $500B and accomplish a reasoned, capable defense of our country and it’s interests.
I suggest there are many aspiring leaders who could accomplish this. The only people we know FOR SURE that cannot accomplish this is the present leadership - so they must go, immediately.
Also, we need Americans who care about the issue of our Defense to also stop repeating the bureaucratic lies.
Rather than focusing on what gets cut, let’s focus on what gets done with $500B in defense spending.
Why do you think the present bureaucrats won’t do this? I’ll tell you - because they’d be exposed for the liars they are.
Gay outreach over combat training, green fuels over much cheaper conventional fuels, police over soldiers....priorities such as that would come glaringly to the surface.
They are lying, and you are repeating the lies.
Unfortunately, I think you're completely correct. I've seen some MASSIVE waste of taxpayer funds over the years. You wouldn't believe how much money is wasted in-theater over in Iraq and Afghanistan. Example: my Brigade Signal Officer took it upon herself to purchase 50+ 7-foot tall server racks for our brigade. Every server in the Brigade wouldn't have filled one of them, let alone 50 of them. They just sat unused in connexes on KAF. And that's just one example of many, many others. This kind of waste is unsustainable, yet, to preserve the nonsense, the brass are going to do what governments do--cut where it hurts first, just to show how unfair it all is, rather than cutting where it needs to be cut.
This is all just a game, and the Soldiers who do their jobs from day to day are going to pay the price for it.
“I have found that out.”
No, you have found that you cannot articulate a coherent argument for what Defense spending should include, instead you parrot the bureaucratic manipulators lies.
“I am told that at least one of them is close to putting his stars on the table. “
Another lie. Not one JCS member will put their stars on the table. Not one senior staffer, not one senior military officer in this budget discussion will quit. Why? because they are bureaucrats first Americans second and they like they position they have, they like to power they wield, and they don’t mind lying to the America they are supposed to defend rather than take the budget they have and articulate an effective plan for the defense of America.
You, at best, are too naive to not parrot the bureaucratic lies.
Really? Those are our only choices? Personally, I would start by gutting the EPA and about a dozen other worthless and or dangerous agencies first. The side benefit would be the return of a robust economy. How about we cut back on the countless muslim outreach programs both at home and abroad? obama wants to give all of the non-military federal employees a raise. There are other places to cut spending without gutting anything that you suggest.
Those are the only choices. Even if we completely *zeroed out* discretionary non-defense spending we’re still in the hole from interest payments, entitlements, and defense spending.
It seems like everyone is a "liar" except you RFEngineer. Seven 4-star Generals who have served this nation with honor, through multiple wars, Purple Hearts, wounds, and heroism are "bureacrats" and "liars."
Perhaps, rather than castigating these military experts (and that's what they are, by definition) with such inflamatory, over the top rhetoric, you should turn that penetrating gaze upon yourself.
Not all these cuts are in DoD. Fifty percent are in discretionary non-defense. There is change in more than one pocket.
Continue big spending for public school teachers, Internet spying, county master plans, idle building inspectors and the Violence Against Women Act, and generally, for enforcement against American freedoms, or our military forces will stay on strike! [Little irony and humor there.]
Who is proposing to cut spending for the new civilian fascism and increase needing spending for our defense? No one. Our nation is morally bankrupt. [Serious and sincere there.]
The Fed is buying up bonds. China still owns a large portion of them. When will the bond collapse commence? The partial repudiations of debt and “haircuts” against bond investors, as are happening in southern Europe?
There is a lot of waste in every large organization, DoD is not exempt. What I have heard is that because of the way the sequestration is written, the cuts this year have to come out of OMN dollars that are used to perform maintenance. The fiscal year is almost half over, and I’ve seen memos (not secret, distributed among the workforce) that outline how the cuts would be accomplished. All 3rd and 4th quarter depot level maintenance on Navy ships and aircraft would be deferred. If this isn’t bluster and actually happens, what happens to the fine folks that work in the shipyards and at the Naval Aviation Depots? These are the guys that know how the complicated systems work and can repair them. Are they sent home? Will they come back? Will the brains of the outfit be back or will you be left with second stringers to get things going again? Who knows? It’s a pretty large impact when you disrupt regular workflow at this level. Not saying it can’t be done, but that there is a lot of uncertainty as to what the actual future impact will be when you try to turn it on again.
I agree that cuts need to be made across the board, not just DoD. Sequestration is like taking a chain saw into surgery. And it’s being done because our elected officials can’t balance a checkbook or pass a budget that can be passed down and planned for at a lower levels.
No, that isn’t all the options! There are thousands of federal agencies that can be cut, furloughed, or closed completely, and there will be little difference in how the nation proceeds. Some of those czars of Obama’s could be finding the double ups, the waste, the no longer needed programs that could be cut.
The military, Medicare, and SS does not need to be at the top of the list. The Dems do this on purpose. They know it touches nerves of the American people.
“They are lying, and you are repeating the lies.”
There are ways to reduce spending and this method isn’t even close to the best way.
The ONLY place they are cutting spending is defense. Heck they are even giving more money to sworn enemies and welfare.
So pucker up and KMA
If that is found unpalatable, the Dept of Ed, and Dept of Energy, the TSA, the DEA, FBI, ATF, HHS, and EPA are an acceptable start; none of the above are found in the Constitution. FHA, Sect 8, WIC, 0Care, and a whole host of gov't entitlement programs need to go. From there, take a look at some of the nonsense that is foisted on the military, such as "green" vehicles and such. - Reducing the deficit.
Repealing the 16th Amendment and taxing consumption vice production would help increase the tax base in a non-punitive manner.....also insuring the illegales "pay their fair share" too.
For good measure, repeal the 17th Amendment so that state legislatures pick their Senators, which will go a long way to cut down on fed.gov using the purse strings to bully the states and enabling the states to actually retain their rights under the 10th Amendment.
No need to undercut the one expenditure under the Constitution that defends to the death all other rights (for those of you quick to point out the 2A, enumerating our God given unalienable right to keep and bear arms, costs the taxpayer nothing as this is an individual right and expense; it is not an expenditure).
Bullshit, typical lib speak. How about cutting the EPA, DEA, and all the other money eating programs that are so dear to our politicians. How about Congress taking a pay cut, how about the fraud of Welfare, money to countries that hate us? Providing defense of our Country and securing our borders is provided in the Constitution, where is it said we should provide men and money to defend other countries? I’m sick of these scare tactics from both parties .
“Seven 4-star Generals who have served this nation with honor, through multiple wars, Purple Hearts, wounds, and heroism are “bureacrats” and “liars.””
If they are saying that a less than 10% cut in the defense budget is “gutting” they are not telling the truth and they are not soldiers anymore, they are bureaucrats.
And not one of them will quit over this like you claimed.
I’m interested in how “truth” correlates with JCS.
“Perhaps, rather than castigating these military experts (and that’s what they are, by definition) with such inflamatory, over the top rhetoric, you should turn that penetrating gaze upon yourself.”
They are trading on their former expertise to try to leverage higher budgets so they get a “revolving door” executive slot at a defense contractor - like most of the rest of their “stars on their shoulder” buddies do when they retire.
For some reason, very few generals have a genuine sense of honor anymore. I don’t know why, but their actions speak louder than your fan-club.
“There are ways to reduce spending and this method isnt even close to the best way.”
When your ox is being gored, it’s never the best way.
“The ONLY place they are cutting spending is defense. Heck they are even giving more money to sworn enemies and welfare.”
You think I don’t want everything else cut too? Start a thread on other cuts. This is a DoD cut thread. I’ll participate.
But just because Defense takes a bigger cut than “something else” doesn’t mean we cut nothing.
“So pucker up and KMA”
Pull your pants up and get your face out of the federal feeding trough. There is work to be done.
“Sequestration is like taking a chain saw into surgery”
Agreed, but that’s all we have to cut off the gangrenous appendage of government right now.
We have to cut something one day. I’m quite sure we’ll get no cuts and “avoid the sequester” like we “avoided the fiscal cliff” and “avoided the debt limit disaster”.
“Pull your pants up and get your face out of the federal feeding trough. There is work to be done.”
Actually I work in the cmomerical sector you ignorant ass.
“Actually I work in the cmomerical sector you ignorant ass.”
You certainly don’t act like it.
After reading many of your posts, I believe you have "issues." Your animosity towards the military runs deeper than a concern over discretionary spending. I don't know if you feel you were burned in your career, a contract, or whatever. But I hope you get over it.
“Your animosity towards the military runs deeper than a concern over discretionary spending.”
You represent the error in thinking - probably deliberate in your case. You think if one does not participate in hyperbole and hysteria regarding minor reductions in military spending representing “gutting” that somehow you are against the military and the common soldier.
Your foray into armchair psychology is best turned towards yourself. Why would you accept obvious glaring lies by the military bureaucracy and supposed “conservatives”? The first one you re-tell is the figment of the “$500B cut”, over 10 years, of course. Then you claimed “2,000,000 jobs could be lost”, and then you claim that somehow General officers on the JCS are “thinking of quitting” over this complete farce of a spending reduction.
How deluded must you be to parrot this ridiculous drivel?
Further, what you fail to recognize, even though I told you, is that honesty in budgeting and capability will PRESERVE military capability for the long-term. Lying and hyperbole now only represents “crying wolf” - so when the time comes for significant cuts our armed services will have some remaining credibility when they object to them.
We should have brought everyone home from Afghanistan 10 years ago.
Afghanistan and Iraq. We win the war in weeks then spend 10 years trying to win the peace. Send the military to win wars. You want peacemakers send the Peace Corps.
Bingo. Same with "nation building".
And it will make next to no difference to the federal deficit. Here's the problem. "Everything else" is chump change. It's like a couple on the edge of bankruptcy refusing to sell their yacht, get rid of their country club membership, and selling their thoroughbred and instead canceling their cable subscription to save money.
You fail to see the total picture. The more that is cut from other budgets, the less cut from the military. Plus, permanent cuts to the waste will not be a factor in the future.
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