The Decline of America [VDH]

National Review ^ | 2/14/2013 | Victor Davis Hanson

[Servant of the Cross]

VDH provides an historical look at the decline and fall of civilizations.

Look no further than the comparison of Hiroshima with Detroit. Democratic socialists running a government are today's nuclear bomb for a city.

[Servant of the Cross]

Correction: DemocRAT socialist. VDH ping.

[G Larry]

“A Democracy will survive until the people discover they are able to vote themselves ever increasing shares of the public treasury.”

Variations of this quote have been around for over 2000 years, yet we’re not sure of it’s true source.

[allendale]

There is no question that Hansen is right. The Age of Obama is the time of decline. The mistake people make is assuming that the end will come with a sudden cataclysm. Actually the decadence and decline began in the 1960’s. The erosion of values and social adhesion has been steady. True Obama has accelerated it, but the our “fall” at least one that even the dolts will recognize is not yet upon us.

[CaptainAmiigaf]

Make the point even stronger. Compare 1945 DETROIT with the 1945 vistas of Berlin, Warsaw, Dresden, Hamburg, Tokyo, and too many others to list.
Many of the photos of today’s Detroit could be shown among the those of a devastated Europe and NO ONE would know the difference. Only the difference in Japanese designs keep them from such a direct exhibit.
Detroit, the “future” of too many American cities. Sad.

[Opinionated Blowhard]

That has been my tag line for years. As Hanson points out so well in this article, its the reasoon many great societies fall. Wealth production is destroyed when the government takes more and more of it to subsidize the unproductive. There is a harsh reality that an affluent society does not want to face —that is that people must face the consequences of their actions, and to suffer from the consequences of their bad decisions. It is what drives them to do better. Are there some people how have “bad luck” and are there others who have wealth they did not work for? Sure. But in large part, over time, people are responsible for the situations they are in. As Hanson states, we are in a situation now where the masses realize they can vote themselves a relatively good life on someone else’s dime.

[US Navy Vet]

There were/are 3 occurances in United States’ History that DIRECTLY contributed to our current decline:
1. Our(founding fathers) acceptance of Human Slavery which led to...
...2. The US Federal Goverment Sponsored and led “War between the US States” which left a festering gash/wound in our national “Psyce” whick will NEVER be totally healed. AND
3. The “Progressives(Liberals)”(Teddy, Woodrow, FDR AND JFK/LBJ).

[TADSLOS]

"The Roman Republic fell, not because of the ambition of Caesar or Augustus, but because it had already long ceased to be in any real sense a republic at all. When the sturdy Roman plebeian, who lived by his own labor, who voted without reward according to his own convictions, and who with his fellows formed in war the terrible Roman legion, had been changed into an idle creature who craved nothing in life save the gratification of a thirst for vapid excitement, who was fed by the state, and who directly or indirectly sold his vote to the highest bidder, then the end of the Republic was at hand, and nothing could save it. The laws were the same as they had been, but the people behind the laws had changed, and so the laws counted for nothing.”

Teddy Roosevelt on the Fall of the Republic

[Theoria]

'Given our unsustainable national debt — nearly $17 trillion and climbing — America is said to be in decline, although we face no devastating plague, nuclear holocaust, or shortage of oil or food.'

The US economy has been using debt to fund the economy and growth for decades. Without the drug of debt, there would be no growth. That is a fundamental problem with our economy and structure; one that our politicians and populace has failed to engage.

[allendale]

Human nature always trumps legalisms. When a culture embraces decadence it ceases to remain vibrant, prosperous and cohesive.

[Sir Napsalot]

Thanks for the VDH ping.

As most of us (even libs, I suspect) can see the decline quite clearly, few can put it like VDH.

This is the last binge on Titanic, even though some have prepared, but circumstances might still sweep us away.

Quite depressing reading from FR, really.

[RedStateRocker]

And in how many of those cases was it the stress and cost of maintaing an empire? There’s a good argument that the Roman Republic fell because that form of government was well suited to a state such as the Republic was in it’s early history, but not such a good form of government for managing a world empire. Sneer all one wishes at the Byzantines, but they went on for just shy of a thousand years after the ostensible ‘fall’ of rome in 476.

I don’t want to pay the taxes necessary to have our boots in Afghanistan, Iraq, Korea, Germany or Japan. I sure as hell don’t want my taxes going to enrich any foreign citizens, anywhere, for any reason.

The desire for Empire, the attitude that we should be the world’s sole superpower, that our way of life is the only way, that any way of structuring a society, gauging morality or running the economy is the only possible good way is EXACTLY the sort of hubris that brought down the Athenians, and is every bit as harmful as any idiocy coming form the Democrats.

[griswold3]

“There are plenty of official proclamations as to how much debt the USA has-$16 Trillion.

But the unofficial debt, using Generally Accepted Accounting Principles (GAAP) now stands at $238 Trillion. Against an annual GDP of approximately $16 Trillion, that means that every dollar of value created by goods and services for the next 15 years is already spent. And that number, by the way, is in today’s dollars.”

http://capitalisteric.wordpress.com/2013/02/07/the-30000-foot-view-of-whats-coming/

[Sir Napsalot]

“Failure accumulates gradually and then its effects become manifest all of a sudden. The slow part is nearly over. ....” (Richard Fernandez, Belmont Club, 2/13/2013) Wretchard was writing about Iran/Hezzbollah/Syria, Pakistan/NoKo and foreign affairs elsewhere.

However, the exact same words can be said about our current State of the Union. As Belmont Clubers like to say the ‘design margin’ had been completely (or almost completely) eroded away.

Not long to wait for "something" to happen now. And why the Feds and Obama Gang are in such a frenzy state.

[Sans-Culotte]

Decline and fall bump.

[VAarea]

It seems more than a coincidence the acceleration of decline in the 1960s, with the Soviet Union's establishment (in the late '50s/early '60s) of the doctrine of the use of subversion vs. more active measures against the West. I suspect whatever seeds they may have planted then are now paying off (too late for them).

[bicyclerepair]

Never before in my life have I EVER had trouble finding a job. Longest unemployment was 5 months.

Can not now if my life depended on it.

[GOPJ]

By any historical marker, the future of Americans has never been brighter.

Not so much anymore... There are countries worth dying for - and this was definitely one of them ... not so much now.

Who wants to send their kids off to fight for Obama and his elite friends - folks skimming the Chicago Way? Or Generals on the 'quiet take' of after retirement high paying jobs... Or large cities - once shining on hillsides - becoming gang infested hellholes?

Once there was pride in our leaders their wisdom at keeping our economy safe. Today lowlife 'leaders' rush to bankrupt the nation while keeping money flowing into their campaign chests. When we object they open our gates and call for freeloaders and illegals to prop up their power.

Ancient Greeks gave up too - they even quit having children. Like Europeans are doing - and we're starting to do... Cultural suicide. Happens.

[VRW Conspirator]

bfl

[longtermmemmory]

hindsight is 20/20 what about a plan for the future?

Themisticles knew what had to be done and did it.

(he convinced Leonidas)

We are fighting with paper cuts, what is the solution?

We are using debt as currency.
What happens to and what do you do with the takers when their obamaphones are gone, ebt cards are empty, and NYC garbage is piling up?