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What Exactly Is... The Militia?
The Tea Party Tribune ^ | 2/21/13 | Jim Funkhouser

Posted on 02/21/2013 8:28:27 PM PST by HMS Surprise

Certainly the militia is the people, for what else could it possibly be? Here’s the definitive quote from one of our founding fathers: ”I ask, sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people, except for a few public officials.” — George Mason, in Debates in the Virginia Convention.

Consider the question: Does combining the right of free speech with the right to assemble diminish either? Of course not. And the same is true when you combine the right to assemble with the right to be armed. Meeting with rifles in hand for the purpose of training in their proper use is exactly what “well-regulated” means.

In fact, the Supreme Court supercedes Joe Biden on this issue. In U.S. v Miller the Supremes decided that a sawed-off shotgun is not a military weapon, so it is therefore not protected by the 2nd amendment. The clear implication is that only military-style weapons are protected. The very weapons politicians are trying to ban, are the only weapons that the founders thought worth defending with a constitutional amendment.

(Excerpt) Read more at teapartytribune.com ...


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: 2ndamendment; constitution; firearms; guncontrol; militia; secondamendment
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The "M" word...
1 posted on 02/21/2013 8:28:29 PM PST by HMS Surprise
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To: HMS Surprise

Who is the Militia???

You ARE!

Armed or amputee.


2 posted on 02/21/2013 8:34:51 PM PST by Scrambler Bob ( Concerning bo -- that refers to the president. If I capitalize it, I mean the dog.)
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To: Scrambler Bob

True that. But if we are to set things right we need to stop avoiding the word, and the deed.


3 posted on 02/21/2013 8:39:19 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: HMS Surprise

Of course the Militia is “the people”
And of course it starts at the local level.

When people who know one another come together for to discuss community and speak earnestly, we generally come to an amicable resolution as to governance which generally falls far short of threat of arms.
We talk and we sort things out at the local level.

When people at in DC want to reinterpret what the militia is, and declare it a military force controlled by the federal government, to be used against the people.
That usurps us at the local level.

Rick Perry is so correct when it comes to 10th amendment and 2nd amendment rights.


4 posted on 02/21/2013 8:40:29 PM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: Scrambler Bob

What we need to do is organize “Our Militia” and prepare for what is destined to happen shortly.

I suggest each person who has the cahonies to organize such a Militia stand and take control.

I offer myself to organize a Militia for the Verde Vally Region (Arizona).

Send me your name and telephone or email if you have what it takes to defend what is left of a once great nation.


5 posted on 02/21/2013 8:41:10 PM PST by jongaltsr
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To: mylife

I like Rick Perry, but I would love to see just one national political figure stand up and ask for local militia units to begin forming.


6 posted on 02/21/2013 8:43:29 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: jongaltsr

I would start with family, friends, neighbors, co-workers, etc. If you have a sheriff who understands inform him of your intentions. I suspect any Arizona sheriff would be supportive. The American Legion, VFWs, local gun shops, and gun shows are great recruiting vehicles.


7 posted on 02/21/2013 8:46:49 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: jongaltsr

Do it by organizing YOUR LOCAL officials.

They work for YOU! Not DC!

And While DC denizens seem to be foreign to us, They also are supposed to work for us.

So let’s get tough at the local level politically, Challenge these chucklehead tyrants via the process.

And of course, keep your powder dry.


8 posted on 02/21/2013 8:48:18 PM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: HMS Surprise

The founders had a mortal fear of a standing army. They did not want one. They wanted the army to coalesce from armed citizens when needed. This on-demand army is the militia. There can be no militia without armed citizens.


9 posted on 02/21/2013 8:50:05 PM PST by E. Pluribus Unum ("Somebody has to be courageous enough to stand up to the bullies." --Dr. Ben Carson)
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To: HMS Surprise

Amen.
This is a long war.

Ya got to check out the city council meetings to know the local players.


10 posted on 02/21/2013 8:50:33 PM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: HMS Surprise
”I ask, sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people, except for a few public officials.” — George Mason, in Debates in the Virginia Convention.

Uh-oh. The "P" word. The "P" that can't be trusted with AR-15s and large cap magazines.

11 posted on 02/21/2013 8:52:05 PM PST by sauropod (I will not comply)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

The Constitution actually specifically forbids the formation of a standing army for more than two years. This is why we have been in a constant state of war since 1945. It’s my opinion that the militia has fallen by the wayside precisely because Ft. Campbell, Ft. Benning, Ft. Hood, Ft. Lewis, etc., have been filling the vacuum.


12 posted on 02/21/2013 8:54:32 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: HMS Surprise

Texas is a Local Militia unit.

Abbott and Perry have been poking DC in the eye for ages.

We have others in this great nation too.

God Bless the people that defend the 10th amendment and protect the 2nd.


13 posted on 02/21/2013 8:54:53 PM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: sauropod

That is an interesting observation. I don’t think Joe Biden is going to be hanging out on his balcony without his shotgun though. Put an “R” by his name and he would forever be remembered as the most ridiculous political figure in American History... Well, maybe Johnson (either one) tops him.


14 posted on 02/21/2013 8:57:49 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: HMS Surprise
If you ask the leftards, they would say....vigilantes, hanging mobs,
the perpetual view the useful idiots take when they think of...'us'


PS: Notice any...specifics' about this pic?
15 posted on 02/21/2013 8:59:00 PM PST by 45semi (A police state is always preceded by a nanny state...)
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To: mylife

Texas has a home guard.. I believe. But I would argue that this needs to be expanded greatly. Yes, Texas is our Alamo.


16 posted on 02/21/2013 8:59:49 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: mylife

We have no local officials. If there are any they are spineless and make no attempt to organize or stand up and speak their piece.

I have nothing to lose.

I think others fear losing what they have left.

I don’t care any longer except to save what I remember America was - but no longer is.......!


17 posted on 02/21/2013 9:00:45 PM PST by jongaltsr
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To: mylife

We have no local officials. If there are any they are spineless and make no attempt to organize or stand up and speak their piece.

I have nothing to lose.

I think others fear losing what they have left.

I don’t care any longer except to save what I remember America was - but no longer is.......!


18 posted on 02/21/2013 9:01:01 PM PST by jongaltsr
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To: 45semi

Yes, all of the rubes are pasty white sub-humans.


19 posted on 02/21/2013 9:02:22 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: HMS Surprise

I would prefer Tx be our Goliad

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Goliad


20 posted on 02/21/2013 9:03:05 PM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: jongaltsr

Run for office and stop acting defenseless and wild.


21 posted on 02/21/2013 9:05:47 PM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: mylife

Draw the lines again and I suspect that a Civil War redux would have a different conclusion. Number one reason why: The leftists have been disarming themselves for 60 years.


22 posted on 02/21/2013 9:07:11 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: HMS Surprise; All
You have to make them from scratch.

Photo & Video Sharing by SmugMug

Photo & Video Sharing by SmugMug

23 posted on 02/21/2013 9:07:26 PM PST by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: mylife

“A Walk in the Sun” was about the Texas National Guard in Italy Great movie


24 posted on 02/21/2013 9:07:30 PM PST by Insigne123
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To: HMS Surprise

Biden lives in a rather large compound in the Wilmington area. Good for me but not for thee.

The man needs a dog walking license for his brain. It sure doesn’t live in his crainium.


25 posted on 02/21/2013 9:08:21 PM PST by sauropod (I will not comply)
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To: HMS Surprise
BINGO!
and almost all members of that most hated of demographics!
26 posted on 02/21/2013 9:09:35 PM PST by 45semi (A police state is always preceded by a nanny state...)
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To: HMS Surprise

American Legion and VFW talk tough but most were beaten down long time ago. Few willing to really fight.

Our Sheriff is non committal. Don’t know what to make of him as to what side of the fence he is on. Think is is just waiting to see which side comes out on top.

Gun Shops are the main source of prospects. DEFINATELY. They have balls and plenty of ammo to expend.


27 posted on 02/21/2013 9:10:34 PM PST by jongaltsr
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To: jongaltsr

Who’s your sheriff? Time for POLITE phone calls...I’ll make one.


28 posted on 02/21/2013 9:13:55 PM PST by Bradís Gramma (Psalm 83)
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To: jongaltsr

Forward the article along to your sheriff.


29 posted on 02/21/2013 9:14:03 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: HMS Surprise

True enough, And Libs think We are at the disadvantage.
They honestly think that we have no understanding of the nuance of law.

I would argue that we have a higher understanding of law and that we rebel when the law is not suitable to reasonable men.


30 posted on 02/21/2013 9:15:11 PM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: sauropod

Yeah, it’s interesting that he is asking his wife to fire shotguns off of the balcony. I suppose the secret service will be well within range when she does.


31 posted on 02/21/2013 9:15:37 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: SWAMPSNIPER

Ammo seems to be the issue now, and that may have been the plan all along. Guns aren’t much use without a thousand rounds or so.


32 posted on 02/21/2013 9:17:04 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: Insigne123

I will look that up.


33 posted on 02/21/2013 9:18:00 PM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: jongaltsr

There are already groups training across the nation that are networked. Many have LEO and military personnel tie-ins. Not spoken of much for obvious reasons especially since the NSA facility domestic spying center in Bluffdale is about to go online. It’s reportedly going to be more focused on spying internally on domestic threats than foreign ones. Draw your own conclusions.


34 posted on 02/21/2013 9:19:03 PM PST by jsanders2001
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To: mylife

And the nuances of the web. Gotta love the internet...

http://newyorkcityguns.com/2013/02/what-exactly-is-the-militia/


35 posted on 02/21/2013 9:20:11 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: Insigne123
Chris Rea~ Texas
36 posted on 02/21/2013 9:20:46 PM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: jsanders2001

I spoke with a gentleman a few days ago... His nephew works for .. won’t say.. but the nephew told this man to turn his phone off, aim it at the wall, turn it on after a bit, and call him back. The nephew turned the phone on independently, turned the camera on, and could see whatever the phone was aimed at... while it was supposedly off. Drones, smart phones, federal clones.. I know all of this, but trust me because I KNOW this also, there are people working within the government who are perfectly willing to keep us updated especially if certain lines are crossed.


37 posted on 02/21/2013 9:26:28 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: HMS Surprise

23 counties?

That is the Militia in action.
We are currently losing the war by not using more legal challenges.

Sometimes I hate the slow slog of Americas system, but it is brilliant, and it ensures that no one will just swoop in and take over.

We feel a bit hopeless with Obama running rough shod on us and many are whipped and beaten, but if you can just get that local militia to rise up...

That neighbor, that local city council, the mayor..

Pretty soon Obamas inbox is getting bombarded.

Keep up the fight, hope for the bes,t and prepare for the worst.


38 posted on 02/21/2013 9:28:39 PM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: HMS Surprise

In any debate, one should define the terms used in the debate: \
Thusly:
Definition of to “KEEP” ‘ to preserve and maintain.. TO GUARD; DEFEND
to “KEEP” `means NOT TO LET GO ONE`S POSSESSION OR CONTROL’
“KEEPER”,n., “one who watches, GUARDS, maintains”

to “BEAR: 1. to support and move; CARRY.
2. to be equipped furnished ..as to BEAR A SWORD.
3. to be directed; to be pointed, as TO PLANT GUNS TO BEAR UPON AS TRENCH’”

‘Thus 2 and 3 above appear refer to BEAR as associated with WAR

if the two defintions are combined we have”

to keep and bear arms=

To preserve arms, to maintain arms, to guard [with arms], to DEFEND with arms;
to NOT LET GO ONE`S POSSESSION OF ARMS OR CONTROL OF ARMS’
TO WATCH WITH ARMS, TO GUARD WITH ARMS, TO MAINTAIN WITH ARMS
TO BEAR ARMS = TO SUPPORT ARMS, TO MOVE ARMS, TO CARRY ARMS
TO BEAR ARMS = TO BE EQUIPPED WITH ARMS, TO BE FURNISHED WITH ARMS;
TO BEAR ARMS = TO DIRECT ARMS, TO POINT ARMS UPON A MILITARY TARGET
‘TO FURNISH ARM[S]= “TO PROVISION FOR EFFECTIVE ACTION FOR OPERATION, ESPECIALLY IN WAR”

ALL above Wiebster`s Dictionary 1887

Therefore “to keep ARMS” MEANS NOT TO LOSE CONTROL OF= ergo SO-CALLED Gun Control’ is a violation of The Second Amendment.
“’TO BEAR ARMS IS A TERM OF WAR-
TO KEEP ARMS IS IMPLICIT IN “TO BEAR ARMS”

Historical examples of WAR TERM ‘BEARING ARMS”

“An account of the numbers of men able to bear arms in the ...”
by
Thomas Carte
An Account
England: 1744
PREFACE May 1 1743

“As all appearances bid us soon expect a war with France,
and the accounts given of the condition and abilities
of that kingdom differ prodigiously,
according to the different views,
inclinations or prepossessions of our
political writers, it is thought proper to publish
to the world the following accounts:
as well as the numbers of men able to BEAR ARMS,
and fit to be employed in the service of the war...”


‘We notice also in the Colony records, 1680, “Srj.John Barker was freed
from BEARING ARMS for the wounds in the late war.”
p17.

p.239 “Peter Collamore (early Collamer) was on the list of those liable
to BEAR ARMS in Scituate 1643.”

p.118 ‘Military Affairs’ “In 1643 the Colony Court ordered a list of men liable to BEAR ARMS that year.”

“History of Scituate, Massachusetts: from its first settlement til 1831”
by Samuel deane, 1831


p.168,
‘No freeman shall be compelled to BEAR ARMS, nor pay an equivalent therefore,
except in times of exigency or WAR.”

p. “Every man should be a citizen, and every citizen a soldier; and then he would be best able to defend
his country and his own property.”

p.180. “The right of conscience in relation to BEARING ARMS is a scared right.
It is equally sacred with the right to self-defence.”

“But what is meant of our militia? Why, when he spoke of them, he meant American citizens, accustomed to the use of arms;
not in the camp or in the field, but American citizens accustomed to use THEIR ARMS, and to all that manual dexterity
which could only be gained by long practice; not field maneouvering and marching, but a perfect knowledge of the rifle
and the musket. Such a use of the rifle that you could take the eye out of a squirrel on the highest tree. This was in all,
and beyond this there was no necessity to go in this country. In this the soldiers of our country had a superiority of those
of any other. Ask the British officers who were engaged in the last war whether there was no superiority in our troops
in this respect. WEll, was this to be learned at military musters? ....But when it is necessary, the American citizen is
always ready to BEAR ARMS without this militia training. how was it before in the last war in this State? [War of 1812]
Were their any militia trainings to make the cititzens of Pennsylvania prepared for service?
Not At all-they were ready to meet the enemy in the east and in the west. How was it in Tennessee before the Battle of New Orleans.
Did the men who fought that battle perform militia service to prepare them for it?
No sir- it was known that they did not. Were the militia of Bunker Hill, prepared for the events of that day
of glory by previous trainings as militia? No sir.’ p183

p.79 “He thought, too, that we ought not to prohibit aliens who had made this their adopted country,
from BEARING ARMS in its defence in time of WAR.”

WEARING ARMS< BEARING ARMS
Volunteers#War of 1812

“Governor Synder, 1815- Our militia and volunteers were actually engage with the enemy..”p.99
‘...if we destroyed the militia system, we did not indeed take away the right of the people to bear arms,
but we destroyed the inclination, the habit of WEARING ARMS; and such was not his [Gov. Snyder]sentiment
as to what ought to be the condition of things in a country like ours.
He believed that not only right, but the habit of WEARING ARMS was essential to freemen,
and to the preservation of the liberty of freemen. This was the principle inserted into
the Constitution of the United States; and if we did away with this, the effect would be to destroy
the principle and the feeling altogether.”-p.100

p.105. “The terms of the Constitution he need not refer to; and the amendment now under discussion
was simply an AFFIRMANCE OF A POWER,-THAT THE RIGHT OF A PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.”
“Who fought the Battles, of Lexington,Bunker Hill and Saratoga?
...Who saved Baltimore? ... Who obtained the victory at New Orleans?
These militia, trained and disciplined in their own houses;
not practised in the field, but BRINGING THEIR GUNS WHICH THEY WERE TAUGHT TO USE WHEN CHILDREN.”p.111

viz “
“Proceedings and Debates of the Convention of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, Vol. 4, by the Pennsylvania
Constitutional Convention, 1837-8


The Second Amendment ‘BEAR ARMS” has nothing to do with defending your home or person; au contraire- to BEAR ARMS is a PURELY TERM of WAR
as demonstrated in these historical facts:
O`Callaghan, “Hist. Of New Netherland”, Vol.2, p.134, `Provisional Order for the Government, Preservation and Peopling of New Netherland`

1650`s New Netherland: also cf. ibid., p.430 “the town contained 40 men capable of BEARING ARMS” ==================

also cf. ibid., p.521 “Staten Island is a two good (Dutch) miles from the fort (Amsterdam). It was settled on the south side, out of sight of the FORT, by ten or twelve men capable of BEARING ARMS.” ========

1656,1664 “At the commencement of Stuyvesant’s administration, the number of persons capable of BEARING ARMS is stated to have been between two hundred and fifty and three hundred, in and around the capital.3 Including Rensselaerswyck, this would give a population of two thousand souls. In 1664, the number is estimated at “ full ten thousand.”4 New of New Amsterdam contained, in 1656, when first surveyed by dam. Capt. de Koninck, one hundred and twenty houses, and one thousand souls. The former increased in 1660, when a map of the capital was made, to over three hundred and fifty,5 whilst the population augmented, in 1664, to fifteen hundred. Of these, not quite two hundred and fifty were male adults; the balance, between twelve and thirteen hundred, consisted of women, and children below eighteen years of age.” ibid, p.540

Thus the second Amendment means to bear arms means to be ready for miitary action; in this case, every citizen has the right to take military action for the security of the state [=the PEOPLE], [which is what Americans did in 1775-1781 against tyranny.] The other pre-consititution state constitutions also say KEEP AND BEAR ARMS, so the “Keep” is understood in the Second Amendment since it was explicitly stated in pre-existing state constitutions.


39 posted on 02/21/2013 9:31:13 PM PST by bunkerhill7 ("The Second Amendment has no limits on firepower"-NY State Senator Marchione.)
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To: bunkerhill7

True that. We don’t “bear arms” when someone is entering the domicile; we come out firing. And all militia are expected to provide their own rifle for a reason... so that they will always be handy.


40 posted on 02/21/2013 9:35:27 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: bunkerhill7

This needs a digest version...

““But what is meant of our militia? Why, when he spoke of them, he meant American citizens, accustomed to the use of arms;
not in the camp or in the field, but American citizens accustomed to use THEIR ARMS, and to all that manual dexterity
which could only be gained by long practice; not field maneouvering and marching, but a perfect knowledge of the rifle
and the musket. Such a use of the rifle that you could take the eye out of a squirrel on the highest tree. This was in all,
and beyond this there was no necessity to go in this country. In this the soldiers of our country had a superiority of those
of any other. Ask the British officers who were engaged in the last war whether there was no superiority in our troops
in this respect. WEll, was this to be learned at military musters? ....But when it is necessary, the American citizen is
always ready to BEAR ARMS without this militia training. how was it before in the last war in this State? [War of 1812]
Were their any militia trainings to make the cititzens of Pennsylvania prepared for service?
Not At all-they were ready to meet the enemy in the east and in the west. How was it in Tennessee before the Battle of New Orleans.
Did the men who fought that battle perform militia service to prepare them for it?
No sir- it was known that they did not. Were the militia of Bunker Hill, prepared for the events of that day
of glory by previous trainings as militia? No sir.’ p183”


41 posted on 02/21/2013 9:38:42 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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To: bunkerhill7
Nicely done
42 posted on 02/21/2013 9:45:07 PM PST by MileHi ( "It's coming down to patriots vs the politicians." - ovrtaxt)
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To: HMS Surprise

YES 7 of my ancestors brought their own muskets to Bunker Hill; one was 70 years old. 7 others rushed to Saratoga in 1777 with their own muskets and pitchforks [automatic bayonet weapons]. They were farmers from Massachusetts.


43 posted on 02/21/2013 9:46:20 PM PST by bunkerhill7 ("The Second Amendment has no limits on firepower"-NY State Senator Marchione.)
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To: HMS Surprise
p183

Who was p183?

44 posted on 02/21/2013 9:48:13 PM PST by MileHi ( "It's coming down to patriots vs the politicians." - ovrtaxt)
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To: MileHi

p.183
“Proceedings and Debates of the Convention of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania”, Vol. 4, by the Pennsylvania
Constitutional Convention, 1837-8


45 posted on 02/21/2013 9:51:23 PM PST by bunkerhill7 ("The Second Amendment has no limits on firepower"-NY State Senator Marchione.)
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To: jsanders2001

I know the cost and the risks of being openly defiant and that is the only way I want to finish out my days if I must.

If I fight face to face with the enemy or as liberals like - by stabbing you in the back - either way I will go out honestly.


46 posted on 02/21/2013 9:53:04 PM PST by jongaltsr
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To: jsanders2001

I know the cost and the risks of being openly defiant and that is the only way I want to finish out my days if I must.

If I fight face to face with the enemy or as liberals like - by stabbing you in the back - either way I will go out honestly.


47 posted on 02/21/2013 9:53:17 PM PST by jongaltsr
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To: HMS Surprise

We lost the war of 1812, well it actually became a pissing contest and we backed down as we did not have the support to see it through materially.

Still, Commodore Oliver Hazzard Perry is one of my Heroes.

He fought against the Brits and the Expatriates that fled to Canada and held allegiance to Britain.

He worked like a mule building ships, fighting battles on the great lakes and in the end took a draw on politics

Oliver Hazzard Perry was the militia.


48 posted on 02/21/2013 9:54:09 PM PST by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: HMS Surprise
It's still being made, just can't keep up with demand.

It's obvious that some people are hoarding, hoping to get rich at a later date. They should be shot!

49 posted on 02/21/2013 9:56:08 PM PST by SWAMPSNIPER (The Second Amendment, a Matter of Fact, Not a Matter of Opinion)
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To: bunkerhill7

Today they would have either an SKS (best option for beginners), an AR-15, or some other semi-auto military style rifle. The recent undoing of law enforcement in Southern California illustrates just how useful these weapons are in an urban enviroment. Ten men with 9mm handguns are a problem, ten men with accurate semi-auto rifles are a MAJOR problem. You can’t even peek your head around the corner from 4 blocks away if you know someone is walking around the neighborhood with a AR. This is precisely why they cannot cotton these types of weapons in the hands of freemen. Such as these CANNOT be subdued without tremendous effort.. Just sayin’.


50 posted on 02/21/2013 9:58:17 PM PST by HMS Surprise (Chris Christie can STILL go straight to hell.)
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