Cardinal Dolan finds common ground with Obama on guns

I get what you are saying. It totally astounds me how the clergy,the GOP, and interestingly enough the blacks don’t know how to get the better of liberals. It makes sense to us as FRiends but ‘they’ just don’t get it. For instance: black people know that gun control laws were aimed at them thoughout American history yet the rats are doing it now with impunity. Blacks just will not hold the rats accountable. Amazing that they just enjoy the plantation that much.

Don’t get in my way on the road to heaven....I won’t get in yours.

No time to re-argue what God, the sword and empty pews has already decided.

Go with God and go armed.

“No time to re-argue what God, the sword and empty pews has already decided”

Tell over a BILLION CATHOLICS about those EMPTY PEWS.
Write Jimmy Swaggard and let him know how empty those pews are.

Peace friend. Peace. Your argument is not with me.

Me and mine will let you be Catholic and follow your church precepts until Hell falls.

Obama will not. He makes war on you.

Practicing Catholics like conservative churches are the new Jews for the next Holocaust if you haven’t figured it out. Catholics just happen to be the biggest nail that needs hammered. First marginalize you....done. Then mock you....done. Generate hatred against you....done. Isolate you from your natural support....done, which by the way you are doing a great job of by pissing my kind off. And then comes the train rides to the east for resettlement while classic musics plays in the background.

Dolan is not alone in his call to surrender arms. The US Council of Bishops has long been on record as favoring guns for police and military only. Other Catholic bodies and personages saying the same thing include Tommaso Di Ruzza at the Pontifical Council for Justice and Peace.

Gun control: Church firmly, quietly opposes firearms for civilians http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/1100159.htm

“However, (while) armed defense is something appropriate for nations, not for all individual citizens in a state where rule of law is effective” said Di Ruzza.

Hmmmmm. Like my fathers, I and my my little Bible church will continue, using one of your terms, “with a show of hands” in conformance with God’s will, to be dissenters still from the will of our “betters” who have their private line to God.

Rome it seems is eager to grovel before yet another new Caesar. Have your BILLION Catholic brethern in their brimming pews and absent the burden of a Baptist Swaggart’s sin.....a send a message to your leadership.

FREEDOM!

But that isn’t the way the Catholic Church works is it? Rules come down with the claimed force of God. Gee, makes it kind of hard to argue policy doesn’t it?

Catholics will have to make an INDIVIDUAL choice in this or surrender their arms when the new Caesar’s call comes.

Sounds like dissent to me. Sounds like being Christian.

The Catholic Church has been putting up with heretics and forces of evil that want to destroy the Church for the last 2,000 years. Jesus predicted every bit of this. He said if they hate me they will hate you. The Catholic Church started the pro-life movement in this country when abortion was ruled legal. 99% of protestant churches went along with the ruling. Protestant churches allow homosexuals and women to become “pastors”. Still many protestant faiths could care less about protecting unborn children. The Catholic Church does not base it’s doctrine on a show of hands like the majority of protestant faiths, it bases it’s doctrine on the never-changing Holy Bible. For the first 1,600 years the only Christians were Catholic. That is the way God intended his Church to be. Catholic. The Catholic Church is the truth whether you want to acknowledge it or not. It is the only faith started by Jesus himself. All other started by a mortal man. End of story.

And Chairman Obummber hates the Catholic Church because the Catholic Church is the truth. No abortion of any kind, no sodomite priests, no ordination of women. Obummer bit off more than he can chew when he went to war with the Catholic Church. The Supreme Court will strike down his assault on religious freedom. Mark it down. By the way I don’t like Dolan. I consider him a politician. I prefer bishops like Cardinal Raymond Burke and Archbishop Chaput, both as conservative as they come and they would not up with heretics like Cuomo, Biden and the rest of the cafeteria catholic politicians. They would excommunicate their sorry asses.

John Calvin put his doctrinal enemy Servetus to death at the stake and fire.

Not accurate. While he did exert considerable influence in Geneva and appeared as an expert witness against Servetus at the trial, Calvin was not a member of the City Council and did not have the power or authority to personally impose a death sentence for what was then a capital crime. Calvin actually sought, unsuccessfully, to mitigate the death sentence to the less painful beheading. It should also be noted that in the spirit of the age Servetus had already been sentenced to death by the Roman Catholic inquisition.

Calvin and Servetus. It is sometimes said that John Calvin burned Michael Servetus at the stake. Servetus was burned at the stake just outside Geneva on October 27, 1553. John Calvin had some connection with the affair, and the part he played is not excusable in the light of the twentieth century, but it is not accurate to say that Calvin did the burning. Let us look at the facts.
Michael Servetus was a Spaniard with a brilliant but erractic mind. He renounced Roman Catholicism, but did not embrace Protestantism. He was a prolific writer and wrote vehemently against some of the most chedrished doctrines of Christianity. Both Catholics and Protestants considered his writings not only heretical but horribly blasphemous.
In 1553 Servetus was arrested by the Roman Catholic authorities in Vienne, France, and sentenced to be burned. While awaiting execution he escaped, and went direct to Geneva. With all the world before him, why did he go to Geneva when he had been warned to stay away? He knew that Calvin had many bitter enemies, and probably knew that at that particular moment the majority of the City Council were opposed to Calvin. The City Council had banished him once, and might be induced to do it again. Servetus probably went to Geneva to ally himself with the enemies of Calvin and thus help to overthrow Calvin and his work. When Calvin heard of the presence of Servetus in Geneva he reported the matter to the City Council. Bear in mind that Calvin was not a member of the City Council and that the majority of the Council were opposed to him. The Council arrested Servetus and put him on trial for heresy and blasphemy. John Calvin appeard as a witness against him.
After a long trial the City Council found Servetus guilty of heresy and blasphemy, and sentenced him to be burned. Accoring to the Old Testament, blasphemy was punishable with death. John Calvin urged the Council not to burn Servetus, but to take a more humane method of executing him. The Council refused. The whole story is a sad one, and Calvin does not appear at his best in it, but we should judge him by the light of the century in which he lived. The large majority of both Protestants and Catholics in that century approved of the death penalty for heresy and blasphemy.
http://capthk.com/2009/07/16/john-calvin-and-michael-servetus/

He reminded his readers that he is no expert on the particulars of gun control legislation, but he maintained that “there can be no denying that, in the wake of Newtown, Aurora, Blacksburg, Tucson, Columbine, and almost countless other horrific and senseless deaths by guns, that something must be done.”

I would suggest that the Bishop do something that lies in his own competence - deny the Sacraments to pro-abort politicians. Ratifying anything that Obama says make Dolan look silly. He needs to fight the fire that's closest to him - the broad based and relentless attack underway against First Amendment religious liberty.

He reminded his readers that he is no expert on the particulars of gun control legislation, but he maintained that “there can be no denying that, in the wake of Newtown, Aurora, Blacksburg, Tucson, Columbine, and almost countless other horrific and senseless deaths by guns, that something must be done.”

He shoulda left it at that: "I don't know nothin'`'bout no legislation, but (glances upowards, wrings hands) somebody do sumpthin'!"

The #1 worst fault of our pink-faced, causelessly smiling USCCB bishops (other than the pink faces and the smiles) is this urgent, restless sense that they've got to say somethng about everything.

Just do your job, OK?

Hint:

Thank you for the Reformed apologetics interpretation.

Here is a more neutral statement of the facts.

“Meaning to flee to Italy, Servetus inexplicably stopped in Geneva, where Calvin and his Reformers had denounced him. On 13 August, he attended a sermon by Calvin at Geneva. He was arrested after the service[22] and again imprisoned. All his property was confiscated. Servetus claimed during this judgement he was arrested at an inn at Geneva. French Inquisitors asked that Servetus be extradited to them for execution. Calvin wanted to show himself as firm in defense of Christian orthodoxy as his usual opponents. “He was forced to push the condemnation of Servetus with all the means at his command.”[22] Calvin’s delicate health meant he did not personally appear against Servetus.[23] Nicholas de la Fontaine played the more active role in Servetus’s prosecution and the listing of points that condemned him.

At his trial, Servetus was condemned on two counts, for spreading and preaching Nontrinitarianism and anti-paedobaptism (anti-infant baptism).[24] Of paedobaptism Servetus had said, “It is an invention of the devil, an infernal falsity for the destruction of all Christianity.”[25] In the case the procureur général (chief public prosecutor) added some curious sounding accusations in the form of inquiries—the most odd sounding perhaps being, “whether he has married, and if he answers that he has not, he shall be asked why, in consideration of his age, he could refrain so long from marriage.” To this oblique imputation about his sexuality, Servetus replied that rupture (inguinal hernia) had long since made him incapable of that particular sin. Another offensive question was “whether he did not know that his doctrine was pernicious, considering that he favours Jews and Turks, by making excuses for them, and if he has not studied the Koran in order to disprove and controvert the doctrine and religion that the Christian churches hold, together with other profane books, from which people ought to abstain in matters of religion, according to the doctrine of St. Paul.”

Calvin believed Servetus deserving of death on account of what he termed as his “execrable blasphemies”.[26] Calvin expressed these sentiments in a letter to Farel, written about a week after Servetus’ arrest, in which he also mentioned an exchange with Servetus. Calvin wrote:

...after he [Servetus] had been recognized, I thought he should be detained. My friend Nicolas summoned him on a capital charge, offering himself as a security according to the lex talionis. On the following day he adduced against him forty written charges. He at first sought to evade them. Accordingly we were summoned. He impudently reviled me, just as if he regarded me as obnoxious to him. I answered him as he deserved... of the man’s effrontery I will say nothing; but such was his madness that he did not hesitate to say that devils possessed divinity; yea, that many gods were in individual devils, inasmuch as a deity had been substantially communicated to those equally with wood and stone. I hope that sentence of death will at least be passed on him; but I desired that the severity of the punishment be mitigated.[27]

As Servetus was not a citizen of Geneva, and legally could at worst be banished, the government, in an attempt to find some plausible excuse to disregard this legal reality, had consulted with other Swiss Reformed cantons (Zürich, Bern, Basel, Schaffhausen.) They universally favoured his condemnation and suppression of his doctrine, but without saying how that should be accomplished.[28] Martin Luther had condemned his writing in strong terms. Servetus and Philip Melanchthon had strongly hostile views of each other. The party called the “Libertines”, who were generally opposed to anything and everything John Calvin supported, were in this case strongly in favour of the execution of Servetus at the stake (while Calvin urged that he be beheaded instead). In fact, the council that condemned Servetus was presided over by Perrin (a Libertine) who ultimately on 24 October sentenced Servetus to death by burning for denying the Trinity and infant baptism.[29] When Calvin requested that Servetus be executed by decapitation as a traitor rather than by fire as a heretic, Farel, in a letter of 8 September, chided him for undue lenience.[30] The Geneva Council refused his request. On 27 October 1553 Servetus was burned at the stake just outside Geneva with what was believed to be the last copy of his book chained to his leg. Historians record his last words as: “Jesus, Son of the Eternal God, have mercy on me.”[31]

Calvin agreed that those whom the ruling religious authorities determined to be heretics should be punished:

Whoever shall maintain that wrong is done to heretics and blasphemers in punishing them makes himself an accomplice in their crime and guilty as they are. There is no question here of man’s authority; it is God who speaks, and clear it is what law he will have kept in the church, even to the end of the world. Wherefore does he demand of us a so extreme severity, if not to show us that due honor is not paid him, so long as we set not his service above every human consideration, so that we spare not kin, nor blood of any, and forget all humanity when the matter is to combat for His glory.[32]

John Locke, Toleration and Early Enlightenment Culture. Cambridge Studies in Early Modern British History...and others via Wiki

Caesar co-oped and created the Catholic church from whole cloth in the 4th century for his use and its leadership has been handmaiden to tyranny far too often ever since.

As to heretics.....well...there are continuously existing Christian bodies such as the Coptics and Nestorians and Assyrians who split about the time the Bishop of Rome was crowned by Caesar as vicar and pontiff....body and bridge...an act of man...not God. Then of course we have the Orthodox Christians who also up and left over West vs East...lots of old timey guys dispute the Pope’s claims to the kingdom keys.

Who are the heretics? Got to smile on that one every time.

Ask your priest why the curtain was ripped in the Temple the instant of Christ’s death on the Cross. NO MORE PRIESTS! No one between man and God. NO ONE! Bow to no one but Lord Jesus. No more secrets...the truth sets us free.

The “keys” were given to all believers in the church, not one, and certainly not pretenders elected by a show of hands as you like to call it....a conclave. It is politics, not prophecy that drives Rome.

If Peter were here....I would be the first man by his side sword drawn...but he ain’t here and no Pope is Peter. Peter was a man, not a capon altar boy and book mouse.

The Catholic leadership contort one verse in Mathew like Schumer and Pelosi rework the Second Amendment to fit a worldly narrative and need.

1st and 2nd Timothy and Acts say nothing of church government beyond the local body of Christ. Deacons and Bishops are to be men of and in the local church...not celibate princes of an earthly power arrayed in Roman Senatorial Purple.

The nonsense talk on abortion is just that, impotent anger not even shaded with a whiff the truth. The evangelicals are the hard core church militant on abortion...not the Catholic who continued to give sacrament to murderous apostates like Teddy Kennedy and Tip O’Neal.....to get along and not rock the boat.

Like Rome, most leadership of the old line protestant churches have been co-opted, de-nutted, and emasculated much like the Catholic church buggering little boys and hiding it.

Satan howls in laughter when he can so easily mislead a whole flock by turning its shepherds be they Catholic, Methodist, Lutheran, or whatever.

So, more importantly...what did the Pope say about you and me keeping our guns when you asked him?

Maybe his local reps on this side of the water will get back to you on it.

Will you turn your arms when they say to? If not, still sounds like dissent to me. Welcome to the Reformation, brother!

Fear not. My gun toting back country preacher will be in the line of battle with his flock defending it from the powers of this world if the time ever comes.

You know, my preacher is the best shot in the county.

How is your priest with a Garand?

Peace brother. See you at the barricades.

The Catholic Church does not base it’s doctrine on a show of hands like the majority of protestant faiths, it bases it’s doctrine on the never-changing Holy Bible.

Then why does the Church now insist the Bible is full of mythology?

With more devout Catholics on FR than Carter has liver pills I don’t know how you walk with balls that big. Be ready for incoming. Now have a nice night, but try staying away from Jimmy Swaggart and read the truth for a change.

http://www.usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/what-we-believe/catechism/catechism-of-the-catholic-church/epub/index.cfm