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The Right Way to Combat Gun Violence ^ | February 24, 2013 | Steve Chapman

Posted on 02/24/2013 7:49:08 AM PST by Kaslin

Public policy is a lot like math: No matter what the problem, the wrong answers are far more numerous than the right ones. This is particularly true on the subject of mass shootings and other firearms violence, which have stimulated a new fervor for barking up the wrong tree.

Many liberals think the answer to mass shootings and street crime lies in stricter gun regulation: banning "assault weapons," limiting the capacity of magazines or, in their unrestrained moments, adopting ultra-stringent laws like those in Britain or Australia.

But most of these ideas are irrelevant or impossible. Even if the Second Amendment didn't prevent it, Americans would never stand for a near-total ban on ownership of semiautomatic weapons, a la Australia, or of handguns, as in Britain. You might as well expect Nebraska to build 300 miles of oceanfront beaches.

Outlawing "military-style" guns would be a waste of time, since other weapons of identical capabilities would remain available. A limit on magazine capacity wouldn't impede street thugs, who don't need to fire 30 rounds to accomplish their tasks, or even mass shooters, who typically bring multiple guns or magazines.

TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Editorial
KEYWORDS: combat; guncontrol; gunviolence; secondamendment; violence

1 posted on 02/24/2013 7:49:12 AM PST by Kaslin
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To: Kaslin
Don't use there terms. There is no such thing as "gun violence". Use mass shootings instead. Mass shootings are stopped by good guys with guns. Idiots on the other side argue against good guys having guns, because that just creates more "gun violence". Piers Morgan or some other moron, said they'd rather be in the Aurora theater unarmed, because innocent people would get shot in the shoot-out.

So, don't use their terms.

2 posted on 02/24/2013 8:03:47 AM PST by Jabba the Nutt (.Are they stupid, malicious or evil?)
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To: Kaslin

It is not gun violence. It is thug violence. We all ready have all the laws on the books to combat thug violence. It is simply a matter of enforcing the laws and punishing the thugs.

3 posted on 02/24/2013 8:08:56 AM PST by ConservativeInPA (Molon Labe - Shall not be questioned)
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To: Kaslin
Rather than banning guns we should ban, with stiff penalties, murdering more than one person in a day. That one law will stop mass shootings, won't it?

Oh wait, that's right. Murder is already illegal. Maybe we need a PSA campaign to let whack jobs know this.

To cure the problem we need to first off ban gun free zones.
This takes away the opportunity for the screw balls to obtain what they most crave; power and control. These people are crazy, not stupid.

The next step is the impossible one; get the press to handle these things differently. Yes this is a pipe dream but if the press handled them this way we'd discourage almost all nut jobs from mass murder (with the exception being the Islamic ones).

1) Hold off on speculation until some facts are in.

2) Don't report on the non-existent “tea party link” unless one is found.

3) Don't report the name; this gives the screw ball another thing he wants - fame - and inspires other nuts who want fame and power/control. Instead use derogatory terms as I am doing here.

4) Rather than (after no tea party link is found) look for “what drove this poor misguided youth to this” treat the evil nut job as they would a Republican. In other words look for all the dirt and embarrassing things the nut case has done and said.

This takes away the opportunity, the fame and the sympathy/understanding these nut jobs crave. They will still engage in anti-social behavior, but hopefully not kill anyone but themselves.

4 posted on 02/24/2013 8:14:47 AM PST by (How many more children must die on the alter of "gun free zones"?)
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To: ConservativeInPA

The second amendment says:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Seems to me if someone is using a firearm for the commission of a crime and by extention reducing the security of a free state, individuals who do so should be considered Constitutional violators and laws passed to banish them from the US upon conviction should be enacted.

5 posted on 02/24/2013 8:17:48 AM PST by Mouton (108th MI Group.....68-71)
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To: Kaslin
Outlawing "military-style" guns would be a waste of time, since other weapons of identical capabilities would remain available. A limit on magazine capacity wouldn't impede street thugs, who don't need to fire 30 rounds to accomplish their tasks, or even mass shooters, who typically bring multiple guns or magazines.

I think you are missing the point. These attacks on the 2nd Amendment are in no way intended to be an effective response to violence or in any way reduce violence. In fact, as statistics and history show - places that adopt such laws experience an increase in violent crimes. Everyone knows this.

So why are they pushing ahead with laws they know will not only not address the issue, but in fact make it worse? It is not about public safety at all, it is about power and control.

The "honorable" {snort} Senator Feinstein even said she had her "gun control" legislation ready for over a year. If it was such a good idea Di, so direly needed for our safety Di, why did you sit on it for over a year? Oh, that's right, as she said, she was waiting for the right opportunity to introduce it. She needed Sandy Hook. She knew no-one in their right mind would consider it unless and until there was an emotional response to some event.

This is about power and control people. They will push hard, get slapped back, but make incremental gains. We are losing ground, losing rights. They want universal background checks - bull, that's universal registration. Next Sandy Hook, they'll say they're "reluctantly" forced to confiscate the guns to prevent another... Oregon has already introduced legislation allowing warrantless searches. Oh, so trash the 4th Amendment along with the 2nd? For you lib lurkers out there - think they'll only do warrantless searches of gun owners homes? Ha! Once you open the door, they'll search any/every property "looking for illegal guns" but oh, what's this we found? ... Normally if it isn't on the warrant, they cannot use it. Oh, but there is no warrant... Hmm... This is quite literally the end of America - if we let them continue down this path. This has to be stopped.

6 posted on 02/24/2013 8:18:43 AM PST by ThunderSleeps (Stop obarma now! Stop the hussein - insane agenda!)
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To: ThunderSleeps

“This is quite literally the end of America - if we let them continue down this path. This has to be stopped.”

Unfortunately, there’s very little that can be done to “stop” them, at least in the deep-blue states. They have the political numbers on their side to ram through the legislation they wish.

And there’s no guarantee that the courts in those states will lift a finger to stop them, either. (Although the 7th Circuit Court decision a day or two ago regarding concealed carry in Illinois is reassuring)

As the nation grows further divided, and as the blue states move to restrict the rights of those within their borders, the only sensible solution for conservatives is to flee from those borders, into states where their Constitutional rights are still revered and where those rights will remain protected.

The blue states are “gettin’ bluer” with each new law that attempts to limit the freedoms of those within. Those who cherish our traditional freedoms have but three options:
1. Remain in the blue states and submit to being subjects
2. Remain in the blue states and be transformed from law-abiding citizens into outlaws in their own homes
3. Get out while the gettin’s good.

The country is devolving into areas that will remain “free states” and others that will become “new slavery states”. Just as fugitive slaves took the underground railroad to escape their bondage, so must conservatives get on board and take the journey to “freedom”.

7 posted on 02/24/2013 9:52:44 AM PST by Road Glide
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To: Jabba the Nutt

Criminal violence.
Criminal murders.
We need to make it clear that these horrors are done by criminals.

Agreed. Take back the language.

8 posted on 02/24/2013 10:37:04 AM PST by RandallFlagg
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To: ThunderSleeps
We are in such a mess in Connecticut. From the OP-ED page of today's Courant:

Gun owners have been shutdown, shutout, shut-up in the discussion so far. Time is near, very near for more action, and I fear it ain't gonna be pretty

Focus On Gun Access, Not Gun Bans

Who among us has not been moved by the unspeakable tragedy that was inflicted upon the children of Newtown, our very home at the National Shooting Sports Foundation? What can possibly heal the wounds, silence the anguished outcries and make rational discourse out of such a horrific act? The answer is, we must come together and try.

To begin with, I submit that there are not two "sides" to this debate. There is only one side — the good people of Connecticut and America, on all points of the political spectrum, united in our common revulsion over this senseless attack on our most helpless. Yes — there is only one side — the good side — the "better angels of our nature," as Abraham Lincoln said, "opposing evil."

It was also Lincoln who said, "A house divided against itself cannot stand." We all must recognize that those who don't agree with us do in fact share a common goal of a safer Connecticut and a safer America. We all must recognize that there are changes we can and should make now to prevent misuse of firearms in the future.

Also, we all must recognize, especially here in Connecticut, that firearms and the firearms/shooting sports industry is a vital part of our history, our economy and — yes — our culture. To deny or act in defiance of that fact will prevent us from achieving workable, meaningful and long-lasting change. As we come together to seek solutions, I think the one thing most of us can agree on is the need for more effective background checks.

The central issue involved in violence where a firearm is misused is the unauthorized access to the firearm. The National Shooting Sports Foundation believes it is critical to first focus on the unauthorized access to firearms by irresponsible persons and those not legally qualified to possess them. We support immediate improvements to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System, known as NICS. This would bring all appropriate mental health and other records, such as restraining orders, into the NICS system.

Fixing NICS must be among the highest priorities in order to help further prevent illegal purchases of firearms from federally licensed retailers.

It's also critically important to understand that the semi-automatic modern sporting rifle has been unfairly mischaracterized as an "assault rifle." An assault rifle by definition is a fully automatic firearm. Automatic firearms were severely restricted from civilian ownership under the 1934 National Firearms Act.

Semiautomatic firearms — one shot for each pull and release of the trigger — are the most popular types of firearms in America, and have been for many years. The most popular hunting and clay target shotguns are semi-automatics. So are the most popular target pistols, including those used in the Olympics. The most popular .22-caliber rifles used to hunt small game are semi-automatics.

The overwhelming choice of both law enforcement and civilians who wish to have a pistol for self-defense is a semi-automatic. Semiautomatic rifles came into widespread use after World War II, and they are overwhelmingly the most popular rifles being sold today — for hunting, target shooting and other lawful sporting purposes as well as home protection.

To arbitrarily ban the modern sporting rifle for essentially cosmetic reasons would be insulting and unfair to millions of Americans who have purchased them legally, use them responsibly and store them safely.

Finally, let me say that as Connecticut lawmakers search for answers, the firearms and sporting industries are committed to being a resource for enhanced gun safety and reviewing all reasonable proposals with an open mind. We want to be part of the solution for the shared goal of a safer Connecticut.

Our hope is that decisions will be made based on fact. But as I was quoted as saying in a recent Hartford Courant news article, " I think people make bad decisions when they are angry, when they are fearful and when they act in haste and I worry that this situation has the making of all three."

After all the pain and with all that is at stake, this time we have an obligation to come together, think it through and take the time to get it right.

The author,Steve Sanetti, is president of the National Shooting Sports Foundation, based in Newtown.

9 posted on 02/24/2013 10:42:27 AM PST by Daffynition (The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted. — D.H.)
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To: Kaslin

Liberals would rather spend $100 billion trying to disarm the peasants than spend $10 billion to hire more police officers.

10 posted on 02/24/2013 5:11:49 PM PST by Blood of Tyrants (There is no requirement to show need in order to exercise your rights.)
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To: Daffynition
Quick question.

What is the evidenciary standard for getting a restraining order against someone?

Is it a he said/she said situation?

Can someone get a restraining order against someone they just pick out of the phone book if they (falsely) claim a threat, with a presumption on the court's part that the threat exists?

What recourse would the subject of the order have in that case?

Just curious.

11 posted on 02/24/2013 5:45:53 PM PST by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly. Stand fast. God knows what He is doing)
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To: Smokin' Joe

I am not a lawyer...nor do I play one, on the internet. I have heard of cases where on the slimmest proof of evidence that POs are issued against men.

12 posted on 02/24/2013 9:11:04 PM PST by Daffynition (The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted. — D.H.)
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To: Kaslin

The push for “gun control” has not one thing to do with crime.

And the politicians doing the pushing know it too. They are not stupid, they are evil.

13 posted on 02/24/2013 9:32:17 PM PST by Blue Collar Christian (One "bitter clinger" praying for revival. <BCC><)
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To: Daffynition

Thank you for your post. I just fired off an e-mail to them telling of our disgust by their way of thinking.

They surely don’t represent me.

14 posted on 02/24/2013 9:53:59 PM PST by Blue Collar Christian (One "bitter clinger" praying for revival. <BCC><)
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To: Blue Collar Christian

FWIW, I don’t know much about the National Shooting Sports Foundation except that they are a national trade association for the firearms industry, founded in the 1960s. They host the SHOT Show in Vegas.

I think they tread lightly.....and it just so happens they are headquartered in Newtown, CT, home of the terrible school massacre. Of course. like you, I wish they were less *PC* in how they say, what they really think. These are troubling times, here in Connecticut. I think they are trying to be a rational voice and remain in the debate....frankly that hasn’t worked, from what we have seen.

Thanks for stepping up to the plate. :)

15 posted on 02/25/2013 5:57:29 AM PST by Daffynition (The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted. — D.H.)
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To: Blue Collar Christian
Not everyone is a Ronnie Barrett. God bless him.

I've been posting the link to the support he is getting after his immortal open letter:

In the never-ending battle to destroy our constitution, more “big lie” propaganda is being dumped on our elected officials. The rhetoric given forth by the Violence Policy Center (VPC) so easily deceived the legislators of California, resulting in the banning of fifty caliber rifles because they are powerful and their bullets punch holes when they strike. Even single shot .50 cal rifles were banned. It’s hard to believe we live in such a dark time that someone has actually banned a single shot rifle. But as you will see, this is the cleverest of all gun bans, and the end goal is civilian disarmament, the confiscation of your tools of liberty, your rifles.

What lies before us is the continuation of the misinformation campaign, trying to coax yet another state to infringe upon the U.S. Constitution as California did. The anti-freedom/anti-gun movement has discovered how transparent they appear when they propose sweeping gun bans and now are successful by biting off a little at a time. Ever so small, many politicians are trading off your rights without you recognizing their violations.

First we had the “Saturday Night Special” which was all affordable handguns, then “sniper rifles” which were any scoped deer rifles. Those were obvious, too big a scam to go unnoticed, but with the creation and demonization of the term “assault weapon,” the Clinton’s Crime bill produced a wasted 10-year setback on your freedoms and safe gun design. Now comes another scam. This time they are shocked to discover that rifles are “accurate and powerful.”

This is the same bull the officials in the 1950′s fell for when they banned the self-unfolding knife. First the knife was demonized by giving it an evil name, “switchblade,” then we (the trusting public) were told that the problem of gang violence was solved with its banning. How ridiculous. It’s surprising they didn’t ban the leather jacket. In reality, gang violence was and is a serious social problem, but it was not related to manually unfolding verses self-unfolding knives. The elected officials voting to ban an object like a knife proved themselves unwilling or uncaring to understand the problem, and thus, incapable of any real solutions.

The handful of people that make up the VPC are solely responsible for the big lie on .50′s, claiming fantastic destruction capabilities. They manipulate fear by claiming terrorists will use these rifles on targets of our infrastructure. “They will shut down our airports in flames” they claim. VPC’s Tom Diaz refers to them as “super guns” lying to his dupable group of politicians, concealing the facts that there are many rifle cartridges that are comparable in performance (those will be added to the list in phase two). He is boldly telling these officials (and all who will listen) that the risk of terrorist attacks on these targets will be solved with the banning of powerful rifles, in this case, the .50 caliber rifle. In reality, terrorism is complex and will be defeated with improved intelligence. In this instance, the officials voting to ban an inanimate object like a rifle prove themselves to be ignorant of the problem of terrorism and are wasting time and resources.

You must understand the brilliance of this dangerous back door deception. Your politicians are being told that the fifty is a highly destructive cartridge that can destroy airplanes, fuel transport trucks and depot storages of fuel. They show videos like the one on 60 Minutes showing a 1/2 inch plate of steel being pierced by a .50 cal round while stopping a .308 caliber. This is all to confuse the people, those with little exposure to firearms; their impression concludes that the .50 punches holes in sensitive targets where other rifles cannot. Had they shot actual aluminum that is used on airplane construction, or aluminum or steel used in actual transport or tank construction, both the .50 and the .308 will pierce along with most all centerfire cartridges. But this, they must keep secret.

First, with the confusion of massive, (although incorrect) technical data and the hammering of urgency, the VPC demands a ban or strict regulations on rifles that chamber a cartridge that has the ability to penetrate targets. Sound ridiculous? It is.

VPC’s Tom Diaz appears often on TV with maps of Washington, DC, irresponsibly instructing where to position one’s self to illegally fire on vulnerable important targets of our government, promising these specific targets will be safe when .50′s are banned. He pressures politicians to act quickly on this URGENT legislation needed to make these terrorist targets safe, hoping they will act before the VPC lies are discovered.

Now slow down. A ban on a rifle because the cartridge it shoots penetrates targets? By the legislation naming and defining the targets that are damageable by rifle fire, and in this case, .50 cal. rifle fire, they create a new class of rifles. This new class is not defined by such foolishness as detachable magazines, flash hiders, or pistol grips. Instead, the test is; does it fire a bullet that punches a hole, and can the hole result in damage to specified and named targets? If so, the law-abiding citizen shouldn’t be allowed to have this, so they must ban this class of rifle before they can be misused. This is the very thing California has just passed!

“Now, we are only talking about those powerful .50 cals, right? It’s such a small class, no one will mind or even notice.” That’s what the VPC’s lies have lead you to believe. No, remember they are banning rifles because specific targets named in our infrastructure are susceptible to damage. Now tell me, what centerfire rifle cartridge won’t punch holes in those targets? What centerfire rifle cartridge is not powerful? Not many or not any? So, in order to comply with the spirit and intent of the law, the Attorney General or State Secretary must add those cartridges to the banned list. The big lie is exposed. They aren’t just talking about .50′s. They’re after your hunting rifles, centerfire target rifles-just about any rifle you own.

Unlike California, we cannot allow any of our local, state, or federal officials to be deceived with any of this “big lie” gun control propaganda. The U.S. has every gun law that could possibly be needed. Virtually every real world scenario of firearm abuse is already covered in some law that is currently on the books.

Many of you have inquired as to the outcome of the letter I wrote to Police Chief Bratten of the LAPD. Unfortunately, the chief’s position did not change. He continued to use his officers in the same deceptive practices formerly utilized with the city council. These few officers testifying in Sacramento ultimately contributed to the unconstitutional AB50 law being passed. It saddened me to have to tell members of the LAPD SWAT team that they would have to send someone for their rifle, because I refused to assist anyone or any organization that is in violation of the United States Constitution. In turn, the department arranged to pick up their un-serviced rifle.

Barrett cannot legally sell any of its products to lawbreakers. Therefore, since California’s passing of AB50, the state is not in compliance with the US Constitution’s 2nd and 14th Amendments, and we will not sell nor service any of our products to any government agency of the State of California.

I appreciate all the phone calls and e-mails from LAPD officers and civilians during that time, encouraging and supporting our actions. We shall see if other firearms companies will follow this path. I know many are corporately owned and feel like they are unable to risk the life of their company for the liberties of our nation, but if we lose our Republic, our freedom, what good is any of it? I am in the proud and fortunate position that many of our forefathers were in when they risked all for our liberties.

“Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!” -Patrick Henry

This “ban large bore” insanity failed in Washington years ago, but that didn’t discourage the VPC. Now it’s resurfacing in city council meetings, in individual states, and it’s being reintroduced in Washington. NRA-ILA Executive Director, Chris Cox, once told me “These (anti-freedom, anti-gun) guys never go away, and they never quit.”

I’ve received thousands of e-mails and letters from you offering encouragement and support. Our Republic, our liberty, needs and demands your support. You must take action to guard your rights. First, find your State Senator and State Representative. Tell them not to fall for this scam. This lie depends on the elected official being naive about firearms and their capabilities. Stand ready to carry this same message to your U.S. Senator and Representatives. Know all of your elected officials’ positions on gun issues. DO NOT ELECT ANY ANTI-GUN PERSON TO ANY POSITION!

Position yourself with me in the battles that we must fight. You need to join the NRA, the Fifty Caliber Shooters’ Association, and the NSSF in order to stay informed. These people have been with me in the trenches, fighting for every inch of the liberty you enjoy.

Today we draw a line; there will be no more nibbling at our freedom. Today you stand idle no longer. Today you do something to save our country!

Ronnie Barrett
Owner and CEO Barrett Firearms Manufacturing, Inc.


Since the recent passage of the draconian NY State gun control laws, some companies have decided to take a stand. These companies have come out and said that they will no longer sell items to law enforcement and government agencies that law abiding citizens can’t possess. First, I have to give credit to Ronnie Barrett, of Barrett Firearms. He really started this list a decade ago, when first Los Angeles and then California banned .50 caliber rifles and ammo. Barrett responded by refusing to sell or service items for California law enforcement or government.

Fast forward to the present. Some states, including Connecticut, are pursuing anti-gun legislation. Other companies are following in Ronnie Barrett’s footsteps. Here’s the ones I know of, with links to their new policy.

16 posted on 02/25/2013 6:21:15 AM PST by Daffynition (The essential American soul is hard, isolate, stoic, and a killer. It has never yet melted. — D.H.)
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To: ConservativeInPA

“It is not gun violence. It is thug violence. We all ready have all the laws on the books to combat thug violence. It is simply a matter of enforcing the laws and punishing the thugs.”

You are obviously confused, the proper way to proceed is that when people break a law you outlaw the instrument they used to break that law. Someone, somewhere has used a semi-automatic rifle with a twenty round magazine to kill someone therefore we must outlaw those. Where we are failing is in not outlawing all the other murder weapons. We must ban automobiles, farm tractors, all kinds of trucks from small pickups to multi-trailer rigs, motorcycles, hammers, screwdrivers, pipe wrenches, axes, chain saws, baseball bats, walking canes, anything and everything with a sharp edge, steel toed shoes and boots, pillows, plastic bags, rope, trees, ladders, bridges, windows, etc. I will have to come back later and finish, I am due to start work in a few minutes.
Oh, before I go we must outlaw refrigerators also, I actually knew someone who swore that he saw a man pick up a refrigerator and throw it at someone once.

17 posted on 02/25/2013 6:45:16 AM PST by RipSawyer
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To: Kaslin

I have always thought that, if we hanged murderers publicly in the town square, in a timely fashion, and left them up for a while, that it would drastically reduce murder.

18 posted on 02/25/2013 7:04:37 AM PST by Little Ray (Waiting for the return of the Gods of the Copybook Headings.)
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